Absol Swords Dance

Hi all.

I'm trying to think of ways to make Absol more usable in competitive play as it's my favourite pokemon. Pretty much wherever I go I see Swords Dance in its "optimal" move set. I get it, boosting Absol's already high attack stat makes it nearly unstoppable. But does it really need it? Does it really have that hard of a time killing stuff that it needs to waste a turn boosting its attack? Just to compare, it has the same base attack as Garchomp, and nearly as high in mega form.

Given how frail Absol is (can't usually survive more than one hit) I would rather either give it another attacking move that makes use of its acceptable special attack in mega form, or a status move like swagger or thunderwave to give it a better chance of surviving 2 turns on the field.

Increasing Absol's attack seems a little pointless to me. Am I missing something here?

Increasing Absol's Attack allows it to power through some of the bulkier threats. Without Swords Dance, Absol misses out on some key OHKOs and 2HKOs. This is not to say an all-out attacker set is bad, though, especially in RU where many of Absol's main competitors are also frail. Using Mega Absol in UU though, I don't see how a set without Swords Dance would work. Especially with Sucker Punch + Magic Bounce working so excellently together to punish both non-attacking moves and attacking moves alike.

Benadryl said:

Increasing Absol's Attack allows it to power through some of the bulkier threats. Without Swords Dance, Absol misses out on some key OHKOs and 2HKOs. This is not to say an all-out attacker set is bad, though, especially in RU where many of Absol's main competitors are also frail. Using Mega Absol in UU though, I don't see how a set without Swords Dance would work. Especially with Sucker Punch + Magic Bounce working so excellently together to punish both non-attacking moves and attacking moves alike.

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I see what you're saying, but how would the following move set work?

Thunderwave
Swagger
Punishment
Psych up

Admittedly a rather risky move set and having only one attacking move would make it quite situational, but in UU I think it could work.

Midnight shadow said:

I see what you're saying, but how would the following move set work?

Thunderwave
Swagger
Punishment
Psych up

Admittedly a rather risky move set and having only one attacking move would make it quite situational, but in UU I think it could work.

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Absol is better setting up Swords Dance itself on a predicted switch. Also, Swagger is banned, and Psych Up is very matchup-dependent otherwise:
-Swords Dance
-Sucker Punch
-Knock Off/Baton Pass
-Play Rough/Baton Pass
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 252 Atk/4 SDef/252 Spe
Item: Absolite

PlatinumDude said:

Absol is better setting up Swords Dance itself on a predicted switch. Also, Swagger is banned, and Psych Up is very matchup-dependent otherwise:
-Swords Dance
-Sucker Punch
-Knock Off/Baton Pass
-Play Rough/Baton Pass
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 252 Atk/4 SDef/252 Spe
Item: Absolite

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Oh damn, forgot that Swagger is banned on Smogen (really lame). Given that you can only have one Baton Pass user per team in UU I would prefer to use a pokemon that can boost speed to give to Absol.

Midnight shadow said:

Oh damn, forgot that Swagger is banned on Smogen (really lame). Given that you can only have one Baton Pass user per team in UU I would prefer to use a pokemon that can boost speed to give to Absol.

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Mega Absol is already fast by itself, so no need for Baton Passing it Speed here.

Considering how common fighting and fairy pokemon are in basically every meta (or rather their moves) I would consider Absol to very high risk/high reward as is. But yeah I'm in agreement that really it's better to improve prediction skills so you can use absol to its fullest capability which is as a revenge killer/sweeper/SD passer.

gimmepie said:

Considering how common fighting and fairy pokemon are in basically every meta (or rather their moves) I would consider Absol to very high risk/high reward as is. But yeah I'm in agreement that really it's better to improve prediction skills so you can use absol to its fullest capability which is as a revenge killer/sweeper/SD passer.

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How about using Absol as a lead to take out the enemy lead pokemon? I'm basically relying on the fact that most leads want to set up weather, entry-hazards or stat boosts for Baton Pass. Have both taunt and payback in your move set and you are covered pretty well. Mega evolve on the first turn and use one of those depending on who you are facing. Against a faster opponent you can use Payback and get 100bp STAB using mega absol's high attack stat, or against a slower opponent use taunt and stop them setting up.

Really the only thing to be careful of at that point is something like Vivillon that can sleep powder on the first turn before you mega evolve....or a moonblast to the face on turn one....

Midnight shadow said:

How about using Absol as a lead to take out the enemy lead pokemon? I'm basically relying on the fact that most leads want to set up weather, entry-hazards or stat boosts for Baton Pass. Have both taunt and payback in your move set and you are covered pretty well. Mega evolve on the first turn and use one of those depending on who you are facing. Against a faster opponent you can use Payback and get 100bp STAB using mega absol's high attack stat, or against a slower opponent use taunt and stop them setting up.

Really the only thing to be careful of at that point is something like Vivillon that can sleep powder on the first turn before you mega evolve....or a moonblast to the face on turn one....

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Mega-evolution would happen before sleep powder. If you want to use a magic bounce lead M-Sableye or M-Diancie are far better alternatives than Absol. Sableye gets Will-o-Wisp which cripples a lot of rocks setters or spiker like Skamory and Diancie can set up rocks or get in a calm mind to function as a sweeper.

If you want a taunt lead Frosslass could do the trick as well as several other pokemon that I'm currently forgetting. Using M-Absol as a lead though is probably a waste of its strengths.

gimmepie said:

Mega-evolution would happen before sleep powder. If you want to use a magic bounce lead M-Sableye or M-Diancie are far better alternatives than Absol. Sableye gets Will-o-Wisp which cripples a lot of rocks setters or spiker like Skamory and Diancie can set up rocks or get in a calm mind to function as a sweeper.

If you want a taunt lead Frosslass could do the trick as well as several other pokemon that I'm currently forgetting. Using M-Absol as a lead though is probably a waste of its strengths.

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Oh? I thought if the enemy is faster they would use their move before you mega-evolve. I'm aware that there are probably better leads available but I am looking to use Absol, and want to get away from the boring old sucker punch and sword's dance move set. Still going with the lead idea, how about this:

Taunt
Payback
Play Rough
Will-o-wisp/Iron Tail

Midnight shadow said:

Oh? I thought if the enemy is faster they would use their move before you mega-evolve. I'm aware that there are probably better leads available but I am looking to use Absol, and want to get away from the boring old sucker punch and sword's dance move set. Still going with the lead idea, how about this:

Taunt
Payback
Play Rough
Will-o-wisp/Iron Tail

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Mega-evolution definitely happens first regardless of speed. If you're really determined to use some weird sort of lead absol you'd be better off replacing Payback for Night Slash or Sucker Punch. Especially once you've mega-evolved absol is too fast to make payback worth it.

gimmepie said:

Mega-evolution definitely happens first regardless of speed. If you're really determined to use some weird sort of lead absol you'd be better off replacing Payback for Night Slash or Sucker Punch. Especially once you've mega-evolved absol is too fast to make payback worth it.

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True. I had Payback in there because I thought to use it against a faster opponent before I mega-evolved, but you are right that Night Slash or Sucker Punch would be better (probably go for Night Slash for the guaranteed damage against an enemy lead). That said, I still like the idea of Payback to punish people from switching out, which would cause the double damage on the pokemon switching in. Alternatively I could take mean look as my fourth move to make sure I could take out the enemy lead.

Midnight shadow said:

True. I had Payback in there because I thought to use it against a faster opponent before I mega-evolved, but you are right that Night Slash or Sucker Punch would be better (probably go for Night Slash for the guaranteed damage against an enemy lead). That said, I still like the idea of Payback to punish people from switching out, which would cause the double damage on the pokemon switching in. Alternatively I could take mean look as my fourth move to make sure I could take out the enemy lead.

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Payback's power no longer doubles on a newly switched-in target. It's worthless now. Also, Knock Off > Night Slash for the utility of removing items. Not only that, the power difference between both is minimal. Refer to the Swords Dance set I posted.

As already mentioned, Absol isn't exactly suited as a lead, and it's better off using either Swords Dance or an all-out attacking set.

If you want an Absol with optimal coverage, here's the set:
-Sucker Punch
-Knock Off
-Play Rough/Superpower
-Fire Blast/Ice Beam
Nature: Naive
EVs: 252 Atk/4 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Absolute

Sucker Punch and Knock Off are there for Dark STABs, the former for picking off frailer attackers, and the latter for a reliable utility STAB. Play Rough hits Fighting and opposing Dark Pokemon. Superpower hits Steels harder. Fire Blast also hits Steels, while Ice Beam deals with bulky Grounds.