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Driver License vs Right to Travel

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    How does not having a license constitute a victim though? Who was injured or had property damaged as a direct cause of my actions? How does having a license automatically constitute that you know what you're doing? Its not like Henry Ford invented the Model T and a license suddenly came out of fat air and suddenly he knew how to use it. It doesn't work that way. Just because someone is not licensed, doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing and again, a law cannot be passed based on potential future events. Its about using your head other then a hat rack.
     
  • 5,616
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    How does not having a license constitute a victim though? Who was injured or had property damaged as a direct cause of my actions? How does having a license automatically constitute that you know what you're doing? Its not like Henry Ford invented the Model T and a license suddenly came out of fat air and suddenly he knew how to use it. It doesn't work that way. Just because someone is not licensed, doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing and again, a law cannot be passed based on potential future events. Its about using your head other then a hat rack.

    You have to take classes,driving tests and pass them to attain a License In doing so you have shown to the state you are a capable person of operating a motor vehicle. You do not get a license if you are incapable of driving.

    Please stop with the dodging of real questions. If you can't even be bothered to answer our questions, stop trying to even falsify your debate. A License has meaning. Yes a person who is not license shows that they lack proper training to handle said object. Its not for potential future events, its for stuff that has happened.


    How do you justify knowing how to properly use a vehicle when there is no official documentation stating you have gone through proper procedures and have learned how to operate the said machinery?


    You have posted nothing but nonsense, twisted horrible logic in order to try and prove a point that you are incapable of sharing. Nothing in this thread has been used to assist you in any way. You cannot even justify yourself when directly asked questions and instead you dodge everything and continue on with meaningless repeated jargon that you yourself have not been able to show comprehension for.

    Your invalid points have all been met with official documentation or valid counters that you cannot even respond to.


    After thinking about it. I really don't want to waste more time in here. Answer the questions or don't, it really doesn't matter. Its been said by multiple people that what you are saying isn't right. They have substantial proof against the claims made. It really isn't worth my time fighting if you don't want to actually debate. And no you aren't debating. You are trying to, but your information is half screwed and twisted in illogical sense. There are many contradictions posted that really hurt what you are trying to say and somewhere early into the thread your point was lost. I only ask you to go back over, reread what was said. Try to reevaluate the argument and start anew. Your original point was a license hindered travel.


    A license or lack of there of does not hinder travel in any way shape or form. A license exists as a contract between the issued recipient and is a state wide recognition that they have passed a certified exam that dictates whether or not they have the ability to drive. Lack of ownership of said license means you either haven't taken the tests and passed, or have failed the tests and have been shown to not have the capacity to drive(Like in my case).

    Driving without a license is the same as traveling to foreign countries without a passport. There is no way to validate your credentials and no proof that you are who you say you are. A license shows that you have been approved to drive because you have demonstrated the ability to do so.

    Driving itself is a privilege, not a right. We do not have to drive to get from point A to point B.
     
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  • 77
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    Ok, but are you telling me that the only way to learn is if a license is involved? That makes no sense. Obviously by using common sense I can tell whether or not I am acting in a safe manner or not. You can learn without the license and even with the license, how do you know that said person didn't cheat their way through the test? Even with licensing, there are still idiots out there getting into wrecks and not to mention its restraining those of us that actually take responsibility for our actions and to know how to travel in a safe manner. I pay attention to my surroundings when I travel in my automobile and am courteous to others. I stay within the limits of speed to those around me and use my turn signals to change lanes. Just because I don't wear a seatbelt on short distance trips and don't endanger others or their property doesn't mean it violates your Right to safety or travel. I am in no way putting you in danger for simply not having a piece of plastic that has my information and set of numbers that supposably "certifies" me to "drive" my automobile when I have the knowledge to do so in a safe and orderly fashion. The gas tax pays for the roads and I've purchased my own petrol since I've been travelling by private automobile, so I am entitled to the roads I help pay for.
     

    Ivysaur

    Grass dinosaur extraordinaire
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    But all we have is your word that you can drive. With a licence, we have both your word and trained officials' words stating that you, indeed, can drive. Cheating can happen but in proportion it's meaningless. If you do know how to drive safely, getting a licence shouldn't take you any effort whatsoever, and the process makes sure that someone who clearly overrates his own abilities and actually cannot drive as much as he'd like to believe the opposite is not allowed to drive. Where is the problem? Tell me, what is the freaking problem? In which way does carrying a licence "restrain" you?

    You keep talking about victims. Legislative law (which is the one operating in the US -and 99% of the known world- from the very second a Constitution was passed) does not require victims, so you can be punished for doing things that do not immediately cause any victims because you are, in fact, severely endangering other people.

    I find it utterly hilarious that you say you are responsible and yet you claim you don't use the safety belt- by doing that, you are endangering yourself and others, and you deserve to be fined and (in my country) you'd get licence points docked for reckless driving. Again, it's NOT you who gets to decide what constitutes safe and unsafe driving, it's the majority of the people and their representatives through laws.
     
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    This is going off on a tangent, but I think it's important.

    Everybody should use a seatbelt. Everybody should know that the most important function of a seatbelt is /not/ keeping you safe through a crash, but /preventing/ crashes in the first place. It keeps your torso in a fixed position when you swerve, preventing you from losing control of the vehicle - it makes sure you're not in a position to be ejected in the first place. People should know this, too often you'll find that they don't. This is something you hopefully learn during the licensing process, but who knows, Canada might be different or something.

    That's the PSA.

    Just because I don't wear a seatbelt on short distance trips and don't endanger others or their property doesn't mean it violates your Right to safety or travel.

    Well, I don't wear seatbelts on short trips, and sometimes I actually drive drunk. But I'm not endangering others or their property, so I'm not violating their right to safety. That isn't irresponsible and a threat to public safety at all - I haven't "done" anything.

    The threat from unlearned unlicensed drivers is greater than the threat from unlearned licensed drivers. The exception proves the rule - you're saying "what if", "what about", but you're only talking about yourself. Laws are created for the betterment of societies, not to judge and limit individuals - in fact, that would be arbitrary and counter to due process. Is licensing arbitrary then? No, licensing is good for us all, and yes, I believe that outweighs your personal entitlements. In fact, I'd find it highly arbitrary for us to remove the licensing system to the benefit of the few like you. Now /that/ would be against due process and undemocratic.
     

    for him.

    I'm trash.
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    Ok, but are you telling me that the only way to learn is if a license is involved? That makes no sense. Obviously by using common sense I can tell whether or not I am acting in a safe manner or not. You can learn without the license and even with the license, how do you know that said person didn't cheat their way through the test? Even with licensing, there are still idiots out there getting into wrecks and not to mention its restraining those of us that actually take responsibility for our actions and to know how to travel in a safe manner. I pay attention to my surroundings when I travel in my automobile and am courteous to others. I stay within the limits of speed to those around me and use my turn signals to change lanes. Just because I don't wear a seatbelt on short distance trips and don't endanger others or their property doesn't mean it violates your Right to safety or travel. I am in no way putting you in danger for simply not having a piece of plastic that has my information and set of numbers that supposably "certifies" me to "drive" my automobile when I have the knowledge to do so in a safe and orderly fashion. The gas tax pays for the roads and I've purchased my own petrol since I've been travelling by private automobile, so I am entitled to the roads I help pay for.

    This argument just falls very short. You are not a representative sample. In no way, shape, or form are you enough of a sample to represent everyone in the U.S. You sir, are just one dangerous case out of the millions that live on American soil.

    Just because you are saying you have done all these dangerous things and you are safe, that does not mean it applies to EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. It only APPLIES TO YOU. So stop acting like ever single person on this country thinks and acts like you.

    Frankly, I have only noticed that you are only giving us cases and quotes of people who justify YOUR ACTIONS, which by the way, are illegal and endangers not only yourself, but everyone around you when you drive. (How you have not received a ticket or hit anyone with your car is beyond me. Luck I guess?)
     
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    Just because people don't know their Rights, doesn't make their (courts) unlawful actions legal. Prosecution must prove three things. A) you are the party, B) that you had the method or oppertunity to do the thing and C) that it was done with with a willful intent. Willfullness is defined as "an evil motive or intent to avoid a known duty or task under a law, with moral certainty." US v Bishop, 412 US 346. I couldn't have done anything evilly because i was following the Constitution and the decisions of the United States Supreme Court.

    The definition of victim: a person harmed, injured, or killed as a result of a crime, accident, or other event or action.synonyms:sufferer, injured party, casualty; fatality, loss; loser "a victim of crime"

    Now tell me, who have I injured or who's property have I damaged as a direct cause of my actions? I have the Right to confront my accuser according to the Sixth Amendment. What injury or other loss do you claim to have received from my actions? If the People of the State is the victim, which people? I need names. If someone does claim to be a victim, but they've received no injury or damaged property, then that's an act of perjury. Again, me not wearing my seatbelt is not a crime and neither is not having a license while travelling in my private automobile. "Victimless crimes" are the reason our jail cells are overfilling. It's a waste of taxpayer money. You're telling me that because I do something that affects no one in a positive nor negative way, i should be jailed because it was made "illegal"? That's ridiculous! If you were a cop in the US and you saw me travelling in my private automobile in a safe and sane manner, are you going to pull me over because you don't think I may not have a license, though I impose no danger whatsoever or are you going to go after the rapist and murderers? If you chose the latter, you're a good cop and are abiding by your oath. Sorry, but maybe you should study the Common Law a bit more and grasp its meaning and again, our nation is not a Democracy.

    Let me say that it is none of a cop's business to worry about my own safety unless I am imposing a direct danger to the safety of others. I cannot simply be ticketed for such "infraction" as tickets are illegal and again, there was no victim.
     
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    Just because people don't know their Rights, doesn't make their (courts) unlawful actions legal. Prosecution must prove three things. A) you are the party, B) that you had the method or oppertunity to do the thing and C) that it was done with with a willful intent. Willfullness is defined as "an evil motive or intent to avoid a known duty or task under a law, with moral certainty." US v Bishop, 412 US 346. I couldn't have done anything evilly because i was following the Constitution and the decisions of the United States Supreme Court.

    What about negligence? Who taught you law?

    The definition of victim: a person harmed, injured, or killed as a result of a crime, accident, or other event or action.synonyms:sufferer, injured party, casualty; fatality, loss; loser "a victim of crime"

    Now tell me, who have I injured or who's property have I damaged as a direct cause of my actions? I have the Right to confront my accuser according to the Sixth Amendment. What injury or other loss do you claim to have received from my actions? If the People of the State is the victim, which people? I need names. If someone does claim to be a victim, but they've received no injury or damaged property, then that's an act of perjury. Again, me not wearing my seatbelt is not a crime and neither is not having a license while travelling in my private automobile. "Victimless crimes" are the reason our jail cells are overfilling. It's a waste of taxpayer money. You're telling me that because I do something that affects no one in a positive nor negative way, i should be jailed because it was made "illegal"? That's ridiculous! If you were a cop in the US and you saw me travelling in my private automobile in a safe and sane manner, are you going to pull me over because you don't think I may not have a license, though I impose no danger whatsoever or are you going to go after the rapist and murderers?

    Possessing child porn is also a "victimless crime". If a person discovered child porn of his or her own volition, but kept it to him or herself and didn't distribute, who is a victim? They aren't encouraging anybody by keeping it to themselves, are they? Some crimes are "victimless" (which is not a legal, but a politically charged term) and some "crimes" shouldn't be punished. But to say that all victimless crimes shouldn't be punished is making a generalization.

    I think you have to understand that there is a society at large who doesn't care about what you or I as individuals do. Laws have to be enforced. We've established (or so you haven't refuted) that your point about people cheating the system is a minor concern compared to how licensing elevates the standard of driving ability for /everybody else/. This being the case, we have to make sure people without licenses are kept off the roads - there's too much uncertainty in the ability of a non-licensed driver. Do the people who enforce the law know that you are pose no danger whatsoever? Shouldn't it be your responsibility to demonstrate that you pose no such danger - by obtaining and carrying a license?

    This is a matter of the lesser evils. Perhaps it is inconvenient to you that a police should stop you to check for your license, but the greater evil is unlicensed, know-nothing drivers rampaging down the roads. Take one for the team.

    If you chose the latter, you're a good cop and are abiding by your oath. Sorry, but maybe you should study the Common Law a bit more and grasp its meaning and again, our nation is not a Democracy.

    You should elaborate on this point.

    Let me say that it is none of a cop's business to worry about my own safety unless I am imposing a direct danger to the safety of others. I cannot simply be ticketed for such "infraction" as tickets are illegal and again, there was no victim.

    If you're expressing how things ought to be, you should say "I should not" not "I cannot" (as I did in this very sentence. Obviously I can't say that you "can't" say something, only that you shouldn't). You can and you will be ticketed, see for yourself. As a disclaimer, I'm not encouraging you to do something illegal and get ticketed, I'm encouraging you to see how the law is applied in the real world.

    Let me tell you that rampant individualism means nothing for the good of the country or society, it is only self-serving. Wrapping it in the cloak of "constitutionalism" is simply putting a wolf in sheep's clothing.
     

    Ivysaur

    Grass dinosaur extraordinaire
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    Also, why do you keep bringing "Common law" over and over? The US works on Legislative law, or else there wouldn't be a Constitution at all. Common law is the one based upon traditions, before laws were ever written. It has long been superceded by now, even if common law jurisprudence not voided by written laws is still valid.

    And, according to the definitions stablished by legal professors, the US is a Presidential Republican Representative Democracy from the very second it elects its officials through free and open elections. A democracy doesn't mean "everybody votes on everything", that is a direct democracy. There are more flavours than one to democracies.

    A Republic only means the head of State is a President instead of an unelected monarch. Spain is a Kingdom but we elect our representatives the same way you do. China and Cuba are Republics because they have a president, yet voting is virtually illegal in there.
     
  • 77
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    Who taught me law? Wow, because its obvious that the Constitution is the Supreme Law of the Land as stated in Article 6. Marbury v Madison supports this. The government of the united states is bound to uphold their end of the contract. Also, how is child porn a victimless crime because its a child that doesn't know the difference between right and wrong. At that age, it can mess with the child mentally and its abuse. You're arguing apples and oranges.

    A cop cannot just pull you over for any reason. He has to have a valid reason. Have I done something that directly endangered a life or property? I have to be suspected of a crime in order to be stopped. When a cop turns on his lights, he is declaring an emergency and if there is not an emergency and he flips on those lights, he just committed a felony. The cop is a public servant, therefore, he works for the People and not government interest. As for the fact that he CANNOT write me a ticket, it is stated in the Constitution that no Bill of Attainder shall be passed (aka traffic tickets).

    We're not a Democracy and we never have been. Democracy is a horrible thing because it creates mob rule verses rule by law. The Roman Empire was a democracy and look what happened to them. That is the path we are going down now because of all the crap that the American People have allowed. We are a nation of INDIVIDUAL Rights, not the Rights of the People as a whole. Just because one person abuses the Rights of the other, doesn't mean that everyone elses Rights can/should be violated, especially if they're abiding by the law of the land.

    Also, as I've mentioned, the government can put things in place to promote the general welfare of the People, but WITHIN Constitutional limitations. Stop lights and signs don't hinder one's Right to travel because it keeps everyone organized upon the roads. I sure as hell don't want people in their auto going head on with me because they're in the wrong lane or hit me because they weren't following the lights/signs. Again, its about common sense. Use your brain, that's the beauty of being human. We can do things that no other species can do. We have intellegence. Obviously, not everyone has the same skills, therefore, it only makes sense that if you can't do something such as "driving", then you shouldn't do it and if you do, then you're going to be responsible for any injury/damage that you cause. Obviously a license hinders one's Right to travel in their private automobile especially if one has the knowledge to do so. Its just like a gun. People back in the 1800's didn't have licenses to carry a gun, but yet those that carried still knew how to use their firearm. Just because there's a few bad seeds that don't know how to operate it or use it to violate someone's Rights doesn't mean the responsible people should have to get a license. The Right of the Individual cannot be simply diminished without due process of the individual.
     

    Ivysaur

    Grass dinosaur extraordinaire
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    A cop cannot just pull you over for any reason. He has to have a valid reason. Have I done something that directly endangered a life or property? I have to be suspected of a crime in order to be stopped. When a cop turns on his lights, he is declaring an emergency and if there is not an emergency and he flips on those lights, he just committed a felony. The cop is a public servant, therefore, he works for the People and not government interest. As for the fact that he CANNOT write me a ticket, it is stated in the Constitution that no Bill of Attainder shall be passed (aka traffic tickets).

    A... traffic ticket is a bill of attainder now.. what?

    We're not a Democracy and we never have been. Democracy is a horrible thing because it creates mob rule verses rule by law. The Roman Empire was a democracy and look what happened to them. That is the path we are going down now because of all the crap that the American People have allowed. We are a nation of INDIVIDUAL Rights, not the Rights of the People as a whole. Just because one person abuses the Rights of the other, doesn't mean that everyone elses Rights can/should be violated, especially if they're abiding by the law of the land.

    The Roman Empire was a democracy

    The Roman Empire was a democracy

    The Roman Empire was a democracy

    Roman Empire

    democracy

    I'm sorry but you'll have to study History again. The democratic ages of the Romans were during the Roman... Republic. Man, where did I hear that word again?

    Democracy is what you do every other year when you go to the polling place and elect your reprsentatives. That's called representative democracy. Stop talking about concepts you don't understand.

    Just because there's a few bad seeds that don't know how to operate it or use it to violate someone's Rights doesn't mean the responsible people should have to get a license. The Right of the Individual cannot be simply diminished without due process of the individual.

    That's your opinion. Modern law disagrees with you. End of.
     
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    You should read over my passage on the /possession/ of child porn again. You should also address how negligence fits into your conception of prosecution, because last time I checked it exists - yet it would contradict what you consider to be a crime.

    According to to various online dictionaries, a bill of attainder is "a legislative act pronouncing a person guilty of a crime, usually treason, without trial and subjecting that person to capital punishment and attainder". It's a law that targets a person or a group of people. Nothing to do with traffic tickets, they apply to us all.

    All police officers need is suspicion to pull you over. If you'd like to change that you can try, but until then that's how it is. Have you ever been pulled over before?

    What is democracy to you? What's a republic?

    It's nice that you have a lot to discuss, but you should make an effort to read and understand what others are saying. We've been having a lot of trouble discussing throughout the entire thread, and that's in no small way due to what seems to be arbitrary re-definitions of commonly accepted legal concepts. It would help if you did a quick search with google or the free dictionary and compare their definitions with your preconceptions. The rest of us have been doing that since the first post, and I think it's on you to be responsible for the factual accuracy of what you say. I don't have a problem with addressing misconceptions when they come up, but...

    According to to various online dictionaries, a bill of attainder is "a legislative act pronouncing a person guilty of a crime, usually treason, without trial and subjecting that person to capital punishment and attainder". It's a law that targets a person or a group of people. Nothing to do with traffic tickets, they apply to us all.

    ^ I shouldn't have to do this ninety-some posts in. Have you ever considered that your understanding of law is flawed? Take some time do your research before you post, /outside/ of your traditional sources mind you. I have a feeling that they are not very trustworthy.
     

    Corvus of the Black Night

    Wild Duck Pokémon
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    It's very clear that his understanding of how law, the constitution and the judicial branch is very skewed but it is also known that people with strong opinions do not like to change their strong opinions regardless of whether or not they are wrong. Even if their argument holds merit in another light they fail because they cannot let go of their misunderstandings that are required to hold their savoury belief that they cling on so dear to.
     

    LoudSilence

    more like uncommon sense
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    As for the article, that's what he thinks, and yes he happens to agree with you, that rights cannot be infringed absolutely. But a great man once said:

    Only a Sith deals in absolutes.

    Was the guy who said that a Sith? Because that statement is an absolute :P

    Anyway, Kevo, I think if nothing else, you should at least understand that your idea of what constitutes a "privilege" and a "right" needs to be refined heavily. The vehement disagreement against you is primarily due to semantics.

    The entire discussion would be rendered unnecessary once you learn what a "right" really is. Not what you think it ought to be, but what it is.
     
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    You're right, Rome was a Republic, but it eventually became a democracy and fell shortly afterwards.

    As for a right v a privilege, I pulled this up from a man in California named Charles Sprinkle. Link at bottom.

    American Jurisprudence, 1st Edition. Constitutional Law, Sect.329, p.1135 "The Right of the Citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon, by horsedrawn carriage, wagon, or automobile, is not a mere privilege which may be permitted or prohibited at will, but the common Right which he has under his Right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Under this Constitutional guarantee one may, therefore, under normal conditions, travel at his inclination along the public highways or in public places, and while conducting himself in an orderly and decent manner, neither interfering with nor disturbing another's Rights, he will be protected, not only in his person, but in his safe conduct." 

    Defendant did not suddenly lose his right to drive. By stealthy encroachment the state takes away our liberty and sells is back to us as a license. The stealth encroachment process of the corporation/ state against the human depends on time for its success. The human lives perhaps 85 years. The corporation/ state has eternal life. As each succeeding generation dies off, the next generation fails to remember the lessons and history of the previous generation. The corporation state counts on that. Defendant remembers the way it was.We use the road as common tenants - not as renters from the state.
    Stealthy encroachment at work: The state counts on this generation to forget that we use the roads as tenants in common - not as licensees! Teodor Marian and his Mentor Richard McDonald have researched this vein. By looking back at old disputes regarding roads, rivers, and other ways of passage, we see clearly that the view was that public property is nothing more than property held in common tenancy for use by thepublic.Comparison of Tenant in Common to Licensee
    The licensee must request the license from the licensor, he cannot demand it from him. The licensor cannot require the licensee to take his license under the licensee has encroached upon the thing or act that the licensor has competent authority over. You cannot demand a liquor license. By comparison you can use the road without even demanding anything. It is there to be used by all.

    Some cases that flesh out the difference between "rights" and "privileges"            The permission or license is a special right or privilege. Once a license exists only the licensee has he right to do the thing the licensor allows. The licensee is privileged over others who do not have a license. It thus is a privilege to have the right to do the thing that is licensed. In other words, the right or permission granted by the licensor is a privilege since he controls who can and who cannot exercise the right. If the licensor grants the licensee a right or benefit, it is called a privilege:            The word privilege is defined as a peculiar benefit, favor, or advantage, a right or immunity not enjoyed by all, or it may be enjoyed only under special conditions. Knoll Golf Club v U.S., 179 F Supp 377 Since the right or permission to do a thing is called a license, and since the right is "peculiar" to the licensee alone, the license is called a privilege. Anything that requires a license is a privilege.A license for the sale of intoxicating liquor is a privilege. Chiordi v Jernigan 129 P 2nd 640, 642; 46 NM 396.

    https://thelawyerdude.com/www.lawyerdude.netfirms.com/5686.html

    Bill of Attainder- also known as a writ of assistance or traffic citation. Civil equity arguments that transmit into law penalties. One cannot be jailed for a debt (debtor's prison)
     
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    Ivysaur

    Grass dinosaur extraordinaire
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    You're right, Rome was a Republic, but it eventually became a democracy and fell shortly afterwards.

    Uhhh... no. You Fail At History Forever. Rome was a democracy during its time as the Roman Republic. Then, after a series of civil wars, Octavian Augustus decided to call himself the Emperor, make all the voting redundant as he's have the last word on everything and nobody would be able to vote/remove him, and kick off the Roman Empire.

    The undemocratic, unrepublican Roman Empire went off to survive for 500 years in Western Europe and a freakingly whooping 1480 years in Eastern Europe/Middle East. So um. "Shortly afterwards" is kind of an understatement.

    As for a right v a privilege, I pulled this up from a man in California named Charles Sprinkle. Link at bottom.

    Okay. I don't care about a copypaste of something Random Dude Smith Jr. Said. Can you link me to a SC/State SC saying "It is unconstitutional to require a licence to drive"?

    Because otherwise it's just yours (and Random Dude's) interpretation of the law. And, unless you are a qualified judge, it matters not how you interpret it.
     
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    Corvus of the Black Night

    Wild Duck Pokémon
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    ohmygod this thread is still going

    My very short response (since I've said it 100x in more detail) is simply that while some people may argue that since it is not described in the constitution, the constitution is designed to be flexible, such as in the acquisition of the Louisiana Purchase. There are things in our current day and age that are much more questionable in terms of unconstitutionality such as random drug testing than requiring a drivers license, if only for the simple fact that you can still use certain kinds of motorized transportation without one. You also require licenses to dispense certain kinds of food and drink as well but that doesn't revoke your ability to dispense food/drinks.

    Your mutilation of history or government doesn't really help in your case either.

    Off topic, but you can crawl back to your Alex Jones cave but he won't support you. The fact that he doesn't actively support anything he says just tells me that him and other conspiracy-laden libertarians are using big fancy words to stir up a crowd into anarchy so they don't have to stand up themselves, also known as the definition of cowardice.
     
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    Well, I've provided all the law, the Supreme Court cases and even two lower cout cases that all support my information. I've explained police powers and how they're limited to the Constitution, both Fed and State, and especially to due process. I've even provided "testamony" from a lawyer and law enforcement officer. I don't know how I can get any clearer on here.
     

    Ivysaur

    Grass dinosaur extraordinaire
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    17
    Years
    The problem is that you are trying to explain how the sky is yellow, so most people in here are going to dismiss your small evidence because if the sky were, in fact, yellow, and you didn't need a licence to drive, it would be all over the news everywhere and lots of people would be aware of it- not just a few select people citing a few select obscure cases that are just barely related to your claims to begin with.

    Not to mention it goes against legal logic- if it truly was outlawed, no State would have a law related to it since when the SC decides something is unconstitutional, any related laws are written off. Since those laws still exist, then it has never been ruled out in a direct way.

    If you are going to claim that the sky is yellow when all of us are used to seeing blue skies, you'll need more than a couple obscure SC cases not even directly related to licences and the testimony of Random Guy Jr. Namely, a SC case that reads something like this:

    "It is unconstitutional to require citizens to obtain and carry a drivers' licence to drive their own car for private transportation purposes."
     
  • 77
    Posts
    10
    Years
    • Seen Dec 21, 2015
    Please see Title 18 of the United States Code:

    18 United State Code section 31 : (6) Motor vehicle.— The term "motor vehicle" means every description of carriage or other contrivance propelled or drawn by mechanical power and used for commercial purposes on the highways in the transportation of passengers, passengers and property, or property or cargo. (10) Used for commercial purposes.— The term "used for commercial purposes" means the carriage of persons or property for any fare, fee, rate, charge or other consideration, or directly or indirectly in connection with any business, or other undertaking intended for profit.

    Also, again, according to 16AmJur2d. Section 256 "...No repeal of an enactment is necessary, since an unconstitutional law is void. The general principles follows that it imposes no duty, converse no rights, creates no office, bestows no power of authority on anyone, affords no protection and justifies no acts under it..."

    Obviously, I'm not travelling in a motor vehicle and obviously, I am not using my private automobile in the act of commerce during my daily activities, therefore, I am not required to have a license.
     
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