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Red/Blue remakes on 3DS

895
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    • Seen Apr 22, 2018
    Maybe they could put Unova's subway in Saffron post game? It does have a the Magnet Train in the Johto games so maybe have them be in the middle of adding a new line to Johto.

    That'd be a great idea. It establishes a link with Unova (however small), and it foreshadows Gen 2. Perfect!

    Also they could add some Super Contests (that is Sinnoh style) and have Daisy participate in them as her FrLg fame checker called her a "star cordinator" or something along those lines. Maybe make her into a not a modest and not so peppy but still kind contest idol. So while her little brother conquers the battling world she conquers the world of contests. Maybe they could give her a Mega. I imagine her with Vileplume( or Bellossom if they give Vileplume to Erika again) due to her flower name. Maybe she could have a team of 5. Vileplume for Beauty or cuteness, Tangrowth for tough, Venusaur (her starter?!) for coolness, Paras for smart, and ...Victribell for beauty or even more oddly...cuteness depending on what Vileplume is. If they're add Johto mons then Sunflora should replace Paras and be the beauty, Victribell Smart, and Vileplume cute, Venusaur cool. Tangrowth stays the same.

    That's an excellent idea, too. It'd be great to finally see some characterization for Daisy, and the Sunflora/Victreebel/Vileplume/Tangrowth/Venusaur team is perfect for her. (They could also give her Roserade, Whimsicott, Lilligant, and/or Florges (not a Grass type for whatever reason, but still a flower) in the postgame.)
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

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  • That'd be a great idea. It establishes a link with Unova (however small), and it foreshadows Gen 2. Perfect!



    That's an excellent idea, too. It'd be great to finally see some characterization for Daisy, and the Sunflora/Victreebel/Vileplume/Tangrowth/Venusaur team is perfect for her. (They could also give her Roserade, Whimsicott, Lilligant, and/or Florges (not a Grass type for whatever reason, but still a flower) in the postgame.)
    Perhaps the Train twins were born in Kanto like how the sister's in the Maison were born in Hoenn.
    I love that post game team. I also wanted to give her Roserade and Lilligant.
     
    895
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    • Seen Apr 22, 2018
    In another thread, I posted this as an idea for how a Gen 1 remake could redo the (lame) backstory FRLG attempted to give Lorelei and write her out of the E4 in a way that treats her with respect and gives her room to reappear in a future game:

    I want the games to establish her as a marine researcher, maybe out investigating Navel Rock (retconned into a place more like Seafoam/Whirl) with her close friend and Sevii's local professor, Philena Ivy (or someone heavily based on her) and her other close friend and fellow E4 member, Lance (who's always been fascinated by Lugia, a dragon-like Pokémon he heard stories about growing up in Blackthorn).

    While there, they run into Archer, Ariana, Petrel, and Proton. They have stolen the Blue, Yellow, and Red Orbs in hopes of awakening Lugia (after placing them together on an altar at the very top of Navel Rock) and sending the ultimate message out to Giovanni (who vanished after disbanding Team Rocket).

    The first Orb, the Red One, is at Mt. Ember (retconned into a dark, creepy volcano; Red Orb is roughly where the Ruby was in FRLG). At the end of the tunnel (and several Rocket Grunts) is Proton, who runs off and drops the Red Orb after you defeat him.

    Just as you exit Mt. Ember, you run into Ivy, who has just received a Pokégear call from Lance; he's at the Rocket Warehouse on Chrono Island and ran into some trouble getting the Yellow Orb. You head there, beat some more Grunts (including Jessie and James, in their final appearance. More on that later...), and enter a back room to find Lance being cornered by Ariana and Petrel. Ariana mocks him, telling him "However strong you may be, you can't take both of us at the same time. Sorry, baby. Now get ready to be thrashed," and when she sees you barge in, she tells him something along the lines of "What? You had an accomplice? Where is your sense of honor?"

    You and Lance fight Ariana and Proton in a tag battle, and after beating them, they run off to Navel Rock (where Lorelei and Archer are), but not before Petrel drops the Yellow Orb. Afterwards, Lance tells you that he had been snooping around and discovered Archer's plans to rebuild Team Rocket in Johto and create an evolution-inducing device; he snapped photos and made copies, planning to investigate this at a later date. He then, expresses concern for Lorelei and takes you back to Navel Rock (via flying on his Dragonite), where she, Archer, and the Blue Orb are located.

    When you get there, Lorelei is arguing with Archer (who is implied to be her ex-boyfriend), who mocks her for being a "silly woman who doesn't know better," and she calls him a "selfish pig." In response, Archer slaps her, making her glasses fall to the ground, and Lance runs forward, threatening to unleash wrath on him if he sees him hit her again. Archer evilly laughs, accusing Lorelei of always needing her "boyfriend" to rescue her, and she calmly gets up, puts her glasses back on, and hits him right back. Lorelei tells him that she can rescue herself just fine, and she challenges him to a battle.

    Archer dusts himself off and calls Proton over, telling Lorelei that she's going to have to fight the two of them at the same time. Lorelei grabs you and says "No problem." You and Lorelei get into a tag battle against Archer and Proton, after defeated, Archer hands over the Blue Orb and vows that this won't be the end of him or Team Rocket.

    Once the Rockets leave, Lorelei tells you about the legend behind the Orbs, and their connection to Articuno/Zapdos/Moltres and Lugia. She says that the birds have been seen roaming Kanto ever since the Orbs went missing, explaining why they were at Seafoam/Power Plant/Victory Road instead of the smaller islands surrounding Navel Rock. She, then, points you in the direction of the altar, and you climb up there, placing the three Orbs together. One amazing cutscene later, you get into a battle with a L70 Lugia, and after you either capture or defeat it, Lorelei and Lance run up to you and express amazement at what they witnessed. They thank you for helping them save the day and return to the Indigo Plateau, unlocking the rematch Elite Four. (They will both have completely different dialog if you return to rebattle them.)

    On certain days of the week (after completing the Lugia event), you can find Lorelei and Lance on certain days of the week training together in Navel Rock. They will challenge you to a double battle and after defeating them, Lorelei tells you that she is considering leaving the Elite Four sometime in the future. She feels that being there is limiting her potential as a trainer (which Lance agrees with, as she is seen defeating him as we arrive) and keeping her from her passion for research. We also learn that a new League is being established in the Sevii Islands, and they want Lorelei to head it as its Champion... Which is where she'll be when we revisit her story in the sequel (Gen 2) three years later.

    It also serves as a postgame Lugia story that canonizes its link to Articuno/Zapdos/Moltres (with a few nods to Pokémon 2000, such as the Orbs and Navel Rock being retconned into a pseudo-Shamouti Island), as well as directly sets up the Team Rocket plot for the Gen 2 games (ie. the Lance and Ariana scene).

    What do you think?
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

    10000 year Emperor of Hoenn
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  • In another thread, I posted this as an idea for how a Gen 1 remake could redo the (lame) backstory FRLG attempted to give Lorelei and write her out of the E4 in a way that treats her with respect and gives her room to reappear in a future game:



    It also serves as a postgame Lugia story that canonizes its link to Articuno/Zapdos/Moltres (with a few nods to Pokémon 2000, such as the Orbs and Navel Rock being retconned into a pseudo-Shamouti Island), as well as directly sets up the Team Rocket plot for the Gen 2 games (ie. the Lance and Ariana scene).

    What do you think?

    As I said by VM they'll need to change the orb names in english to avoid confusion with the Weather Trio orbs (though in Japanese it's fine as Groudon's is called the Crimson Orb, and Kyogre's the Indigo Orb.) Actually would perfer they make them feathers and/or bells to fit in with Lugia's Silver Wing and the bell they gave it in Ss. They could have the feathers when united have a similar power as the Silver Wing (but weaker seperately). Perhaps the orbs/feathers can be used as the bird trio's Mega stones (or perhaps they'll form Lugia's).
     
    895
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    • Seen Apr 22, 2018
    I prefer keeping them as Orbs, although they could easily be renamed Ice/Electric/Fire.

    The birds' Mega Stones would be found in the trio of Islands surrounding Navel Rock. Also, the birds, themselves, would return to the islands (where they can be caught at L50) if you didn't catch/defeat them in Kanto before awakening Lugia.

    I'd drop various hints to this storyline throughout the Kanto part of the game, especially around Seafoam/Power Plant/Victory Road.
     

    ShyRayq

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    • Seen Apr 2, 2024
    I am in the camp that would prefer a break this year and a new game being revealed later this year/released next year.

    A Red/Green re-remake for the 20th anniversary makes sense and I would love to see Kanto in 3D. But honestly I'd prefer if the storyline was altered, because after playing the more story-driven games from Gen V and VI, FireRed and LeafGreen just can't keep my attention.

    Although, I can't think of how the plot could be reworked to include Mega Evolution and all that. Giovanni monopolising on Mega Stones? Or something more Pokemon-esque.
     

    Indigo

    The Novelist from Panju
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    • Seen Nov 7, 2019
    Please NO! Not to be rude, but we've been to Kanto soooooooooooooo much! It's getting old to me.
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

    10000 year Emperor of Hoenn
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  • I am in the camp that would prefer a break this year and a new game being revealed later this year/released next year.

    A Red/Green re-remake for the 20th anniversary makes sense and I would love to see Kanto in 3D. But honestly I'd prefer if the storyline was altered, because after playing the more story-driven games from Gen V and VI, FireRed and LeafGreen just can't keep my attention.

    Although, I can't think of how the plot could be reworked to include Mega Evolution and all that. Giovanni monopolising on Mega Stones? Or something more Pokemon-esque.

    Perhaps Giovanni will seek out Mega items to make his organization more powerful. Also they could add in Ariana and Archer could appear in the Kanto story-line with their own Mega items. With Archer using Mega Houndoom and Ariana using either Mega Vileplume, or Mega Arbok. I bring up these two as they appear in FrLg at the Rocket Warehouse in the Sevii islands, or at least two executives with similar teams to theirs do. They could add the other two as well (Mega Weezing for both?). Perhaps they could have Giovanni plan an attack on Indigo Plateau to make himself the new Champion and thus head of the Kanto...and the Johto region, like how Ghetsis refers to N as (for the Unova region) during his call to free the Pokemon when N defeats Alder. His Four Generals could act as his version of the Elite 4. Perhaps replace Proton (maybe Normal with Mega Raticate as his ace?) and Petrel's (perhaps Dark? or Poison and Ariana Dark with Mega Honcrow as her ace) teams to other types while making Ariana a poison type (or Dark if Petrel is poison) specialist and Archer a fire type specialist.
     

    ShyRayq

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    • Seen Apr 2, 2024
    Perhaps Giovanni will seek out Mega items to make his organization more powerful. Also they could add in Ariana and Archer could appear in the Kanto story-line with their own Mega items. With Archer using Mega Houndoom and Ariana using either Mega Vileplume, or Mega Arbok. I bring up these two as they appear in FrLg at the Rocket Warehouse in the Sevii islands, or at least two executives with similar teams to theirs do. They could add the other two as well (Mega Weezing for both?). Perhaps they could have Giovanni plan an attack on Indigo Plateau to make himself the new Champion and thus head of the Kanto...and the Johto region, like how Ghetsis refers to N as (for the Unova region) during his call to free the Pokemon when N defeats Alder. His Four Generals could act as his version of the Elite 4. Perhaps replace Proton (maybe Normal with Mega Raticate as his ace?) and Petrel's (perhaps Dark? or Poison and Ariana Dark with Mega Honcrow as her ace) teams to other types while making Ariana a poison type (or Dark if Petrel is poison) specialist and Archer a fire type specialist.

    That would actually be really cool. I mean, it would make Rocket more deadly/on par with teams like Plasma and Flare in terms of 'evil'? Or power. Something like that. Maybe incorporating Mega Mewtwo in there somewhere? And having a more in depth look into its history, with Blaine and Mr. Fuji.
    Things like this would really enhance the plot of Kanto. Make it more in-depth and expanding on the characters. Like I said, I'd prefer something like this over the bland Rocket of R/B and FR/LG.
     
    895
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    • Seen Apr 22, 2018
    If they remake Kanto again I'll like to see new areas added to the region. Perhaps a route north of Mt. Moon that can be accessed post game. It could have the Kalos mascots even.

    The entire region should get an overhaul, if you ask me. The 3DS is capable of far more than the GB/C, GBA, and even, DS, so all of the cities and routes could stand to be expanded. With the right thinking, even Pallet Town could be redone to look more like this, this, or this. Imagine how a larger city like Celadon or Saffron could look!

    And, of course, with the redesign would come new areas. Cinnabar should have an explorable volcano, and there should also be a new area added near the Power Plant where Magneton could evolve. I wouldn't mind seeing the underground tunnels between Cerulean/Vermillion and Celadon/Lavender fleshed out, too.
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

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  • Maybe they could bring back Underground Secret Bases and have them play a role in the tunnels?

    Speaking the 3DS keep in mind that GF could even use the "New" 3DS which is more powerful than the 3DS so if done right they can do so much more.

    Kanto is known for being very urban and modern (check out Bulbapedia's page, it's one of the few things they highlight about Kanto along with their scientific achievement) so making it's cities larger would make sense.
    Also since every non-Kanto Electric gym leader likes messing with their city (Wattson redesigned Mauville, Volkner's gym caused the power outage, Elesa had a entire new building made for gym despite having one she could just have remodeled, and Citron like making inventions and uses the city's biggest attraction as a gym ) perhaps Lt. Surge will follow suit.
    The old man's building could finally be completed in this new timeline! It could be a PWT even.
     
    895
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    • Seen Apr 22, 2018
    Quoted from a post in this thread.

    I never said that we should stick with the original 151. It should be a remake with all Pokemon being obtainable. It's just that Rhyperior is already a beast and don't think that it deserves a Mega Evolution. It would be called Mega Magmar if Mega Evolution had been implemented in Gen IV. Same goes for Electivire, Dusknoir, Togekiss, Mamoswine, Lickilicky, Tangrowth, Yanmega, PorygonZ etc. I do not think these Pokemon deserve a Mega evolution. Giovanni could have a Rhyperior but as a secondary Pokemon, with the leading being his Mega Nidoqueen.

    I agree that a remake with only the original being obtainable would be the same as building a wall without cement, not good.

    Do you know what Smogon Tier Rhyperior is currently in? RU. In fact, out of the Pokémon you listed, only Togekiss and Mamoswine are OU. And, Porygon-Z is UU. The rest are all RU or lower.

    No, Smogon isn't everything, but for better or worse, the "metagame" is a huge part of the franchise now, and their Tiers are a pretty good guide to what Pokémon are considered "good" or "bad." Something is not a "beast" if it's sitting in NU, RU, or even UU. In fact, it's quite the opposite.

    Looking at Rhyperior, what's the problem? First of all, its typing. Ground/Rock is well-known for being a horribad defensive typing, especially when paired with horribad Speed and Sp. Defense (as is the case with Rhyperior). Yes, Rhyperior has high HP and Solid Rock, but neither do much to help curb those nasty Water and Grass weaknesses, especially when its so easily outsped and most attacks of those types hit its weak Sp. Defense. (And, even its better Physical Defense does less than it should, thanks to the Ground/Fighting/Steel weaknesses, as well as attacks like Waterfall and Aqua Tail.)

    And, speaking of Speed, that's also a pretty big issue. To be that slow with that awful of a typing doesn't do it many favors. Rock Polish only goes so far, and Trick Room support is very situational.

    Basically, Rhyperior is something that should be strong and looks like it on paper... but doesn't exactly work out in practice. A Mega is exactly what it needs, and a Gen 1 remake would be the obvious place to give it one (as it evolves from a Gen 1 Pokémon).
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

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  • I bet Mega Rhyperior would get the Aggron treatment or a better ability to get rid of it's 4x weaknesses (at least taking them down to 2x). Since Rhinos are herbivores they could give it Sap Sipper and get rid of one of those weakness ^_^.
     
    895
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    • Seen Apr 22, 2018
    I bet Mega Rhyperior would get the Aggron treatment or a better ability to get rid of it's 4x weaknesses (at least taking them down to 2x). Since Rhinos are herbivores they could give it Sap Sipper and get rid of one of those weakness ^_^.

    The Aggron treatment is probably the most likely one. I think the Rhyhorn and Aron lines are meant to be pseudo-counterparts, both being three stage Rock type rhino/dinosaur Pokémon (although Rhyhorn didn't get its third stage until Gen 4), so it would be fitting for Mega Rhyperior to lose its Rock typing in the same way Mega Aggron did. (Most of Rhyperior's weaknesses come from its Rock typing, anyways.)

    Then, they could, maybe, give it Sand Rush to patch up that Speed stat. Rhyperior has an incredible Attack stat and movepool, but it needs more Speed to really put it to use and pose a threat.
     

    Cerberus87

    Mega Houndoom, baby!
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  • Rhyperior can't shed its Rock typing because of its lore and the fact it boasts the strongest Rock type move, which is its signature move. If anything, it's the Ground type that would go. Rock is great offensively and benefits more from sandstorm than Ground. In fact, the boost from sandstorm is a big reason why Tyranitar is OU with all those weaknesses. With Assault Vest it becomes impervious to most Special attacks.

    I do NOT want changes to Pokémon to be made because of the "metagame" but sadly that's what happening with the Mega Evolutions. Masuda loves the competitive scene and is catering to them now more than ever.

    (fun fact, my two favorite Johto Pokémon are Houndoom and Tyranitar, but I can't ever use them together now since Houndoom's Mega Evolution clashes with Tyranitar's ability)
     
    Last edited:
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    Rhyperior can't shed its Rock typing because of its lore and the fact it boasts the strongest Rock type move, which is its signature move. If anything, it's the Ground type that would go. Rock is great offensively and benefits more from sandstorm than Ground.

    Then, maybe, they could ditch the Ground typing and give it Sand Stream (for the buffed Sp. Defense). Either way, it's not a "good" Pokémon as it currently is.

    I do NOT want changes to Pokémon to be made because of the "metagame" but sadly that's what happening with the Mega Evolutions.

    Unfortunately, that's just the harsh reality of Pokémon nowadays. GF now realizes that a significant and vocal portion of the fanbase cares more about competitive battling than the main story and only sees the games as an alternative to battle simulators, button-mashing through the story as quickly as possible to get straight to breeding and EV-training.

    You can see it in how most of XY's biggest additions--Super Training, Horde Battles, Friend Safari, and even (to a lesser extent) Fairies and Megas--are of more benefit to competitive players than casuals, and how both the new Exp. Share and quick, watered-down story make button-mashing through the game as fast and easy as possible. The fact that XY literally have zero postgame besides competitive battling makes it all the more obvious.
     

    RandomDSdevel

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  • What about Glaceon and Sylveon?
    Maybe instead they could have the rival ask the player questions and overtime how one answers adds up to one of the eeveelutions (sort of like in a character quiz). Could be other NPC's too like Oak.
    Or maybe keep the three eeveelutions how it was in yellow but give them Megas. Both Diantha and Steven have them (while Cynthia has Mega Garchomp already set for her games remakes). Maybe give Dragonite it's Mega.

    ...

    If you really think about it, the theory that the legendary beasts used to be either Eevee or its original three evolutions suggests that Vaporeon, Flareon, and Jolteon may already have Mega Evolutions!
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

    10000 year Emperor of Hoenn
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  • Then, maybe, they could ditch the Ground typing and give it Sand Stream (for the buffed Sp. Defense). Either way, it's not a "good" Pokémon as it currently is.



    Unfortunately, that's just the harsh reality of Pokémon nowadays. GF now realizes that a significant and vocal portion of the fanbase cares more about competitive battling than the main story and only sees the games as an alternative to battle simulators, button-mashing through the story as quickly as possible to get straight to breeding and EV-training.

    You can see it in how most of XY's biggest additions--Super Training, Horde Battles, Friend Safari, and even (to a lesser extent) Fairies and Megas--are of more benefit to competitive players than casuals, and how both the new Exp. Share and quick, watered-down story make button-mashing through the game as fast and easy as possible. The fact that XY literally have zero postgame besides competitive battling makes it all the more obvious.
    Sadly that was also the case with ORAS post Delta Episode.

    My issue with Rhyperior losing the Ground type and being Giovanni's possible ace is that the Mega won't match Giovanni's type as he's a Ground Specialist not a Rock specialist (and if they go the pure Rock route they might as well give Brock Mega Rhyperior).
     
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