a pokemon game without... plot?

[Corveone]

My biggest problem with the plot in Pokémon games is that it's very childish and allways end up revolving around the same thing, everyone flattering and cheering the player about how good trainer you've become and how you're the only one who can stop the villain and save the region from whatever legendary-related evil scheme, because apparently the Elite Four and Gym Leaders are mostly ornaments sitting there in their spots for pretty much the entire game doing nothing but waiting for the next challenger, while the region or the whole world would effectively collapse if it wasn't for the bravery and skill of a 10-12 years old kid who just started training Pokémon days/weeks ago.

Using that same formula over and over again gets boring and super predictable pretty quick, and is probably one of the reasons why many people just skip all the dialogues because you know plot-wise there's nothing new or interesting to read. Whatever the plot is about, and whatever the villains are planning, at the end it doesn't matter, because you're the hero who will stop them with your Pokémon and the power of love, catch the legendaries and put them in boxes or in your team as you just do with any regular Pokémon, and restore peace in the region so that everyone can continue living their happy lives.

I'd personally like to see a Pokémon plot in which instead of being the pure and invincible hero child with no flaws, the chosen one, the son of the greatest trainer who has disappeared, etc., you were just a regular trainer with a more unique goal, a detective, someone who did something wrong in the past and has to fix things, or whatever else that can add a bit of fresh air.

 

[Megan]

The original games had the plot revolve around you. You go through the region, catch Pokemon and collect badges in order to be the best. The way how you accomplish that was your own. Those Team Rocket grunts didn't stand in your way because they had some really evil plan to ursurp the region. They just stood there because they wanted to block you off. As such you delt with them appropriately so you could continue.

This allowed the games to center more around the players goals. Sure, the basics were set: complete the Pokedex, beat the Gym leaders. But how you were going to do that is your choice. A lot of the narrative in those games in you the player imagining your own story.
That's how it was in gen 1 and for the most part in gen 2.

Gen 3 onward they tried to emulate the style of JRPGs. Ironically, both Pokemon and JRPGs had their origins in DnD, except JRPGs had the split from that origin happen a lot sooner and as such had more nuance in their more character driven approach. The player was not a self insert, they simply watched as the characters of those stories did their own thing, maybe acting as a sort of guiding spirit that clicked the right moves during battles (but that's all there was to it).
Pokemon tried to become that but also wanted to keep the player as the main focus; best of both worlds: deep story telling coupled with player agency.

But that is very hard to pull off. In fact: So far I have not seen a single game succeeding with that. Try too hard to focus on one end and the other one just falls off, entirely. Trying to incorporate deep characters and their development and combine that with a silent protagonist who gets asked questions during important moments but ultimately the answer never matters. Or a gameplay focused game where story is non-existant but they still throw cutscenes at you which needlessly halt the progress of your own story. It always seems to be inbetween those two options...

 

[Duck]

I'd like deeper plot, but I don't think the kind of plot that's worthwhile is something GameFreak can deliver.

Generation III was pretty OK actually. I mean, it's simplistic and certainly could be done a lot better but for the first attempt of Pokémon at plot it was OK.

Generation IV was a rehash of Generation III, essentially. So was Generation VI.

I haven't played Generation VII but I'm told that it goes balls to the walls crazy and I can appreciate that. Trying out their story chops and new themes. Might have not stuck the landing but hey, they're trying.

Generation VIII was a dumpster fire and I really hope they fired the writers that thought it was a good idea. As far as I can tell, every single detail was done badly. Like, at that point, make it a character study like you wanted to, to begin with and we'll end up with a richer story that's just less stupid.

As for Generation V ... I like the ideas they introduced, hated Hugh with a passion and I think that it shows what's the major problem with plot in Pokemon.

We're in an era in which simple black and white stories aren't that popular anymore. So we need moral complexity and shades of gray, but for that to work, Pokemon needs to be able to let go and allow the world to be criticized without having to go "nope, he's completely wrong, we're right and the king of morality".

And while they tried to do that in Generation VIII to a certain extent - Rose was trying to do it to save the future or whatever - they aren't willing to fully commit. In that example, why is just using electric Pokémon not a valid solution to the energy crisis? The crisis won't happen next year, it'll happen in 1000 years, why can't we study other options?

So, in general, I think we have the potential for great stories in the Pokémon world, but I don't think Game Freak is interested in delivering those great stories. And if we're gonna get mediocre stories, I'd rather have none at all. This way I don''t have to listen about Hugh's gosh darned Purrloin for the eighteenth time already.

 

[Corveone]

We're in an era in which simple black and white stories aren't that popular anymore. So we need moral complexity and shades of gray, but for that to work, Pokemon needs to be able to let go and allow the world to be criticized without having to go "nope, he's completely wrong, we're right and the king of morality".

Well, black and white stories can allways work for eight years old or less children who are playing their first Pokémon game and have a much simpler perspective of life.

The thing is, when you stick with the franchise over many years, you won't remain eight forever. Players grow up, but the games' stories and general tone don't, because when designing that and other aspects of the games the developers likely prioritize new (and very young) audiences over recurring players. And even where they did have some ideas for a deeper and more mature story it wasn't handled very efficiently. Like Sun/Moon for example tried to add some drama moments, but then you have your character listening at all that stuff with an immutable big smile on his/her face (because no facial animations) and immersion goes down the toilet.

 

[Duck]

Well, black and white stories can allways work for eight years old or less children who are playing their first Pokémon game and have a much simpler perspective of life.

The thing is, when you stick with the franchise over many years, you won't remain eight forever. Players grow up, but the games' stories and general tone don't, because when designing that and other aspects of the games the developers likely prioritize new (and very young) audiences over recurring players. And even where they did have some ideas for a deeper and more mature story it wasn't handled very efficiently. Like Sun/Moon for example tried to add some drama moments, but then you have your character listening at all that stuff with an immutable big smile on his/her face (because no facial animations) and immersion goes down the toilet.

I mean, there has been been a shift from simple black and white beat the villain and move on stories lately, in kids' media I'm aware of.

The latest 3 or so Pixar movies for example didn't really have completely "all evil" villains, if they had villains to begin with. And maybe I'm misremembering, but it seems like that's a broader pattern in the major children's media as well.

Villains are getting smaller and smaller focus (like Shiny Crab in Moana or de la Cruz in Coco) if they even exist (I don't really think Frozen II even had a villain). So while black and white stories can work for younger audiences, it seems to me that it's falling out of fashion.

And I'd wager GameFreak agrees since Gen VII and Gen VIII attempted to spice it up with Rose's "it's to save the world" spiel and the whole Lusamine arc.

I'm not necessarily opposed to cheesy black and white stories, these can be fun too - after all most Zelda games are essentially that and hey, that's a very well loved franchised - but if you want to go down this path, you should probably add some little gauntlets and spectacle to make it feel larger than life.

Or go full comedy with your villains, which can also be a fine choice. Embracing the cheesiness and corniness and going full golden age can also be fun (although I'm not sure how it'd be received by kids).

I also think that if you're going down that path, you're probably scraping for a plot idea or forcing a plot because you think you should have a plot, when just "I wanna explore the pretty region" can be good enough motivation and you can do a character study on how your rivals evolves or something like that (which is what I think Sword / Shield were trying to do in their B plot?).

 

[TheClassyHerddIer]

I really like the plot. I feel the games get boring without it. Blue could barley keep my attention. It was fun to go back in time and see where it all started but if it wasn't for the glitches I don't think I would of finished the game.

For that reason I think that black and white were pokemon's magnum opis. If it people didn't poopoo it on release I think we might of gotten more thought out stories. I still think the new games are good. In fact SMUSUM's story is really good and we need more of that and less of SWSH