Concerns Regarding Clothing

[Pinkie-Dawn]

Since the Medieval times, people have been wearing modest clothing, showing little skin that leaves nothing to the imagination. Even their bathing suits back the day didn't show that much skin. But as we've reach to modern times, people have been wearing skimpier clothing, and it's not limited to just adults, but also children. In an era where some are convinced we live in a rape culture, having a girl wearing a midriff could leave her as a target for any sexually active man, allowing radical feminists and social justice warriors to voice their concerns about having women to start wearing modest dresses and not showing off their stomachs. Should we or should we not worry about how we choose to dress despite knowing the consequences?

 

[Oryx]

Point of order: "leaving nothing to the imagination" means the opposite of the way you're using it here. It means that you can see everything and imagine nothing, while dressing modestly means you see nothing and have to imagine everything.

Also, uh....feminists, not even radical ones, are pro modesty. The radical ones are the ones doing ♥♥♥♥ walks to make the point that nothing you wear means you deserve an attack and to normalize skimpier clothing. Not even the people who are against sex with men as a concept talk at all about modesty. Rape culture has nothing to do with what women are wearing.

Considering there's no evidence that skimpy clothing causes rape, there's no reason to connect the two.

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

Point of order: "leaving nothing to the imagination" means the opposite of the way you're using it here. It means that you can see everything and imagine nothing, while dressing modestly means you see nothing and have to imagine everything.

I've seen this phrase used to describe modest clothing from everyone else on the internet, so I thought that was its true definition.

Also, uh....feminists, not even radical ones, are pro modesty. The radical ones are the ones doing ♥♥♥♥ walks to make the point that nothing you wear means you deserve an attack and to normalize skimpier clothing. Not even the people who are against sex with men as a concept talk at all about modesty. Rape culture has nothing to do with what women are wearing.


Considering there's no evidence that skimpy clothing causes rape, there's no reason to connect the two.

This was based on this image I found regarding clothing policies on women.

 

[Oryx]

I've seen this phrase used to describe modest clothing from everyone else on the internet, so I thought that was its true definition.

No you haven't, because that's not the way the phrase is used. You probably misunderstood it.

This was based on this image I found regarding clothing policies on women.

That's agreeing with what I'm saying - that feminists are not advocating for modesty, and instead are advocating for men to control themselves around women that they're attracted to in tank tops.

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

No you haven't, because that's not the way the phrase is used. You probably misunderstood it.

Actually, I've seen the phrase misused in one of the comics posted in 4chan's /v/ boards discussing feminism. That's where I first saw the use of that phrase for the subject.

That's agreeing with what I'm saying - that feminists are not advocating for modesty, and instead are advocating for men to control themselves around women that they're attracted to in tank tops.

I was referring to the school, which partly inspired me to post this thread, rather than the person who wrote the paper to. As much as I wouldn't be bothered by seeing women wearing tank tops, I only fear how officials react that causes me to feel concern about other's choice of clothing, as I don't want the system to create controversy by old folks, social justice warriors, and feminists.

 

[Monophobia]

I really don't care what anyone wears, honestly. I also really don't have to respect people who dress like wannabe-thugs and prostitutes.

 

[Livewire]

In cases of rape, I think it makes more sense to blame the rapist for their cruel and disgusting behavior than to somehow suggest that the victim is at fault and/or brought it on themselves. No one brings that on themselves, no one deserves to be raped for what they chose to wear or because they "wanted it". People would be able to wear what they like - There arr important things to worry about, haha. And lets remember what constitutes modest depends on your worldview and and cultural upbringing on the concept, which are pretty subjective things.

 

[Oryx]

I really don't care what anyone wears, honestly. I also really don't have to respect people who dress like wannabe-thugs and prostitutes.

Do you think it's reasonable to not respect people who dress in all black?

 

[Monophobia]

Do you think it's reasonable to not respect people who dress in all black?

The color of the clothing is not important. It's how you present yourself. For instance, I could wear black basketball shorts and a black tee. However, a twelve-year-old girl could also wear a too-short black miniskirt and black tank top that shows a little too much.

Trust me, I don't judge people by what they wear, but honestly, when you meet someone, it's the first thing they see. How you dress can determine a lot of things, such as getting a job. I'd rather you look nice than wear something that gives people the wrong impression.

 

[Oryx]

The color of the clothing is not important. It's how you present yourself. For instance, I could wear black basketball shorts and a black tee. However, a twelve-year-old girl could also wear a too-short black miniskirt and black tank top that shows a little too much.

Trust me, I don't judge people by what they wear, but honestly, when you meet someone, it's the first thing they see. How you dress can determine a lot of things, such as getting a job. I'd rather you look nice than wear something that gives people the wrong impression.

Okay, I'll clarify: do you think it's reasonable to not respect those who dress in an emo/goth style? Or a punk rock style? Or a preppy style?

 

[ShivaDF]

Remember that rape is often committed by person who knows the victim well and not by a random stranger on the street.

Women should be able to wear whatever they want without being shamed for it. However, wearing skimpy clothing can cause people to judge a woman. But we shouldn't stop that by making woman quit wearing skimpy clothing, we should stop that by teaching people not to shame others because of what they wear.

Of course, any woman can choose to wear modest clothing to avoid being catcalled or attacked, but plenty of women who don't show skin are still harassed.

 

[Monophobia]

Okay, I'll clarify: do you think it's reasonable to not respect those who dress in an emo/goth style? Or a punk rock style? Or a preppy style?

No, that's self-expression. Totally different than showing your ass or too much cleavage. Just...stay classy, right? Everyone should.

 

[Keiran]

We shouldn't have to worry about how we dress, because there should be no consequences. People that demonize skin just need to get over it.

No, that's self-expression. Totally different than showing your ass or too much cleavage. Just...stay classy, right? Everyone should.

Skin is commonly shown in literally every style of clothing.

I really don't care what anyone wears, honestly. I also really don't have to respect people who dress like wannabe-thugs and prostitutes.

Why is dressing in styles popular with white people "self-expression" but urban style gets you labeled as a thug or prostitute?

 

[Monophobia]

Skin is commonly shown in literally every style of clothing.

Why is dressing in styles popular with white people "self-expression" but urban style gets you labeled as a thug or prostitute?

Well, different scenarios have different clothing needs, correct? Clothing that shows off sensitive areas should be worn in the bedroom, fancy clothing should be worn to special events such as parties and weddings, etc. It's not so much that they dress that way, but they do it at the wrong time. Like...I don't walk around outside in boxers.

Sagging (and other means of showing underwear, boy or girl) shoudn't be something considered as a "fashion" because it's ridiculous. No one should see your undergarments except the people that raised you and people you're "involved' with. Hey, could just be how I was brought up, but I don't like seeing stranger's underwear.

 

[Ivysaur]

My idea is that anybody should be free to wear whatever the hell they please, just taking into account that some places and/or situations require you to wear some more respectful outfits, but that's it. I honestly couldn't care less about what you are wearing to walk your dog- if you are showing your underwear, going barefoot, hoodied in summer, whatever. If you don't like what someone is wearing, don't look at them.

And -obviously I have to add this- if a girl is going on a skimpy outfit, she's not "deserving" anything. As I read somewhere "well you aren't wearing any helmets so I guess you were asking for it if I decide to smash your head with a stick".

 

[PokemonLeagueChamp]

Obviously skimpy clothing does not qualify as an excuse for rape. The problem comes in when people wearing skimpy clothing(or ridiculously saggy pants or whatever else is in nowadays), there just seems to be this expectation that it's all somehow perfectly normal and nobody should look at them like they're wearing anything unusual. Except they are. And with the more extremely skimpy attires that get seen sometimes, the whole point is to attract the gaze. The tendency towards that sort of looking, which sometimes gets called "eye-rape" or something when it's men looking at women, is not something that's going anywhere. It would likely require several generations of people going around literally naked all the time to desexualize exposure of the human body, and for practical reasons I don't see that happening.

 

[Dakotah]

I'm a naturist. That means I prefer little to any--if any at all--clothing in my daily life. I wear it out of necessity because it is the law. However, I should point out that this need for clothing to protect one's modesty is a puritanical concept.

When humans first began wearing clothing, it was not to hide certain parts from showing. Rather it was intended to protect the body from the elements, be it the sun or rain or snow, etc.

This aversion to nudity is a relatively new concept in human history. Now we don't wear clothing merely to protect ourselves from mother nature, we wear it to conform to society's puritanical sensibilities.

If we were meant to wear clothing, we would have been born with it.

 

[Oryx]

I'm a naturist. That means I prefer little to any--if any at all--clothing in my daily life. I wear it out of necessity because it is the law. However, I should point out that this need for clothing to protect one's modesty is a puritanical concept.

When humans first began wearing clothing, it was not to hide certain parts from showing. Rather it was intended to protect the body from the elements, be it the sun or rain or snow, etc.

This aversion to nudity is a relatively new concept in human history. Now we don't wear clothing merely to protect ourselves from mother nature, we wear it to conform to society's puritanical sensibilities.

If we were meant to wear clothing, we would have been born with it.

While I definitely feel you on the wish not to wear clothing in general (I've argued that dress codes on the whole shouldn't exist at all and everyone should be able to be naked if they want), I'm not sure the argument "I would have been born with it if I was meant to have it" works very well. Unless you also walk everywhere, because if you were meant to use cars as transportation, you wouldn't have been born with just two perfectly good feet. Or you don't take medicine because if we were meant to get better after a sickness, we would have been born with the medicine in our bodies. How do you reconcile using other modern conveniences while using that argument about clothing?

 

[Dakotah]

I'm not sure the argument "I would have been born with it if I was meant to have it" works very well.

That comment was made in jest. {:3}

 

[Oryx]

That comment was made in jest. {:3}

Clearly I have been thrown off by the arguments that emo style is self-expression but "thug" style is reprehensible.