kanto and johto vs hoenn and sinnoh?

[MithosFall]

As much as I would want Kanto and Johto to win, I calculated each pokemon that would make a difference in that fight from a scale of 4-10. All other pokemon are 2. The numbers I came up with are:
Kanto / Johto - 804
Hoenn / Sinnoh - 876

 

[Sand Alchemist]

Kanto and Johto. Hoenn and Sinnoh were meh.

 

[DarkChariardX]

oh brother another guy who thinks that numbers corresponds strength..look at hoen and sinnoh's legendaries, they have so many useless legendaries that can be beat by ordinary pokemon, i mean heatran got hurt by a pikachu in movie 12, a PIKACHU. besides that arceus is the god of all pokemon so he cant pick sides so leave him out. besides mewtwo could take them all on at the same time, after all he was designed to be the STRONGEST pokemon, and they "succeded" and as for your statement "That means nothing if it doesn't have the stat power to back it up (Which Mew doesn't, really)." mew indeed has extremely high stats, so your statement is irrelevant!! and mewtwo has more than just strength. it has intelligance, pokemon such as dialga rayquazza and deoxys are just raging power houses who couldnt think their way out of a wet paper bag. and mewtwo could just catch them with his super pokeballs and clone them! perhaps even "super" clone them(the clones with the stripes) thus making mew and mewtwo a EXTREMELY powerfull force, maybe if all of sinnoh and hoen fought mew and mewtwo, they MIGT loose. but if mew and mewtwo have the rest of kanto and johto behind their back....they are quite literally a force to be reckoned with

 

[Niprop]

Battle wise:

Sinnoh would win simply cause it has the GOD of Pokes on its side (with Mewtwo the only thing that stands the chance at beating it), and even then, by the time Mewtwo DOES beat up Arceus, most of the pokes on the other side would be done for. And when the last poke is standing, Mr, Mime jumps from behind and smashes their head!

Mr. Mime is the winner!

In all seriousness though, it's a tough pick. Sinnoh and Kanto get boring after a while, and Johto & Hoenn are then only regions where you can truly go to over and over and over again without losing that sense of adventure.

...

...

I'm at a draw...

 

[Wings Don't Cry]

Very tough, on one hand the hoenn and sinnoh pokemon are outnumbered (keep in mind I consider electivire and other evolutions to be kanto/johto pokemon, this is about their native regions not the video games they first appeared in.)

Their native regions are Sinnoh, why do you think they don't exist in Kanto. There aren't any electrizers in Kanto, so obviously no Electivires either.

Probably Kanto and Johto based on the fact that I think they had the better/stronger legendaries.

I totally agree since Hoenn and Sinnoh had 18 ubers while Kanto and Johto had 5.


I'm pretty sure Hoenn and Sinnoh would win in game terms and anime. Mewtwo is cool and really strong but it can't create continents or bend the fabric of space.

 

[Meepman]

Their native regions are Sinnoh, why do you think they don't exist in Kanto. There aren't any electrizers in Kanto, so obviously no Electivires either.

Keep in mind most of the evolutions weren't even originally in the sinnoh pokedex (that is up until platinum came out), and now thanks to hg/ss the only 4th gen evolutions that aren't in kanto or johto are magnezone leafeon and glaceon. And besides even if those pokemon were sinnoh pokemon they'd still be outnumbered (251 vs. 242).

 

[CensorFairy]

Kanto and Johoto-purely on personal preference.

 

[Kirbychu]

I do believe that Kanto and Johto have their tough Pokemon, I just don't agree with these reasons...

oh brother another guy who thinks that numbers corresponds strength..look at hoen and sinnoh's legendaries, they have so many useless legendaries that can be beat by ordinary pokemon, i mean heatran got hurt by a pikachu in movie 12, a PIKACHU.

Anime=/=Games :/

Heatran is actually one of the toughest Pokemon in the game. He easily fits in with the best tanks and sweepers. He's one of the most frequently used Pokemon for a reason !

besides that arceus is the god of all pokemon so he cant pick sides so leave him out.

This makes absolutely no sense, but okay... Hoenn and Sinnoh still have the superior legends, in numbers and strength/usefulness.

besides mewtwo could take them all on at the same time, after all he was designed to be the STRONGEST pokemon, and they "succeded"

That was over 10 years ago, buddy. Deoxys and Arceus both share that tttle now. Deoxys can literally 2HKO anything, and Arceus is just as much of a monster with his diverse movepool and monster stats.

and as for your statement "That means nothing if it doesn't have the stat power to back it up (Which Mew doesn't, really)." mew indeed has extremely high stats, so your statement is irrelevant!!

Okay then. Tell me why you think Mew is powerful, I dare you.

and mewtwo has more than just strength. it has intelligance, pokemon such as dialga rayquazza and deoxys are just raging power houses who couldnt think their way out of a wet paper bag. and mewtwo could just catch them with his super pokeballs and clone them! perhaps even "super" clone them(the clones with the stripes) thus making mew and mewtwo a EXTREMELY powerfull force, maybe if all of sinnoh and hoen fought mew and mewtwo, they MIGT loose. but if mew and mewtwo have the rest of kanto and johto behind their back....they are quite literally a force to be reckoned with

Thank you. You have motivated me enough to conjure up an image for these sort of occasions.

Spoiler:

 

[Pikachu2007]

Kanto and Johto. There's just no school like the old school. -_-

 

[DonRoyale]

oh brother another guy who thinks that numbers corresponds strength..look at hoen and sinnoh's legendaries, they have so many useless legendaries that can be beat by ordinary pokemon, i mean heatran got hurt by a pikachu in movie 12, a PIKACHU. besides that arceus is the god of all pokemon so he cant pick sides so leave him out. besides mewtwo could take them all on at the same time, after all he was designed to be the STRONGEST pokemon, and they "succeded" and as for your statement "That means nothing if it doesn't have the stat power to back it up (Which Mew doesn't, really)." mew indeed has extremely high stats, so your statement is irrelevant!! and mewtwo has more than just strength. it has intelligance, pokemon such as dialga rayquazza and deoxys are just raging power houses who couldnt think their way out of a wet paper bag. and mewtwo could just catch them with his super pokeballs and clone them! perhaps even "super" clone them(the clones with the stripes) thus making mew and mewtwo a EXTREMELY powerfull force, maybe if all of sinnoh and hoen fought mew and mewtwo, they MIGT loose. but if mew and mewtwo have the rest of kanto and johto behind their back....they are quite literally a force to be reckoned with

Anime =/= Games. kthnx.

You can't even put Uberchu in an equation.

Let's put a greater view of things into this equation. The top 15 most used Pokemon in the standard format are currently:

1. Scizor (Johto)
2. Salamence (Hoenn)
3. Latias (Hoenn)
4. Tyranitar (Johto)
5. Heatran (Sinnoh)
6. Gyarados (Kanto)
7. Metagross (Hoenn)
8. Jirachi (Hoenn)
9. Lucario (Sinnoh)
10. Infernape (Sinnoh)
11. Gengar (Kanto)
12. Swampert (Hoenn)
13. Rotom Heat Forme (Sinnoh)
14. Blissey (Johto)
15. Azelf (Sinnoh)

5 of those are from Kanto/Johto, while 10 of them are from Hoenn/Sinnoh.

Not counting Ubers, but let's observe those, too, since you like to use Mewtwo and legendaries in general in arguments like these (And honestly, don't jump on the "sinnoh's legendaries are ugly and uninventive" bandwagon; we all know that. Try something fresh for once >_>)

The top 15 most Ubers:

1. Kyogre (Hoenn)
2. Groudon (Hoenn)
3. Mewtwo (Kanto)
4. Palkia (Sinnoh)
5. Dialga (Sinnoh)
6. Rayquaza (Hoenn)
7. Giratina Origin Forme (Sinnoh)
8. Scizor (Johto)
9. Wobbuffet (Johto)
10. Darkrai (Sinnoh)
11. Deoxys Speed Forme (Hoenn)
12. Forretress (Johto)
13. Ho-Oh (Johto)
14. Latios (Hoenn)
15. Blissey (Johto)

Again, with 9-6, Hoenn/Sinnoh win this one.

So you can't say that Gen 1-2 Pokemon are generally better than Gen 3-4's Pokemon, because statistics prove otherwise. (Proof here, if you don't believe those numbers. The numbers are uses on Shoddy Battle.net, the most popular online battling server.) There are specifics (Scizor being #1 OU and in the top 10 in Ubers, for example), but in general, people prefer using the later generations' Pokemon to the earlier, and besides that, Generations 1 and 2 owe it to mechanics introduced in the later generations, such as abilities, the special-pyhsical split, and the new moves introduced. Generation 1 was PsychicLand, and Generation 2 was PerishTrappingStallWarLand. At least the later generations introduced mechanics that balanced things out and made certain crappy Pokemon useful. (I'm looking right at you, Scizor)

tl;dr version: More people use Gen 3-4 Pokemon because they're actually useful. Gen 1 and 2 had terrible metagames and their Pokemon sucked until Gens 3 and 4 breathed life into them.

 

[Solo_Kid]

I'd say that Hoenn and Sinnoh win. I love the Kanto and Johto but the newer pokemon are so much stronger. Heck, even the legendaries alone could beat the all the pokemon of Kanto and Johto.

 

[DarkChariardX]

everything you said was completely irrelevant to the fact of strength. people use pokemon because they want to use them, generally has nothing to do with strength....

 

[DonRoyale]

everything you said was completely irrelevant to the fact of strength. people use pokemon because they want to use them, generally has nothing to do with strength....

People don't use Pokemon because they want to use them. Why do you think over half the Eeveelutions aren't on the top 50 most used Pokemon in standard environment? Because they're weak. The same goes for Charizard, Blaziken, and Typhlosion. They can't compete in tournaments because they're weak.

But, OK, then,

The strongest Pokemon in existence is Attack Forme Deoxys; 180 to both offensive stats. Again, Hoenn/Sinnoh wins this one.

Mewtwo's got better overall stats? True; Mewtwo's 680 beats Deoxys' 600.

Arceus. 720 total.

/thread.

 

[Kirbychu]

everything you said was completely irrelevant to the fact of strength. people use pokemon because they want to use them, generally has nothing to do with strength....

...Really?

What do favorites have to do in an argument about a fight between all the Pokemon?

People don't use Pokemon because they want to use them.

A complete lie. I know quite a few competitive battlers that think otherwise, including myself. There are plenty of people who prefer to use their favorites over the Pokemon that apparently "outclasses" them. A common example is Blaziken, who is said to be Infernape's lackey. I like to use UUs on my OU team, and use Delibird on my hail team. Thinking outside the box has its benefits. I understand that many of the highest teams on the ladder are pretty much all the common standards, but many still stick with their favorites, even at the cost of a win.

Why do you think over half the Eeveelutions aren't on the top 50 most used Pokemon in standard environment? Because they're weak.The same goes for Charizard, Blaziken, and Typhlosion. They can't compete in tournaments because they're weak.

Not necessarily true. A lot of Pokemon such as Charizard are only really "weak" because of the evil entry hazard known as Stealth Rock. A lot Pokemon that are considered "weak" do have their uses, and if the player has a good strategy they can conquer a tourney. One of the VGC finalist used an Arcanine.

For the 17 of you who think Kanto and Johto are stronger, would care to explain?

 

[DarkChariardX]

"Okay then. Tell me why you think Mew is powerful, I dare you."
ok here look for yourself
http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-dp/151.shtml

and like i said before buddy, mewtwo could just super clone them all and pwn them, and if you think thats cheating then like i also stated previously, intelligence> brute strength. which mewtwo has plenty of intelligence, perhaps the smartest pokemon ever. what does rayquazza do? go into a blind rage. percect example of how blinded attakcs could easily be defeated. the ordinaries would end up canceling each other out in the end, so basically it would mainly be the legendaries fighting. lets face it, its pretty much a big stalemate between them, but like all stalemates there has to be 1 side that will take the lead, and to be honest that side would be kanto and johto, underdogs always win (call me superstitious if you want) sinnoh and hoenn could win as well, they have very powerful pokemon i admit, oridinaries with legedary stats (salamence,garchomp, are prime examples) but so does johto and kanto,(dragonite, gyarados,tyranitar, and others) remeber my friend, being bias can lead to many crucial mistakes in a debate, try to not be as bias in your reply ok? and try and convince me better than your previous methods, your just pushing shere power and numbers, which can only help in some areas of a true all out battle. unless hoenn and sinnoh gets some true stratagies in their power and numbers, they are screwed.

 

[Kirbychu]

First of all, I'm going to eliminate everything in the post that is meaningless in battle. My comments are in bold.

"Okay then. Tell me why you think Mew is powerful, I dare you."
ok here look for yourself
http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-dp/151.shtml
Oooh, a Serebii net dex entry. How does this prove Mew is powerful again?

and like i said before buddy, mewtwo could just super clone them all and pwn them, and if you think thats cheating then like i also stated previously, intelligence> brute strength. which mewtwo has plenty of intelligence, perhaps the smartest pokemon ever. what does rayquazza do? go into a blind rage. percect example of how blinded attakcs could easily be defeated. the ordinaries would end up canceling each other out in the end, so basically it would mainly be the legendaries fighting. lets face it, its pretty much a big stalemate between them, but like all stalemates there has to be 1 side that will take the lead, and to be honest that side would be kanto and johto, underdogs always win (call me superstitious if you want) sinnoh and hoenn could win as well, they have very powerful pokemon i admit, oridinaries with legedary stats (salamence,garchomp, are prime examples) but so does johto and kanto,(dragonite, gyarados,tyranitar, and others)
I can respect all that is not crossed out.

remeber my friend, being bias can lead to many crucial mistakes in a debate, try to not be as bias in your reply ok?
How exactly am I being biased? I acknowledge the fact that Kanto and Johto have many powerhouses such as Ttar, Gyarados, and of course Scizor.

and try and convince me better than your previous methods, your just pushing shere power and numbers, which can only help in some areas of a true all out battle. unless hoenn and sinnoh gets some true stratagies in their power and numbers, they are screwed.
I am using actual statistics found within the games, while you're arguing that Mewtwo will just capture and clone all the Pokemon, thus winning, a concept that wasn't even created by the actual game devs. Who is at fault here?

 

[Converge]

Despite Hoenn/Sinnoh outnumbering, the first two generations had lots of quality pokemon, which you cant say about the others

 

[DarkChariardX]

hmm i agree with the fact that the mewtwo strategy is a bit overthe top, but even so, i still think the tide could turn either way, i just think kanto and johto would end up the victor, i may be wrong but thats my personol opinion. and if you wanted to know how your being bias, u seem to be against everything about kanto and johto, and only praise sinnoh and hoenn, thats being bias, note how i used "SEEM" you may not be against everything but you sure seem like it, only untill ur previous post did you decide to give kanto and johto a somewhat of a compliment. degrading their legendaries will do the battle no good. deoxys is also a very interesting one, whilst his attack is high his defense is very low, 1 attaack could wipe him right out. and sinnoh and hoenn have many minor legendaries (*legendaries that can be easily overcome by a strong ordinary*) mewtwo can learn attacks of a wide range, and so can nidoking, nidoqueen, tyranitar, gyarados, dragonite, kanghaskan, and rhyhorn, they have strong fighting types such as primeape, machamp, hitmonlee, hitmonchan, and hitmontop, they have also have all of the unknown!!! sinnoh has theirs too, which as why i said previously, it would most likely be a stalemate...if your talking on technical terms, there is no right or wrong here. the reason why i started this post is to find out who do you THINK would win, their is no way of knowing for sure who would actually win. so to bring this debate to an end i say the match would be an unknown decision for me or you to make, but we can have our own opinions.

 

[Kirbychu]

and if you wanted to know how your being bias, u seem to be against everything about kanto and johto, and only praise sinnoh and hoenn, thats being bias, note how i used "SEEM" you may not be against everything but you sure seem like it, only untill ur previous post did you decide to give kanto and johto a somewhat of a compliment.

I didn't feel the need to. Kanto and Johto are winning in the polls, someone had to give Hoenn and Sinnoh the respect they deserve. Trust me, I do stuff like that a lot. =P

degrading their legendaries will do the battle no good. deoxys is also a very interesting one, whilst his attack is high his defense is very low, 1 attaack could wipe him right out. and sinnoh and hoenn have many minor legendaries (*legendaries that can be easily overcome by a strong ordinary*) mewtwo can learn attacks of a wide range, and so can nidoking, nidoqueen, tyranitar, gyarados, dragonite, kanghaskan, and rhyhorn, they have strong fighting types such as primeape, machamp, hitmonlee, hitmonchan, and hitmontop, they have also have all of the unknown!!! sinnoh has theirs too, which as why i said previously, it would most likely be a stalemate... if your talking on technical terms, there is no right or wrong here.

Of course. Everything in Kanto and Johto can be countered by something in Hoenn and Sinnoh and vice-versa.

the reason why i started this post is to find out who do you THINK would win, their is no way of knowing for sure who would actually win. so to bring this debate to an end i say the match would be an unknown decision for me or you to make, but we can have our own opinions.

Agreed.

 

[Meepman]

It seems that this thread has quickly gone from battle of the regions to battle of the legendaries, being that it's the only back up statement comeback people seem to be able to come up with.