4th Gen Mystery Gift Shiny Prevention in D/P/P

[interdpth]

Nice data finding, that's some hope for the PKMN community. I can confirm his tests and such. ^^

Good Job.

 

[randomspot555]

All that proves is that you have digital Pokemon files that check out. And isn't the whole complaint about Pokesav is that, when correctly used, makes hacks indistinguishable from those received in-game and at events? Compared to Action Replay hacks, which are often poorly made and can be identified by visual cues.

This also still doesn't answer questions like:

Looking at other communities, Serebii's trade board bans them on how unlikely it is anyone would actually trade them away, and SkittyonWailord talked to a NOA executive who confirmed that 4th gen event can't be shiny (she even specifically asked if it could be done by saving in front of the deliveryman and re-starting, like SRing for an in-game legend). I checked both Psypokes and Smogon, but they don't have any rules about event trading at all.

More so, how does one get a 4th gen event shiny from a wonder card? Re-setting? IT just comes out as such? You'd think someone would've personally obtained one by now.

EDIT: The NOA exec that Skittyonwailord talked to is Mike Liesik, where she was a judge at one of the Pokemon tournaments. They also had some type of hack checking device called (I think) Nintendo ROM Checker.

Her conversation with him:
Me: So, I was wondering, can any of the D/P events ever be shiny?
Mike: Darkrai, no. I'm not sure on the rest but I don't think so.
Me: Thank you. You saved me alot of SRing time.

EDIT: Just to prove that Mr. Liesik is who he is:

link
link

 

[Stronkadonk]

SVC, the video may not be true.
CME, nor the hacks checker, DO NOT lie. It is all legit.
Although that shiny Regigigas isn't legit, the other 2 are. Therefore, there is proof. You're fighting a battle with the pros that you can't win.

 

[randomspot555]

SVC, the video may not be true.
CME, nor the hacks checker, DO NOT lie. It is all legit.
Although that shiny Regigigas isn't legit, the other 2 are. Therefore, there is proof. You're fighting a battle with the pros that you can't win.

You're right that a program cannot lie, but it can be manipulated. Anyone with Pokesav can modify any PKM file and make it shiny, and do it properly and any hack checker will check it off as okay.

Posting a PKM file, or screen shots of a PKM file being checked, is not evidence of shiny events. The whole complaint over Pokesav is that it can modify anything and make it look legit. Which is a stark contrast from all the 3rd gen Action Replayed Celebi and Jirachi which are clearly hacked. So posting something that was probably made with Pokesav, and then running it through any legit checker, just means that someone with Pokesav did a good job.

A statement from a Pokemon or Nintendo official (see my posts), analysis of the data that contradicts SCVs, an explanation as to how shiny events are ACTUALLY obtained at the event, and for mere curiousity reasons, how you got some 8 year old Japanese kid to trade you their shiny movie Shaymin.

EDIT: I'd also like to hear how the video may not be true, but you put complete faith that her PKM files and screen shots are legit. As I'm fairly certain very few here went to any actual Japanese events, you can't say if they're legit. They might look legit, but the only way to know for sure is to go to the event yourself.

Someone with technical data experience want to weigh in for a second opinion on SCV's data analysis?

 

[Stronkadonk]

You're right that a program cannot lie, but it can be manipulated. Anyone with Pokesav can modify any PKM file and make it shiny, and do it properly and any hack checker will check it off as okay.

Posting a PKM file, or screen shots of a PKM file being checked, is not evidence of shiny events. The whole complaint over Pokesav is that it can modify anything and make it look legit. Which is a stark contrast from all the 3rd gen Action Replayed Celebi and Jirachi which are clearly hacked. So posting something that was probably made with Pokesav, and then running it through any legit checker, just means that someone with Pokesav did a good job.

A statement from a Pokemon or Nintendo official (see my posts), analysis of the data that contradicts SCVs, an explanation as to how shiny events are ACTUALLY obtained at the event, and for mere curiousity reasons, how you got some 8 year old Japanese kid to trade you their shiny movie Shaymin.

EDIT: I'd also like to hear how the video may not be true, but you put complete faith that her PKM files and screen shots are legit. As I'm fairly certain very few here went to any actual Japanese events, you can't say if they're legit. They might look legit, but the only way to know for sure is to go to the event yourself.

Someone with technical data experience want to weigh in for a second opinion on SCV's data analysis?

Maybe you don't get that the Diamond and Pearl Moderators have an even stronger drive than the rest of the staff to delete all hacks. They are specifically given this section, and they take great pride in it. They do not, not one little bit, allow ANY hacks here. I don't think that CME would lie, because she just isn't that way, and because she is the Diamond and Pearl Mod. And if you truly knew anything about events, you would know that all that CME, Livenudes, and I have said is true.

 

[SCV]

SVC, the video may not be true.
CME, nor the hacks checker, DO NOT lie. It is all legit.
Although that shiny Regigigas isn't legit, the other 2 are. Therefore, there is proof. You're fighting a battle with the pros that you can't win.

That is why I gave an explanation along with instructions as to how anyone can compare the lines of code (look at the hex part) that show up on the video to the hex in the rom.

Again, a hack checker is only as good/knowledgeable as the person who programmed it. The knowledge which I am providing here was only figured out a few weeks ago. SHC was programmed long before that. Its not that its lying, its just that the programmer was not aware of what I verified.

However, I don't think that even if SHC's programmer would have included it. He did not program SHC to check for the things that pAC checks for and much less what pAC Legends checks for. Do you notice that he even put a notice saying that SHC is unreliable and should not be used as the final word? That someone more experienced should check?

Maybe you don't get that the Diamond and Pearl Moderators have an even stronger drive than the rest of the staff to delete all hacks. They are specifically given this section, and they take great pride in it. They do not, not one little bit, allow ANY hacks here. I don't think that CME would lie, because she just isn't that way, and because she is the Diamond and Pearl Mod. And if you truly knew anything about events, you would know that all that CME, Livenudes, and I have said is true.

I am not saying that Color Me Evil is lying. This is new information and it took alot of technical skill to figure out. There's no way she could have known. But now that I have confirmed it and provided a way for everyone to check that the code is in the rom, she should take the necessary steps to make sure that these hacks are eliminated from these trade forums.

If you realize that pokemon DP is a video game which is programmed and that we can look at the code (with a disassembler) to study it, then watch the video, and look for the code in the rom, you would know that what I said is true.

Also if I gave Color Me Evil a shiny event Regigigas that passes SHC and says legit does it mean she should declare that it can be shiny? (the answer is no).

 

[randomspot555]

Maybe you don't get that the Diamond and Pearl Moderators have an even stronger drive than the rest of the staff to delete all hacks. They are specifically given this section, and they take great pride in it. They do not, not one little bit, allow ANY hacks here. I don't think that CME would lie, because she just isn't that way, and because she is the Diamond and Pearl Mod. And if you truly knew anything about events, you would know that all that CME, Livenudes, and I have said is true.

Being a mod is great, and I am not one to bash. However, being a mod does not give someone an inherent advantage of knowledge on events, or anything of the sort. I have a friend who manages a comic book shop. He knew jack all about comics before working there, but has great customer service skills and knows how to handle ordering inventory and all that great stuff. The title of Moderator does not give someone more or less credibility, it just means they were chosen to moderate an area.

When shiny events were banned from the site, her shop still traded them, as did many others. Hate to break it to you, but being a mod does not make you infallible. To CME's credit, she isn't playing the "I'm a mod" card and it's good she can post in a thread without doing so. But you're not helping your case if one of your points is "a mod agrees with me."

Yes, I do know about events. I'm not going to say more or less, because that's not a judgment anyone here can make. But why can't someone answer my questions, besides "trust us, we know"?

Why does someone who actually works for PUSA say Alamos Darkrai cannot be shiny?
How are shiny events actually obtained when one goes to an event? Soft resetting IE same 1/8000 chance every shiny has? Some other method?

Seeriously, having a PKM file that passes a test is not proof that there are shiny events. You all do know about Pokesav, right? How it can either make Pokemon, or modify existing ones, and change the intricate details so they'll pass any hack checker, right? So how is everyone so certain these files are legit?

Please note I am not accusing anyone here of hacking the events, modifying files, or anything of the sort. But if you didn't obtain it yourself, you'll have no way of knowing as long as the hacker did a good job.

 

[Stronkadonk]

*Groan*
Then why don't you just soft reset yourself up a shiny TRU Dragonite or something?

 

[SCV]

*Groan*
Then why don't you just soft reset yourself up a shiny TRU Dragonite or something?

Did you watch the video? There is code in the game that prevents it from ever being shiny. If you did get lucky and get a PID that would have made it shiny the game calculates another until you get one that is not shiny.

This happens for any pokemon which does not have a constant PID (which results in constant nature, gender, ability)

 

[Zebra Thunderhead]

Well, it seems this has gone on long enough. This thread spiraled downwards into a flame war and nothing really got accomplished on either side. I'm not going to ban shiny events from this forum because there's no real proof on either side. People may trade for shiny events at their own risk. The side that believes shiny events are not legitmate aren't really giving the other side a chance, so rather than continually bicker about this, this is just going to be closed and if you have any more disagreements about whether shiny events are legitmate or not, please keep them to PM or VM.

-CLOSED-