Recommend a physical wall for this team?

[joeyboy]

Trying to make a mostly UU/RU team if possible or at least less commonly seen mons (including new megas)

So right now I have no mega slot used up, so I could use one for my physical wall, though not sure what I'd use yet.

Currently the team is using Furfrou. Now he's surprisingly good and has won me several matches via toxic stalling a couple of remaining physical attackers, but he has serious case of four moveslot syndrome. Right now he has no damaging moves so anything he can't toxic or that hits too hard to be worn down, is a no go.

So far my five alternatives are...

1) Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
Bold, 252HP/Def

Will-o-wisp
Hex
Knock off
Pain split

2) Mega Aggron
Impish, 252 HP/Def

Iron defense
Heavy slam
Sleep talk
Rest

3) Gliscor @ Toxic orb
Impish, 244HP/248Def, 16 Speed

Earthquake
Taunt
Ice Fang
Roost

4) Cresselia @ Leftovers
Bold, 252 HP/Def

Moonlight
Toxic
Ice beam
Psychic (unless I use a HP here, fighting maybe?)

5) Mew @ Leftovers
Bold, 252 HP/Def (might change it a bit and add a little speed?)

Roost
Barrier
Psychic/Toxic
Aura sphere



Other mons in the team are...

Porygon2 (special wall)
Sigilyph
Hitmonlee
Zoroark
Gyarados

I would say the team fears fighting moves a fair bit, Infernape is fairly common and is probably the biggest threat to the team as it generally packs close combat and thunder punch, life orb sets decimate most of my mons.

So for this reason I am leaning towards either Cofagrigus, Mew or Cresselia.

Just wondering what folks think is the best choice or if they have alterations/totally different suggestions?

 

[PlatinumDude]

You have too many physical walls, yet you ask for another one? ._. Just putting that out there.

Mega Aggron's current set is terrible; it has better things to do than set up Iron Defense:
-Stealth Rock
-Heavy Slam/Iron Head
-Thunder Wave/Ice Punch
-Earthquake/Rock Slide
Nature: Relaxed
EVs: 252 HP/16 Def/240 SDef
Item: Aggronite
Ability: Sturdy

or
-Rest
-Sleep Talk
-Heavy Slam/Iron Head
-Earthquake/Ice Punch
Nature: Relaxed
EVs: 252 HP/16 Def/240 SDef
Item: Aggronite
Ability: Sturdy

Shadow Ball > Hex. Hex is too unreliable, and Shadow Ball is the better STAB for non-statused opponents. Also, Cofagrigus should use offensive Trick Room, as most of your Pokemon are currently not that fast:
-Trick Room
-Nasty Plot
-Shadow Ball
-Hidden Power (Fighting)
Nature: Quiet
EVs: 248 HP/252 SAtk/8 SDef
Item: Life Orb/Leftovers

Here are better Gliscor sets for you to use:
-Substitute
-Toxic
-Protect
-Earthquake
Nature: Impish
EVs: 244 HP/32 Def/224 Spe
Item: Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal

or
-Earthquake
-Stealth Rock/Toxic
-U-turn/Knock Off
-Protect/Roost
Nature: Impish
EVs: 244 HP/208 Def/56 Spe
Item: Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal

Don't think about using Barrier. This make Mew further setup bait. Also, half of this team is vulnerable to Pursuits from Tyranitar and Scizor, and that's bad.

Don't think about Hitmonlee. It's not a good OU Pokemon because it's very prone to priority. And don't think about Furfrou either; its lack of reliable recovery wears it down.

Honestly, I'm not sure on what to do with this team.

 

[Evoker102]

Avalugg, idk what tier he's in now, but saved me from M-Garchomp a lot!

I usually go with this:
Avalugg @ Leftovers
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 126 Def / 252 HP / 4 SDef / 126 Atk
Relaxed Nature
- Avalanche
- Earthquake
- Recover
- Curse


He's already slow, so curse isn't bad. I know the EVs are really spread out, but it's worth it. The defense is 450+, HP is about 380, and attack is 290? Since he's slow avalanche usually gets the boost. I really hope I helped!

 

[PlatinumDude]

Avalugg, idk what tier he's in now, but saved me from M-Garchomp a lot!

I usually go with this:
Avalugg @ Leftovers
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 126 Def / 252 HP / 4 SDef / 126 Atk
Relaxed Nature
- Avalanche
- Earthquake
- Recover
- Curse


He's already slow, so curse isn't bad. I know the EVs are really spread out, but it's worth it. The defense is 450+, HP is about 380, and attack is 290? Since he's slow avalanche usually gets the boost. I really hope I helped!

I disagree 100% on this. Avalugg is a terrible option because of its bad defensive typing, which offsets its incredibly high Defense. It's also incredibly vulnerable to special attackers (like the above set is).

 

[Onicon]

Are you playing Smogon UU? We cannot really determine from your post because Infernape is still OU the last time we have checked, and so are Gliscor and Gyarados. Anyways, UU has a few spendid physical walls.

Slowbro is very sturdy against Fighting types, especially Mienshao and Hawlucha, and can heal itself via Slack Off and Regenerator. It still is versatile enough to run multiple set like psysical tank or CM as well as as Specs that can heal itself. Much better than Mew can hope to be, at least in the wall aspect.

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 4 Spd / 252 Def / 252 HP
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Slack Off
- Thunder Wave / Calm Mind

In terms of raw stats, Hippowdon rules. It is also the most sturdy weather inducer in the game thanks to Slack Off, something Groudon would kill for. Sand Stream allows you to wear the opponent down while you are walling them.
Normally people go for the obvious physical wall set, but in our opinion Hippowdon is best off as a mixed wall. See, how many physical wall can claim that they counter Mega-Houndoom will SR.

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs Lv 100: 252 SDef / 248 HP / 8 Spd
EVs Lv 50: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 Spd
Careful Nature
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Whirlwind / Ice Fang
- Stealth Rocks

Those are the best UU walls the game has to offer. Abuse them.

 

[Azire]

You have too many physical walls, yet you ask for another one? ._. Just putting that out there.

I believe what he posted was other options he was thinking of. The only other team member I saw mentioned was Porygon2 that he is using as a Special Wall. He mentioned Furfrou as the Pokémon being replaced.

 

[PlatinumDude]

I believe what he posted was other options he was thinking of. The only other team member I saw mentioned was Porygon2 that he is using as a Special Wall. He mentioned Furfrou as the Pokémon being replaced.

Derped.


It's better to post the team's full move sets, natures, EVs, items and abilities so that we have a better idea on what you really need.

 

[Onicon]

Technically he mentioned the whole team. It is barely more than a sidenote, though.

Other mons in the team are...

Porygon2 (special wall)
Sigilyph
Hitmonlee
Zoroark
Gyarados

The main problem is that Gyarados kicks the whole team up to OU. It should be replaced with something in the lower tiers for this team to be valid.

 

[joeyboy]

Hey folks thanks for all the information so far! Apologies on not giving more information about the team. This isn't really designed to be the perfectly competitive team, I'm using this for wifi battles generally and it's more a group of pokemon I don't seem to see very often which have strategies I like. Amusingly it's probably won me more battles than I had expected, I suppose people don't always know how to handle stuff which isn't OU top 10 lol.

Anyway although I technically don't have to limit myself to UU stuff, I hadn't realized Gyarados was OU, I never seem to see it haha. So if I were to replace it, what would be suggested as an alternative physical attacker?

I gave Mew a try, though a more baton pass style one, sometimes useful but not that great really.

I like the suggested Slowbro set, may go with that.

Though Hippowdon looks good too...and it's always useful to be able to disrupt your opponents weather.

 

[Sopheria]

Just to point out, isn't Infernape OU this generation?

Anyway, I would go with what Onicon suggested. Though I don't have much experience with Hippowodon, I know first hand that Slowbro is a brick wall to physical attackers, especially fighting types, and with a few uses of Calm Mind it becomes a pretty good special wall as well. Its biggest threats in UU are Electivire's Wild Charge, Absol's Sucker Punch and Night Slash, and Mega Heracross's Megahorn. But even then none of the above can OHKO Slowbro unboosted.

Another option I would personally go with is Cresselia, but with a slight adjustment:

Cresselia @ Leftovers
Bold, 252 HP/ 252 Def / 4 Sp Def
Moonlight
Toxic
Reflect
Psychic

Also, I personally feel think that Furfrou can work as a decent physical wall if you give it Cotton Guard. Just make sure you switch out on potential threats, especially Pokemon with Mold Breaker (most of which in UU are fighting type). The lack of recover is a problem, but it still works well in the late game when most of its threats have been taken care of by other Pokemon. This is the set I usually run:

Furfrou @ Leftovers
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
-Cotton Guard
-Toxic
-Return
-U-turn

 

[joeyboy]

I'm going to trial that Slowbro set for now. My only concern about it is that it has a weakness to electric, something the team doesn't appreciate (with Sigilyph and Gyarados sharing it, well...unless Gyarados gets replaced haha).

 

[joeyboy]

Just as a quick query, if I did replace Gyarados and made this truly OU free, could a Life orb/scarf Darmanitan be a good option for my team?

 

[PlatinumDude]

Just as a quick query, if I did replace Gyarados and made this truly OU free, could a Life orb/scarf Darmanitan be a good option for my team?

Darmanitan isn't an OU Pokemon, so you're safe.

Also, posting the full team would be appreciated.

 

[joeyboy]

Okay here's the full team, as I say I appreciate this isn't the most effective competitive team...

1) Zoroark @ Choice specs
Impish
EV's: 252 Sp. Att, 252 Speed, 4HP

Dark pulse
Flamethrower
Focus blast
Trick

This guy usually leads, though not always, it's usually very effective, often knocking out two mons, or tricking specs onto something which really doesn't want it. Shame you can't trick a megastone prior to its activation though haha.

2) Sigilyph @ Flame orb
Bold
EV's: 252 HP, 200 Def, 56 Def

Cosmic power
Stored power
Psycho shift
Roost

Standard fare for Sigilyph really, against the right opponent it has caused many a rage quit/disconnect.

3) Porygon2 (Trace) @ eviolite
Calm
EV's: 252 HP, 252 Sp.Def, 4 Def

Recover
Toxic
Discharge
Ice beam

4) Gyarados (Moxie) @ Life orb
Jolly
EV's: 252 Att, 252 Speed, 4 HP

Dragon dance
Waterfall
EQ
Ice fang

5) Hitmonlee (Unburden) @ Liechi berry
Adamant
EV's: 252 Att, 252 Speed, 4 HP

Reversal
Endure
EQ
Stone edge

6) Insert physical wall here!

 

[joeyboy]

Looking at alternatives to Gyarados, I was wondering if a Swords dance Virizion set would be any good?

 

[PlatinumDude]

If this is a UU team, remove Gyarados. Suicune, Cloyster, Swampert, Jellicent and Barbaracle are fine substitutes.

Suicune:
-Calm Mind
-Surf/Hydro Pump
-Ice Beam
-Hidden Power (Electric)
Nature: Timid/Modest
EVs: 252 SAtk/4 SDef/252 Spe
Item: Life Orb/Leftovers

or
-Rest
-Sleep Talk
-Scald
-Calm Mind/Roar
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Item: Leftovers

Cloyster:
-Shell Smash
-Icicle Spear
-Rock Blast
-Razor Shell/Hydro Pump
Nature: Jolly/Naive
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Item: White Herb/Lum Berry
Ability: Skill Link

Swampert:
-Stealth Rock
-Scald/Waterfall
-Earthquake
-Toxic/Roar
Nature: Relaxed/Impish
EVs: 240 HP/16 Atk/252 Def
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Torrent

or
-Waterfall
-Earthquake
-Ice Punch
-Superpower/Stone Edge
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 208 HP/252 Atk/4 SDef/44 Spe
Item: Choice Band
Ability: Torrent

or
-Waterfall
-Earthquake
-Ice Punch
-Stealth Rock/Roar/Toxic
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 240 HP/252 Atk/16 Def
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Torrent

Jellicent:
-Scald/Shadow Ball
-Will-o-Wisp
-Recover
-Taunt
Nature: Bold
EVs: 248 HP/172 Def/88 Spe
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb/Cursed Body

or
-Scald
-Shadow Ball/Ice Beam
-Will-o-Wisp/Toxic
-Recover
Nature: Calm
EVs: 248 HP/172 SDef/84 Spe
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb

Barbaracle:
-Shell Smash
-Stone Edge
-Razor Shell
-Cross Chop/Earthquake
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Item: White Herb/Mystic Water/Splash Plate
Ability: Tough Claws

Edit: I think Cobalion may be better, since Virizion shares weaknesses with Hitmonlee:
-Swords Dance
-Close Combat
-Iron Head
-Stone Edge/X-Scissor/Hidden Power (Ice)
Nature: Jolly/Naive
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Item: Life Orb

 

[Super Bling]

Avalugg, idk what tier he's in now, but saved me from M-Garchomp a lot!

I usually go with this:
Avalugg @ Leftovers
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 126 Def / 252 HP / 4 SDef / 126 Atk
Relaxed Nature
- Avalanche
- Earthquake
- Recover
- Curse


He's already slow, so curse isn't bad. I know the EVs are really spread out, but it's worth it. The defense is 450+, HP is about 380, and attack is 290? Since he's slow avalanche usually gets the boost. I really hope I helped!

I second this, sure it has "bad defensive typing but honestly most people should have something to check special attackers, like Chansey or Blissey. Yeah, Avalugg totally cripples Mega Chomp. I ran a Curse+Gyroball set. and practically the same EV spread. Worked wonders on the battle sim.

 

[PlatinumDude]

I second this, sure it has "bad defensive typing but honestly most people should have something to check special attackers, like Chansey or Blissey. Yeah, Avalugg totally cripples Mega Chomp. I ran a Curse+Gyroball set. and practically the same EV spread. Worked wonders on the battle sim.

Disagreeing.

1. Its bad defensive typing offsets its incredible physical bulk

2. It's an easy target for special attackers. That above set is very prone to them, as Curse doesn't buff Special Defense.

3. It falls to top threats such as Aegislash, Tyranitar and Charizard (OU), as well as Mienshao, Darmanitan, Chandelure and Heracross (UU).

4. Avalanche is weak if Avalugg isn't hit by an attack.

 

[Pryze]

I second this, sure it has "bad defensive typing but honestly most people should have something to check special attackers, like Chansey or Blissey. Yeah, Avalugg totally cripples Mega Chomp. I ran a Curse+Gyroball set. and practically the same EV spread. Worked wonders on the battle sim.

I don't really want to be 'that guy', but given how commonplace mixed M-Garchomp is, and the fact that only CB and SD Chomp don't carry Fire Blast, Avalugg can hardly be considered something that 'cripples' it, with rocks up, it's not even a check.

0 SpA Mega Garchomp Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Avalugg: 338-398 (85.7 - 101%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO (OHKO's if rocks are up.)

Even if it is a banded Chomp:

252 Atk Choice Band Garchomp Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 126+ Def Avalugg: 162-192 (41.1 - 48.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

It's 2HKO'd by Stone Edge if rocks are up, meaning that it can't switch in on it. Even if they're not up, it doesn't enjoy taking either of the two moves at all. Not saying that Avalugg is a bad wall or anything, I just don't think it has much of a place in the higher tiers, given that it's atrocious typing severely hinders its ability to stomach near any hit, and it's primarily outclassed by other defensive tanks in both OU and UU.

Anyway,

I would definitely start looking for a bulky Water-type or Rock-type. As it stands, your team is horribly weak to anything Fire-type or Dark-type, having no switch ins whatsoever; most notably Banded Victini and Honchkrow. V-Create decimates your entire team, and nothing wants to switch in on Honchkrow, especially if it's a sub variant. I'd recommend running a Rhyperior.

Rhyperior@Leftovers
Trait: Solid Rock.
Impish Nature (+Def -Sp.A)
252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
-Stealth Rock
-Earthquake
-Dragon Tail
-Rock Blast/Stone Edge.

And of course, Slowbro and Cofagrigus, which were stated somewhere above, also work very well.

 

[Sopheria]

For dealing with V-Create, what about a Physically Defensive Arcanine? It can switch in to any fire type move and take no damage thanks to Flash Fire.

Arcanine @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
Nature: Impish
EV's: 252 HP / 188 Def / 68 Spd
- Flare Blitz
- Extreme Speed
- Morning Sun
- Will-O-Wisp

While it doesn't solve the problem of the lack of a switch in for Honchcrow, it does deal with Honchcrow quite well. Flare Blitz does a good amount of damage on its own:

0 Atk Arcanine Flare Blitz vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Honchkrow: 237-279 (69.5 - 81.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (a good chance of knocking it out of Substitute range, by the way).

If boosted by Flash Fire it's a guaranteed OHKO. Without the boost Extremespeed can be used to finish it off, and it takes priority over Sucker Punch.