Why don't you use your commonsense for a chance ??
Your treating some non-existent Anime character as real people with real feeling when its obvious that all their will is controlled by the writers.
Agatha was forced by the writers to encourage Ash for Battle Frontier ! Even if she doesn't act like being forced.
Its just like Ash was forced to lose to the likes of Trash Trip and Cameron because Writer wanted them to win .
And Instate of being Ashamed and go on a training journey , Ash happy-happy go on Kiddy adventure shamelessly.
Its because Writer wanted him too !
They still weren't "forced", actually. Forcing someone usually implies they're made to do something against their will.
What if He doesn't ?
What if Misty reappear in XY series as a Water pokemon Master without ever leaving the Gym ?
What if Misty claimed that she love being the Gym-leader ?
There are so many "What if" Scenario so you can not claim anything based on it.
She never CLAIMED to love being that (and besides, if she really loved it, she wouldn't have left in the first place, heck, she wouldn't have even DELAYED leaving the gym at all). And newsflash, the only way she'll reappear in the XY series is if A., they show her watching the league (which won't give any indication of whether she's a WPM), or B., she actually LEAVES the Gym and headed to Kalos.
Are you really comparing Real World with Pokemon World ? You can't put your pet inside little capsule in Real World.
Actually, you can. They're called "carry on" cages, or doghouses, or just non-portable cages.
Misty's sister confirmed to have their own pokemon! Its safes to assume that they took their close one with them.
Not really. They showed EXTREMELY little interest in accepting challengers and would rather give away badges than fight. It's extremely unlikely they would have brought their Pokémon along even if they DID have them. Besides, the only Pokémon they are explicitly confirmed to have is Goldeen in Episode 7 (it's unclear whether Seel/Dewgong actually counts as one of their Pokémon), and while we could assume that the Seaking and other Water Pokémon present were theirs (barring Starmie and Horsea), it's pretty obvious they didn't take them along going by some of the Hosos.
Their absolutely no confirmation that Filnt didn't brought in pokemon Considering that we only seen Brock's pokemon in the gym.
Filnt probably had his pokemon in his Pokeball like his wife.
We've got a bunch of Golem according to the Hosos, which were clearly Flint's, and the other trainers barring Forrest weren't even old enough to run the gym, and considering we DID see some Golems in Grating Spaces, chances are he DIDN'T take them along.
May herself said that She wasn't allowed to travel without A pokemon !
What more then you need ?
How about the fact that Max was even allowed to travel at all DESPITE not only not even having ANY Pokémon, but the fact that he wasn't even of age to become a trainer yet?
We seen enough! Those girls wasn't actual trainers to begin with , They were just bunch of Fangirls who wanted Photo with a Hot Actor.
If they weren't actual trainers, there's absolutely NO way they could have even entered the tournament in the first place. They had Pokémon on their person, so they ARE by definition Pokémon Trainers.
That's Why , Even Original Jessie reached the final round even though Team Rocket was on their weakest in Original series.
As DBZ Fan pointed out before, JJM even in the original series had varying skill level. Heck, in Episode 3, they actually took out the same Pidgeotto that nearly KILLED the Caterpie Ash had (the same one, BTW, that beat them). And don't even get me started on how they actually nearly defeated Ash in the Viridian Gym episode.
But it shows that Misty had more faith in others pokemon then her own pokemon !
Again, as DBZ Fan pointed out beforehand, of Misty's Pokémon on hand, Horsea and Goldeen were not even CLOSE to good for use on dry land in battle, and it's not even clear if Togepi was even hatched or discovered yet at the time the episode occurred, and even if it was, there's no way it could go for battle there. Of them, only Staryu, Starmie, and Psyduck would have been appropriate for the battling environment, and even then, only Staryu and possibly Starmie were actually reliable, as Psyduck is a wild card and is more likely than not to cost her a victory as well unless he gets a headache.
And besides, Ash also relied on other's Pokémon as well, like in that Pokémon testing evaluation and especially that firefighting Pokémon competition in Johto where he had to rely on Misty's Staryu and Psyduck. Are you all of a sudden going to claim he's so pathetic he needs others help as well?
Rare Candy doesn't make Pokemon building Size !
Not in the games. This is the anime, though, and besides, the Japanese name for the item was indeed the same as the Japanese name for Rare Candy, so yes, it IS that.
he's no longer the Directors , It doesn't matter what he know or Don't know .
A movie was made to promote giratina & Plantium ! That movie had a Director and Producers.
He DOES act as the storyboard artist, though, and it would have been necessary for him to have SOME idea for what the movie's about as well as what the film is essentially promoting, and possibly even Platinum (and besides, they were advertising these bits in CoroCoro anyhow, so it would have been impossible for him to miss that as well).
Since when Rating determine money ? Rating only show how many people watching it on TV .
The main reason many low rated anime (Yugioh , Battle Spirit and PreCure) still running because of all the money they earn.
There are a lot of meaning behind that phrase such as Production cost , lawsuit , Dept etc etc.
First of all, ratings are basically the lifeblood of TV, and if they have low ratings, they also get low revenue, and if they decrease, there's indeed the possibility of them going into the red. Second of all, there's the fact that ratings are also tied into revenue generated by advertisements, and if people don't watch, they don't get revenue through that, either.
Disney Film=/=Anime !
They are many more anime couple with no love in first sight such as Ranma & Akane (Ranma1/2) , Ushi and Misaki (Maid Sama) , Ryuji & Taiga (Toradora) etc etc .
Better and interesting couples screw "Love at first sight" in Anime .
And again, there have been plenty of animes that dealt with love at first sight as well. Pokémon with Serena technically had that, as did Brock for most girls he sees, or how Bulma fell for both General Blue and Zarbon in two non-consecutive events, Chi-Chi falling for Goku instantly, etc., etc.
Pokemon Master is still mystery and possibly a made-up title since Ash is only one to ever mention Pokemon Master .
Plus , Ash already explained at the end that his goal is to participate in Champion league to be Champion Master in DP.
However , Whirl Cup only give the title of "Alpha Omega" , Not Master !
Alpha Omega basically means the same thing as Master. It means you have absolute mastery over something, that you are the beginning and the end of something.
If Viola , Clair , Fantina , Byron , Grant and Candice leave the Gym for other business then Why can't Misty ?
Does PIA goal is to make Kento Gym-leader life miserable ?
Who took care of Clair's Gym when she appear in Deckora Island and decide to go to Unova to visit Drayden and Dragon Village ?
Unova is very far away then Jotho considering that Pikachu was treated like a Rare pokemon.
Compare to that , Misty leaving Gym to compete in Whirl Cup is nothing ! She might have already won Whirl Cup and became Alpha Omega.
As DBZ Fan already pointed out, we don't know about Clair, Viola, Byron, Grant, and Candice's situations (it's not even clear if they have a substitute, not to mention they don't visit the gym while they are not present), and as far as Fantina and Roarke, DBZ Fan pointed out that the less-trafficked routes are a bit more lenient anyways, so there's that to consider (and besides, in the case of Fantina, the only reason that occurred was because at the time, the series was still stuck on the first two Diamond and Pearl games. Platinum wasn't even released until after Crasher Wake was beaten, which by that point it was already too late to change it. Now, maybe if Platinum was released around the time of Gardenia, we could have Ash challenging Fantina first).
It was mentioned 3 time and you claiming all of them were Dub added .
Even in AG , Ash told May that there won't be another Grand Festival for a year when she decided to sacrifice her only chance to compete there to find Max.
Actually, when I said "dub added", I was referring to the Viridian Gym episode.
Except , If Misty start collecting badge then she will be Ash's rival , not protagonist !
I never said Misty should start collecting Gym Badges, just do a token quest, and if she stayed in AG rather than getting the axe, she definitely would have gotten a token quest.
No she didn't , Considering that she only followed Ash around !
No, she did FAR more than just follow Ash around. I can even name plenty of instances disproving that claim, like how she got everyone out of the St. Anne, or how she saved Porta Vista from the Tentacool and Tentacruel. Heck, she was also effectively responsible for guaranteeing that Ash actually fight Blaine (and believe me, had it not been for her, Ash would have probably called it quits on Cinnabar under the belief that it truly was gone, going by how Gary basically decided against going to Cinnabar gym precisely because he thought it was shut down).
You might not noticed that Pikachu was right beside Manaphy and even he couldn't do anything !
Oh I noticed, and Pikachu in all fairness alongside Manaphy were facing away, but still, it was pretty obvious that he was coming over to them and going to ambush them.
May was already too concern about Ash's possibility of "dying" when Phantom sneak up.
Too concerned about Ash dying? Ah, first of all, that's not a reason to not even attempt to do anything at all. Gohan was very concerned about his dad croaking from Cell, yet when Cell returned to Earth, he STILL attempted to fight Cell, and even Vegeta attempted to fight Cell as well after witnessing Trunks dying (in fact, Trunks dying WAS the reason he basically suicidally challenged Cell). Also, at least in Anime filler, Gohan actually opted to go challenge Frieza alone when it seemed like the latter killed Goku, even if it meant disobeying his dad's wish for him to evacuate Planet Namek.
Plus , Did you even seen her Squirtal ? It was itself younger and less stronger then your average Squirtal.
Do you honestly think it has enough strength to carry May and follow Phantom ?
Considering it's weather altering abilities in that time travel episode (where Dogasu when comparing that episode had even gone so far as to compare Squirtle to a member of the Son family, and it wasn't meant to be a compliment at all), yeah, actually, it very much COULD do so. Heck, one of the reasons it's in the Scrappy heap right now is practically BECAUSE of its overpowered nature especially for a youngster. And who said it had to carry May. All I said was that she have it pursue Phantom. I never said anything about May hitching a ride on it.
Plus , Ash shown up before May could do anything !
Had it been me in May's position, I would have used the few amount of moments between the abduction and Ash's emergence to actually call out Squirtle and save Manaphy. Sure, I'll probably recall it when Ash is nearby, but at least I'd actually ATTEMPT to do something beforehand.
Plus , Why didn't Ash used Corephise in the Sea Temple ? Why he decide to run when he had Sceptile to fight Phantom ? Was he a Coward ?
That's not even close to the same thing, especially when it wasn't Manaphy's life being in danger from an abduction. And while I do think that Ash should have used Corphish to aid in retrieving the Sea Crown, I didn't consider his not using it a cowardly action, especially when it was at least mitigated by the fact that he actually put his own life on the line to save it. And I really don't see how Sceptile would have been of any use in a flooding temple. Newsflash, Sceptile isn't even a water-type, he's a grass type.
Lance is the Champion so obviously Clair is inferior to him !
That's what I'm getting at, and that's why Clair is NOT a master by any means.
Dreyden is a Dragon Master so do you think he stronger then Lance ? Not to mention , he is a Gym-leader as well .
You know full well that that's only because they had a different method of going for mastery for that bit than just becoming Champion.
Dragon is far superior type then Water pokemon ! And it hard to find one because of their rarity.
What makes you think that it's superior. It's true that it's rare, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's absolutely superior to Water Types.
So , A Dragon Master should have higher position .
Not exactly. After all, the Kalos champion was a Pure Water-Type Master.
I said "Resemble" !
Obviously the Anime does little tuinking with Ash's outfit to make it look different.
Except it doesn't even RESEMBLE their outfits. At best, Lucas' DP outfit comes the closest to ACTUALLY resembling Ash's outfit. The others, no, they actually have several discernible differences.
What if Ash get replace by a new protagonist ? Are you going to claim that Ash wasn't the protagonist in previous series because he got replaced.
May was Ash's Co-star in AG Series , Thats the truth .
Ah, yeah, I would claim that Ash isn't the main protagonist, at least not of the current series. And for the record, Ash STILL got more focus than May did in terms of goals.
He did it because Misty provoked him !
He wanted to proof Caterpies strength and send it before thinking ! He didn't knew that Caterpie will get killed there since he was thoughtless who act without thinking.
Are you kidding me? Had I been in Ash's position, I'd actually avoid using Caterpie specifically BECAUSE I'd know, even as a rookie trainer, that using him against a bird-like Pokémon is a VERY bad idea, regardless of whether I want to prove his strength, and for the record, as you probably already know from my posts, I'm not exactly the best in regards to impulse control, either.
Misty didn't stand up for Caterpie , She was simply Criticizing Ash .
Yes, actually, she did. Do you really think that she'd scold Ash for endangering Caterpie if she didn't stand up to him? It's called common sense.
There were other hint as well ! Not to mention that Teacy was in Misty gym in BW seires .
Not really. As DBZ Fan pointed out, there actually weren't even that much hints to Orangeshipping at all. Also, I don't recall Tracey ever accessing Misty's gym in the Best Wishes series at all. Doesn't he usually call in from Oak's lab anyway?
Brock get lovestruck by every girl he sees !
Not every girl. In fact, believe it or not, he didn't go gaga over one of Surge's fellow trainers, and that's despite the fact that said trainer was a girl. In fact, he barely even reacted to the Nurse Joy in Vermilion City either. And he certainly wasn't attracted to that Gastly's old geezer form, and by definition, she WAS a girl. Heck, the wedding-obsessed girl from Johto who actually ended up falling for him and was essentially a female Brock actually had Brock being caught off-guard.
Dawn didn't had a heartfelt goodbye , Pipup did !
She was shown crying as they were leaving on a ship while waving (I saw the facial expression in that GIF, so don't claim that I don't even know what I'm talking about). Of course she did have a heartfelt goodbye.
Dawn was shown sad like May when Ash was leaving.
No, May wasn't sad at all. Instead, May just left Ash then and there without even a HINT of sadness. In fact, the ONLY one of the AG group who was even REMOTELY sad at the group splitting apart. Even several of May's fans, including that treacherous ex-Misty fan Cybercubed/Scott85/Gliscor'd, admitted that her final episode was EXTREMELY rushed and that May essentially just said "goodbye" and ran off. And based on the way they were talking in that episode review on SPPf Forums, it's obvious that she didn't even have a hint at sadness at all.
Does anyone in the game calls him Water Pokemon Master ?
Yes, at least in the sense that he was a Pokémon Master with an all-water type team.
We are talking about Anime.
Your point being?
I said Pokemon to be like Gintama ! Since when Gintama is serious as Batman ?
If machomuu is anything to go by, it IS as serious as Batman, at least in the first season.
Anyways, as the topic states, Ash REALLY needs to age especially if we're going to have his journey come across as plausible. Lack of aging may work with something like the Simpsons which deals with a floating timeline and negative continuity, but not with Pokémon, where the nature of the story pretty much REQUIRES a large basis in continuity as well as a strict timetable.
We don't know if they were trainers or weren't. Because you can be both trainer an fangirl wanting to get photo with your favorite movie star.
Yeah, and besides, considering they HAD Pokémon on-hand, it's pretty obvious they indeed WERE trainers. And quite honestly, I hated those Fiorello Fangirls just as much as I do Love Hina, May, Dawn, Maron, Battle Vixens, and the like, and for the same reasons (heck, the Fiorello Fangirls and Love Hina are practically THE reason why my name for the Female Anime Stereotype: Hina Stereotypes, even HAS a name beyond Female Anime Stereotype), yet even I have to acknowledge that they ARE trainers.
Given how some of girls they faced put up a fight knowing about pokemon technniques,strategy and what moves to use. Chances are how Misty and Jessie weren't only trainers participating in Princess festival tournament.
Yeah, they most certainly weren't the only trainers (kind of pointless to call it a contest if Jessie and Misty were the only actual trainers there).
Jessie coming to finals could also mean that she was simply that good or had luck, reather than competition she faced being utterly weak.
Because if theres one thing clearly obvious about Jessie and James is howe inconsistent their competence is. Going from traioners cpoming in finals of tournament, winning contests, defeating higher ranked TR members like Butch and Cassidy. To writers having them watered down to level of failures and punching bags who can lose to rookies.
Yeah, I have to agree there. There have been plenty of times where JJM actually DID come across as skilled trainers (heck, in the Viridian Gym episode, they actually nearly handed Ash his butt during their battle).
Im not sure if this had anything to do with Misty not having faith in her pokemon to be honest. Otherwise she wouldn't have planned to use Starmie against Jessie Lickitung if it wasn't for Psyduck popping out.
Yeah, agreed with that. Though a bit of a correction, but she actually planned to use Staryu (Starmie was a dub mistake).
Misty wanted to borrow her friends pokemon for simple fact of knowing this would increase her chance of winning competition due to using only water pokemon would give her much harder time when facing grass or electric types.
Yeah, agreed, and let's face it, while it is theoretically possible that Misty COULD use a solely Water-type team, you also have to get into practicality.
Another reason steemed from fact of only two of Mosty pokemon team being reliable and fully effective on dry land. Something which wasn't case for Goldeen or Horsea. And Psyduck is handicapped and very risky choice.
Yes, fully agreed with that. Unlike in the games where it pretty much doesn't even matter where you fight with your Pokémon (ie, you could even use a Magikarp on dry land and it probably wouldn't make much of a difference either way), the Anime tries to be a bit more realistic with how battles are done. Heck, in the second episode, Misty attempted to use Goldeen against Team Rocket, and it didn't even work well at all. So the only practical choices were Staryu, Starmie, and Psyduck, and even then, only the first two could even be decently considered "reliable" since Psyduck as aforementioned is more or less a wildcard and handicapped.
Maybe so, but Ash goal was stated several times to become strongest and most recognized pokemon trainer in world. And we reliably know how one of steps on that road is to enter gyms, collect badges and win regional league followed by conquering champion league.
Thus having rough picture of what pokemon master career involves despite not knowing what else Ash needs to overcome.
Yes, though even then, it wasn't until DP that we actually have ANYTHING pointing to actually winning the league, since even the Orange Islands wasn't enough for Ash to actually BECOME a Master (and don't forget Battle Frontier).
In Misty case winning Whirl Cup and acquiring title Alpha Omega of water pokemon while wont make her water master, it would bring her closer toward achieving this dream. Since it was very clearly stated how sea heroes(which is in Japanese convoluted form of water masters)acquired this title before becoming water masters. With whoie Whirl Cup being presented as one of tasks Misty needs to win in order to become water master.
Given how E4 Siebold is referred as water master in games and Misty wanted to reach Lorelei strength and reputation just like her game counterpart. Its rather obvious how in case of becoming E4 Misty would become water master.
Yeah, Whirl Cup made very clear that at the very least, it gets someone one step closer to becoming a Water Pokémon Master. And if Siebold can be considered a champ for using all water-types and especially a Water Pokémon Master, the player most certainly can be the same if they used a strictly water-type team, or at the very least a team with partial Water Types. So yes, Misty's goal, if anything, came far closer to something that actually can be accomplished in the games as a primary goal needed to beat it than May or Dawn ever could.
In Viola, Clair, Byton, Grant and Candice case we don't know if they had substitutes running gym temporarily when they were absent so this examples dont prove anything.
Yeah agreed, especially when in those cases about Candice, Clair, Viola, Byron, Grant, and the like, we don't even SEE their gym while they were absent. For all we know, they most likely had reliable substitutes.
As for likes of Roark, Fantina etc like it was stated earlier PIA may be more lenient toward gyms and leaders which arenpt frequently visited by challengers and if there are eniugh nearby gyms for trainers to come to in case that particular gym is closed.
Yeah, and in the case of Fantina, we also have to consider that the only reason that happened was because at the time, we still were stuck with DP, which for rather stupid reasons, they had the player not be able to challenge Fantina at all (remember, this was well before Platinum's release, which switched around the gym orders to ensure Fantina was fought earlier).
If Cerulean gym is placed on route where many trainers and challengers travel and there aren't many alternate gyms in its vicinity, than its fairly obvious how pokemon agency would be less tolerant toward those gym leaders in leaving gym closed. Unless valid suvbstitute is provoded.
Yeah, agreed.
Needless to say in Fantina or other examples case their examples of closing gym with challengers not being able to get badge could pass unnoticed by PIA agency not being notified of this situation. Similar how no one notoifioed them of Brock passing his duties to brother Forest in Pewter gym incident.
Just so we're clear, you ARE referring to the DP special and not the Hoso/Chronicles episode, right? Beyond that, I agree (and quite frankly, I'm more bothered at how Pewter Gym even MANAGED to pass the inspection despite Lola's rather horrid running of Pewter Gym (having horrible decorations and nearly drowning several Rock Pokémon due to the stupidity of making their training holes into a swimming pool), things that actually made even Daisy, Lily, and Violet actually seem like competent responsible Gym Leaders by comparison (and that's saying a lot considering what they often did to Cerulean Gym).
If your talking about Misty considering she traveled to become water pokemon master, reach E4 strength, learn and explore about pokemon and world as much as she can. Along with her story having various saubplots like complex of inferiority caused by older sisters, fear from Gyarados, Togepi, developed love feeings toward Ash etc.
Than yes Misty had quest, her goals and story in full sense of that word.
Yeah, fully agreed, and I even pointed out some examples of how Misty actually did far more than just follow Ash.
I think your missing the point of what dragon master title represents. Unlike its case with water master title being said to involve becoming strongest water trainer in world learning to use this specie to full potential. Proving your worth and getting recognized by winning prestigue tournaments like Whirl Cup was.
Dragon master title was revealed to not having to be necessarily strongest dragon trainer. But trainer who learned how to read dragon pokemon feelings reaching to their hearts raising them in strong battlers. With title being given from elders in dragon village.
Yeah, agreed with that. And it only requires a strong bond with Dragon Pokémon and effectively act as one with them in order to qualify rather than actual strength, while with Water Pokémon Master, it's made more than a little clear that you actually NEED to be strong as well.
With games also emphasizing on heavy ties between dragin master title and Lance grandfather who is in charge of dragon masters clan.
So yes, in Drayden case he didn't necessarily needed to be on E4 or champion level to be considered dragon master if he fulfilled requirements set by dragon village.
Fully agreed there. If anything, unlike with Water Pokémon Master, being an Elite 4 or Champion was just a bonus.
Likewise Dragons as type are rare and very powerful, but i wouldn't say theyre far superior to water. Given how majorioty of water pokemon can leasrn ice techniques and they are known as incredibly adaptive pokemon type posessing high variety of of pokemon to choose from being most widespreaded and versatile type. As theyre paired with every other pokemon type(including fairies, dragons worst enemy).
Yeah, and that's not getting into how Ice types are, before fairy-types, also Dragon Types worst enemy.
Not to mention water is only type tied with dragons in posessing most items which boost their power.
Agreed. At best, they're at a stalemate.
Either way Clair is not dragon master by any means. Otherwise we would have known by now, especially when meeting Iris who is highly enthusiastic to meet dragon masters in person.
Yeah that's another reason why we shouldn't consider Clair a Dragon Master (and unlike in the games, she's at least down to earth enough to not claim otherwise.).
That is more attributive to Dawn than May to be honest given how Dawn amount of focus, screentime and episodes dedicated to her is closest to what is Ash getting as main star per series. Let alone her song themes, endings or debut episodes being mainly focused around her.
Yeah, if anything Dawn's probably closer than May is to being an actual co-star, and even SHE can't qualify since she was basically removed. Misty's probably the closest we've got to a true co-star anyhow.
I canpt recall personally any hints of Misty showing even tiny portion of affection and romantic interest for Tracey. Acting this way only when Ash was in question Not even when Sakura and Casey assumed Tracey was her boyfriend or Daisy teased them. Misty was never jealous, blushed or agitated infront of that guy only being annoyed and assertively denying it.
Yeah, agreed.
Does she care about her friend enjoying in his company? Yes, but enjoying to be in someone company isn't evidence of considering him as more than friend in my opinion.
Fully agreed with that.
Misty inviting Tracey to Cerulean gym at end of BW could be due to various reasons like showing him new pokemon. Needing his advice or to hear if there are any news regarding Ash, Brock etc. Because she needed Tracey help in fixing something at gym etc.
Because friends invite each other to their house as well.
Agreed, especially when in some Hosos, they actually had Tracey maintaining the gym. If anything, he seemed to have more of a relationship beyond friends with Daisy than he did to Misty (though that reminds me, I don't recall Tracey even being mentioned to have gone over to Misty's place). Besides, I remember how in one Team Rocket Radio show episode, Ash actually took over (while posing as Giovanni to ensure they leave) and made a call with Misty, and they even vowed to actually see each other again, and that was just a couple of years ago.
