TG TCG Development Comittee : Starting hand and basic mechanics

[digi-kun]

Something I've been playing around in my mind for a while to help out with activity (maybe)

We've had enough people pitch tcg ideas without really touching up on them afterwards, so why not try to make our own?

As such, week by week we can discuss different parts of our system. Obviously the choices listed for some of these will be off other systems, but if there are any ideas feel free to voice them.

We'll start with the theme around the card game. This will provide a setting for the game, and can influence terminology and fluff (if we decide to go that far). Obvious choices are fantasy, futuristic, historical, and tv shows (though this can limit options), though mixes of these are always possible.

 

[Alice]

The only TCG I've played is pokemon, although that's really only because I've never had anyone to play with... otherwise I'd probably play a bunch of them. So, I dunno if I'll be that helpful, but I wouldn't mind participating.

 

[Cirrus]

This is a pretty fantastic idea.

I like fantasy as a theme for card games in general, but I think that's because the TCGs I play are all fantasy-themed.

 

[Alice]

It's a lot easier to have more variety/unique cards/attacks in a fantasy setting.

 

[donavannj]

Fantasy would probably be among the simplest, but we'd have to be wary not to copy too much from a single existing TCG in that genre of TCGs.

 

[Alice]

We could always try a combination. Magic that was created through science, and spellcasters have to be attached to basic spaceship cards or something like that.

I actually already have a few other ideas based on this, but I'll let other people post their ideas first.

 

[Mr. X]

Spellcasters being on ships always reminds me of the Advent (from Sins of a Solar Empire) for some reason. They aren't really spellcasters though, just incredibly powerful psychics with varying abilities.

Fantasy genere is the easiest to do, but I like seeing scifi tcg's.

I've a couple idea's for one, bujt I still have some things to work out.

Anyway, this is the basic design for the 'monster' cards.

For the upgrades, the basic upgrades are applied to all ship classes, but all would have some special class only upgrades. The basic upgrades would be a tiered system. (Lvl 1 upgrade is replaced with lvl 2, lvl 2 replaced with lvl 3.)

 

[Overlord Drakow]

This does seem pretty cool. Count me in. We should just steal ideas from a bunch of TCG's and slap them together to make our own one.

 

[Mr. X]

Why limit it to just tcg's though? We could proably steal ideas from videogames and force them to work in a tcg.

Edit - How about we all work on one tcg idea as a team and all work on our seperate idea's?)

 

[digi-kun]

As the idea in general is to boost activity, I'd prefer to do it long term over parallel processing.

Fantasy is always the easiest, though it doesn't have to be limited to fantasy. ie. there could always be futuristic mecha units or a set that introduces them, or an ancient civ with advanced tech, etc.

Why limit it to just tcg's though? We could proably steal ideas from videogames and force them to work in a tcg.

One of the big ones i've seen as far as that goes is UFS, which converted fighting games into a card game system. It's a pretty fun one.

 

[Mr. X]

Aite, I've worked out a basic idea for a scifi TCG

The objective is to destroy your opponents starbase. To get to it, you will have to first destroy the ships that are defending it.

Line 1 would have 3 frigates and 2 support ships, line 2 would have cruiser's and light carriers (3 cruisers, 2 carriers). line 3 would only be 2 ships, but they would be capital ships. The final line is the starbase itself but it would have 2 turrets and 2 carriers defending it, along with whatever offensive power the chosen starbase would have.

The game would start with just your starbase and two turrets. Neither player can attack the other until their first line is filled up with ships. Each turn, you would be allowed to 'summon' one ship per line to replace destroyed ships with the exception of the capital ships (Which would be limited to 2 per deck), or to fill up extra ship spots.

Ships/Starbases have special abilities. Passive abilities can be used with no cost. Command abilities have some sort of cost but are always stronger then passive abilities.

Ships/whatever so far.

Spoiler:

Cards
Turrets

Gauss Turret
Desc - The Gauss Turret is a simple, high powerered, defense. Although lacking the abilities of other turret types, the Gauss Turret has the strongest base attack out of all turrets.
Upgrades - 1H, 1W, 1Sp
Special Upgrades - Advanced Gauss Capacitor, Burst Rockets, Ion Rounds, EMP Rounds, AP Rounds
Attack - 150
Shield/Hull 1000/2000

Prototype Advanced Gauss Turret
Desc - This is a prototype for a more advanced turret system. Although having less attack power and hull stength, it is able to power more upgrades then the original varient.
Upgrades - 1H, 1W, 3Sp
Avaliable upgrades - Advanced Gauss Capacitor, Burst Rockets, Ion Rounds, EMP Rounds, AP Rounds
Command Ability - Overload Capacitor - Doubles the attack of the turret s for one turn, but turret takes 500 hull damage
Attack - 100
Shield/Hull 1000/1500

Beam Turret
Desc - The Beam turret is a advanced turret emplacement that excells at destroying enemy shields. Although extremely effective against shields, it has only minimal effect against a ships hull.
Upgrade - 1H, 1S 2Sp
Avaliable upgrades - Advanced Energy Focuser, Multi-Strike, Beam Recalibration
Passive Ability - 2x damage against shields, half damage against hull
Attack - 100
Shield/Hull 1500/2000

Bypasser Turret
Desc - The Bypasser is a extremely advanced turret design that is able to partially bypass a ships shields. This partial bypass allows the turret to damage both the shields and hull of a target at once. The advanced systems unfortunantly take up a large amount of space leaving the turret lightly protected against attack.
Upgrade - 1H, 1W, 2Sp
Avaliable upgrades - Improved Plasma Containment, Shielding Loop
Attack - Not decided yet
Shield/Hull 500/500

Frigates

Frigate - Colbalt
Desc - The Colbalt is a mass produced light combat frigate. It is used by all minor governments, but is obselete when compared to the frigates used by major governments.
Upgrades - 1H, 1S, 1W
Command Ability - If a ship in this current line is attacked, you can choose to have this ship take the damage instead.
Attack - 25
Shield/ Hull 150/175

Frigate - Corona
Desc - The Corona is a upgraded version of the Colbalt. Sporting stronger cannons and more efficient shield emitters, the Corona is a vast improvement over the Colbalt. Despite these upgrades, it is still a obselete design.
Upgrades - 1H, 1S, 1W
Command Ability - If a ship in this current line is attacked, you can choose to have this ship take the damage instead.
Attack - 30
Shield/Hull 175/175

Frigate - Vulkan
Desc - The Vulkan is the basic frigate used by all major governments.
Upgrades - 1H, 1S, 1W
Command Ability - 50 damage to ship of choice on first occupied enemy line. Hull -200
Attack - 30
Shield/Hull 225/250

Frigate - Vulkan-R
Desc - Vulkans, being used in mass numbers, are usually the first ships to be destroyed in a fight. Occasionally, major governements will sell the severely damaged Vulkans to minor governments at cheap prices. The R type is the resulting ship once repairs have been completed.
Upgrades - 1H, 1S, 1W
Command Ability - 50 damage to ship of choice on first occupied enemy line. Hull -200
Attack - 30
Shield/Hull 200/200

Frigate - Firestorm
Desc - The Firestorm is a reletively new combat frigate that is armed with missiles and rockets. It has no shields, but is heavily armored.
Upgrades - 1H, 1W
Passive Ability - ATK against line 1 +10, attack against line 2 +20, attack against line 3 +30, attack against line 4 +40, attack against starbase +50
Attack - 30
Shield/Hull 0/450

Frigate - Thunderstorm
Desc - The Thunderstorm is a multi-targeting frigate. Although armed with weak weapons, it is able to attack 3 targets at once. The Thunderstorm can temperaroryly overload its targeting computer to launch a attack against all targets.
Upgrades - 1S, 1H
Command Ability - Attack first occupied enemy line, all units 20 damage
Command Ability - Attack all occupied enemy lines, all units 20 damage. -200 shields or -100 hull to activate
Attack - 20
Shield/Hull - 200/200

Support Ships

Support Frigate - Energizer
Desc - The Energizer is a experimental ship that is able to increase the effectiveness of other ships shield systems. Although having no weapons and minimal armor, this ship has extremely powerful shields.
Upgrades - 1S
Passive Ability - Owned ships Shield +100
Passive Ability - Regenerate 50 shield points per turn
Command Ability - Can transfer shield power to other ships in the current line.
Attack - 0
Shield/Hull 500/50

Support - Garda
Desc - The Garda is a escort frigate that provides AA support. Although heavily armored, it is useless in ship to ship combat.
Upgrades - 1H, 1S, 1W
Passive Ability - Light carriers and carriers attack - 50
Attack - 10
Sheld/Hull 200/300

Right now, I've decided to scrap the vanilla descriptions from the cards. I'll give all ships abilities of some sort. I haven't gotten to the 2nd, 3rd, or starbase line cards or the majority of the upgrade cards.

Turret Upgrades

Spoiler:

Advanced Guass Capacitor - Gauss turret atk +50
Burst Rockets - If attacked, deal 50 damage to attacking ship.
Ion Cannon - (Additional Command Ability) Targeted ship will not be able to attack or use command abilties next turn. Any passive abilities it has are disabled next turn. Turret will not be able to attack this turn
AP rounds - Damage against hull +50, damage against shields -25.
EMP Rounds - Damage against shields +50, damage against hull -25.

Advanced Energy Focuser - Beam Turret atk +50
Multi-Target system - Able to attack twice
Beam Recalibration (additional command ability) - Disable passive ability for this turn

Improved Plasma Containment - Attack +100
Shielding Loop - Shields +1000

 

[Alice]

I think you've made it way too complex. We should limit it to just a few (maybe 5) ships in play at a time. So, just the first row, but any type of ship can be played there. Also, there's no need for damage numbers as large as 1000 in a TCG imo. Keep it to double digits for most ships, maybe triple for really strong ones.

Also, perhaps we could swap light carriers out for battleships, so we don't have two ship classes that are essentially the same thing in different sizes.

 

[Mr. X]

LC was one that I was thinking of scrapping so I'll cut it down. Battleships are considered capital class ships, and I do plan to make them extremely powerful.

I don't intend to have any units with that high of a base attack. I plan to have a couple of command abilities that go near that, but I don't think I'll have a base attack over 9000 250. Frigates will be double digit base attacks, most cruisers would have triples (Around 100-150) and capitals would have 200-250. Not counting abilities, just the base attack. Starbases will come in two flavors. Heavily armed and armored with crap abilities, or minimally armed with great abilities.

I might remove the line system all together though and replace it with a 'supply' system, but as of right now I can see that being more complex then the line system.

Edit - I'm loosely basing this TCG off of Sins of a Solar Empire. Thankfully, not the 7DS modded version. (I've had games where i've wiped out a entire 100+ ship fleets (With at least 20 or so capital class ships) with a. single. ship. Fully researched Beam Cannons doing 700+ damage a pop. And did I mention that it completely ignores shields?)

 

[Alice]

LC was one that I was thinking of scrapping so I'll cut it down. Battleships are considered capital class ships, and I do plan to make them extremely powerful.

I don't intend to have any units with that high of a base attack. I plan to have a couple of command abilities that go near that, but I don't think I'll have a base attack over 9000 250. Frigates will be double digit base attacks, most cruisers would have triples (Around 100-150) and capitals would have 200-250. Not counting abilities, just the base attack. Starbases will come in two flavors. Heavily armed and armored with crap abilities, or minimally armed with great abilities.

I might remove the line system all together though and replace it with a 'supply' system, but as of right now I can see that being more complex then the line system.

Okay, good luck with your TCG then.

As for the rest of us. Can we take an actual poll on what theme we want to go with for ours? I'm actually really torn on whether I'd like it to be fantasy or future.

 

[digi-kun]

I believe the consensus is currently to make a primarily fantasy system, though it'd be possible to add more futuristic themes based on how it's formed. I'll throw up the next topic on the weekend once we get more time in to discuss, since it WAS just kinda made yesterday.

@Mr. X: Regarding the system you proposed, I would use a resource system over a play for free with limited field system. Say, the base generates a certain number of resource per turn and you can choose how much resource to allocate to paying for ships. Ships always start in line 1 from base and can choose to attack or move forward. In addition to the provided stats, I would recommend including certain weapons that are stated out with Range and Power which determines how far said ship can shoot (Range 1 being 1 line away and range 2 being 2 lines away). Some weapons could have AOEs in the effect that says it effects X ships in an area. Not sure how permissions to movement would work. Base could be upgraded with turrets and same for ships in line 1. Maybe ships can also retreat to the base for repairs as well, which time can vary based on base and ship class.

Also, if you could actually make your own thread for that, it'd be great. The original intention of the thread was to come up with a system step-by-step, rather than someone submits their idea and everyone provides their opinion.

btw if you wanna try a similar game to this, try the EVE tcg. It's been forever since i tried it out, so i don't really remember the rules, but it's somewhat similar.

 

[Mr. X]

I'll look that up.

I won't directly address the ships weapon on card, but the name and upgrades for it would give hints as to what weapon they use.

 

[digi-kun]

Ok, so the theme decided has been base Fantasy. The next step is to figure out a resource system.

The resource system is used to provide a separation between early game and late game. In other words, it ensures that extremely powerful cards cannot be played early on and shut down the field just by it's presence. Obviously there are resource acceleration strategies that can get around that, but that's for a later time. Anyways, here's some example options

Resource as separate cards in Deck - Used by Magic: The Gathering. The resource acts as a separate set of cards and are put into the deck to play.

Any card can be used as a resource - Used for WoW and Duel Masters iirc. Any card from your hand can be laid down as a resource.

Resource separate from deck, slowly incrementing - Used for (Insert target Shonen Jump card game here) TCG - Start with a pool of resource that goes up by 1 each turn.

No Resource, Limited Field - Used for Yugioh and Vanguard. There is no resource, but uses a different mechanic to separate early to late game.

 

[Cirrus]

I vote for Resource as Separate Cards in Deck: this usually promotes more skilful deckbuilding, though it opens itself up to some luck-based shenanigans.

I think it is also possible to do a hybrid - something like having resource cards but also being able to trade two cards for a resource or something like that.

 

[digi-kun]

Oh right, I actually almost forgot. There's another one.

Resource as cards in Separate deck - Allows player to choose whether to draw resource or card from their deck on their turn.

I think it is also possible to do a hybrid - something like having resource cards but also being able to trade two cards for a resource or something like that.

That sounds pretty interesting if done right. Unlike Magic, we also have the option to not use "basic" resources, so all our resources can be potentially useful in that way.

 

[Mr. X]

It would be interesting to see some sort of a kill-based addition to incrimental resources. You destroy a monster, you can a small part of its resource cost or something.