News: The Battle Tree - Where Strong Opponents Await!

[MegaKuriboh]

I'd be pretty happy with all the Rivals and Champions returning to be honest, I mean we haven't seen Silver since 2009 and we probably won't again for at LEAST 15 years, so I'd like to see him again. Giving all the rivals and champions nice 3D Models and new remixed themes would be great too. but it would be my dream to include all the Gym Leaders and Elite 4 too, as well as protagonists, but that's asking too much (imagine all the glorious 3D Models though)

 

[Altairis]

Uhhh is Red really 30 now?!

Wasn't he 10 in the original Kanto stories, then only like 15 or 13 or something in HGSS? Hadn't only a few years passed between FRLG and HGSS, not 10 whole years?

Also, something funny: Wally sends out his Gallade in an Ultra Ball. I was there when he caught it, though! He definitely used a regular old Pokeball.

 

[Mawa]

I really want to see Koga again, he's my favorite leader :3

I really wonder if the leaders and champions will have new Pokemon... I can see Salandit with Koga...

 

[Nah]

Uhhh is Red really 30 now?!

Wasn't he 10 in the original Kanto stories, then only like 15 or 13 or something in HGSS? Hadn't only a few years passed between FRLG and HGSS, not 10 whole years?

He's ~20, not 30, idk why that picture says that

It seems to be thinking that his new FRLG design is an older version of him when it's not

 

[MarinoKadame]

I would like to see the frontier Brains mostly Anabel.

 

[Rivvon]

Also, something funny: Wally sends out his Gallade in an Ultra Ball. I was there when he caught it, though! He definitely used a regular old Pokeball.

That's not his original Gallade: Wally has discovered the world of IV breeding and is using his new, 6IV Gallade which he bred into an Ultra Ball.

I would like to see the frontier Brains mostly Anabel.

Since this is our new Battle Tower, it would make a lot of sense if Anabel, and even Palmer, made cameos.

But if Dahlia or even Darach is somehow one of the scoutable characters in here, I'd be pretty excited.

 

[Charlie Brown]

Obviously they showed Cynthia for long time fans who know and love her, Wally was for the more recent fans, and Red and Blue were for the nostalgic fans that haven't played Pokemon in a while. Here's a list of some other trainers I want to see in the Battle Tree:

• Lance
• Steven Stone
• Alder
• Iris
• N
• Bruno
• Koga
• Caitlin
• Malva
• Misty
• Sabrina
• Giovanni
• Blane
• Flannery
• Candice
• Fantina
• Elesa
• Ceren
• Barry
• Silver

Good point @ the reasons for them revealing Cynthia/Wally/Red/Blue! I do think that if they add some Gym Leaders they should go ahead and add them all. And tbh most of the previous Elite Fours are really dull and lack personality so I can't see any of them being added (save for Lance and maybe Flint since he had a story role...however brief it was) either. Would love to see the other rivals and champions added in though.

 

[BettyNewbie]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I think the list of returning characters in the Battle Tree will be *a lot* smaller than the PWT.

Remember that the PWT was back in the sprite era, so GF was able to just reuse Platinum and HGSS sprites for the Kanto, Johto, and Sinnoh characters. Only the Hoenn characters needed new sprites, which didn't take much effort at all.

Now that we're in the 3D era, bringing back older characters takes more time and effort. 3D models take longer to make than sprites, and they also take up more space in the game. Plus, only the Hoenn and Kalos characters even have already-made 3D models, so far less can be recycled from past games.

There's also the issue of Mega Evolutions. Wally is clearly going to have his Mega Gallade, and the other revealed trainers all have obvious potential Mega Evolutions (Cynthia = Garchomp, Red = Charizard X, Blue = Blastoise). Red even appears to be possibly wearing a Mega Bracelet in his new artwork. Megas may be last gen's thing, but if one character's going to have one, then it stands to reason that the others will as well, especially since the Battle Tree is a postgame facility.

Putting this all together, the two other characters I expect to return the most are Steven and Diantha. They're both Champions, they both already have 3D models, and they both already have Megas. Steven is also an extremely popular character like Red, Blue, and Cynthia. Diantha is less popular, but still has the advantage of being recent (and also conveniently adds another woman to the Battle Tree lineup).

Who I feel are much less likely to return are Lance, Wallace, Alder, and Iris. None of them have potential Megas (blame GF for shafting Dragonite, Milotic, and 99% of the Unova Dex when they doled out Megas last gen), and only Wallace even has a premade 3D model. They also don't exactly have popularity on their side, either. They've all long been seen as the "weakest" Champions, and it's possible that GF doesn't even see Lance, Wallace, and Alder as the "real" Champions of their respective games (instead favoring Red, Steven, and N, who all happen to be far more popular).

For those who don't believe GF plays favorites, remember Charizard, Mewtwo, and their two Megas each. They almost certainly pay attention to who is and isn't popular.

(And, I say this as someone who loves Lance very much and has gotten used to her favorite character always getting ignored and sidelined. :()

 

[BettyNewbie]

Of course, it'll be more than a pleasant surprise if all Champions were to make an appearance; surely if Hoenn characters needed to be sprited into PWT, it wouldn't be too much to ask to model most Champions and notable past characters into Battle Tree, as well?

You can't really compare making a new sprite to making a new 3D model, though. Models take a lot more time and effort to make out of scratch.

Wallace already has a 3D model in ORAS. It's likely he's going to return,

The problem with Wallace is that he was only ever a Champion in Emerald and not the most recent version of Hoenn (ORAS). He also lacks a Mega Evolution, and again, I get the sense that all of the Battle Tree opponents are going to have one (since Wally has his M-Gallade).

Diantha may or may not be likely, although I wouldn't call her notable because she appeared in XY a grand total of twice.

Poorly handled or not, she's still XY's Champion. She also has a 3D model and a Mega, so it would take little effort to include her.

What should also be noted is that Cynthia didn't actually have a 3D model prior to these games. Red and Green didn't have models either. This hints at the fact that Game Freak probably doesn't have a huge issue making models of past characters that didn't have 3D models before. If important Sinnoh characters are going to make an entrance, can we expect Barry to perhaps make an appearance as well? What about Lance, perhaps?

The difference between Cynthia, Red, and Blue and the likes of Lance and Barry is again, popularity. Cynthia, Red, and Blue are among the most popular and overexposed characters in the entire franchise, so GF has no problem putting in the extra effort for them. Red and Blue also carry the bonus of promoting the 20th anniversary of the games. (Notice the "96" on Red's shirt?)

Lance has his fans (myself included), but he's mostly regarded by fans as a "cheater" and is seen as one of the weaker Champions. Barry also has his fans, but he's otherwise been mostly forgotten (and was never one of the more popular rivals to begin with). It also doesn't help that neither of them have potential Mega Evolutions or anything else special like that to show off.

 

[Nah]

I agree with Betty that the list of NPCs to pair up with in the Battle Tree could potentially be small, although for different reasons. It's possible that Cynthia, Red, Blue, and Wally (plus probably like Hau or something) is all we're getting actually.

The reason that the PWT had a lot of past characters in it is because that was its purpose. It was designed to be the place where the strongest trainers from around the world duke it out and see who's the strongest in the world, hence the "World" in Pokemon World Tournament.

The Battle Tree however is, from what we know right now, basically yet another version of the Battle Tower. And the Battle Towers have never been about getting as many characters together as possible, it's just simply been a place for battles harder than what's usually provided in the main story. The Maison of 6th Gen has had roughly the same number of usable AI allies: 3 in X/Y (Shauna, Tierno, and Trevor), and 4 in ORAS (Wally, Steven, Brendan/May, and Archie/Maxie) as we've been shown to have in the Battle Tree. Hell, there was only one in 5th Gen's Battle Subway (just the opposite gendered player character).

So if they aren't interested in gathering up as many characters as possible, but are interested in providing ones from past games as part of the whole series celebration thing, they're going to include the most popular ones (and which is also why they'd be willing to create brand new 3D models for them), which is what Cynthia, Red, and Blue are. Maybe Wally is too, maybe he's way more liked in Japan than elsewhere, idk.

Maybe some of you will think "but maybe they will add more characters just to change things up with this stale old Battle Tower, they've been changing up a lot of stuff in S/M". But can we really expect them to change everything? Not really. Maybe this is one of the things left being largely untouched.

 

[blue]

The Battle Tree is presumably for the NPCs who have completed the island trial challenge which will probably only be restricted to the more challenging past characters. Wally became extremely strong for his final battle in ORAS whilst the others we've seen so far are past Champions. Thinking about it now, I'm going to guess that this will just be restricted to Champions and some rivals. As much as I'd like to see some of the Gym Leaders returning, I don't think it is all that likely. I think Barry could make a cameo along with Lance, Steven Stone, Alder, Diantha, and perhaps Iris.

 

[BettyNewbie]

If Wally has a mega and he's a rival, should it be fair to say that other rival and non-rival characters that have megas would be included? Brendan/May had a mega in ORAS, do you believe they'll be included, as well? What about Archie and Maxie? They had megas, and they aren't Champions or rivals. Heck, you can partner with them in Battle Maison, I don't see a reason why you can't partner with them in Battle Tree. Zinnia had a mega and a 3D model, why can't she be included?

I didn't say anything about Archie, Maxie, and Zinnia not being possible. In fact, I think they're more likely to happen than some of the other characters fans have been clamoring for.

Brendan/May won't happen simply because GF wants to avoid canonizing player characters. It worked with Red because RBY had no female protagonist, and Yellow meant that you didn't even have to favor one starter over another. Doing it with any of the other protagonists forces you to unfairly favor one gender and one starter over another.

I agree with Betty that the list of NPCs to pair up with in the Battle Tree could potentially be small, although for different reasons. It's possible that Cynthia, Red, Blue, and Wally (plus probably like Hau or something) is all we're getting actually.

The reason that the PWT had a lot of past characters in it is because that was its purpose. It was designed to be the place where the strongest trainers from around the world duke it out and see who's the strongest in the world, hence the "World" in Pokemon World Tournament.

The Battle Tree however is, from what we know right now, basically yet another version of the Battle Tower. And the Battle Towers have never been about getting as many characters together as possible, it's just simply been a place for battles harder than what's usually provided in the main story. The Maison of 6th Gen has had roughly the same number of usable AI allies: 3 in X/Y (Shauna, Tierno, and Trevor), and 4 in ORAS (Wally, Steven, Brendan/May, and Archie/Maxie) as we've been shown to have in the Battle Tree. Hell, there was only one in 5th Gen's Battle Subway (just the opposite gendered player character).

So if they aren't interested in gathering up as many characters as possible, but are interested in providing ones from past games as part of the whole series celebration thing, they're going to include the most popular ones (and which is also why they'd be willing to create brand new 3D models for them), which is what Cynthia, Red, and Blue are. Maybe Wally is too, maybe he's way more liked in Japan than elsewhere, idk.

Maybe some of you will think "but maybe they will add more characters just to change things up with this stale old Battle Tower, they've been changing up a lot of stuff in S/M". But can we really expect them to change everything? Not really. Maybe this is one of the things left being largely untouched.

Exactly. {:3} This is nothing more than a place to put popular (or at least recent) characters and "spice" up the stale Battle Tower formula. GF is 100% going to play favorites with this, and a lot of characters are going to get unfairly excluded.

 

[Thunderflare]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I think the list of returning characters in the Battle Tree will be *a lot* smaller than the PWT.

Remember that the PWT was back in the sprite era, so GF was able to just reuse Platinum and HGSS sprites for the Kanto, Johto, and Sinnoh characters. Only the Hoenn characters needed new sprites, which didn't take much effort at all.

Now that we're in the 3D era, bringing back older characters takes more time and effort. 3D models take longer to make than sprites, and they also take up more space in the game. Plus, only the Hoenn and Kalos characters even have already-made 3D models, so far less can be recycled from past games.

There's also the issue of Mega Evolutions. Wally is clearly going to have his Mega Gallade, and the other revealed trainers all have obvious potential Mega Evolutions (Cynthia = Garchomp, Red = Charizard X, Blue = Blastoise). Red even appears to be possibly wearing a Mega Bracelet in his new artwork. Megas may be last gen's thing, but if one character's going to have one, then it stands to reason that the others will as well, especially since the Battle Tree is a postgame facility.

Putting this all together, the two other characters I expect to return the most are Steven and Diantha. They're both Champions, they both already have 3D models, and they both already have Megas. Steven is also an extremely popular character like Red, Blue, and Cynthia. Diantha is less popular, but still has the advantage of being recent (and also conveniently adds another woman to the Battle Tree lineup).

Who I feel are much less likely to return are Lance, Wallace, Alder, and Iris. None of them have potential Megas (blame GF for shafting Dragonite, Milotic, and 99% of the Unova Dex when they doled out Megas last gen), and only Wallace even has a premade 3D model. They also don't exactly have popularity on their side, either. They've all long been seen as the "weakest" Champions, and it's possible that GF doesn't even see Lance, Wallace, and Alder as the "real" Champions of their respective games (instead favoring Red, Steven, and N, who all happen to be far more popular).

For those who don't believe GF plays favorites, remember Charizard, Mewtwo, and their two Megas each. They almost certainly pay attention to who is and isn't popular.

(And, I say this as someone who loves Lance very much and has gotten used to her favorite character always getting ignored and sidelined. :()

It also depends on how long it was in production and how they designed the 3D models. Did they plan for the 20th Anniversary from the start, or did they just luck out? And do the 3D models come from the same base, or are they individually designed?

 

[Venks]

Lance has his fans (myself included), but he's mostly regarded by fans as a "cheater" and is seen as one of the weaker Champions. Barry also has his fans, but he's otherwise been mostly forgotten (and was never one of the more popular rivals to begin with). It also doesn't help that neither of them have potential Mega Evolutions or anything else special like that to show off.

Lance has Aerodactyl and Gyarados, both of which have Megas. So I don't see a problem there at all actually.

 

[BettyNewbie]

Lance has Aerodactyl and Gyarados, both of which have Megas. So I don't see a problem there at all actually.

But, neither of those are his main Pokémon, the Pokémon most closely associated with him. Neither of those are even Dragon types for that matter. Let's be honest, Lance having either of those as his Mega would be 100% lame (and would probably only further make him look like a "lesser" Champion compared to Red, Steven, and Cynthia).

 

[Charlie Brown]

There's also the issue of Mega Evolutions. Wally is clearly going to have his Mega Gallade, and the other revealed trainers all have obvious potential Mega Evolutions (Cynthia = Garchomp, Red = Charizard X, Blue = Blastoise). Red even appears to be possibly wearing a Mega Bracelet in his new artwork. Megas may be last gen's thing, but if one character's going to have one, then it stands to reason that the others will as well, especially since the Battle Tree is a postgame facility.

Ah damn didn't realise that Red was wearing a Mega Bracelet in his artwork, nice catch. I guess it does stand to reason then that Mega Evolutions would be used by the trainers in the Battle Tree, which does suck for a lot of the champions that you mentioned :(

I do wonder though if N will still be added. He's pretty popular (at least from what I've seen) but then there's the lack of Megas that could be attributed to him - unless his mantra of using + releasing Pokémon continues and he just uses a random team. ...Actually with that mantra it probably wouldn't make sense for him to be participating in the Battle Tree I guess lol.

 

[blue]

I wonder if mega evolution will apply to all or only some trainers? I can't really imagine what would determine which characters can and can't mega evolve their Pokémon. It would seem like either they all would have the ability to do so or none of them could.

 

[Ammy175]

I wonder if mega evolution will apply to all or only some trainers? I can't really imagine what would determine which characters can and can't mega evolve their Pokémon. It would seem like either they all would have the ability to do so or none of them could.

Well, if the Battle Tree is just Yet Another Battle Tower clone, and Red, etc., are replacements for the boss trainers, then I'd assume that the regular trainers wouldn't be able to Mega Evolve, since it seems like Mega Evolution is one of those things that's for "important" trainers only.

 

[Rivvon]

From what I can remember, none of the Battle Maison ladies used Mega Pokémon, not in XY or in ORAS, so while I get that with Wally and his Mega Gallade it looks like the scoutable Trainers will also have Megas, I hesitate to say it will be an absolute requirement.

 

[Famon]

I'm wondering if we are going to battle Gym-leaders from other region on Battle Tree!
Just imagine , 3D Misty shows up to battle the player.
Off course , Red and Blue aged even further so Kento Gym-leader like Misty might aged as well.