MrGriszell
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So now that we have confirmation that ORAS and XY are in an alternate time line from the rest of the games how do you think this will influence future Pokémon games ?
6th Gen Spoilers spoiler spoiler spoiler. Pokemon Time line
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Pretty sure OR/AS is in a separate timeline from X and Y. If they're in the same timeline, then there really wouldn't be much point of Sycamore looking into Mega Evolution and Professor Cozmo said he would be sending his findings to him. Plus there's that tweet stating that X and Y are in the same timeline as the rest of the games.
Although I guess there's nothing stopping OR/AS from being in the same timeline as the obligatory third version.
Although I guess there's nothing stopping OR/AS from being in the same timeline as the obligatory third version.
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In the Oceanic Museum, there's a picture of the Royal Unova that states it'll take some number of years before it's completed, and i've heard that they actually replace RSE in the timelines. (As far as I recall, I even made a similar topic on this back in July...) So I find it hard to believe there would be more than one timeline for the franchise.
Zinnia specifically mentioned an alternate timeline/world that was the exact same as the one that OR/AS takes place in, only Mega Evolution hadn't been discovered. Also the fact that Archie or Maxie (depending on the version) further hint at it at the Battle Resort by saying that in a different world they would have tried to awaken Groudon/Kyogre themselves.
To further add onto that- if Ruby and Sapphire are supposed to take place before X and Y, then barring retcons (a whole lot of them at that), how else can Mega Evolution exist at that time if it's supposed to be newly discovered in X and Y?
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Cerberus87
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I think the only possibility is for ORAS to be in a parallel universe.
One of the reasons I didn't want these remakes to happen is that it would screw the timeline. It was generally accepted that the Hoenn story took place close to the FRLG one, and the remakes don't make sense because Mega Evolution was only discovered in Kalos, which is further in the future than B2W2.
One of the reasons I didn't want these remakes to happen is that it would screw the timeline. It was generally accepted that the Hoenn story took place close to the FRLG one, and the remakes don't make sense because Mega Evolution was only discovered in Kalos, which is further in the future than B2W2.
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Yeah, but that display in the museum (I just went there today) says "will be completed in __ years" (and the number has been worn off) so that's kinda flimsy in the sense that couldn't it simply have been an old model that the museum never updated?
Okay, so that shows it could be a different timeline from the original RSE that totally makes sense, but how does that make it a different timeline from X and Y? Weren't the original mega stones created thousands (hundreds? I am not actually that far into the story of X and Y, sorry!) of years ago? So why can't ORAS be in the same timeline as X and Y? (which is what I thought we were talking about)
They were created thousands of years ago, but the concept of Mega Evolution wasn't actually known until the time of X and Y. Despite that, in OR/AS (which would take R/S/E's place in the timeline if they did take place in the same timeline/universe) people not only know about it, but plenty of people are using it...which means it wouldn't be 'newly discovered' by the time of X and Y. Add that into the fact that the timeline that was confirmed awhile back confirms that X and Y DOES take place in the same universe/timeline as the rest of the games, then the only explanation is that OR/AS takes place in a different timeline/universe from X/Y and the other games.
Basically, it's Game Freak's way of getting around having to retcon anything while still being able to remake R/S/E, and possibly even future remakes.
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Why would Or/AS take the place of RSE in it's original point in time? (so to clarify, why does ORAS HAVE to be from X number of years ago, why can't it be now?) Why wouldn't it simply be chronologically in the same universe as the Kalos games? X Y happened, then OR/AS happened, in that order? (even if Mega evolution was "newly discovered" during the events of X Y (wasn't it used in the war though? The first time the mega stones were created there's no way they would have just sat around of thousands of years and NOBODY knew about them until now) why couldn't simply a few years later the events of OR/AS happen and everybody already knows about Mega Evolution? I mean, we in the real world are "over" the newness of mega evolution, so wouldn't the residents of a world that live in it for a few years?)
MrGriszell
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Where was this confirmed? Are you talking about the tweet? And in XY it clearly states that mega evolution has been know and used for many years AKA the mega lucario story. The prof is just trying to study more on the subject. Kind of like the professor in sinnoh studying regular evolution.
ORAS is pretty much a progressive alternate world where technology is more advance. Now when I talk about alternate time line I'm not referring to the obvious which is the different story plot between each version, I'm talking about in general.
So pretty much all the games that involve AZ's war are in there own separate timeline than the rest . Also it does seem that ORAS takes place before XY based on the appearance of a young Looker washing on shore and not remembering who he his. Of course he does give you a mega stone from a Unova pokemon so maybe time travel could be involved
It is in the same universe as the Kalos games, unlike previous discussions of time lines this is actually told to us in the story so it's not speculation
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There IS that giant statue of mega Lucario, but it's implied in X and Y that it's both lost knowledge and relatively restricted to Kalos. In X and Y as I understand it mega stones were originally normal evolution stones exposed to Yveltal/Xerneas's energies. Even with AZ's death machine there's no way the energy could have reached Japan, where Hoenn is. It's also important to remember that even if the mega stones were well known about you still need another component; the mega stone attached to the trainer. In Kalos only a few people had them, and that would imply that that part of the mechanism is quite rare and/or unheard of. Thus explaining why it's relatively unresearched; if it's that rare only a few families would know that mega evolution even exists or how it would work, and thus you get modern day scientists trying to figure out how it works.
If ORAS is on an alternate timeline I might be able to actually tolerate it a bit. It's quite a canon screw.
destinedjagold
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So in the main timeline, mega evolution is still being researched in Kalos.
In this alternate timeline, mega evolution is already well known and already scattered all around the globe.
Well, as long as Ash isn't in the alternate timeline, then I'm fine with that!
...huh, I wonder if that other world Ash went into in Reflection Cave was THE alternate timeline. o.o
...well, as long as there won't be anymore timelines in the future, else I'm going to start praying for Chaomega to be in the games.
In this alternate timeline, mega evolution is already well known and already scattered all around the globe.
Well, as long as Ash isn't in the alternate timeline, then I'm fine with that!
...huh, I wonder if that other world Ash went into in Reflection Cave was THE alternate timeline. o.o
Of course, if there ARE two different timelines... Just what kind of time-breaking shenanigans caused it? What sort of unknown cataclysm caused the split in timelines, and will it have any effect on the main timeline in the future? Will dimension-hopping shenanigans ensue, and will there be some ludicrously awesome crossover between the two continuities?
MrGriszell
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But remember the mega stones in Hoenn are said to be from a meteor that fell and made the city of the 8th gym. And Rayquaza was said to be the first mega in Hoenn
No XY and ORAS are in the same reality
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Except this is coming from the same source that tells us there is an alternate reality where mega evolution hasn't been discovered yet, and other than that everything is the same. Why would it say that if there was no alternate reality? Saying mega stones can come from a meteor and an evolutionary stone exposed to Xerneas or Yveltal's power is quite contradictory and really makes no sense once you remember that there have been meteor strikes in Sinnoh's Veilstone city that contain nothing, look like regular meteorite, and only affect Deoxys. Also the stones themselves look like marbles. How do you get shiny marbles from meteorite shards? ._.
But there's several huge plot holes that appear once you try and place ORAS in the same continuity as the other games. First, that meteor would have left mega stones all over Asia. Why do they only appear in Hoenn? Discounting Pokemon Origins there are no reports of mega evolution or even knowledge of it. This is quite the problem as Kanto and the Sevii Islands don't have mega evolution even though they take place at the same time as ORAS, and in a mere three years everyone just magically forgets about mega evolution in Sinnoh, Johto, and Kanto, and all traces of it disappear. Why would people be so knowledgeable about mega evolution and then suddenly forget about it all, losing both the mega stones and the trainer apparatus that makes them work? Also why do only Lysandre, Maxie and Archie use it? Ghetsis would love to get his hands on that technology, and if Cyrus had it and if Palkia and Dialga had mega evolutions the world as we know it would be screwed. Yet even though mega evolution is well-known and widely used neither villain uses it. Why? Given just how powerful mega evolved legendaries are wouldn't they spare no expense in getting that power for themselves?
MrGriszell
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Your not realizing that when she talks about a time line where mega evo doesn't exist she's talking about the Hoenn from the original Ruby and Sapphire
That can't be right. The events of B2/W2 are specifically mentioned in X and Y, which also means that the events of the other games had to happen in some form, too.
Edit: Or maybe it was Black and White, but regardless the reference is still there.
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Uh... That was my main point. Did you not understand a word? ._.
There are two continuities; one in which the original Ruby and Sapphire take place, where mega evolution is not discovered for another decade, and one in which ORAS takes place, where mega evolution is well known, and much more expansive than in the first continuity. FR/LG, Platinum, HG/SS, B/W, and B2/W2 all take place in the first continuity, and to date we have no games exploring ORAS's timeline. X and Y, having just discovered mega evolution and being more than a decade after R/S/E can only fit into the first timeline, and in that time line mega stones were created by evolutionary stones being exposed to Xerneas and Yveltal, and currently seem to be restricted to just Kalos. In ORAS mega stones come from meteor shards, there are way more of them, and some Pokemon like Rayquaza can mega evolve without a trainer's assistance.
For her to mention the original Hoenn R/S/E must still be canon, and the timeline established by those games must also be canon as well. Thus there are two timelines; both sets of games take place at the same time, yet are canon. I'm assuming there's a counterpart for every region set in the original timeline, but they're drastically different from the versions we're familiar with.
MrGriszell
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XY wasn't just discovering mega evolution that's what I'm trying to say
And actually I just checked the references , nothing story related involving gen 5 is mentioned in XY only general stuff is
To Generation V
A Tourist eating outside of a café in Lumiose City mentions having visited the café in Striaton City.
A Monsieur in the Stone Emporium talks about ores that he adores, before saying, "this is where you should laugh".
Statues of Reshiram and Zekrom can be found in the courtyard of Parfum Palace. Two Tourists in the courtyard explain that the two Pokémon are legendary Pokémon of the Unova region, and that Kalos and Unova must have been in contact with each other.
A Hiker found at the Ambrette Town Fossil Lab, who gives the player the four Drives if shown a Genesect, says that he got the Drives from an acquaintance of his in the Unova region.
A Backpacker on Route 10 mentions that Colress told him that the big rocks on that route emit some kind of special energy.
A male Ace Trainer in Coumarine City will play a remix of the song "An Unwavering Heart" from Generation V when spoken to.
A Beauty in Coumarine City explains that Dr. Fennel of the Unova region created Game Sync.
A female Scientist in Coumarine City mentions that Pokémon dream when they're tucked in with Game Sync.
A Lass in Coumarine City explains that Triple Battles and Rotation Battles got their start in the Unova region.
A male Pokémon Breeder in the Magenta Plaza Pokémon Center mentions Team Plasma "making news a while back in the Unova region".
A Waitress on the first floor of the building containing the Fighting Dojo asks about the whereabouts of The Riches, before mentioning that she's looking for Master Miles.
A woman on the first floor of the building containing the Fighting Dojo mentions that she recently moved from a very rural part of Unova.
Paintings of both Castelia City and the Battle Subway appear in the Lumiose Museum.
One of the items that the player may be asked to find during the lost-and-found job in Hotel Richissime is a Brycen-Man Figure.
A Fairy Tale Girl on Route 14 says that she can't wait to finish reading Shauntal's new book.
Sky Trainer Clara on Route 16 says that her hometown is Mistralton City.
According to the television show Gym Freaks, Wulfric is a fan of the Brycen-Man Series, and Clemont is secretly saving up money to visit the amusement park in the Unova region.
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