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[Sword & Shield] All 800+ Pokemon will NOT be available in Sword and Shield at launch, even via Pokemon Home

lowkey1202

Unofficial Game Tester
55
Posts
14
Years
    • Seen Nov 20, 2023
    i personal think its a waste of time to not get all the pokemon in the new game why even buy it if you cant use/catch them all good job pokemon company for giving us what we didn't want
     

    Whim

    king of weirdtropolis
    45
    Posts
    5
    Years
  • Sincerely, I came here to also say I'm not buying these games as they are right now. In fact, I planned to buy Switch just for this game, because in the majority of time I barely have time to play anything else, and here I am completely horrified to what thhey decided. I feel people are misunderstanding the meaning of all of this when they ask what is wrong about their decision. In the last 2-3 generations, we've seen many things happen and stayed loyal to the franchise, either buying their games, even when they had flaws.

    In Gen 5 they gave us the rotation and triple battles. Cool gimmick, right? Dream World, a kind of fun way to catch the Pokémon with special abilities, too. Both ended. The first ones completely disappeared last gen. Dream World was forgotten and switched to Friend Safari, that was literally a patch of grass. But ok. Then in Gen 6 we got the holy megas and sky battles. This last one made every single flying-type have a weird glide 3d model and was completely broken, than god it ended. Megas? Made many forgotten mons a reason to come back. Now? They're all gone. Their designs, how they made many mons viable. Just puff, Gone. Lopunny, Altaria, Mawile, Absol, Beedrill - they're all back to their viability from when they came. It doesn't matter if you liked them, they won't come back. But that's still fine, right? You may not like their designs. And don't forget DexNav! Wait, what's that? You probably forgot, because it didn't come back too. Then Gen 7 gave us Z-Moves, so this game could be more balanced and every mon will have its chance to shine. Even though it was kind flawed, gone too. At the end of the day, GF has been planning many great stuff, stuff that comes and goes. Following Pokémon, something everyone wanted so much, survived literally the remake. In the last years we had many signs that what happened today was already planned. LGPE literally didn't allow any other mon other the ones from the first generation. Do you guys know what happened? Everyone bought it.

    My point is, we're all part of Pokémon's fanbase and it has been a long time since we've had many features we cared about that never came back and we didn't do anything to make their developers change their ways. We all kept (including myself) buying these game even when they felt sometimes incomplete. For the first time in years the fanbase has something to actually criticize without dividing much the general opinion. Not every Pokémon will be in the dex and, in the same way it happened with LGPE, the ones out of Galar Pokedex simply won't exist anymore. Yeah, you can have them in Pokémon Home next year, if you pay monthly to keep them there with possibly no real use. This is different from both RS and BW, because the other mons were there! RS had everyone in their code, and FRLG made sure they would all be catchable asap, while BW allowed them to be transferable. After 7 generations it will be the first time we will have a Pokémon game without every Pokémon present in its code. Seriously, I don't get we're not all worried about this, because it's basically all of us having less content for nothing! They said it's a question of balance, but we all know that if that was the problem, they could use online barriers to fighting formats just like we had in XY from Pokémon that came from transfer. They said is a question of resources, but we know they have the money to increase the number of people working on it to make its production faster. And don't even think about patches, because both game directors answered in the last interview that they haven't planned to make one. If you ask any of your friends that also play Pokémon, you'll also see how bad this feels when you are also the kind of person that likes unpopular mons because you know it: they'll be cut for sure.

    I can spend all day speaking about how frustating this is, because I feel the game series are losing their heart and looking too much at the money grab. Gen 1 has never been so forced down in our throats. I'm not looking forward to see Pokémon my Pokémon in a paying application and neither playing a game that looks like it was made by Thanos. Welcome to Pokémon, the Purge edition, where your hope is up for your friends to not be cut than to seeing the new mons avaiable.​
     

    shadowmoon522

    Master of Darkness & Light
    1,005
    Posts
    11
    Years
    • Age 33
    • PA
    • Seen May 7, 2024
    Sincerely, I came here to also say I'm not buying these games as they are right now. In fact, I planned to buy Switch just for this game, because in the majority of time I barely have time to play anything else, and here I am completely horrified to what thhey decided. I feel people are misunderstanding the meaning of all of this when they ask what is wrong about their decision. In the last 2-3 generations, we've seen many things happen and stayed loyal to the franchise, either buying their games, even when they had flaws.

    In Gen 5 they gave us the rotation and triple battles. Cool gimmick, right? Dream World, a kind of fun way to catch the Pokémon with special abilities, too. Both ended. The first ones completely disappeared last gen. Dream World was forgotten and switched to Friend Safari, that was literally a patch of grass. But ok. Then in Gen 6 we got the holy megas and sky battles. This last one made every single flying-type have a weird glide 3d model and was completely broken, than god it ended. Megas? Made many forgotten mons a reason to come back. Now? They're all gone. Their designs, how they made many mons viable. Just puff, Gone. Lopunny, Altaria, Mawile, Absol, Beedrill - they're all back to their viability from when they came. It doesn't matter if you liked them, they won't come back. But that's still fine, right? You may not like their designs. And don't forget DexNav! Wait, what's that? You probably forgot, because it didn't come back too. Then Gen 7 gave us Z-Moves, so this game could be more balanced and every mon will have its chance to shine. Even though it was kind flawed, gone too. At the end of the day, GF has been planning many great stuff, stuff that comes and goes. Following Pokémon, something everyone wanted so much, survived literally the remake. In the last years we had many signs that what happened today was already planned. LGPE literally didn't allow any other mon other the ones from the first generation. Do you guys know what happened? Everyone bought it.

    My point is, we're all part of Pokémon's fanbase and it has been a long time since we've had many features we cared about that never came back and we didn't do anything to make their developers change their ways. We all kept (including myself) buying these game even when they felt sometimes incomplete. For the first time in years the fanbase has something to actually criticize without dividing much the general opinion. Not every Pokémon will be in the dex and, in the same way it happened with LGPE, the ones out of Galar Pokedex simply won't exist anymore. Yeah, you can have them in Pokémon Home next year, if you pay monthly to keep them there with possibly no real use. This is different from both RS and BW, because the other mons were there! RS had everyone in their code, and FRLG made sure they would all be catchable asap, while BW allowed them to be transferable. After 7 generations it will be the first time we will have a Pokémon game without every Pokémon present in its code. Seriously, I don't get we're not all worried about this, because it's basically all of us having less content for nothing! They said it's a question of balance, but we all know that if that was the problem, they could use online barriers to fighting formats just like we had in XY from Pokémon that came from transfer. They said is a question of resources, but we know they have the money to increase the number of people working on it to make its production faster. And don't even think about patches, because both game directors answered in the last interview that they haven't planned to make one. If you ask any of your friends that also play Pokémon, you'll also see how bad this feels when you are also the kind of person that likes unpopular mons because you know it: they'll be cut for sure.

    I can spend all day speaking about how frustrating this is, because I feel the game series are losing their heart and looking too much at the money grab. Gen 1 has never been so forced down in our throats. I'm not looking forward to see Pokémon my Pokémon in a paying application and neither playing a game that looks like it was made by Thanos. Welcome to Pokémon, the Purge edition, where your hope is up for your friends to not be cut than to seeing the new mons avaiable.​
    the worst part about this is that they could keep all mons in the code if they gave up on the whole "higher quality" for the rest of the mons(and not incurring as much ire) because no one expects it from GF anyway and people always bitches about it regardless(hell, people are already bitching about SwSh's quality).
    all they'd have to do is keep the models from USUM, use them only in battle & in the menu and remove the outlines and just use those from now on without attempting the higher quality stuff except in the over-world & cut-scenes.
    what pokemon needs is more content is not HQ animation, but having the fun stuff that was cut from the older games brought back and never being cut again and adding new stuff in with it.
    Hm01+he+forgot+megas_ab78b5_7137356.png

    (that list is missing z-moves and megas)
    another thing that could be done is make it so that pokemon home can be accessed without internet, let you store & transfer mons offline like PKSM can, let you battle randomized npcs with your mons, and make it so it allow you to battle others online(or offline depending upon the device) and make it so it can hold online competitions.
    another thing is that this is also partly nintendo's fault for putting to much pressure on game freak and having them rush out pokemon releases every year, GF can't really put as much into the pokemon games because of that. i mean look at TOWN's trailer its obvious that GF is going to do a better job with that game because they don't have the same about of pressure in completing it as they do with pokemon. i also wouldn't be surprised if because of this backlash, nintendo will start putting pressure on GF to revert their policy change & put the rest of the dex into the games once they realize how badly this is going to affect their sales.
     
    1,372
    Posts
    18
    Years
  • I understand people being angry at GF for this. I personally am alright with it, for 2 reasons.

    I'm bringing this up as a discussion point because I want to see how others feel about my thoughts.


    1: Pokemon Home will allow for all 800+ Pokemon to be transferred to it by way of Pokemon Bank/GO/SWSH/LGPE/etc.
    We only assume it's going to be Pokemon Bank but for Switch. I don't see it this way, I think that Pokemon Home will be much more than just a storage system, allowing you to interact with your Pokemon. Regardless, your living dex isn't going anywhere.

    2: We all know that they can fit all of the Pokemon and animations in a switch cartridge. 3DS carts hold up to 8GB, Switch has a max of 32GB, with 64GB coming this year, apparently. I foresee either a 3rd version or "definitive edition" with all Pokemon included once more storage is available. Also keep in mind that, at the Treehouse event we saw(although this might change) the same 6 year old animations. I know I will buy and play these games, because I love Pokemon! But you have to admit, if you're going to claim that you can't put all Pokemon in because of the high quality models an animations, and use the same animations you've been using.

    We all saw those Wingull t-posing.


    I understand that I am almost 30 years old, the Pokemon franchise isn't made for me, it's made for people much younger than myself. Even so I am still very passionate about the series as a whole.

    TL;DR: I think that the next games we get will have all Pokemon.
     

    Whim

    king of weirdtropolis
    45
    Posts
    5
    Years
  • I understand people being angry at GF for this. I personally am alright with it, for 2 reasons.

    I'm bringing this up as a discussion point because I want to see how others feel about my thoughts.


    1: Pokemon Home will allow for all 800+ Pokemon to be transferred to it by way of Pokemon Bank/GO/SWSH/LGPE/etc.
    We only assume it's going to be Pokemon Bank but for Switch. I don't see it this way, I think that Pokemon Home will be much more than just a storage system, allowing you to interact with your Pokemon. Regardless, your living dex isn't going anywhere.

    2: We all know that they can fit all of the Pokemon and animations in a switch cartridge. 3DS carts hold up to 8GB, Switch has a max of 32GB, with 64GB coming this year, apparently. I foresee either a 3rd version or "definitive edition" with all Pokemon included once more storage is available. Also keep in mind that, at the Treehouse event we saw(although this might change) the same 6 year old animations. I know I will buy and play these games, because I love Pokemon! But you have to admit, if you're going to claim that you can't put all Pokemon in because of the high quality models an animations, and use the same animations you've been using.

    We all saw those Wingull t-posing.


    I understand that I am almost 30 years old, the Pokemon franchise isn't made for me, it's made for people much younger than myself. Even so I am still very passionate about the series as a whole.

    TL;DR: I think that the next games we get will have all Pokemon.

    For the first point, I really doubt it'll come free for us tho. They will probably make a month/anual value for players to pay to keep their mons in there. Differently from Bank, they made it clear that what goes can't come back, so USUM Pokémon that don't belong in Gen 8 dex have nowhere to go, thus making so everyone who wants to keep their mons in Home will probably have to submit to the needed price. At the end of the day, differently from Bank that could work only as a transfer system, Home will probably offer something more expensive in the price of giving to the player the option to do something that, funnily, the prior games could do in their own. Being capable of battling or trading in Home is almost a joke. People who have it probably will have SWSH, which could do the same things for Gen 7 Pokémon, but won't be allowed to, since not every Pokémon will be present in the dex. Oh, but hey, having a third game with everyone is a must buy, right?

    Seriously, the more time you give to think about their idea, the worse it gets.​
     
    Last edited:
    1,372
    Posts
    18
    Years
  • I never said anything about battling in HOME.
    All I said was interact with them.

    And of course it's not going to be a free service, I don't think anyone expected it to be.

    I was just saying I see it as more than just storage like Bank is. Who knows, it could function like PokePelago, or something similar.

    EDIT: You can also just not transfer anything from Gen 7 until you know what can/can't be put in SWSH, or until you can transfer them all.
     
    Last edited:

    theclaw

    Haruhi Mania
    30
    Posts
    20
    Years
    • Seen Feb 23, 2023
    They even kind of backpedaled on that releasing RBY/GSC on VC and allowing to transfer your mons from there to the bank, I mean, 2 decades later, so maybe there's hope for the far future ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    The far future is the ultimate problem. The indeterminate yet unavoidable reality of too many Pokemon existing to be able to include in a single title in a reasonable development time frame.
     
    650
    Posts
    6
    Years
  • There's not really much new I can add to this debate as it's been laid out by a lot of well written posts in this thread about why exactly what Game Freak has chosen to do leaves a very bitter taste in the mouths of those that this is a deal break for (and evidently there is a lot of us given the very visible backlash). I've been a loyal Pokémon fan since Gen I and remember feeling Poké-mania and the message of 'gotta catch 'em all'. To me this decision completely goes against the very heart of what the franchise has always been about. Even if it isn't as big a deal to you it is most definitely a valid deal breaker for others (which for me it is). I am glad to see posts of people that do recognise that in this thread, even if it isn't as big a deal for them at least.

    Although I wouldn't have been able to buy this game until a while after it was released anyway; I have lost my desire to eventually buy it at all and that is the very first time in the franchises history I do not have plans to pick up a main game at some point (LGPE is not a main game no matter what you say Masuda). All I can hope for now is that something comes of the backlash and they announce a free patch to be released at some point later on to fix this because again, it is very much a choice i.e. not a necessity on their part.
     
    Last edited:

    bobandbill

    one more time
    16,935
    Posts
    16
    Years
  • A video I came across from a 3D animator's/modeller's perspective on the topic. In short he says it's just a case of needing textures made rather than new models, but still may be worth the long watch if you want details (and some amusing censoring).

     
    45
    Posts
    4
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    • Seen Jan 26, 2020
    if I want a sceptile I will ply oras. and if I want a piplup, I will wait for dp remakes. I don't care about this and I recently found out how ungrateful this community can be. we screamed for open world, see pokemon walking
    around the routes, and more. ss gave us all of that, and yet we call it trash for not having EVERY SINGLE POKEMON IN IT. ah I can see it now

    >shows off pokemon following you

    >shows off a story better then bw and sm combined

    >gives us all awesome and well desinged pokemon

    >shows off more awesome features that we were screaming for

    >then proceeds to get more dislikes and hate comments then youtube rewind 2018

    ah, I hate how ungrateful you people are
     

    Whim

    king of weirdtropolis
    45
    Posts
    5
    Years
  • Actually it is completely uncommon for people from the fanbase to criticize about what they are doing, seriously. In eight generations, there's literally 3 points in Pokémon history that fans actually went on a rampage against GF's decision and it happened in RS (after they couldn't transfer their mons from Gen 2), BW (when people didn't like many designs + you couldn't meet older mons until finished the game) and now. Complaining about the game is literally the only way for a consumer to get from his games what they want. Criticizing is necessary because it gives the developer a chance to work with their mistakes and understand what's relevant to build a game for everyone!

    And honestly, right now is what they need the most.​
     
    Last edited:
    45
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    • Seen Jan 26, 2020
    Where do I begin? Your "if you want this Pokemon, you can play a different game" logic is silly since not everyone has older games with the Pokemon that they want to use. You're also calling the new Pokemon awesome and well-designed even though that's just your opinion; it's completely subjective, so to the rest of us how is that a good argument in favor of these games? Also, how can you claim that these games have a better story than B/W and S/M combined when all we have are a few short trailers, a few character designs, 12 new Pokemon, and only a couple of new features so far? Then you claim that people are trashing these games for not having every single Pokemon in them as if that's asking for too much.

    That "I hate how ungrateful you people are" line is in particular triggers me because you're acting as if people have to be grateful for everything that Gamefreak creates as if they're handing out charity. Well they're not. The games cost us money, so if it's not worth the investment then of course fans are going to complain. Nobody wants to spend ~$50 on a game that already has several flaws in it.

    ok first of all I meant a brand new trailer and not the current one.
    second of all when I said ungrateful I meant how they aren't talking about any of the pros and they act like this con(s) is the entire game.
     

    shadowmoon522

    Master of Darkness & Light
    1,005
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    • Age 33
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    • Seen May 7, 2024
    ~$50 on a game that already has several flaws in it.
    its a switch game so the price is $10 more then a 3ds game, so the price is $60 + tax which here in PA is 6% which in turn brings the price up to $63.60 unless you get it though some deal like that voucher thing or online somewhere
    so essentially its about 10$ more then USUM, most likely about the same amount of content as USUM(because this is game freak) for "higher graphics".
    rather they just went back to using pixel sprites then this...
    i swear, this↓ would be so much better then getting rid of all the mons
    hYP15B0.png

    xs8fowN.jpg
     

    LyokoGirl5000

    Lyoko Princess
    426
    Posts
    14
    Years
  • I knew they were going to cut Pokemon from the games sooner or later since around the time 4th Gen game out. It doesn't really bother me. That said, I hope they let us know before we transfer Pokemon to Home so they aren't stuck there.
     

    jfuze174

    Elite Trainer Joey
    367
    Posts
    14
    Years
  • The only that would make me feel better about this if poke home was a hybrid of Pokémon pelego and go park Except with the re capturing of course
     
    2
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    • Seen Jun 29, 2019
    not understanding the anger over sword/shield

    Alright so i get that people are angry over the whole "cant bring all Pokemon over" thing but the reasoning behind it doesn't really make sense and i thought i would make a list stating my arguments (and if this has been done before sorry :x).

    1. This is no longer 3DS quality game its much higher resolution thus higher quality models and more time spent recreating said models

    2. The game releases have coincided with the television series as far back as i can remember (granted my memory isn't very good but still). Since theres going to be a new series beginning at the end of this year it only makes sense that they're going to come out with a new Pokemon game representing the new region (please tell me theres Pokemon fans that actually know this).

    3. bringing over Pokemon for attachment reasons? Alright this i don't understand are there really people out there that would bring a Pokemon over for this reason?

    I'm sorry if i don't seem as sympathetic to this whole thing as others but as someone who has played since gen one I've just played the games for the joy and fun thats about it. It just seems like all this hubbub is for nothing really (i mean theres Pokemon home for crying out loud just keep em there). If theres a key point I'm missing thats fine tell me please! But as it stands i don't really understand why people are so upset about this.
     
    Last edited:

    Vragon2.0

    Say it with me (Vray-gun)
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  • Alright so i get that people are angry over the whole "cant bring all Pokemon over" thing but the reasoning behind it doesn't really make sense and i thought i would make a list stating my arguments (and if this has been done before sorry :x).
    Before we start there's one big thing that should be first referenced. Gamefreak has always been about the "Gotta catch them all" and stuff in pokemon. Pokemon is after a JRPG and mons are something to collect and train. Now, while the game does have a lot of flexibility room for people not caring to complete the pokedex, wanting to do more competitive, side stuff, etc. it does still have a strong emphasis on being able to collect mons and fill the dex (The story, trading, new random encounters, post-game stuff).

    So that already had some form of abrupt change when you say that Pokemon not in the dex won't be able to be sent over. Now, let's go over each point one by one.

    1. This is no longer 3DS quality game its much higher resolution thus higher quality models and more time spent recreating said models
    And that should sacrifice making mons why exactly? This actually is a decent highlight on an issue a lot of people have with pokemon games direction. Being with a lot of the new hardware a lot of the scaling and art direction takes a bit of a nose dive. You can see this in XY with the rather smaller looking region and stuff as well as fewer mons added and even in SM with the ration of your character to the world being rather...small despite it supposed to be Hawaii.

    Now, this isn't a problem inherently, but it is perfectly understandable some would be bothered by such a change. Let alone factoring that their reasoning was they wanted the mons to be more expressive, but so far from what we've seen the only real "added" expression is better textures and the battle gimmick of the game. Now, I won't say they don't have this or the mons being way more expressive, but that would simply be information GF hasn't given us yet and therefore it is understandable why people would consider the contrary.

    There is another reason I want to bring but it relates to your second point.

    2. The game releases have coincided with the television series as far back as i can remember (granted my memory isn't very good but still). Since theres going to be a new series beginning at the end of this year it only makes sense that they're going to come out with a new Pokemon game representing the new region (please tell me theres Pokemon fans that actually know this).
    Firstly, it hasn't been announced yet, secondly that doesn't mean it's a good thing. You see, would you rather have a game that would have the time taken to make it better and rather full of the content fans would expect from the series or would you want to release it the same day as the anime and have to put out this little tid bit of info. I think it's obvious how big this little thing is to the fandom by how SWSH has gone down in popularity due to this (presumably that is).

    Now, the anime is more or less its own thing/adaption of stuff from the game so releasing it before the game would be problematic; I would agree, however, I doubt the better course of action would be to release the game when it would normally come out as opposed to taking the time to make the stuff. It's as you said, "not the 3DS" they clearly need more time to make it all and a yearly release might not cut it anymore. But Nintendo frankly isn't going to really let that fly and GF is showing signs of needing more staff if they're going to keep it to a yearly release.


    3. bringing over Pokemon for attachment reasons? Alright this i don't understand are there really people out there that would bring a Pokemon over for this reason?
    Hey remember when you said you saw flaws with the "reasoning" and how it didn't add up? Well, how is not understanding why someone would want to bring over mons they like for attachment reasons "flawed reasoning". It's a subjective thing some do others don't. Just like the news of the transfer issue with SWSH being important to some while not as important to others.

    Also there could be many reasons. "EV training, breeding, stuff for early trade, using your team in some competative, testing stuff, mons you want to do the adventure with" there could be several reasons other than simply "attachment"
    I'm sorry if i don't seem as sympathetic to this whole thing as others but as someone who has played since gen one I've just played the games for the joy and fun thats about it.
    I applaud you for playing the game the way you want to, so what's wrong with how others want to play it? Again, I think your substituting the whole "why did they choose this?" as it being an emotional outcry when there is issues with the reasons they've levied. Some people have even dissected them better than me, not to mention GF has contradicted itself more than once.
    It just seems like all this hubbub is for nothing really (i mean theres Pokemon home for crying out loud just keep em there).
    Even if it's over nothing to yah, you did mention you "Don't understand" why it is like this. Have you looked at articles or discussions on this topic? Have you listened to the arguments and points brought up from the faction that wants all the mons in the game? The way you've said this comes off as simply noticing the drama and commenting on it rather than delving into both sides of the argument.

    And it's fine we all make mistakes, but I think you misrepresent the people you talk about with the points you've given here.

    If theres a key point I'm missing thats fine tell me please! But as it stands i don't really understand why people are so upset about this.

    Well, I hope these points help clear some of it up, but I'd encourage you to also look into other articles or discusion stuff that can talk about it better than I.
     
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