Forums.

[Nihilego]

Is being a member of a forum a good use of time? Why or why not? Consider not only posts, but also that members will meet, and what members could have done in their offline life had they not found the forum. Does anyone really get anything out of being part of a forum which, if the time spent online was dedicated instead to their offline lives, they couldn't have had anyway? Why do people bother with online lives in the first place? Is it healthy?

Discuss.

 

[Alice]

For me, PC is my happy place on the internet. Most of the net is even more harsh than real life, and while I don't have any trouble handling trolling, it's really nice to come to a place where I know everyone's always really friendly and accepting.

It may not be productive, but it keeps me sane. lol



Edit: Ah, you edited it to be all forums, not just PC... In that case, I feel like forums are my gateway to the world. It allows me to talk to a large number of people all at once, make new friends, learn about recent news, and spread the word about things I think are important. Again, it doesn't produce anything in particular, but is an important piece of my social life, whether I have one irl or not.

 

[Scuki]

[SIZE="a"]People here in Pc are really friendly. =). I got to discuss a lot and it's really fun to post and share stories. =)[/SIZE]

 

[Captain Fabio]

Depends on the forum.

Good:
General learning forums

Bad:
Forums like this

Let's face it, not much good actually comes from forums like PC, but it is fun, so that is all that matters.​

​

 

[Nick]

As long as it stays a hobby and not something that someone does all day, every day, then I don't think it's that bad. But if someone spends too much time here and starts to neglect things going on in their life and takes it very seriously, then that's a sign that it's time to take a step back and organize your priorities. As long as priorities are in check, it's not much of a waste of time. Besides, being on forums can be an interesting learning experience for some, and it can be an outlet of discovering who you are, which is always grood. You can also meet people and make friends.

 

[Dakotah]

Depends on the forum.

Good:
General learning forums

Bad:
Forums like this

Let's face it, not much good actually comes from forums like PC, but it is fun, so that is all that matters.​

​

I think you just contradicted yourself. You actually identified something good about forums like this. Namely, that it's fun. I've always been of the belief that if something is enjoyable, it's always worth doing.

 

[Alley Cat]

^ What he was saying though, is that there is no real benefit to PC other than the fact that it is fun. Which is "bad" because we could put the time we spend on PC to something more useful like going to work and school.

I don't think it is bad, though. Even in forums like PC where it is about a game, it still promotes discussion and thought. It[PC] covers a HUGE range of topics, as I'm sure we all know. The biggest thing though, is that those discussions and stuff, and the relationships you might build, those are good for your brain. They help structure it and define it, making you smarter. /There is more brain science behind this claim, but I don't feel like explaining it....

 

[Dakotah]

^ What he was saying though, is that there is no real benefit to PC other than the fact that it is fun. Which is "bad" because we could put the time we spend on PC to something more useful like going to work and school.

Well, I could be doing the dishes right now, or putting the laundry away. But...

 

[Shiny Celebi]

I think for the most part being on forums is a good thing. Its a great way to meet people from all over the world that share common interests and to discuss those interest in an organized place. Honestly for me its important because its harder for me to make friends offline and these places bring the world to me. Though forums are not the most important thing and real life obviously comes first. Going on forums is a fun hobby though and a great way to meet people and relieve stress. Thats the benefit I see to them.

 

[Oryx]

I think forums have a generally detrimental effect on a lot of people. I'm talking specifically about people that are shy just because...they're shy, and it's something that they can put effort into it to fix but don't. Those kinds of people will retreat to an online forum like this, make friends here, and decide that real life doesn't actually matter and never bother learning the social skills to make friends in that way. It's really detrimental to them because if they didn't have online socializing such as the internet, they would have made an effort to be closer to real people and will have created a real life for themselves.

Of course, this doesn't apply to everyone. Some people join and never have the social skills to interact normally in real life, and never will. Some already do interact normally and this is just something on the side. Those are two different cases.

 

[Dakotah]

I think forums have a generally detrimental effect on a lot of people. I'm talking specifically about people that are shy just because...they're shy, and it's something that they can put effort into it to fix but don't. Those kinds of people will retreat to an online forum like this, make friends here, and decide that real life doesn't actually matter and never bother learning the social skills to make friends in that way. It's really detrimental to them because if they didn't have online socializing such as the internet, they would have made an effort to be closer to real people and will have created a real life for themselves.

Shyness is really a bi-product of fear and of low self-esteem. Both can be overcome for some, but not all. Overcoming shyness certainly doesn't happen overnight. In a lot of cases, it could take years before an individual is comfortable in a social setting. Many, however, are unable to get over their shyness despite their best efforts. I don't think it's fair to say that shy people use forums like this as an excuse not to socialize in the real world. Most desperately want the kind of social lives they see their friends and families have. They even go to extremes like hypnotic therapy to rid themselves of their shyness. But rarely is the solution so simple. What must be tackled is the fear they feel and their low self-esteem before it can even be contemplated that they'd develop an active social life.

 

[Oryx]

Shyness is really a bi-product of fear and of low self-esteem. Both can be overcome for some, but not all. Overcoming shyness certainly doesn't happen overnight. In a lot of cases, it could take years before an individual is comfortable in a social setting. Many, however, are unable to get over their shyness despite their best efforts. I don't think it's fair to say that shy people use forums like this as an excuse not to socialize in the real world. Most desperately want the kind of social lives they see their friends and families have. They even go to extremes like hypnotic therapy to rid themselves of their shyness. But rarely is the solution so simple. What must be tackled is the fear they feel and their low self-esteem before it can even be contemplated that they'd develop an active social life.

I'm speaking from personal experience, for a long time I was the exact kind of person I'm talking about. Online doesn't help with that kind of thing, because it just strengthens the notion that "no one irl will ever be friends with you, you can't even get friends unless they don't meet you irl", which is the biggest problem with online friends. They tend to do next to nothing for self esteem. My self esteem finally went up when I went to college and made friends here in real life.

I specifically said I wasn't talking about people that are unable to get over their shyness though, lol. It's a certain type of shy person - the type that, given the chance, would be able to make friends in real life with effort, but choose not to because they decide to just give up on real life and focus on the internet instead.

 

[Dakotah]

I'm speaking from personal experience, for a long time I was the exact kind of person I'm talking about. Online doesn't help with that kind of thing, because it just strengthens the notion that "no one irl will ever be friends with you, you can't even get friends unless they don't meet you irl", which is the biggest problem with online friends. They tend to do next to nothing for self esteem. My self esteem finally went up when I went to college and made friends here in real life.

I specifically said I wasn't talking about people that are unable to get over their shyness though, lol. It's a certain type of shy person - the type that, given the chance, would be able to make friends in real life with effort, but choose not to because they decide to just give up on real life and focus on the internet instead.

My whole life is on the Internet. But that's mostly because that's where I sell my books from. You get to meet people from all over the world that way, which I think is pretty neat as people from all over come from all sorts of different backgrounds so they'll have very unique points of view. This as opposed to people I meet in real life who have a very similar world view having grown up in almost the same circumstances.

The funny thing about online relationships though, is if you're determined enough, you can meet them in real life. I've met people from as far as Texas (In in Southern Ontario, Canada) through the Internet. And my boyfriend and I began our relationship over the net as well. So, used right, the Internet can be a source of great, real relationships.

 

[Oryx]

I'm not denying that. But for many people, in fact many people I met when I spent a lot of time playing MMOs and had low self-esteem in high school, they had the ability to make friends in real life if they made the attempt, but they didn't because they felt that the internet should substitute for their real life. There's a difference between that and what you're describing. It's not something you can generally look at a person and judge for them, whether or not they have the ability to go out and make friends if they actually put as much effort into friendships irl as they do online. But for many, many people, that's the reality of it. They can have real relationships with people that don't involve months of online contact that may evolve into a week of real contact and then months of online contact, but they would rather not put forth the effort although the payoff is generally much greater.

I'm not saying that the internet is bad or not to talk to people online, or that internet relationships are inherently bad or no one should do business online. So not sure what your point is.

 

[Dakotah]

I'm not saying that the internet is bad or not to talk to people online, or that internet relationships are inherently bad or no one should do business online. So not sure what your point is.

The point is, forums such as this can't be labeled as detrimental, even for those who use it to escape from reality. Because regardless of whether a relationship is started online or in the real world, it's a relationship. I would rather the shy, who can't face reality, have an active online life rather than one in which they are perpetually alone. For many, starting an online relationship, and developing those relationships into strong friendships, can be just the thing they need to want to take it to the next level. Forums like this can be a powerful motivator. Even if a person didn't have an active social life in the real world, participating in discussions on forums and in chat rooms is an excellent way to enhance social skills in a way that's not threatening to them.

 

[Oryx]

The point is, forums such as this can't be labeled as detrimental, even for those who use it to escape from reality. Because regardless of whether a relationship is started online or in the real world, it's a relationship. I would rather the shy, who can't face reality, have an active online life rather than one in which they are perpetually alone. For many, starting an online relationship, and developing those relationships into strong friendships, can be just the thing they need to want to take it to the next level. Forums like this can be a powerful motivator. Even if a person didn't have an active social life in the real world, participating in discussions on forums and in chat rooms is an excellent way to enhance social skills in a way that's not threatening to them.

I can say that for me, in high school, my online relationships were detrimental to my life. So yes, I can label them as detrimental. And as I'm not a particularly unique case, I can from that assume that there are other people in the world for which they are also detrimental. My self-esteem only rose once I put forth the effort to make real friends, instead of shutting myself away online.

I feel like I should repeat "I am not talking about everyone" over and over until you get it, lol. I'm speaking of a specific group of people that are similar to how I was in high school, because I know it was detrimental to at least one person. Shutting out real life and focusing on forums is certainly not beneficial to every single person in the world, I'm sure you can concede that your experience doesn't apply to everyone.

I would rather the shy, who can't face reality, have an active online life rather than one in which they are perpetually alone.

See, you're assuming this hypothetical shy person will not put forth the real world effort if they don't have an online option. I'm not speaking about someone who's incapable of real life social interaction - those kinds of people can benefit from online interaction to give them basic social skills. I'm speaking about people that have some social skills, but are shy and are made uncomfortable by the idea of using them; they have the ability to decrease their discomfort by working hard on it, but they choose not to and take the easy way out by spending all their time on here instead.

Yes, it will be uncomfortable for them. But discomfort comes with growing as a person, no one can take the easy way out their entire lives.

 

[Dakotah]

I can say that for me, in high school, my online relationships were detrimental to my life. So yes, I can label them as detrimental. And as I'm not a particularly unique case, I can from that assume that there are other people in the world for which they are also detrimental. My self-esteem only rose once I put forth the effort to make real friends, instead of shutting myself away online.

And yet you continue to develop online relationships. Which tells me it wasn't the relationships themselves that were detrimental. We can't keep blaming the intangible for our failures. At some point we have to accept responsibility for our own actions (or lack there of). It wasn't the forums that were at fault. It was your own lack of confidence in yourself that was to blame. And as you stated, eventually you sought to change that, which you should be congratulated for. But let's not treat forums as the culprit. Like any other tool, they can be abused. The real fault lies in the user.

I feel like I should repeat "I am not talking about everyone" over and over until you get it, lol. I'm speaking of a specific group of people that are similar to how I was in high school, because I know it was detrimental to at least one person. Shutting out real life and focusing on forums is certainly not beneficial to every single person in the world, I'm sure you can concede that your experience doesn't apply to everyone.

And yet there are people who were, or are, in the same shoes you filled, who see things differently, who don't see Forums as detrimental but rather as something wonderful. It really does depend on your personal point of view. You saw it as detrimental, but someone who is just like you were, may look at it differently. That's why your assertions cannot be applied to that "specific group." In fact, your assertions can only be applied to one individual. Yourself.

See, you're assuming this hypothetical shy person will not put forth the real world effort if they don't have an online option.

I make no assumptions about anyone. I take everyone as they are and don't try to push them into something they may not be ready for or are uncomfortable with. If a person is perfectly fine with developing relationships online only, I have no problem with that. My only concern is that they are happy. And I certainly wouldn't impose my version of happiness on them.

 

[Yoshikko]

As long as it stays a hobby and not something that someone does all day, every day, then I don't think it's that bad. But if someone spends too much time here and starts to neglect things going on in their life and takes it very seriously, then that's a sign that it's time to take a step back and organize your priorities. As long as priorities are in check, it's not much of a waste of time. Besides, being on forums can be an interesting learning experience for some, and it can be an outlet of discovering who you are, which is always grood. You can also meet people and make friends.

Agreed, as long as you keep your priorities straight and your time online balanced, there's no problem. Something I want to add though is that about neglecting your priorities in life by spending too much time here and how that is a bad thing - that does not only go for forums or online things even, there are things in real life too in which you can get too caught up and cause you to neglect the important things that are going on in your life, it's not limited to online so in that sense that goes for everything really.

I agree on that forums like PC (or actually, really just think about it, any forum on the internet, how "educational" it might be) aren't very productive and can be considered a "waste" of time or "pointless", but in the grand scheme of things, does it really matter that much? I mean if you have your irl straight and solid, you know what you want, then what's the deal?? You meet people, it's fun, you learn something here and there, you're part of a social community, and if you look at it like that I really don't see the problem. Look at how long we live and what we actually live for in the end and it suddenly becomes not as big of a deal.

 

[Idyll]

Consider also that a lot of things come out online that aren't expressed offline. It can be everything from questioning one's sexuality, seeking help for family problems, reaching out about personal issues for someone who understands, etc. Anonymity can do great things for people, and forums like these serve as wonderful places for the kinds of discussion that I feel are all too uncommon offline. Things like philosophy, ethics, current events, etc, are popular debate and discussion topics here whereas I don't hear much about them offline outside of casual chat and straight arguments.

 

[Oryx]

And yet you continue to develop online relationships. Which tells me it wasn't the relationships themselves that were detrimental. We can't keep blaming the intangible for our failures. At some point we have to accept responsibility for our own actions (or lack there of). It wasn't the forums that were at fault. It was your own lack of confidence in yourself that was to blame. And as you stated, eventually you sought to change that, which you should be congratulated for. But let's not treat forums as the culprit. Like any other tool, they can be abused. The real fault lies in the user.

I didn't say the forums were at fault. But if the internet wasn't an option, I know myself and know that I desired social interaction, and therefore would have worked to achieve social interaction in real life. I never said forums are the culprit, it can be the person's fault while still acknowledging that they misused the internet in a way that was detrimental to them.

And yet there are people who were, or are, in the same shoes you filled, who see things differently, who don't see Forums as detrimental but rather as something wonderful. It really does depend on your personal point of view. You saw it as detrimental, but someone who is just like you were, may look at it differently. That's why your assertions cannot be applied to that "specific group." In fact, your assertions can only be applied to one individual. Yourself.

I am not talking about everyone
I am not talking about everyone
I am not talking about everyone
I am not talking about everyone
I am not talking about everyone

Maybe I should try a flashing neon sign next time you use the argument "some people don't see the same way".

I know other people who were the same way. There's a very, very, very tiny chance that my mindset on the internet is unique among billions of other people. The overwhelmingly obvious assumption to make is that it is detrimental to some people. You only need one counterexample to destroy your argument of "it's not detrimental to anyone".

I make no assumptions about anyone. I take everyone as they are and don't try to push them into something they may not be ready for or are uncomfortable with. If a person is perfectly fine with developing relationships online only, I have no problem with that. My only concern is that they are happy. And I certainly wouldn't impose my version of happiness on them.

Some people need pushing. I'm glad for the people that pushed me, even if I was uncomfortable at the time it's paid off in a better life right now. If I hadn't pushed myself in school then I wouldn't be enjoying the college I go to now, I would have given in to my natural laziness and would be at home unhappy. If I hadn't pushed myself to be social when I started college I wouldn't have had the happiness of having good friends in real life, I would have been as miserably lonely as I was in high school despite having countless online friends, because it's far from the same for me. Yes yes I know the internet is your savior and lover and whatever whatever, I said "for me" so I don't need another lecture on how wonderful you think the internet is for every single person on the planet based on your book-selling or whatever it is.