(Mature) DOOM

[Necrum]

I lost any fear of disappointment the second I finished my first "arena" in the game. The rush of adrenaline I felt was invigorating like I haven't felt in a game in what seems like forever! I am a bit irked by the repetitious Glory Kills, but they aren't particularly stale. It's still a fun game mechanic.

Also what platforms are you guys on? I'm on Steam.

 

[JJ Styles]

PC and steam obviously. I don't want to be a lil off topic but has Steam taken over the PC platform so much that even DOOM? DOOM is part of the platform?

Anyway, I just bought my copy. Too bad that in the store that i went to get my own, so many copies have been bought that I was just left without a nice box on it.. Just the game on its usual container. Dunno for those who were able to buy the game on launch day... I guess you were all luckier than i am. However, i have to wait for a couple of weeks before i can start ripping and tearing since I'm still in the WIP process of building my new compooter. Or there's the option of buying an MSI Gaming laptop with the right specs for DOOM (Processor and Graphics Cards, along with the Win 10 64 bit OS) but dang 80,000 (PHP) Philippine pesos is a mountain of a budget.

But, i still feel good for myself. I was lucky to get the last copy of the game from said store. The salty faces of the other customers was too dank for me to snapshot off XD. Yes, I feel good. REAL GOOD. LIKE MAH PRAETOR SUIT!

Oh man, if I can recreate Hell Revealed in Doom 4, that would be the best thing ever. Imagine Doom 4 + Hell Revealed (Legendary megawad that houses more than 300 monsters per map each level).....

 

[Necrum]

PC and steam obviously. I don't want to be a lil off topic but has Steam taken over the PC platform so much that even DOOM? DOOM is part of the platform?

Anyway, I just bought my copy. Too bad that in the store that i went to get my own, so many copies have been bought that I was just left without a nice box on it.. Just the game on its usual container. Dunno for those who were able to buy the game on launch day... I guess you were all luckier than i am. However, i have to wait for a couple of weeks before i can start ripping and tearing since I'm still in the WIP process of building my new compooter. Or there's the option of buying an MSI Gaming laptop with the right specs for DOOM (Processor and Graphics Cards, along with the Win 10 64 bit OS) but dang 80,000 (PHP) Philippine pesos is a mountain of a budget.

But, i still feel good for myself. I was lucky to get the last copy of the game from said store. The salty faces of the other customers was too dank for me to snapshot off XD. Yes, I feel good. REAL GOOD. LIKE MAH PRAETOR SUIT!

Also i had an idea! Wouldn't it be fun if we made a community map? Since SnapMap allows you to branch other people's levels, we could have one person start building, then pass it on and on until we have a single awesome level.

Oh man, if I can recreate Hell Revealed in Doom 4, that would be the best thing ever. Imagine Doom 4 + Hell Revealed (Legendary megawad that houses more than 300 monsters per map each level).....

There's a monster limit on SnapMap so don't expect to get too crazy. However, you could probably work the Survival AI Conductor to your advantage to create a really overwhelming situation. I actually crashed the game with it lol.

 

[zevarius kerensky]

OKAY CHICKS AND DUDES! THE GAME IS OUT! (just came yesterday)

For those who bought the game, how is everything so far? I still haven't gotten my copy which I should be doing later so that I'm not being a pleb.

My first impressions so far based from footage:

- Enemies deal a lot of damage. Like TONS of left unchecked and especially at Ultraviolence difficulty
- HOLY MOLY THE ENEMIES HAVE AI! LIKE WOW! COOOOOOOOLLLLLLL! Fighting the first IMP ALONE makes you feel like you're fighting a demon already! WHOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!

- Gameplay feels like this: Both Player and Enemy takes advantage of the space between them in the encounters. Some enemies, ESPECIALLY THOSE IMPS, will be taking advantage of whatever space they have to move around while you have to move around as well to make sure that you do not get shanked by that imp or that other enemy.

- I'll emphasize this again: AVOID PROJECTILES UP THE ARSE! This is the way Doom was since the beginning of time, and the game perfectly captures it in this game. I mentioned before that enemies deal a lot of damage, oh yeah, especially those projectiles. I can't imagine the sorry player who got far enough to be smacked by a Baron of Hell's fireball :)))))

EDIT: Hell Knights in D4 are pure melee brawlers as far as i can. BRB getting the game as soon as i can.

TO CELEBRATE THE RELEASE OF THE GAME:

MAH QUESTION OF THE DAY!!!

*How do you feel about the Doomguy in this iteration of the game being given a sort of backstory - an ancient warrior called the "Doomslayer" that was either banished to hell or chose to stay there in which he was captured by hell's forces and sealed in a tomb, he is later retrived by the UAC where he is "held captive" and studied, until hell invades the base, and he escapes and arms himself with a pistol, and his Praetor Suit.

6 main points from my perspective:

1: i FUCKING LOVE IT!
2: im playin on ULTRAVIOLINCE! and good fucking GOD IS IT HARD!
3: got the blue key, and in HELL!
4: i love the pistol :3 i wish i had it outside of doom :3
5: not as... refreshing as project brutality/russian overkill, but it works :3
6: the rune trial loading screen is SO AWESOME! SO METAL! i wish i had it as my screensaver :3

im not very far yet so... ya, i love it so far! :D

the doomguy having a story? i thought "hell broke free and killed every1 on base, GO KILL EM BACK!" is a good enough story! but i guess it gives a good perspective on the lore i suppose

 

[JJ Styles]

6 main points from my perspective:

1: i ****ING LOVE IT!
2: im playin on ULTRAVIOLINCE! and good ****ing GOD IS IT HARD!
3: got the blue key, and in HELL!
4: i love the pistol :3 i wish i had it outside of doom :3
5: not as... refreshing as project brutality/russian overkill, but it works :3
6: the rune trial loading screen is SO AWESOME! SO METAL! i wish i had it as my screensaver :3

im not very far yet so... ya, i love it so far! :D

the doomguy having a story? i thought "hell broke free and killed every1 on base, GO KILL EM BACK!" is a good enough story! but i guess it gives a good perspective on the lore i suppose

- Yeah i knew that Ultraviolence was something that's going to be challenging. It seems that other than just massing more enemies on screen, they went with the other direction of making the enemy AI be more competent and giving them a damage boost. I'm not much of a fan of giving enemies a damage boost as part of the difficulty curve, but remembering Quake 2 on its harder difficulty settings (enemies dealing more damage + being less vulnerable to pain chance while still adding more enemies on screen), I might as well be accepting of it. DOOM's ways of enemy encounters really reminds me a lot about Quake 2 for some reason, where you spent a lot of time fighting enemies on areas where both you and the enemy have a lot of room to navigate on (referring to my previous post)

- OH YES! SOMEONE WHO ACTUALLY PLAYS THE DOOM MODS! WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! And yes, I've already mentioned that DOOM may not be as overly outrageous as that of Project Brutality, but hey, we still have to give credit to the said game. We knew from the start that its not going to be as outrageous as that of Brutal Doom/Project Brutality. Then again, we are a bunch of spoiled gorehounds anyway to have played Brutal Doom to kingdome come :)))))

- I was actually quite surprised when they decided to give the Doomguy some sort of backstory about him being a resurrected ancient warrior thing. However, we are living now in the age (well since 2014 i suppose) that characters without backstories seem to be not working now because of ya know, people being more critical to things outside of gameplay (i miss the 90s when we all just cared about shooting demons in the face and kicking their faces off. WHOOOOO!!!!!!!) But I'll be positive about this. I don't want to be overly negative and critical on something outside the gameplay as well..

===> Doomguy being a ressurected ancient Warrior = That is some brilliant analogy right there folks. Its a great symbolism of what Doom 4 is meant to be. A revival of a legend, or at least what id Software and Bethesda where going for. The Doomguy is a legendary warrior of his own right, (and he has the biggest D**K manhood out of everyone in any video game ever) and he came back to a day and age where he has to fight not just against the forces of Ultrasatan, but also modernity itself. Unlike his Bro-in-arms Duke who had a rather unsuccessful relaunch in DNF, Doomguy keeps what he is all about... "Less talk, more action" (Since he doesn't talk anyway) (Btw suck it Screwattack)

===> Along with giving the Doomguy some backstory, there is a lot of dialogue in this game.. a lot. But its not on the level of "Running around with a Flashlight Simulator" aka Doom 3. I love how the Doomguy aggressively shoves all NPCs faces around since HE KNOWS (He's that much of a MAN, and a half) that we players don't want dialogue in our Doom games. WE AINT MILLENNIALS! WE ARE MEN! BORN FROM THE FLAMES OF ULTRAVIOLENCE! LESS TALK.. MORE MURDER! THATS WHAT THE DOOMGUY SYMBOLIZES! WHOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!

--> I'm still not a fan of the huge amount of Dialogue though. I get that we all need a break from all the blood and guts flying but still, this is a DOOM game. Call me a mindless meathead for not liking dialogue in a DOOM game but that's probably the last thing you need to know about. In my worldview, Dialogue in a Doom game is basically Doomguy's manly grunting and the Demons' cries of despair as the Doomguy mercilessly butchers them into a milion pieces. That is Doom poetry.

 

[Sir Codin]

Game Debate didn't give my machine a good grade, but I'm playing on the PS4 right now and I have to say the game was damn well optimized for running on consoles; it can get a damn good solid 60FPS on my PS4, which gives me confidence that my i3, GTX745, 8GB oven might be able to run it well with the right settings; especially since I don't use an HD monitor.

In the meantime, I'm going to make a video on my channel on my first impressions of the game with the PS4 version. Don't worry...I rented it. Just bought the PC version. If it runs shit no matter what I do, I'll just refund, settle for PS4 until I build up a surplus to upgrade my machine. Especially since newer cards and CPUs are going to go down in price with nVidia's new card coming out.

 

[Necrum]

First SnapMap level complete! This started off with me trying to make something straight forward and simple. As you can see when you open it in the editor, it is far from the original intention. I kept on coming up with stuff that would be cool to include and had to keep re-balancing the enemy flow, then I added a Nightmare mode and that took all kinds of retooling and then sore multipliers and on and on and jeebuz I made a pretty cool map! Lucky for all of us, SnapMap works cross platform, so all a ya do give it a go, won't you? I promise you won't be disappointed.

Spoiler:

 

[Sir Codin]

First SnapMap level complete! This started off with me trying to make something straight forward and simple. As you can see when you open it in the editor, it is far from the original intention. I kept on coming up with stuff that would be cool to include and had to keep re-balancing the enemy flow, then I added a Nightmare mode and that took all kinds of retooling and then sore multipliers and on and on and jeebuz I made a pretty cool map! Lucky for all of us, SnapMap works cross platform, so all a ya do give it a go, won't you? I promise you won't be disappointed.

Spoiler:

Cool. Might give it a shot.

My computer is probably not going to run DOOM 4 well, so I've settled with the PS4 version. Is SnapMap available on there as well?

 

[Necrum]

Cool. Might give it a shot.

My computer is probably not going to run DOOM 4 well, so I've settled with the PS4 version. Is SnapMap available on there as well?

Yeah, and completely cross platform too! Anyone can download a map from any system.

EDIT: I just updated Lore Friendly to v1.2, which includes some simple pacing fixes, a penalty for dying, and a buffed Nightmare mode because I was getting too good at it when testing. I haven't fully tested Nightmare in its current state but it should be beatable, if really fucking challenging! Oh, and a Plasma Rifle early on for anyone who doesn't like one of the starting weapons. If I get around to a v1.3 I'll add in another secret. Might raise the par time too, it's tough to hit with any modifiers on. Then again there is a hefty score bonus for Par on harder difficulties so maybe it's fine. I'm gonna make something much simpler for my next SnapMap, lol. This took all day yesterday to make, and I have a couple neat ideas that won't take nearly as long to implement, the first of which I call Glass Cannon Survival.

 

[Sir Codin]

Yeah, and completely cross platform too! Anyone can download a map from any system.

Cross-platform functionality is the biggest solution to gaming's problems right now. So is eliminating exclusitivity. Glad to see id Soft taking note of that.

 

[JJ Styles]

Yeah, and completely cross platform too! Anyone can download a map from any system.

EDIT: I just updated Lore Friendly to v1.2, which includes some simple pacing fixes, a penalty for dying, and a buffed Nightmare mode because I was getting too good at it when testing.

You know you are getting really good at the game when you just say "BUFF NIGHTMARE PL0X" :))))
********************

I'm still kinda infatuated with something though. I really do miss Doom 2's masses of enemies waiting to be slaughtered. Its was probably the whole reason why i started playing on Ultraviolence all the way, till Tuesday. I'm hoping that I go deeper in the campaign, my wishes of some UV style hordes of enemies will be there.

Spoiler:

Of course, given how DOOM's monsters are quite powerful, the Doomguy himself does grow stronger with Dem upgrades that you can get from finding those other Elite Guard suit guys. BTW spoilers so if you clicked this spoiler for your morbid curiosity

Then again, that was also my main gripe with Doom 2.. Doom 2's level design was pretty mindless by the time you get past "Tricks and Traps" with maps that are basically monster closets number 80001, which is why Doom 1 and Knee Deep in the Dead remain as the pinnacle of Doom in terms of level design and monster placement, hence it also is the most recreated in other engines and other games. Hmmm Knee Deep in Doom 4... that would be quite an accomplishment. Or... Thy Flesh Consumed.. OH GOD.. OH GOD.. I can only imagine how brutal a Doom 4 recreated Thy Flesh Consumed map series would feel like..

*For the morbidly curious, Thy Flesh Consumed is the 4th episode from Doom 1's campaign. introduced from The Ultimate Doom. The campaign or episode is known for being very challenging and at times morbidly unfair where Doom's level designers like John Romero have said themselves "FECK IT! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!". And this is Doom 1 we are talking about so no super shotguns, no megaspheres, and Barons of Hell are everywhere up the arse.

Hmm God Romero, please try Snap mapping for us.

I just recently tried his recreations of E1M4 and E1M8 for Doom 1 and they were awesome. Johnny Rom still knows how to design a map.

 

[Necrum]

Here's the full map info rundown I wrote for the DoomWorld forum:

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Map Name: Lore Friendly
Current Version: 1.2
SnapCode: 4327KCBV
Difficulty: Hurt Me Plenty/Nightmare
Story: A United Aerospace Corporation base on Deimos has gone offline. Restore power to the facility and investigate the source of the interuption.
Features:
-Adustable Score Modifiers:
--No Weapon Pickups: Removes all weapons from the map
--No Powerups: Removes Regeneration, Mega Health, and Haste from the map
--Nightmare: Buffs AI Conductors and Boss Fights
-Point Loss on Death
-Combination of AI Conductor and Scripted Battles for a balanced and fun pacing
-Arcade Mode: Shows damage values and score above enemies, as well as the score and timer on the HUD
-Two Secrets w/ optional Boss Fight: Be observant and they shouldn't be too hard to find

Possible features for v1.3:
-Another Secret Room
-Score Modifiers
--No Demon Drops: Will require more pickups. Maybe Glory Kill Drops only, we'll see.
--Hard Core Mode: Dying ends in failure
-Easy Mode: I'm back and forth on this one, because the main level isn't that hard. But it could be interesting to set it up just for people who suck at shooters. In theory it would disable on activating any modifiers, and would disable modifiers if turned on. Would also cut the score in half.[/FONT]

 

[zevarius kerensky]

well i just beat the game a while ago... holy hell did this throw me around x.x

a little adivice fer later on: turn down the diffaculty! trust me on this, monster count on screen SKYROCKETS faster thn u can fire the shotgun EVEN ONCE

do as many rune trials as u can find, trust me, they get VERY rewarding!

 

[Necrum]

I need someone to help me test Glass Cannon, my survival challenge. I don't think player can participate between platforms, sadly, so someone with a PC will have to work with me. Also searching on the Steam Discussion board so hopefully I can find someone soon.

 

[JJ Styles]

I love how our lovely little pub suddenly got a (Mature) tab on it XD. Machoslapped? :))))

anyway, for the sake of those building a new PC or planning to buy one fresh from the market, let me refresh everyone on DOOM's GFX card requirements:

Minimum: NVIDIA GTX 670 2GB / AMD Radeon HD 7870 2GB or better

Recommended: NVIDIA GTX970 4GB / AMD Radeon R9 290 4GB or better

I know that NVIDIA recently came out with their new killer GFX cards and I'm hoping that they ship here in the Philippines soon so i can complete my PC build and start ripping and tearing in 2016, (since I'm overplaying Brutal Doom and Project Brutality already XD)

*****************************

Okay, in my attempt to keep the thread fresh, delicious, and lovely. I'll also open up some Doom talk, outside of our lovely 2016 Triple AAA anti-indie Doom game :))) though I'm not exactly sure what to talk about yet OH WAIT maybe i do..

I'll ask, and its still related to DOOM 4 anyway so:

- When the DOOM E3 teaser came out, a lot of people have speculated that the first person fatalities aka Glory Kills were heavily inspired by Brutal Doom, along with the increased level of graphic violence and chainsaw supermurder. So my question for the day/week for us Murderjims and Murderjills to answer is that do you believe that DOOM 4 was indeed inspired by Brutal Doom?

 

[Necrum]

Honestly, and I know all the Halo comparisons are old, but Halo implemented executions some time ago as well. I think it's just a natural progression of the FPS to include them. Now, obviously, there's a strong chance that the guys at id have played Brutal Doom. While making the new one they probably played tons of mods and WADs to get into the right mindset. So I would say that they probably added Glory Kills for numerous reasons.

Glass Cannon is currently at beta status. It has also been renamed to Walking on Glass as the name of the map itself. Glass Cannon is now what I call the game type. Once I have the framework in place I can play with the layout and branch it into multiple actual stages you can play the game type on. I actually published it in an unfinished state so I could try to host a match with it, I needed to test a scoring thing. I still need to test it actually, part of the reason it's still at v0.8 (First published version was v0.666 ;). So glad that publishing the same map over again updates it instead of making a brand new entry though! I can put my ideas out before they are completely finished and get people excited for the final version. Man, this started as a simple idea and now it's evolved into a huge project again. I just can't help myself. Oh well. HELLKNIGHT.EXE should be a much simpler map... or so I say now.

 

[JJ Styles]

Oh well. HELLKNIGHT.EXE should be a much simpler map

If this is a map full of Hell Knights, I'd be willing to play this all day so that I can practice the crap out of killing them. Dear god Doom 4's Hell Knights are incredibly intimidating with the speed, power, and agility they possess. I can't even imagine how fighting a Baron of Hell would feel like given that those Hell Knights are mini bosses in disguise.

Okay I'll blow a lil steam off with something:

I'm not really a big fan of the way they implemented their way of challenge for the game. Making enemies deal more damage as a "challenge factor" is really what triggers me as I feel that its just some padding. The reason why I loved Ultra-Violence on classic Doom (and Doom mods) is that the challenge factor of that difficulty is = Much more enemies vs the normal amount of ammo you get. And ultimately, those bigger masses of monsters is what's enjoyable to kill.

I was playing Quake 2 on Hard difficulty, since I felt like Doom 4 really reminded me of Quake 2 for some reason, so i was caught off guard a little bit. Since I remember that after any of the Doom engine games, Id software seems to have had this habit of making the enemies either deal more damage or resist less damage (in quake 2's case, difficulty also affects their resistance to staggering) as a way of adding challenge to their games. Again, I am so not much of a fan of this way of adding challenge. I would have liked for them to stick with the way they did with Doom 1 and 2, where you face greater number of enemies AND face higher tier enemies earlier on (Like in Doom 2 and the early Revenant in The Crusher if played on UV)

I dunno. Maybe its just way too early in the morning and I'm triggering my infatuations for some body counts and huge masses of corpses D: (HEEEELLLLLLLLPPPPPPPP!)

Anyway, questions of the day will still exist along with my new one:

Previous question (which is still here): Do you think Brutal Doom was an inspiration for Doom 4? (with one response so far)
Next question: Are you happy with the way they padded in the challenge for this game or would you have preferred the classic way of doing it? This refers to Ultra-violence difficulty which I would safely assume that everyone SHOULD be playing on.

BONUS QUESTiON: Favorite weapon in the game?

And for our own amusement, some Weapon montage courtesy of Gamespot.

 

[Arsenic]

Catch up on the 'story' for anyone not caught up!

 

[Sir Codin]

I really just cannot look at the game and imagine that no one at idSoft did not play at least a little of Brutal Doom.

 

[Necrum]

If this is a map full of Hell Knights, I'd be willing to play this all day so that I can practice the crap out of killing them. Dear god Doom 4's Hell Knights are incredibly intimidating with the speed, power, and agility they possess. I can't even imagine how fighting a Baron of Hell would feel like given that those Hell Knights are mini bosses in disguise.

Nope, it's going to be a modern take on the "Joke WAD" and a parody of CreepyPasta like SONIC.EXE. I decided to put it off though in favor of a competitive game type I call Kill the Badass, where one player is picked at random to be super powered and the other 3 have to kill him to win.

Personally I think making enemies stronger is an appropriate way to increase difficulty, especially with them needing to stay inside the limits of what the engine can handle. This isn't like Dead Rising where you can have up to 300 zombies on screen lumbering with the same simplistic animations. These monsters are all very complex and including the same hordes that were in Classic Doom would break most modern computer systems and game consoles. So far I'm pretty happy with the intensity of the encounters in the game, and playing on harder difficulties will surely ramp that up when I can't reduce the horde as quickly. I've experienced some pretty overwhelming encounters in SnapMap so I'm sure Campaign has the right scenarios for it on Ultra Violent and Nightmare. Ultra Nightmare is the only difficulty that really bothers me since all it is is a Doom Nuzlocke, which anyone could easily enforce on their own. Just include an achievement for not dying, don't make a game mode out of it.

And my favorite weapon so far? Probably the Combat Shotgun with the Burst Shot. Now that I have it maxed out it's a very valuable asset. The Super Shotgun is great too, but it sometimes feels cheap. Definitely an effective Knight slayer though. The shared ammo pool with Shotguns is a nice touch. SnapMap doesn't share ammo sadly. Chaingun is pretty sweet, but the slowed movement speed makes it unattractive in a game that relies on constant movement. I only really use it for lone Cacodemon encounters. Rocket Launcher has become my best friend in Revenant and Summoner fights lately. I tend to want to use other weapons on Mancubi just because they're so slow and I can take my time with them a bit. The only weapons that I don't use all that often are the HAR and the Plasma Rifle. They do come out when I need to be more controlled about my Glory Kills, but for the most part they are just there for when I am low on ammo. I do use the Plasma a bit more now that I have the Heated Blast, but on the whole I found it a bit disappointing compared to the original weapon. In Doom it was a great reserve weapon for when you needed something to die really fast. In this it just feels like a slower Machine Gun. Gauss Cannon is pretty sweet for thinning the tougher encounters out but it's nothing I would write home about. No BFG as of yet. I am only just to Advanced Research right now. Not sure how long the game lasts but I think I still have a ways to go. Only been to Hell the one time and I feel like there hasn't been a boss fight yet. Unless the first Baron of Hell counted, which I doubt.