Super Smash Bros. Discussion

[Nah]

Were there any other tweaks made to the characters?

Also I still find it highly unlikely that we'd be getting Roy and Ryu in Smash 4.....

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

Were there any other tweaks made to the characters?

I'll post the list of tweaks found by GameFAQs and Reddit:

Spoiler:

Smash attacks w/ A/B button mash at same time
Mario's D-throw Utilt combo does less damage
Death of HOOHAA. Less damage and knockback
Sonic Bthrow knockback nerf by a lot
Ness Bthrow nerf. Slight knockback reduction, but still kills like crazy.
Pacman has faster grab, shorter fruit range on most fruit, and straw/cherry get 1 less ground bounce
Ike's moveset is generally buffed in knockback
Ganoncide lives. Ironic name is ironic.
Palutena has faster tilt startups and autoreticle speed, plus no autoreticle endlag
Megaman U/Dsmash have faster startup
Sheik's Bair is nerfed w/ less knockback
DHD's Fsmash seems to reliably connect w/ all 3 hits
MetaKnight's Dspecial glitch has been fixed
Charizard's Sspecial has more self-recoil and less %-damage
Lucina has stronger Nspecial
Greninja loses the ShadowSneak AT's Indefinite and Running SSneak
Rob has nerfed Uthrow knockback
Link has stronger % Uspecial
Ganon has stronger jab, but weaker reverse-warpunch
Robin is faster, has stronger arcfire and dash attack

R.O.B:
-Up Throw: Nerfed. Before the update, could kill mario from the starting platform of battlefield at 127%. It now kills at 145% .
*Uthrow: Damage-wise Identical, but lower knockback as stated before. This actually pops people right up beside ROB.
Link:
-Dash Attack (non-tip) 13% to 12%
+Up-B Uncharged 12% to 14%
+Up-B Fully Charged 19% to 22%
Robin:
+Movement speed +
+Arcfire does more damage. Used to do 10% in total, now 12%
+Dash Attack 7% → 10%
Greninja:
+Forward air knockback seems a little stronger
+All three smash attacks seem to have greater range, may even be slightly faster
+Up tilt seems to have greater range
+Up-throw seems to have reduced knockback making it better for follow ups.
Ganondorf:
+Jab now does 10 instead of 8
-Reverse aerial warlock punch does 37 instead of 40.
Lucina (Marth?):
+Non charged shield breaker killed Zelda at 121% on new patch, down from 139%.
Bowser:
As far as I can tell, damage is unchanged, but knockback has been increased for most attacks
Fthrow 115% vs. 130% at edge
Bthrow 117% vs. 133% at edge
Bair 100% vs. 105% from center
Fair 110% vs. 121% at edge
Fsmash from center 59% vs. 68%
Usmash 87% vs. 91% off the top
Dair non-spike-non-weak hit 91% vs. 100% at edge
Dair spike hit 132% vs. 137%
Utilt back hitbox 132% vs. 139% off the top
Utilt top of Mario's jump 115% vs. 123% off the top
Ftilt 108% vs. 119% at edge
Dtilt hit1 93% vs. 101% at edge
Jab combo 139% vs. 150% at edge
Side-b 116% vs. 124% off the top
Down-b (grounded) 82% vs. 88% off the top
Up-b (grounded) 161% vs. 171% from the center
Mii Gunner
U-Smash: 16% – 17%
B-Throw: 2% – 5%
U-Throw: 2% – 5%
Duck Hunt
Duck Hunt's can was buffed by 1% from the minimum of 8%
Fair in a sour spot does 1% damage less now.
His nair's sweet spot was nerfed 1% also.
Sheik
D-tilt 5% Kills: 263% sweetspot, 279% weak hit (2% less damage)
Bair 5% weak hit, 7% sweetspot Kills: 214% sweetspot , 316% weak hit (2% less damage on sweetspot, knockback nerfed hard)
Vanish 12%, 5% reappearing Kills:129% (Kills 6% earlier)
Bouncing Fish 12% Kills: 153% (Kills 2% earlier)
Meta Knight:
Fair Changed from 5% to 6%
Uptilt hitbox is larger, and it can hit grounded opponents now. This is probably his most important change, as it increases his combo ability greatly.
Lag install is gone
Mii Brawler's one-inch punch is gone.

Also I still find it highly unlikely that we'd be getting Roy and Ryu in Smash 4.....

Considering that we already have a Roy in Smash 4 and Sakurai previously stating that he won't bring third-parties that originated from traditional fighting games, there is a right to doubt.

 

[Nah]

Yay Robin buffs

Arcfire does 13% in total though. I'm not really seeing the increased movement speed though but I'm kinda bad at noticing that kind of thing.

 

[Aven]

Yay Robin buffs

Arcfire does 13% in total though. I'm not really seeing the increased movement speed though but I'm kinda bad at noticing that kind of thing.

I can definitely notice the speed buff. I don't know though, Robin was already decent and a pretty tricky character to fight unless you knew him well. I think the speed buff has made him a little OP.

 

[Kameken]

Mewtwo's out now, and I've got to say, from the few matches I've used him in, he's pretty good.

So, that's cool.

 

[CageTheMartyr]

MewTwo in smash?

As you probaby know, Mewtwo codes were handed out today.
----
What do you think of him as a character? do you think he is the pokemon that should of been included on smash?
what would you do to improve his move set?

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

Mewtwo has definitely improved from Melee. This side B actually hits its opponent with a reflected projectile, his Down Air moves can properly spike its opponents, and some of his other moves have kill potential.

 

[Kameken]

As you probaby know, Mewtwo codes were handed out today.
----
What do you think of him as a character? do you think he is the pokemon that should of been included on smash?
what would you do to improve his move set?

Moveset wise, the only thing I think he really needs is range. His average current rage is below 0% lucario's (Or at least feels like it), and that's pathetic for a psychic pokemon.

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

Well then, it looks like both Roy and Ryu are coming to Smash as DLC after all. Sakurai better give us a reason on why he contradicted his statement on not adding a third-party character from another fighting game. However, keep in mind that these additions have nothing to do with the fighter ballot, because they'll pick a character with the most requests when it ends this October. This does, of course, made me concerned about Wolf.

 

[Aven]

Moveset wise, the only thing I think he really needs is range. His average current rage is below 0% lucario's (Or at least feels like it), and that's pathetic for a psychic pokemon.

Yeah I agree with that. Even though he's been slightly buffed from Melee, without speed or range he's not the best competitive character (coming from someone who mains him) He was fairly good in Melee because punishes were so hard, but in 4 mind games aren't the easiest things to pull.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Well then, it looks like both Roy and Ryu are coming to Smash as DLC after all. Sakurai better give us a reason on why he contradicted his statement on not adding a third-party character from another fighting game. However, keep in mind that these additions have nothing to do with the fighter ballot, because they'll pick a character with the most requests when it ends this October. This does, of course, made me concerned about Wolf.

Didn't the guy also say that DLC was going to be limited to Mewtwo back when it was announced? Also didn't he/Nintendo also say they weren't going to do any more adjustments to the balance of the characters (like Nerf/Buff them after like update 1.3 or 1.4 came out on the N3DS version) At this point contradictions don't surprise me...

 

[Starry Windy]

Didn't the guy also say that DLC was going to be limited to Mewtwo back when it was announced? Also didn't he/Nintendo also say they weren't going to do any more adjustments to the balance of the characters (like Nerf/Buff them after like update 1.3 or 1.4 came out on the N3DS version) At this point contradictions don't surprise me...

I'm wondering if the balancing was to tie with the previous update of 1.0.4, but then, they keep on saying that the replays will be unusable after the update, which sometimes makes me a bit paranoid of saving replays in my 3DS nowadays. I wish they would clarify things about this.

EDIT: Apparently yes, there is a new balancing going on rn in 1.0.6.

And even though they have some characters on the set long before the ballot, I think they might consider other game characters too if the characters have high votes there as well.

 

[Nah]

I kinda wish that Mewtwo's side B didn't reflect projectiles. I mean its great to have if you play Mewtwo but being a Robin main it's annoying how like a good 1/3 or more of the roster is capable of reflecting or neutralizing projectiles =(

Also not understanding why Sakurai is putting Roy and Ryu in....assuming that's really gonna happen.

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

I kinda wish that Mewtwo's side B didn't reflect projectiles. I mean its great to have if you play Mewtwo but being a Robin main it's annoying how like a good 1/3 or more of the roster is capable of reflecting or neutralizing projectiles =(

Mewtwo's side B not reflecting projectiles like it's suppose to was part of the reason why it was a low tier in Melee. Projectile spammers just need to learn to adapt into a new strategy dealing with Mewtwo.

Also not understanding why Sakurai is putting Roy and Ryu in....assuming that's really gonna happen.

Ryu I can give you that, but there's been high demand for Roy's return ever since Brawl from both the U.S. and Japan, even if he is a Marth clone.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Ryu is an interesting choice...I'll like to see Lucario fight him...

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

Ryu is an interesting choice...I'll like to see Lucario fight him...

And Little Mac too.


One of the positive aspects of having Ryu in Smash is that they could use Guile's theme as one of the songs played at his stage on the Wii U version, and everyone knows how popular Guile's theme is.

 

[Aven]

Has anyone noticed Samus being a little over powered? I mean, she has tons of speed, a lot of strength and power, and most of all range. I honestly liked Samus in Melee, she was powerful but not as fast. Now she's very speedy, which is completely fine with me as long as they balance her range or power.

P.S. It didn't double post this time :O And I didn't reply to anything or use advanced.

 

[Nah]

I wouldn't really call Samus OP. She has range and power (Charge Shots are awesome), yeah, but she's not that fast and plenty of characters can deal with projectile spam. Oh and the ending lag on a missed throw is pretty bad, not to mention that her throws kinda suck too. She's a good character, but not overpowered imo.

 

[Proteun]

Meanwhile, I'll enjoy my Greninja buffs :] The meme got nerfed, haha.

Whoa, did Greninja get buffed? I'm maining him, but I don't really feel any big difference (although I was looking for nerfs of course).

 

[SnowpointQuincy]

DLC Characters. Mewtwo was in a previous game and so was Lucas. (and Lucas is pretty much Nes?)
So, The Smash Ballot says anything is possible, but logically it seems more likely to return a character or clone a character.
If they did pick a new character today, wouldn't it take a Year or longer to make/animate 3D models - design moves and balance test.?

I would really like Isaac from Golden Sun... but I'm afraid there just going to put pigtails on Diddy Kong and call it a day.