The US 2012 Elections Thread / American Politics Discussion

[Livewire]

They complain because the Government wastes money giving social services to the citizens, so what do they do? Waste money on useless laws. Sounds much more right.

Remember to breathe guys!

The fine politicians of the Republican party, at your service.

 

[Esper]

And people talk about the federal government wasting time and money. I have this tiny fear that some state somewhere is going to try something like this and come up with its own special definitions of what it considers acceptable records so it can try to keep Obama off the ballot. Oh, wait. That's what Arizona's already trying to do.

Republican Rep. Carl Seel of Phoenix, the bill's author, said the president's birth record wouldn't satisfy the requirements of his proposal and that Obama would have to provide other records, such as baptismal certificates and hospital records.

 

[Bela]

Plus, it'll hopefully shut up the remaining "Birthers" when they actually find out that he was born in the United States.

Nothing will ever satisfy a person who is willfully ignorant.

The Republican Party is basically the legislative equivalent of Internet trolls.

All of this political grandstanding that they engage in with legislation like this is just them trolling the public.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Nothing will ever satisfy a person who is willfully ignorant.

The Republican Party is basically the legislative equivalent of Internet trolls.

All of this political grandstanding that they engage in with legislation like this is just them trolling the public.

The Republican Party is a political party. There are 55 million registered Republican Party voters in this nation as of the 2004 election. Both parties have a lot of variation in them. We have Libertarian Republicans like myself as well as Authoritarian Republicans, which are almost polar opposites. Labeling such a broad class of people all as "trolls" is a sweeping generalization (which is a logical fallacy).

 

[Margot]

I am not racisest and this is not to offend anyone but we just don't want someone who could be from afghanistan trying to become president and them being a terroist and plotting some way to kill us all or something.

That is why i believe you must be born in US to be president. Then again thou even someone in born in us could be a terrorist but it eliminates a lot of factors.

Location doesn't have anything to do with people becoming terrorists. It has to do with their mentality. So no, I don't think just because you're born in the US, suddenly there are less factors for some crazy person to become president.

Oh Arizona, just when I think you can't disappoint me more, you always find a way :'D I find this so redundant and ridiculous and while it makes me mad this is already in one state, I hope it stays confined to just one state and this pointlessness doesn't spread.

 

[The Trotsky]

The Republican Party is a political party. There are 55 million registered Republican Party voters in this nation as of the 2004 election. Both parties have a lot of variation in them. We have Libertarian Republicans like myself as well as Authoritarian Republicans, which are almost polar opposites. Labeling such a broad class of people all as "trolls" is a sweeping generalization (which is a logical fallacy).

The current political agenda of the "Party of No" can certainly be described as trolling. Willful ignorance and inability to cooperate and communicate =/= good politicking or good citizenship

 

[Oryx]

The current political agenda of the "Party of No" can certainly be described as trolling. Willful ignorance and inability to cooperate and communicate =/= good politicking or good citizenship

I have to disagree with you, even though I tend to lean towards the Democratic side. Both parties have problems. Both parties have dumb politicians. Like Freaky said, you seem to be accusing 55 million people of being exactly the same, and holding the same views as the Party on every ideal. Even in that case, while the Republican platform is certainly different from my own, I don't feel like it's trolling at all. What makes you think that?

 

[Ivysaur]

I am not racisest and this is not to offend anyone but we just don't want someone who could be from afghanistan trying to become president and them being a terroist and plotting some way to kill us all or something.

Because an Afghan Muslim would get thousands of millions of votes coming towards him. We all know the prototype of the ideal candidate people would massively vote for is exactly that.

That is why i believe you must be born in US to be president. Then again thou even someone in born in us could be a terrorist but it eliminates a lot of factors.

The guys who wrote the Consitution thought the same, that's why that law has existed from day one, as Article Two of the US' constitution.

Republican Rep. Carl Seel of Phoenix, the bill's author, said the president's birth record wouldn't satisfy the requirements of his proposal and that Obama would have to provide other records, such as baptismal certificates and hospital records.

So, if I'm not baptized, I can't run for President? That's cool.

 

[The Trotsky]

I have to disagree with you, even though I tend to lean towards the Democratic side. Both parties have problems. Both parties have dumb politicians. Like Freaky said, you seem to be accusing 55 million people of being exactly the same, and holding the same views as the Party on every ideal. Even in that case, while the Republican platform is certainly different from my own, I don't feel like it's trolling at all. What makes you think that?

I just said I'm not accusing the people, but rather the leadership of the party. The political beliefs of the party in and of themselves are not necessarily what makes them trolls, but rather their utter inability to compromise at all (unless it would provide them with political capital) and belligerence towards any political stance that angers their most extremely conservative supporters (despite their minority status) is what makes them trolls.

 

[Mario The World Champion]

Both Republicans and Democrats are nothing but trolls, anyway. Neither side will compromise on anything that will remotely help the American people, but they can waste time on stupid crap like this. I wouldn't mind some anarchy right about now.

 

[Steven]

Both Republicans and Democrats are nothing but trolls, anyway. Neither side will compromise on anything that will remotely help the American people, but they can waste time on stupid crap like this. I wouldn't mind some anarchy right about now.

Then move to Somalia, please. :)

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Both Republicans and Democrats are nothing but trolls, anyway. Neither side will compromise on anything that will remotely help the American people, but they can waste time on stupid crap like this. I wouldn't mind some anarchy right about now.

I agree completely. The two-party system is killing us. When we don't like what one side is doing, we give power to the other side until we get fed up with them, then we give power back to the other side.

 

[Buggyo]

I agree completely. The two-party system is killing us. When we don't like what one side is doing, we give power to the other side until we get fed up with them, then we give power back to the other side.

Yeah, but nothing short of a sweeping overhaul of our entire political system would allow for a multi-party state.
I think proportional representation would work quite well, but the current two-party system would never pass legislation to allow for that.

 

[Livewire]

Again, let me remind you all to keep this civil. :)

 

[Bela]

The Republican Party is a political party. There are 55 million registered Republican Party voters in this nation as of the 2004 election. Both parties have a lot of variation in them. We have Libertarian Republicans like myself as well as Authoritarian Republicans, which are almost polar opposites. Labeling such a broad class of people all as "trolls" is a sweeping generalization (which is a logical fallacy).

I was referring to the Republican Party leadership. You are referring to the voters who identify as Republicans; this misrepresentation of the term would be equivocation (which is also a logical fallacy). :)

As for what I'm talking about, see any event where the President capitulates to Republican proposals. The tax deal? The wealthy are "job creators." The health care debate? "Socialism, death panels, etc, etc." If this type of disruption and provocation on the Republican Party's part isn't trolling, then what is?

See the argument for defunding Planned Parenthood. "We don't want to have federal dollars go to funding abortions." Title X specifically bans such funding, but it doesn't stop Republicans from saying it anyway. It's all just a bunch of trolling.

And no, I would disagree that both parties are at fault for this. In our current political discourse, the Republican Party are the ones who troll; the Democrats, the ones trolled.

Although capitulation to the Republicans would make Democrats effectively trolls as well.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Yeah, but nothing short of a sweeping overhaul of our entire political system would allow for a multi-party state.
I think proportional representation would work quite well, but the current two-party system would never pass legislation to allow for that.

Other parties appear on the ballot. If people would vote for them, they would win their elections. This is not impossible. We have 2 Senators that are not affiliated with either of the major political parties, and we've had several state governor in the past decade as well. Maybe this is beginning of a backlash against the two major parties. Who knows?

I was referring to the Republican Party leadership. You are referring to the voters who identify as Republicans; this misrepresentation of the term would be equivocation (which is also a logical fallacy). :)

As for what I'm talking about, see any event where the President capitulates to Republican proposals. The tax deal? The wealthy are "job creators." The health care debate? "Socialism, death panels, etc, etc." If this type of disruption and provocation on the Republican Party's part isn't trolling, then what is?

See the argument for defunding Planned Parenthood. "We don't want to have federal dollars go to funding abortions." Title X specifically bans such funding, but it doesn't stop Republicans from saying it anyway. It's all just a bunch of trolling.

And no, I would disagree that both parties are at fault for this. In our current political discourse, the Republican Party are the ones who troll; the Democrats, the ones trolled.

Although capitulation to the Republicans would make Democrats effectively trolls as well.

The Hyde Amendment (that bans funding for abortions) you are referring to is not automatic. It has to be attached to bills individually in order for it to be applied.

 

[Esper]

So, if I'm not baptized, I can't run for President? That's cool.

Just in Arizona... for now.

Now that I think about it this also feeds into the whole "OBAMA IS A MUSLIM OMG!!!" thing because even if he has baptismal certificates and does show it people will still call it fake. And if he doesn't want to show then that's just going to fuel the fire even more. D:

 

[Buggyo]

Other parties appear on the ballot. If people would vote for them, they would win their elections. This is not impossible. We have 2 Senators that are no affiliated with either of the major political parties, and we've had several state governor in the past decade as well. Maybe this is beginning of a backlash against the two major parties. Who knows?

I'm fully aware that a few Reps/Senators/Governors have been elected under third party tickets, but without proportional representation, whatever party that has the majority will dominate Congress. The few independent politicians are forced to either caucus with either Democrats or Republicans, or have no say.

If every constituency in the US had an outcome where the Republicans won 51% of the votes, Democrats won 30%, and Libertarians won 19%, then the Republicans would get 100% of the seats in the House of Representatives.

Under proportional representation, 51% of seats would be Republican, 30% would be Democrat, and 19%(!) would be Libertarian.

 

[lx_theo]

And people talk about the federal government wasting time and money. I have this tiny fear that some state somewhere is going to try something like this and come up with its own special definitions of what it considers acceptable records so it can try to keep Obama off the ballot. Oh, wait. That's what Arizona's already trying to do.

Republican Rep. Carl Seel of Phoenix, the bill's author, saidthe president's birth record wouldn't satisfy the requirements of his proposal and that Obama would have to provide other records, such as baptismal certificates and hospital records.

WHAT?!


So... mad... trying... to... contain... rage... against... Republicans... and... overused... ellipses...

 

[Buggyo]

WHAT?!


So... mad... trying... to... contain... rage... against... Republicans... and... overused... ellipses...

This is America.
If you ain't Christian, you dun belong here.
I'm talkin' to you, God-hatin' atheists!
(and Muslims, and Jews, and Wiccans, and Hindus, and Buddhists)