Is Pokemon Anime Ruined

[weedle_mchairybug]

I saw an old trailer of Pokémon Mewtwo movie.
There was an end to this series but the writers deleted the end. Because Pokémon got popular and no need to end it.


Here:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=b70GRNYnacI

Now we have to deal with an endless story that goes nowhere.

I don't like this. I remember burning the fuel of my motorbike to go to the nearby Internet cafe. I wanted to see the DP league. Then .... I was highly disappointed watching Ash getting a humiliating defeat. I will not trust the series and its amazing Japanese openings again.

If it's of any consolation, Ash did get a far better rank than before in the Sinnoh League, which is definitely better said than what AG or BW did (staying at the same rank he got in Johto, and decreasing in rank, respectively). In fact, BW was even WORSE, not only getting a worse rank than before, but he ended up losing to a complete idiot who made even BW-era Ash seem smart (which is saying something because BW made Ash a Homer Simpson-class idiot, even by Ash's usual nature in the series). Say what you will about Tobias, at least he was a veteran trainer who actually knew what he was doing, which isn't nearly as embarrassing as when Ash lost to Cameron. Cameron, on the other hand, well... I'll probably let his scrappy entry on TVTropes handle the description:

Introduced at the end of the Junior Cup arc, he displayed far greater traits of an Idiot Hero than Ash ever did. Not only did he miss the tournament, but he thought the Unova League took place in Ecruteak City in Johto. He also got Ash lost in the woods, and even his own Riolu is disappointed with him; affectionately giving a Face Palm at his actions. It doesn't help that one,

Spoiler:

he defeated fan favorite Bianca in what many perceived to be a cheap win

, and two, the kid has scary-ass evolved Pokémon that prove to be a huge threat, like a damned Hydreigon and his little Riolu which seems to have gotten through Training from Hell like one would expect from Ash's Pikachu. To add further insult to the injury, he brings only 5 Pokemon to an official Unova League match of 6-on-6 against Ash. Worse yet, Cameron's Riolu has received a lot of hate due to how he mimics his trainer's hyperactive attitude. The worst of all is Riolu evolving to Lucario as a last ditch attempt to defeat Ash's Snivy and Pikachu in the league.

Spoiler:

And then it happened: Lucario defeated Pikachu, and Cameron won the battle against Ash, meaning Ash has yet again lost a major league, this time to such an air-headed trainer, and adding insult to injury in that Cameron was handicapped by having one less Pokemon than Ash.

But as a bit of small consolation,

Spoiler:

Cameron lost to Virgil, who then went on to win the league.

Personally, I would have preferred it if Ash lost to Virgil than to Cameron, at least it wouldn't have seemed nearly as embarrassing.

 

[GiovanniViridian]

Personally for me, I don't really care much because I watched the anime (haven't watched it in months but I'll definitely get back to it) just to clear my mind and pass the time.

From my glance the animation is better though.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

Personally for me, I don't really care much because I watched the anime (haven't watched it in months but I'll definitely get back to it) just to clear my mind and pass the time.

From my glance the animation is better though.

Just because the animation might be better doesn't mean the anime itself is better, especially if it has such a lackluster story right now.

DreamWorks, for example, does impressive CGI effects for their films, yet most of their films barring possibly the first Shrek movie were horrible, at least one was even a blatant plagiarization of a Pixar movie.

 

[UltimateFrosty08]

Aren't you that guy who hated that Pikachu special for "ruining" Pikachu? I didn't take that thread seriously, so why should I take this one serious as well? The anime is about the journey, not the destination.



XY would've actually been better than what it currently is if Goodra was still around and Serena kept her long hair.

1. Yes they did ruin Pikachu in fact he was already ruined I swear he can take on Arceus, and win 2. How can hair save the Anime???

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

1. Yes they did ruin Pikachu in fact he was already ruined I swear he can take on Arceus, and win 2. How can hair save the Anime???

Okay, Frosty, before you continue, I must ask... What special are you referring to where they ruined Pikachu? I'm serious, I don't even know.

Hair may not have made much of a difference regarding the anime (that being said, though, they should have given Serena a different reason for the haircut, because that was just over the top. There's crying when you lose, and then there's this...), but Ash retaining Goodra certainly would have made some difference.

 

[Pinkie-Dawn]

Okay, Frosty, before you continue, I must ask... What special are you referring to where they ruined Pikachu? I'm serious, I don't even know.

He's referring to the Pikachu movie special from XY, which showcased the cosplay Pikachus and starred Ash's Pikachu as the main hero.

 

[UltimateFrosty08]

Okay, Frosty, before you continue, I must ask... What special are you referring to where they ruined Pikachu? I'm serious, I don't even know.

Hair may not have made much of a difference regarding the anime (that being said, though, they should have given Serena a different reason for the haircut, because that was just over the top. There's crying when you lose, and then there's this...), but Ash retaining Goodra certainly would have made some difference.

Yes Goodra would make it better and the Pikachu special is a Special where about 100 pikachu make a movie because this old man wants to make Pikachu a famous Pokemon but it was gay look for my thread that says "They Ruined Pikachu" it will explain everything. But Serena is the worse girl I have ever seen Ash travel with shes worse than Iris which is saying something.

 

[UltimateFrosty08]

I saw an old trailer of Pokémon Mewtwo movie.
There was an end to this series but the writers deleted the end. Because Pokémon got popular and no need to end it.




Now we have to deal with an endless story that goes nowhere.

I don't like this. I remember burning the fuel of my motorbike to go to the nearby Internet cafe. I wanted to see the DP league. Then .... I was highly disappointed watching Ash getting a humiliating defeat. I will not trust the series and its amazing Japanese openings again.

Wait so Mew Two Strikes back was supposed to be the end I don't see that but I hope if they do end the series but not end Pokemon and they'll just replace Ash and start fresh.

I couldn't understand it so I just need to ask if someone can please tell me I tried looking it up in English it just showed the newer Mew Two Movie.

You know what maybe we can just get a Group together and try to contact Pokemon maybe if we get to talk to the owner we can tell him why we dont like the show and how they can fix it (Im starting to feel the only way they can end it is by replacing Ash I feel like originally like they had planed we end it with a Movie Im starting a Discussion on this).

 

[Hikamaru]

Just because the animation might be better doesn't mean the anime itself is better, especially if it has such a lackluster story right now.

This is correct, not everything can be perfect they say. While I have been questioning the XY series with its plots, I do at least love the characters and the animation. Or like how BW started having more beautiful animation but I hated that saga like many others did.

 

[Anime Sucks]

The show hasn't been as good as it used to be, but if I thought it was ruined I wouldn't be watching it. That being said XY has been more or less a snoozefest so far IMO, and Best Wishes, while better than XY, wasn't so great itself.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

The Pokemon anime has never really been that good. It's pretty much the same thing since it was back when it started; and it's purpose was the same as it is now, which is to promote the games.

If it was never good to begin with, it would have lasted a season at best, like what happened to that Maureen show, or GCB, or Love Hina.

Besides, the original series if anything barely even attempted to promote the games other than loosely (in fact, Ash deviated from the route we take in the games), which an advert would try to be very close to the games. Not to mention several Anime-only locations as well. It wasn't until AG where they actually DID try to promote the games (even going as far as to distribute event Pokémon at movies). They did come close to doing a promotion in the anime for a method of acquiring Celebi, but that got nixed with Pokémon 4Ever.

 

[donavannj]

If it was never good to begin with, it would have lasted a season at best, like what happened to that Maureen show, or GCB, or Love Hina.

Besides, the original series if anything barely even attempted to promote the games other than loosely (in fact, Ash deviated from the route we take in the games), which an advert would try to be very close to the games. Not to mention several Anime-only locations as well. It wasn't until AG where they actually DID try to promote the games (even going as far as to distribute event Pokémon at movies). They did come close to doing a promotion in the anime for a method of acquiring Celebi, but that got nixed with Pokémon 4Ever.

Pokemon is and always has been an acceptable kids show that is primarily a merchandise sales driver without being overt about it (being overt would probably have killed interest in the show immediately). It's never really deviated far from that because it works. Here's where my "doesn't really deviate" and "always been an acceptable kids show" stances come from: I have watched all 800-some English episodes of the series in the past 6 years (save for the last month of English episodes because I've not even felt like turning on my TV for anything lately), and for nearly every episode, including the bulk of the original series, it was my first time seeing it. That means I have seen every single episode in a very close time frame suitable for comparison between each series.

Guys if the show wasn't CRAP then why does it just air once a week not counting the second cartoon network channel (which is basically a channel that airs the same shows but 3 hrs after the first time it airs) and Boomerang (which airs the original which as I pointed out is much better)

Have you even checked the weekday mornings? There's an episode on the main Cartoon Network every morning at 7 AM Eastern time, and there have been episodes in that slot for at least the past 6 years. Those cycle through either the last or the current saga up until a point that's typically 3 months back from the current week's new episode. Additionally, there's a rerun of last week's episode on Sunday at the same time of day as the weekday morning episodes.

Unless you're talking "new" episodes, which would be because there's only one new episode per week in Japan. In fact, most shows only air one new episode a week no matter which side of the Pacific or Atlantic you're on. Very few studios worldwide could manage multiple new episodes per week, if any even can.

Guys even though the Anime is Crap the Pokémon Games and Cards just get better wouldn't you all agree and if the Pokémon Ratings keep going down they may turn to the fans to help make it better or just start from scratch know IDK or probably they will just cancel it which we do not want even if the show is Crap because if that happens it might impact the Games and Cards (Or not because they might just focus more on the game to make them better).

The card designs get more interesting, yes, but the trading card game has been hit pretty hard by Power Creep over the years, which I've seen turn off many people because "I can't use my old cards and the new cards are stupid." Not exactly the best choice to use to try to make your point.

 

[weedle_mchairybug]

Pokemon is and always has been an acceptable kids show that is primarily a merchandise sales driver without being overt about it (being overt would probably have killed interest in the show immediately). It's never really deviated far from that because it works. Here's where my "doesn't really deviate" and "always been an acceptable kids show" stances come from: I have watched all 800-some English episodes of the series in the past 6 years (save for the last month of English episodes because I've not even felt like turning on my TV for anything lately), and for nearly every episode, including the bulk of the original series, it was my first time seeing it. That means I have seen every single episode in a very close time frame suitable for comparison between each series.

That's not being an advert, that's being an adaptation. Otherwise, the Harry Potter films and even various Disney adaptations of fairytales are adverts for the original stories.

 

[donavannj]

That's not being an advert, that's being an adaptation. Otherwise, the Harry Potter films and even various Disney adaptations of fairytales are adverts for the original stories.

Pokemon has a ton of filler (filler which I don't mind, really) in every region featuring characters that never return after that episode and center around a specific Pokemon/Pokemon type. That is part of what makes it an advert (which doesn't mean it's not an adaptation, it just means it's an adaptation being utilized to advertise), and it is not comparable to either of your examples, which largely opted to never create and utilize any filler side plots in adapting their sources (side plots being the key word here; I haven't seen every Disney fairy tale adaptation). It much more closely resembles the approaches of Dragon Ball, Digimon, and Yu-Gi-Oh! in their approaches than it does either of your examples. The 3 I mentioned, while they largely follow the source material storyline, aired weekly for years on end, necessitating filler rather than opting to pull off the air for a season or two so the source material could get some breathing room, because more time on the air, even if it's filler, translates to more merchandise and source material sales.

Also, Togepi's entry is a prime example of how the original saga was still an advertising vessel, probably debuting around the time the new Pokemon games were announced in Japan, as is the existence of the GS Ball.

That said, Harry Potter and the Disney fairy tale adapations never got to a point where they needed to use anything of that sort because they stuck hard to the source material and didn't air weekly because they were movies, and western moviegoing audiences won't show up to something if it dawdles toward the finish line of the plot, which is something the Pokemon anime has done in every saga. The middle set of sagas that have aired are the biggest offenders in this regard, but that has to do with the release timing of new games compared to the comparatively frenetic releases of new games in the beginning and in the current era. They still had to eat up all that time somehow since they didn't shelve the show show until the next new source material release.

Also, Harry Potter and the Disney fairy tale adaptations were made with the intent of turning a strong profit on them specifically, while the anime industry in Japan works in such a way that a show can acceptably spend years on the market before turning a profit due to funding from sponsors who want to make it happen and think covering any losses made by producing the anime would easily be recovered in sales of product, making the anime turning profitable the gravy on top.

 

[DBZ fan]

I wouldn't say its ruined persay, not yet anyway.

But could pokemon anime be better than what it was for past 18 years? Were there cardinal mistakes, wrong moves and misjudgments from production team?

Without any doubt and i doubt even biggest hardcore fans would deny that.

To this day i believe repeated and constant character replacing and disruption of main group of characters instead of helping only accumulated already growing problems pokemon series suffered from delivering more damage than benefit in longer run.

Pokemon anime was supposed to be treated as show with continuity. Which follows permanent main hero going through all kind of challenges and difficulties in his quest of becoming pokemon master. Followed by story which is supposed to be consistent and stable building on itself and doing updates with characters which helped build anime.
Instead of flushing down the toilet everything taking place from before only hurting story credibility and creating unnecessary plotholes messing up everything.

Some would argue how starting with Misty removal, "pokemon show was allowed to breathe in new ways, deliver new stories to be told and addfition of new facers helped to keep things fresh".

They are right to extent. But there was nothing innovative and fresh in replacing so many main characters like pokemon does.
It only prevented possibility of having stable cast of main characters with who you could as viewer invest emotionally growing with them, continuity in series and on going plot which builds on itself. Reassuring and consistent constant other shows like Naruto, One Piece, Dragon Ball, Fairy tail, Winx etc had/have.
Since we cannot have cohesive story in pokemon because every friendship, development, experience and started storyline which begins with one group of characters is cut and flushed down the toilet.

When soft reset happens with Ash ditching every traveling companion starting all alone in next generation. Thats not exactly way to build endearing and eventful character development, journey to be fair.

Needless to say the waste to constantly get new characters and follow their development when there exists so much potential, exciting adventurous and unanswered enigma surrounding previous ones we grew attached to with Misty being biggest contender in how little her dreams and goals were explored or desore to reach E4 level.

Surely there are other things like repetitive overuse of previous ideas from past series with writing staff rather choosing to rehash plots instead of coming up with new original ideas to implement in their story. Or stagnation of main protagonist Ash making it seem like all his development, journey and hard work ultimately wont matter just experiencing soft resets in every new generation. Never seeing his character taken on deeper, more profound character development.

But going overboard with replacing of main characters definitely didn't helped in longer run in my opinion. Effectively abandoning opportunity in having stable cast and better glued story.

To me such policy only reveale lack of care and creativity among pokemon directors and production commitee. In not introducing new features and characters from future games in more innovative eways. Such as playing role of rivals to already established main cast. Being recurring protagonists etc, without necessarily abandoning other main characters and allowing them to become forgotten and abandoned eventually.

Which is practice with pokemon series where despite adventure being set in same universe and timeline everything from past journeys is completely forgotten and ignored.

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EDIT:
On a side note based on what was said in this thread when it comes to Original series i wish people would stop labelling anyone who genuinely still prefer them better over new sagas as someone "blinded by nostalgia".,

Because your reasoning behind preferring Kanto, Oranghe Islands or Johto over let say Sinnoh or Kalos can be for various reasons and not just "sentimental longing for past times".

Because in its defense Original series still had as far as im concerned strongest continuity from any other subsequent series, sense of progression made with characters like Ash, Misty and Brock feeling like they have been growing and learning new things on their journey. Changing in emotional aspect with gradual and notable chabnges in their personalities, strength of bond between them as friends which growed and breaking free from persnalm struggles, disthrust and misconceptoon made it feel like they gained something from their journey maturing greatly as individuals. Producing more endearing and organic type of dynamic where no one felt left out.

There wasnt much progression on goals, exploration of pokemon personalities, villains being properly introduced and exploited etc with newer generations obviously doing better job in those fields(especially Sinnoh so far), but in advance there was put bigger accent of exploration of humans themselves, their thoughts, past and friendship. With main message being put on adventure, emotion and exploring all kind of mysteries in pokemon world with writers being bold enough to deviate from games and add their own touch into storyline. With mixed results, but still enjoyable nonetheless.

Being one of advantages this series had over others in my opinion.

 

[pkmin3033]

Personally, I think the quality of the Pokemon anime has been pretty inconsistent over the years. The original series was great. Hoenn was awful. Sinnoh was great. Unova was even more awful; it was easily the lowest point in the franchise. Kalos is OK I suppose, but not particularly awe-inspiring, it doesn't have the original series' fantastic comedy or the DPPt anime's plot and character development. It's just better than the two awful seasons and not unbearable to watch as a result, at least for me. But the anime is far from ruined, as nothing has really changed since it first started airing asides from the quality of the animation and, in the dub at least, some of the voice actors.

Therein lies the problem: nothing has changed. Ash gets reset to factory default settings with each new season, grabs himself some new supporting characters, and proceeds to do the same song and dance for 100 or so episodes before ultimately losing in the League at the end just so he has an excuse to do it again. Which season you prefer just comes down to personal preference, because each season is damn near identical. Maybe it's just gotten more tired by this point for some of us who have been watching it since it first aired. It's been going for over 900 episodes now, after all.

 

[Piks]

Personally, I think the quality of the Pokemon anime has been pretty inconsistent over the years. The original series was great. Hoenn was awful. Sinnoh was great. Unova was even more awful; it was easily the lowest point in the franchise. Kalos is OK I suppose, but not particularly awe-inspiring, it doesn't have the original series' fantastic comedy or the DPPt anime's plot and character development. It's just better than the two awful seasons and not unbearable to watch as a result, at least for me. But the anime is far from ruined, as nothing has really changed since it first started airing asides from the quality of the animation and, in the dub at least, some of the voice actors.

Therein lies the problem: nothing has changed. Ash gets reset to factory default settings with each new season, grabs himself some new supporting characters, and proceeds to do the same song and dance for 100 or so episodes before ultimately losing in the League at the end just so he has an excuse to do it again. Which season you prefer just comes down to personal preference, because each season is damn near identical. Maybe it's just gotten more tired by this point for some of us who have been watching it since it first aired. It's been going for over 900 episodes now, after all.

If it was never good to begin with, it would have lasted a season at best, like what happened to that Maureen show, or GCB, or Love Hina.

Besides, the original series if anything barely even attempted to promote the games other than loosely (in fact, Ash deviated from the route we take in the games), which an advert would try to be very close to the games. Not to mention several Anime-only locations as well. It wasn't until AG where they actually DID try to promote the games (even going as far as to distribute event Pokémon at movies). They did come close to doing a promotion in the anime for a method of acquiring Celebi, but that got nixed with Pokémon 4Ever.

To me, the quality of the anime has really gone downhill over the years since the AG, The Original series was very mature and well like. The anime nowadays isn't as good as it used to be. Hoenn was really horrible and pointless. Sinnoh was just garbarg and made the anime even more worser then before. Unova was way too overrush. Kalos is the only series as of right now that is on par with the OS.

 

[Hikamaru]

To me, the quality of the anime has really gone downhill over the years since the AG, The Original series was very mature and well like. The anime nowdays isn't as good as it used to be. Hoenn was really horrible and pointless. Sinnoh was just garbarg and made the anime even more worser then before. Unova was way too overrush. Kalos is the only series as of right now that is on par with the OS.

I never watched much of AG so can't give much opinion on that, but maybe I do plan to catch up if I have the time. DP however wasn't a bad saga, in fact I actually find it the best saga so far (as far as the completed ones go) since I loved the battles, Ash's main rival Paul and his abuse of Chimchar, and Dawn's depression arc that she suffered after losing contests on a consecutive basis (two of them she failed to get past the first round), and Ash managing to overcome Paul in the Sinnoh League and finished in the Top 4, his best performance to date so far.

 

[precita]

Personally, I think the quality of the Pokemon anime has been pretty inconsistent over the years. The original series was great. Hoenn was awful. Sinnoh was great. Unova was even more awful; it was easily the lowest point in the franchise. Kalos is OK I suppose, but not particularly awe-inspiring, it doesn't have the original series' fantastic comedy or the DPPt anime's plot and character development. It's just better than the two awful seasons and not unbearable to watch as a result, at least for me. But the anime is far from ruined, as nothing has really changed since it first started airing asides from the quality of the animation and, in the dub at least, some of the voice actors.]

Really? The Hoenn saga had many great episodes and funny fillers, and had Ash becoming a competent trainer and evolving most of his Pokemon (his Hoenn Pokemon in general are one of his best teams of the series, with great personalities for the Sceptile line and Corphish in particular), and of course May was one of anime most popular and well developed female leads, along with the Contests being a great addition to the show. Brock and Team Rocket were also still funny and well written in AG, until they became bland and repetitive in DP and beyond. It was also the first time the writers started to focus on battling more (which would improve into DP), and so forth. DP is a better series overall, but to say a saga that blended the OS comedy with development for the pokemon and female companion was well done.

BW was a mixed bag, but had some great ideas like the Don battle tournaments, Cilan's character, and some of the rivals like Georgia, Bianca, Stephen, and Burungly.

 

[pkmin3033]

Really? The Hoenn saga had many great episodes and funny fillers, and had Ash becoming a competent trainer and evolving most of his Pokemon (his Hoenn Pokemon in general are one of his best teams of the series, with great personalities for the Sceptile line and Corphish in particular), and of course May was one of anime most popular and well developed female leads, along with the Contests being a great addition to the show. Brock and Team Rocket were also still funny and well written in AG, until they became bland and repetitive in DP and beyond. It was also the first time the writers started to focus on battling more (which would improve into DP), and so forth. DP is a better series overall, but to say a saga that blended the OS comedy with development for the pokemon and female companion was well done.

BW was a mixed bag, but had some great ideas like the Don battle tournaments, Cilan's character, and some of the rivals like Georgia, Bianca, Stephen, and Burungly.

Yes, really. I found AG to be very bland and repetetive up to the Battle Frontier arc, which attempted character development and was a lot more interesting to watch, mostly because Ash learned from his mistakes, especially against Brandon at the end. Ash's Pokemon having more personality than Ash himself is something every series shares, even BW, so I don't really think it a point in AG's favour specifically. None of his AG Pokemon particularly stood out to me, except Sceptile...and that is only because it managed to take down Darkrai in DPPt. As for it being on-par with the original series when it comes to humour...I don't see that. But then, I suppose that's probably because our senses of humour are different. The anime was a lot less tongue-in-cheek by that point. It was more entertaining than BW, but BW cut out 90% of the humour by attempting to turn Team Rocket into a credible threat, something it ballsed up spectacularly.

I will agree with you about the Don battle tournaments in BW though, those were the only reason I kept watching the series after a point, if only because the battles were entertaining and you were never sure who was going to win them. It wasn't a foregone conclusion that someone would win or lose, so it was pretty entertaining to watch. That would be the only word of praise I have for that season, though. Iris and Cilan were filler characters who never really went anywhere, the rivals were forgettable - probably because there were so many of them - and Ash's reset to default after DPPt was a particularly bitter pill to swallow this time around.