I wish to clear a few things up Landorus while it is beaten by a bunch of things checks/beats many others. landorus makes sure Zard X and zygarde cannot do whatever they want, it sets rocks pressuring Volcarona and zard Y, and it pressures just about any physical attacker there is bar Kyurem-B.
Also infernape is likely not as good in terms of what it really accomplishes compared to the mons you mentioned Landorus as a suicide lead aims to set up rocks and then either explode to kill a threat and gain momentum or switch out for later assuming that the sash is in tact. Ferrothorn primarily functions as a bulky pivot that takes advantage of its typing to force switches and set up spikes or leech seed. Alolan-Ninetails acts as a turn one (or two depending on matchup) means to get veil up in order to assist set-up sweepers. also the term "glorified sweepers" is not the correct term the point of a suicide lead is to get hazards up turn one reliably and effectively and keep them up like in Landorus's case Sets rocks then explodes to prevent defog or remove a key threat.
Same can be said in Landorus's case for Azelf.
Infernape on the other hand or in your case does not run fighting stab so it is walled by Heatran and any rock or water type which in Heatrans case gets up rocks anyway or just uses toxic on the switch or on Infernape. and if you run fighting coverage you will have to give up fake out or endeavor which allows other leads to deal with it better.
As for porygon, when you use Z-conversion porygon changes its typing to the first move in its move slot making tri-attack null on adaptability and normal as a typing does not do much in wall breaking. that is what PD is trying to say here. Also a one time boost to tri-attack or a +1 in all stats + adaptability on a different move is something that i believe needs to be considered.
Nidoking functions better as a wallbreaker with Sheer Force + Life orb or sash in some rare instances in my opinion. Scarf Nidoking does not outspeed or kill many of the threats in the metagame ( weakened Nido is beaten by Water shuriken, outsped by any scarfer above 90 base speed which is just about everything in the tier that can be scarfed) and when running a mon with a scarf it is important to run Max Speed.
I respectfully disagree, Gigalith cannot block almost anything. I understand that you are exaggerating on it's bulk but it has no reliable recovery to start, it losses to both Greninja and kartana both of which are huge threats in the metagame right now and can dismantle your team if they do happen to kill it. it has very little resistances and immunities being weak to quite a few common offensive typings in the game Grass, Water, ground,Steel,fighting. A good wall does not have to have great defenses look at a mon like gastrodon it has pitiful defenses (not including HP) but it has a really good typing and ability to make really good as a wall. As a side note TTar runs into the exact same problems.
Apologies for the wall of explanations but i felt as to if i needed to explain a few things quickly so i may have left out a few things in my explanations
First off, don't worry about the block text. I am guilty of doing it also.
Secondly, I'd like to admit where was wrong/where I could have been more clear:
- I admit that
Porygon-Z doesn't benefit from
Tri Attack. In all honesty, I forgot that it changed typing.
- Also I feel as if I could been more clear with
Gigalith. When I say it can block just about anything, I am referring to this set that I posted earlier:
Gigalith @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Explosion
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Superpower
This set is not great, I know. The set however is only used for two purposes. Its either for tanking a hit from the enemy or to take out threats such as
Mega-Lopunny,
Greninja and most Special Attackers. A standard
Gigalith set (252 in HP, 252 in Atk, leftovers) cannot withstand what this set can.
My set is a literal wall. It's good defensively, not so much offensively.
- As a side not, I agree that my
Nidoking set needs work. I am still new to the Pokémon so I still need to refine my set for it.
Now for
Infernape.
I believe I mentioned in an earlier reply that I had swapped
Fake Out for
Vacuum Wave. On your part, this was great advice as I do agree that
Vacuum Wave works far better with this Pokémon.
I would disagree however that
Landorus,
Ferrowthorn and
Alolan-Ninetales are the better. The term I used, "Glorified Tanks" (Not "glorified sweepers") was to express how setup Pokémon such as the three mentioned are no longer used as their title states, 'suicidal leads'. They are now just another Pokémon to protect.
I believe each setup Pokémon works well in it's own way. However as you mentioned,
Landorus and the other need to swap out if something can KO your Pokémon turn one. This shouldn't be the case as suicidal leads in past have always been disposable. They were designed so the team could fair fine without it. It seems as though teams are relying too much on these 'suicidal leads' these days.
Anyway, bottom line is that each 'suicidal' lead has it's own benefits. I may choose to use
Infernape, you may choose to use
Landorus/
Alolan-Ninetales/
Ferrowthorn, they all work well in one way or another.
Infernape is used the way I use it so I can deal with early game sweepers/tanks. I realise the set isn't perfect, however that's why I use it. To find out what needs to improved upon.
