2vs2 Trick Room Team

[TheNewRocketMovement]

*image removed**image removed**image removed**image removed*
This team is for next years VGC, I have built it based on this years rules (2vs2, 4 Pokemon in a team, 2 ubers are allowed to be used)​

*image removed*
Togekiss @ Lum Berry
Sassy Nature
Ability: Serene Grace
252 HP / 4 DEF / 252 S.DEF
Air Slash
Follow Me
Encore
Safeguard/Heal Bell​

Follow Me will be used to protect Dialga while it sets up Trick Room.
I don't plan to use her other moves much as she is just there to protect Dialga until Rayquaza replaces her.​

*image removed*
Dialga @ Iron Ball
Quiet Nature
Ability: Pressure
252 HP / 252 S.ATK / 4 S.DEF
Dragon Pulse
Aura Sphere
Protect
Trick Room​

Dialga will open with Trick Room and if all goes well Dialga and Rayquaza will be able to sweep together.​

*image removed*
Rayquaza @ Macho Brace
Quiet Nature
Ability: Air Lock
128 DEF / 252 S.ATK / 128 S.DEF
Air Slash/Dragon Pulse
Ice Beam
Flamethrower
Energy Ball​

A special sweeper that will replace Togekiss, it's moveset is designed to protect the teams sweepers (Dialga, Marowak and Rayquaza) from their weaknesses.
I'm not too sure about this moveset, any suggestions?
Also, I chose Rayquaza as its Air Lock ability to cause trouble for weather teams.​

*image removed*
Marowak @ Thick Club
Brave Nature
Ability: Rock Head
252 HP / 252 ATK / 4 S.DEF
Earthquake
Double Edge
Rock Slide
Protect​

Marowak can safely use Earthquake as Rayquaza is immune to it, he can also inflict heavy damage with Double Edge and Rock Slide.​

This team isn't finished yet so any constructive criticism is welcome and appreciated, thank you for reading.​

 

[aragornbird]

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Well, you're getting there, it's certainly better than your last attempt.

However

This team is for next years VGC, I have built it based on this years rules (2vs2, 4 Pokemon in a team)

You realize that this year's rules allow you to have 2 Ubers on your team, right? And a team without Ubers doesn't stand much of a chance against a team that does have ubers. VGC 09 doesn't allow Ubers though.

Anyways, here are two problem with your team:

1. Predictability

If you lead with Bronzong + ANY slow Pokemon in a double battle, your opponent will automatically know you will use Trick Room. So they will try to stop you from using Trick Room by one of the following methods:

* Putting Bronzong to sleep
* Using Taunt on Bronzong
* Using Fake Out on Bronzong
* Beating Bronzong with a powerful Fire attack

Since Bronzong needs to use Trick Room on the very first turn in order for your strategy to work, it's up to your partner to help it out. And the best way to do this is to use Follow Me. Follow Me always goes first, so Speed isn't an issue. Follow Me will deter all attacks aimed at Brozong so it can set up safely.

Only a few Pokemon can learn Follow Me and the best users of it are Togekiss and Clefable. Togekiss is generally better since it has better defenses and immunity to Earthquake:

Togekiss @Lum Berry
Sassy Nature
Serene Grace
252 HP / 6 Def / 252 SDef

-Follow Me
-Protect
-Air Slash
-Encore

Lum Berry wakes it up if the opponent uses Sleep moves and Encore lets you force opponents to repeat Fake Out or non-damaging moves.

Give Bronzong Chesto Berry over Light Clay. Light Clay is unneccesary because double battles rarely last longer than 5 turns. Chesto Berry lets Bronzong wake up from Dark Void used by Smeargle. Dark Void hits both opponents so Follow Me is ineffective against it.

The second problem with your team is:

2. Turn Order

Normally, Magnezone is faster than Dusknoir/Marowak so it would be able to use Magnet Rise BEFORE they used Earthquake. However, in a Trick Room, Dusknoir/Marowak will use Earthquake BEFORE Magnezone uses Magnet Rise because they're slower so they will end up KOing Magnezone.

Instead of Magnezone use Machamp:

Machamp @Life Orb/Sitrus Berry
Brave Nature
No Guard
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef

-Dynamicpunch
-Rock Slide
-Ice Punch/Thunderpunch
-Protect

Additional tips:

*Instead of Fire/Thunderpunch, use Rock Slide. Rock Slide hits both opponents and has a high chance of flinching either one (it might even flinch both if you're lucky!).
*Use Sassy Nature with 252 SDef EVs on Bronzong. This is in case your opponent uses Eruption/Heat Wave, which hits both opponents.

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

 

[TheNewRocketMovement]

You realize that this year's rules allow you to have 2 Ubers on your team, right? And a team without Ubers doesn't stand much of a chance against a team that does have ubers. VGC 09 doesn't allow Ubers though.

Thats true, personally I can't stand using ubers, but I'd be willing to use them for this, assuming I'm still allowed to next year. I'll look into them, I know they can be very useful as I had ideas for a Sunny Day team that used Latias and Groudon so I might try developing that.

1. Predictability

Very good points here, I've reviewed the team and made a few changes, Togekiss has replaced Dusknoir and will be the lead that protects Bronzong.

2. Turn Order

I think a way I could get around this problem is by bringing in Magnezone after Bronzong explodes, it could use Magnet Rise while Togekiss uses Follow Me, then bring Marowak out for Earthquake.

1st Turn: Togekiss uses Follow Me, Bronzong uses Trick Room.
2nd Turn: Bronzong uses Light Screen, Togekiss uses Reflect/Encore.
3rd Turn: Togekiss uses Protect, Bronzong uses Explosion.
Then Magnezone is sent out.
4th Turn: Magnezone uses Magnet Rise, Togekiss uses Follow Me.
Marowak will be sent out now as I'm assuming Togekiss won't have survived the last turn.
Following turns: Sweeping.

The above senario gives Marowak 2 turns of attacking (3 if I choose to skip the wall building/encore turn) I think Thick Club + Earthquake could do a very good amount of damage in this time.

Machamp @Life Orb/Sitrus Berry
Brave Nature
No Guard
252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef

-Dynamicpunch
-Rock Slide
-Ice Punch/Thunderpunch
-Protect

I'm very grateful for this Machamp set but I'd prefer a levitating/flying special sweeper to finish the team if thats possible. I'm not sure but I think I probably could get away with Magnezone (Especially now that Marowak has Rock Slide) If I could pull it off I'd have a good special sweeper with decent defences, 12 resistences, 2 immunities and a Marowak that could safely use Earthquake.

One quick idea, what do you think of replacing Double Edge/Protect on Marowak for Fire Punch? This would defend him against two of its weaknesses (Grass/Ice) while Magnezone is defending it against water.

I've edited the original post, thank you very much for all your help, if there are any other tips you could give me I'd be very grateful.

 

[Hatchet]

What about those 2 ubers that you are allowed to put on?

 

[TheNewRocketMovement]

What about those 2 ubers that you are allowed to put on?

I'm not too sure how to use ubers in a Trick Room team as many of them are too fast (I'm very unfamiliar with ubers, so I'm not sure which ones I could use on this team). I am planning to use the 2 ubers I'm allowed, I'm working on a Sunny Day team with Latias and Groudon.

 

[jle1076]

I thought the point of dusknoir was to wall and pain split?

 

[TheNewRocketMovement]

I thought the point of dusknoir was to wall and pain split?

I was trying to use him as a sweeper, not the best idea I've ever had lol, he's out now though.

 

[aragornbird]

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Don't give Togekiss 4 non-damaging moves. If it gets Taunted, it can't do anything but Struggle the next turn. Use Air Slash over Reflect.

The slowest Ubers allowed in VGC are Dialga, Groudon, Kyogre, Giratina, and Ho-oh
Dialga and Groudon are the best ones to use.

Dialga @Chesto Berry
Quiet Nature
252 HP / 252 SpAtk / 4 SpDef

- Trick Room
- Dragon Pulse/Draco Meteor
- Flamethrower
- Protect/Thunder

Groudon @Iron Ball
Nature: Brave
252 HP / 252 Att / 4 SpDef

- Earthquake
- Protect
- Rock Slide
- Fire Punch/Fling

Dialga can replace Bronzong and Groudon can replace Marowak.

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

 

[TheNewRocketMovement]

Thank you for your feedback, I'm sorry I haven't got back to you sooner, I was on holiday for the past week.

Don't give Togekiss 4 non-damaging moves. If it gets Taunted, it can't do anything but Struggle the next turn. Use Air Slash over Reflect.

Good point, I don't know why I didn't notice this.

Dialga @Chesto Berry
Quiet Nature
252 HP / 252 SpAtk / 4 SpDef

- Trick Room
- Dragon Pulse/Draco Meteor
- Flamethrower
- Protect/Thunder

Groudon @Iron Ball
Nature: Brave
252 HP / 252 Att / 4 SpDef

- Earthquake
- Protect
- Rock Slide
- Fire Punch/Fling

Dialga can replace Bronzong and Groudon can replace Marowak.

Some great ideas here, thank you, Dialga will definately replace Bronzong however I worry that Groudon's Drought ability will strengthen the super effective Fire-type attacks against Magnezone. I also substituted Flamethrower for Aura Sphere as Dialga's new partner will have Flamethrower.

Also, I'd prefer to replace Magnezone instead of Marowak, I'd like to do so with Rayquaza as it is immune to Marowak's Earthquake and will sabotage the strategy of weather teams with it's Air Lock ability.

*image removed*
Rayquaza @ Lagging Tail
Quiet Nature
Ability: Air Lock
128 DEF / 252 S.ATK / 128 S.DEF
Air Slash
Ice Beam
Flamethrower
Energy Ball

Rayquaza will replace Togekiss. It's moveset is designed to defend the team's sweepers against their weaknesses.
Air Slash will defend Dialga from its Fighting weakness.
Ice Beam will defend both others against Ground type attacks and Rayquaza from its Dragon weakness.
Flamethrower will defend Marowak from its Ice weakness and Rayquaza from its 4x weakness to Ice attacks.
Energy Ball will defend Rayquaza against its Rock weakness and both Diagla and Marowak from their Ground weaknesses, Marowak will also be protected from Water attacks.

I'm pretty sure this moveset covers all of the teams weaknesses, any help with this new addition and its moveset (or any other part of the team) will be appreciated.

 

[Team Sweeper]

One thign i do not understand is why you would get rid of bronzong? Yah Dialga is better but he is an uber and i cant stand them.

 

[Kylie-chan]

Because Ubers are so good that Uberless teams generally struggle against teams with them. Dialga works better, plain and simple. Explosion is an incredibly handy asset, I will admit.

 

[TheNewRocketMovement]

One thign i do not understand is why you would get rid of bronzong? Yah Dialga is better but he is an uber and i cant stand them.

I don't like using Ubers either, however seeing as I had to pick two for this team, I chose Dialga because he can use Trick Room and he is one of my favourite ubers, also, Dialga gives my team an extra sweeper.

Because Ubers are so good that Uberless teams generally struggle against teams with them. Dialga works better, plain and simple. Explosion is an incredibly handy asset, I will admit.

I was sad to see Explosion be lost, however this way after I use Trick Room the oppodent isn't going to know what move I'll use next as the old Bronzong set I had pretty much screamed "Get out of the way, I'm gonna explode" after Trick Room.

Thank you both for your feedback.

 

[aragornbird]

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

NOTE: Do not use Lagging Tail. It does not lower your Speed. It simply makes you go last, even during Trick Room. Iron Ball is the item that cuts Speed in half.

You moveset is also terrible. Why use a Dragon type when you don't have any Dragon moves? Remove Air Slash for Dragon Pulse. Flying attacks suck.

Why does Dialga have a Brave nature? It doesn't even have any physical attacks.

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

 

[TheNewRocketMovement]

NOTE: Do not use Lagging Tail. It does not lower your Speed. It simply makes you go last, even during Trick Room. Iron Ball is the item that cuts Speed in half.

Thank you for pointing that out, I've swapped it for a Macho Brace, I'm assuming this will still cut speed in battles where my Pokemon don't gain EV's.

You moveset is also terrible. Why use a Dragon type when you don't have any Dragon moves? Remove Air Slash for Dragon Pulse. Flying attacks suck.

Rayquaza's moveset was focused on type coverage, Air Slash was to protect Dialga from it's fighting weakness, it'll also gain a STAB and I neglected Dragon Pulse from Rayquaza's moveset as Dialga has it.

Why does Dialga have a Brave nature? It doesn't even have any physical attacks.

Sorry about that, a typing error that I failed to notice.

Thank you again for your feedback.

 

[eevee00]

Why didn't you use something like Mewtwo or Mew as your trick roomer?

 

[aragornbird]

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Why didn't you use something like Mewtwo or Mew as your trick roomer?

Mewtwo is WAY too fast for Trick Room. Also Mew is banned from VGCs.

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~