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Celebi has now learned to not give that trampoline to Gyarados again [OU RMT]

Tinhead Bruce

the Neighbour
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    But the Leech Seed doesn't fit with the rest of his Celebi's set, so you're basically saying: "You need to change your Celebi set to the Leech Seed set, but do what makes you comfortable." What the hell is that?
     

    Anti

    return of the king
  • 10,818
    Posts
    16
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    Alright, this thread is beginning to spiral into a deep pit of irrelevant arguments when Wolfare can make an educated decision for himself based on what has already been posted.

    Also, to everyone, explain and back up your suggestions, and make sure they make sense. No, Leech Seed on CM Celebi does not make sense. If you want to suggest a defensive Leech Seed variant and back it up with solid reasoning, be my guest. I'm just going to start deleting rates that aren't up to standards, since this team seems to be well thought out, so he deserved nothing less than rates with the same amount of thought put into them.
     

    Greene1516

    Scratching the surface...
  • 373
    Posts
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    Ok Anti my apologies.

    The full set for what I was suggesting is below.

    Celebi - Bold @ Leftovers
    252HP/252D/6Sp.A
    Leech Seed
    Calm Mind
    Recover
    Energy Ball

    I have used this set and I have come up against it also and it is a pain in the ass to take down. Leech Seed can help phase as well as just give you general recovery along with Leftovers so that you can concentrate on attacking should you need to. It is a very versatile set and has served me well.
     
    Last edited:
  • 8,280
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    • he/him
    • Seen today
    I'm really not liking the uncomfortable weakness to the standard Choice Band and Dragon Dance Tyranitar. In your threat list, you mention Heatran and Celebi as counters and checks to it, however, I fail to see how they're even remotely safe options. Both are OHKOed by a boosted Tyranitar, and both fail to OHKO back. Gyarados has no business with the Dragon Dancer, and can't switch into the Choice Bander. So basically, you have Metagross and Jirachi as uneasy checks to this behemoth, another concern I have. Why both Metagross AND Jirachi? Who is benefitting from paralysis on this team? Drop Body Slam, go with Stealth Rock on Jirachi, and remove Lead Metagross for something to help with these weaknesses. Right now, Tyranitar, Latias, and even Mamoswine cause serious problems for you. All of which can set up on a good portion of your team, and all of which can either OHKO or 2HKO your team entirely. Call me crazy, but a Weavile might do you more good than you would expect. Let's take a look at a few things, shall we?

    A Jolly Weavile has enough Speed to outrun your standard Dragon Dancing Tyranitar and OHKO it with Brick Break if you run Life Orb. It can also utilize Night Slash to screw up Latias who stay in to try and take a Pursuit. Ice Shard will revenge all kinds of Salamence bar Yache Berry versions (extremely rare, and with Stealth Rock and some residual damage, even Yache Berry won't be able to save it. Ice Shard / Brick Break / Night Slash is a given, but the last slot is up to you. You can either run Swords Dance, which will give Weavile awesome offensive stats of 881 Attack with a 383 Speed stat. A +2 Ice Shard even does enough damage to do 58% to a max HP / max Defense Hippowdon, pretty cool if you ask me. You can, however, run Pursuit to remove things such as Gengar and Latias which can stop your Gyarados sweep and threaten to wall Heatran. Up to you really.

    If you do take my changes, you can lead with either Rotom-H or Jirachi. Both work fine.
    I will consider Weavile, thanks. ^_^
    I like how you praise Bounce Gyara but you don't have a way to stop it if your opponent uses one as well. Again, the only thing "countering it" is Metagross using Explosion.
    I am changing Calm Mind on Celebi to Reflect, then use HP Electric over HP Ice, and Dragon Pulse over Explosion for Heatran. All variants except Bounce Gyarados will then be countered. Bounce Gyarados would be countered by luring a Bounce when switching to Celebi then Heatran to revenge kill it (like how I handle DD Mence).
    Mixape (Nasty Plot version or the one with T-punch) could also be problematic for you but I guess Heatran is enough to keep it in check.
    I do have problems with it, but at least Heatran can revenge kill it. I definitely have problems with Vacuum Wave + Nasty Plot one though.
    Blissey can spam T-wave, and I don't think Celebi is gonna beat it anytime soon with Grass Knot (Blissey is very lite).
    Yeah, just found that +6 Grass Knot does squat. :|
    I would suggest leading with Swampert instead, to solve a few of your problems (T-wave, TTar, Yanmega if it's leading).
    I have been testing that actually. :3
    My next suggestion is having T-bolt on Jirachi instead of Body Slam. It's a good check against your Gyara problem. I'm not entirely sure about it, but other changes would mean changing more than 1 pokemon, of a some sets to counter it properly.
    Okay~
    Alright, this thread is beginning to spiral into a deep pit of irrelevant arguments when Wolfare can make an educated decision for himself based on what has already been posted.

    Also, to everyone, explain and back up your suggestions, and make sure they make sense. No, Leech Seed on CM Celebi does not make sense. If you want to suggest a defensive Leech Seed variant and back it up with solid reasoning, be my guest. I'm just going to start deleting rates that aren't up to standards, since this team seems to be well thought out, so he deserved nothing less than rates with the same amount of thought put into them.
    I fine with it. :D Thanks.
    Ok Anti my apologies.

    The full set for what I was suggesting is below.

    Celebi - Bold @ Leftovers
    252HP/252D/6Sp.A
    Leech Seed
    Calm Mind
    Recover
    Energy Ball

    I have used this set and I have come up against it also and it is a pain in the ass to take down. Leech Seed can help phase as well as just give you general recovery along with Leftovers so that you can concentrate on attacking should you need to. It is a very versatile set and has served me well.
    Yeah, I have had it before my current moveset, but I found HP Fire is usually better than Leech Seed is most cases. Thanks though. :D

    I appreciate the rates. :) I have been working a lot on trying to counter threats, and I will test everyone's suggestions soon enough (when I have time to :x).
     
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