Chick-Fil-A (restaurant chain) Controversy

[Sydian]

Have you read anything in this thread?

In addition, they donate to a group who spent money in support of the bill in Uganda that wants to make being gay punishable by death. That's what really pushed me over the edge on their policies to be honest.

It's in another country, but how Christian-like of him to support a bill that punishes people by death! And I could go on and on about the other organizations he donates to that oppress a group of people and why that's bad, but I'd just be beating a dead horse. I know I said I was done with this thread, but I had to say something here.

 

[Oryx]

And is anyone that surprised? Cathy is a super fundamentalist Christian who even makes sure the restaurant is closed on Sunday. Why is everyone so surprised by this?

It's not about surprise. I know many, many Christians. Not a single one I know donates their money or time to anti-gay organizations. They may believe that gay marriage should remain illegal, but they don't do anything like that to support it. That's where the difference lies; if Cathy just believed it and voted for it, those are things that wouldn't change no matter what you did with Chick-Fil-A. You don't support them, they still vote how they feel. However, with donating money, if you don't support them, they have less money to donate. This is why people who claim it's about free speech are seeing the situation entirely wrong; it's about something that the public can actually make a difference in with their choice of not supporting CFA anymore.

 

[Dakotah]

I don't see why people are against him using his money how he pleases. You work, you get wages, does your employer monitor what you buy? Does he say, no, you can't get that Pokemon game because it's lame? He earned his money, he can use it as he pleases.

If he was using his money, no, no one would really care. But it's not HIS money that's being used. The money is coming from Chick-Fil-A's account. Not his own. The money is being given to these organizations on his company's behalf, not his own. That's the difference.

 

[TRIFORCE89]

It's not about surprise. I know many, many Christians. Not a single one I know donates their money or time to anti-gay organizations. They may believe that gay marriage should remain illegal

We also may not.

Like sex before marriage or work on Sundays or anything else, not every Christian is stuck in the 1940s. Most I have met aren't. God created the universe and Jesus was a cool guy. Everything else is superfluous.

But if a private citizen or a private company wants to believe whatever they want to believe or support or whatever they want to support, they should be able to... with the obvious repercussions of that, especially if they put it out in the open, as we're seeing.

Like... I will support your right to be a vile hateful idiot, even if I completely disagree with you - which is the case here. Private people and private organization can do whatever they want so long as it isn't illegal. By all means try to change them, but it so isn't going to happen.

If he was using his money, no, no one would really care. But it's not HIS money that's being used. The money is coming from Chick-Fil-A's account. Not his own. The money is being given to these organizations on his company's behalf, not his own. That's the difference.

How big is Chick-Fil-A?

Do they have shareholders?

 

[Dakotah]

How big is Chick-Fil-A?

Do they have shareholders?

Chick-fil-A is a privately owned company and has 1,614 restaurants in 39 states, and the District of Columbia.

 

[TRIFORCE89]

Chick-fil-A is a privately owned company and has 1,614 restaurants in 39 states, and the District of Columbia.

Hmm...

This would be a much easier battle if there were shareholders. They might pressure a leadership change. That's too bad.

Is the making being gay illegal and the murder in Uganda claims legit? I'm not really following the story because we don't have these eateries here, so I don't care much... but whenever I see it mentioned in the media it's always just "He spoke out against gay marriage. Everyone else is now all huffy". The other stuff (which is horrible and a very valid reason for a boycott and force financial repercussions) I've only seen here. So, I'm somewhat suspicious.

 

[Dakotah]

Hmm...

This would be a much easier battle if there were shareholders. They might pressure a leadership change. That's too bad.

Is the making being gay illegal and the murder in Uganda claims legit?

Yes. Tony Perkins, the president of one of the organizations that Chick-Fil-A donates to, the FRC (Family Research Council), has publicly stated on national TV that one of his organization's goals is to re-criminalize homosexuality. He stated that he believed the 2003 Supreme Court ruling that made anti-sodomy laws in the U.S. unconstitutional was, as he put it, "wrongly decided."

I offer this video (he states this opinion at the very end of the segment):

 

[Bluerang1]

Have you read anything in this thread?



It's in another country, but how Christian-like of him to support a bill that punishes people by death! And I could go on and on about the other organizations he donates to that oppress a group of people and why that's bad, but I'd just be beating a dead horse. I know I said I was done with this thread, but I had to say something here.

Yes, I made it.

If he was using his money, no, no one would really care. But it's not HIS money that's being used. The money is coming from Chick-Fil-A's account. Not his own. The money is being given to these organizations on his company's behalf, not his own. That's the difference.

Which he owns. Of course it's horrid to support the killing of people but it's still his money.

 

[Sydian]

Yes, I made it.

Just because you made it doesn't mean you've read it.

Which he owns. Of course it's horrid to support the killing of people but it's still his money.

I don't understand this logic. It's okay to give money, as long as it's yours, to negative causes? So it's okay for me to donate to Kony? It's okay for me to donate to the KKK? As long as it's my money? Awesome. I'll remember that when I get my paycheck this week. And it's already been pointed out that he's not using his money.

He may own CFA, but if it's coming out of the company's money on the company's behalf, not his own, then it's not him.

If he was using his money, no, no one would really care. But it's not HIS money that's being used. The money is coming from Chick-Fil-A's account. Not his own. The money is being given to these organizations on his company's behalf, not his own. That's the difference.

 

[Keiran]

Of course it's horrid to support the killing of people but it's still his money.

So you're saying his actions are okay because he's just another rich white man who believes his money is superior to the welfare of innocent people.

Gotcha. :)

 

[Nihilego]

This thread's starting to get ratty. Again. Livewire's left a warning in here already and I'm about to leave another one - please think before posting. This is a bit heated, and I'm ok with that, but things have to stay respectful. I've warned people in this thread already and I won't hesitate to hand out infractions and close the whole thing if necessary. Please be sure to post respectfully or don't post at all before stuff gets out of hand, which would be a real shame since it's provoked some interesting discussion up to now.

Thanks.

 

[droomph]

it's horrid to support the killing of people

He's Christian, am I right? So here is the contradiction:

God is love, Jesus is love, the Holy Spirit is love, the Trinity is love. God is love, among other things. He is contradicting himself when he supports the killing of homosexuality, no, anyone, and when he isn't embracing any group of people. I am ashamed to call myself a Christian in front of the world and the Internet because of people like him.

He is the minority - the majority of Christians are disgusted by him and people like him. It is a fact that we are, because whether you are Lutheran or Calvinist, Catholic or Protestant, if you have even read the Bible you should know that God loves the sinners, and that Jesus didn't hang out with the righteous people, but rather the prostitutes and the homeless and the downcasts of society. It's not just horrid, but absolutely confounding, confusing, crazy, outrageous, and wrong to support the killing of any group of people (much less the gays), especially if you're Christian.

(To people who still want to read on:)

Spoiler:

Homosexuality is no more a sin than lying, than any other sin. So if we were
to ban homosexuality, we need to also ban swearing, lying, promiscuous behavior
(like one-night stands, which are legal as far as I know), and every other lie
in the world. Would it be a very fun world? No. Why? Because you are naturally
going to sin. Deal with it, Jesus has saved us for a reason. He has come here to
help us overcome that natural tendency to sin, and so thus becoming holy
and one with God.





There are some homosexual people who love Christ more than some straight
people. It isn't a matter of what you do, but that you accept Christ as your
savior, and through communion with him you shall be cleansed and be more like
God. It isn't the job of Man to cleanse the sinful - our job is to merely be
present for God and be present to where he wants to affect someone. We shouldn't
take the job of God; it's much too powerful and demanding for us to accomplish,
and it wasn't the intent of God anyways, so you will be punished for your pride
unless you repent. We are all the same useless and worthless contaminated water.
We will always fall short of the glory of the Lord, unless we are helped by
him.





So by the same idea, we should embrace each other as if we were all worthless
and sinners and liars and worthy of eternal hell to the ninth power, and accept
everyone to seek God's grace like we have so that they would enjoy
the joyous (though not carefree) life that we look for in Christ.
For Heaven is not an exclusive night-club; it is an open bar, happy hour, free
drinks, and everything you've ever wished for in the back room, and unlimited
space to party and with the best DJ you've ever heard, but twice as better, and
has every song you have ever heard, and more, and will openly accept your
request.





Even that comparison, however, is only dirt compared to the glory of our Lord
and the glory of Heaven. So why should we keep gay people out, simply because
they committed a sin so small Christ would simply brush away when they enter his
Kingdom?





tl;dr Atheists and non-believers and all the most horrible and evil people in the
world, we invite you over to our party.

but it's still his money.

He used Chik-Fil-A's account, as was said by Sydian. If he used his own money, it would be marginally more acceptable to me (and most other people) to support the killing (however indirect) of other people. But he hasn't, so it's our money he's spending to kill gay people. And if it's my money, I should have a say on all $5.99 of it. And I'm sure many people (if not all) feel the same.

 

[TRIFORCE89]

He is the minority - the majority of Christians are disgusted by him and people like him.

Thank you *high fives* Also, I'd add... if you act that way, then you're not a Christian purely out of contradiction.

He used Chik-Fil-A's account, as was said by Sydian. If he used his own money, it would be marginally more acceptable to me (and most other people) to support the killing (however indirect) of other people. But he hasn't, so it's our money he's spending to kill gay people. And if it's my money, I should have a say on all $5.99 of it. And I'm sure many people (if not all) feel the same.

It's not your money. If this was a government or a publicly-funded corporation of some kind, then it would be your money. This is a private company

It also isn't publicly traded. It is a privately held and family owned company. Cathy is CEO. Heck, they don't even franchise in the traditional way. They own most of their locations, which is not the case with McDonald's for example. It is his company and ultimately his money, not your money, or my money, or anyone else's. Once you have exchanged your hard earned cash for the chicken - the chicken is your's, and the money is their's. That is how the transaction works. It is your money until you give it to someone else. So, boycott so that you don't give him more. Makes perfect sense. But you don't really have a say in what they do with it once it is no longer your possession.

Does that justify him? No, probably not. But it isn't your money. I wish people would freak out when their own money is misspent by elected officials rather than focus on what individuals do with their own money.

If you're selling lemonade, and I've bought some from you and I'm a happy customer, you have that money. Then I find out, you're abusive to your dog. I don't come anymore because I don't want to support you further. But if you use the money gave you before to further punish your dog, well tough. I can't ask for my money back.

 

[Bluerang1]

He's Christian, am I right? So here is the contradiction:

God is love, Jesus is love, the Holy Spirit is love, the Trinity is love. God is love, among other things. He is contradicting himself when he supports the killing of homosexuality, no, anyone, and when he isn't embracing any group of people. I am ashamed to call myself a Christian in front of the world and the Internet because of people like him.

He is the minority - the majority of Christians are disgusted by him and people like him. It is a fact that we are, because whether you are Lutheran or Calvinist, Catholic or Protestant, if you have even read the Bible you should know that God loves the sinners, and that Jesus didn't hang out with the righteous people, but rather the prostitutes and the homeless and the downcasts of society. It's not just horrid, but absolutely confounding, confusing, crazy, outrageous, and wrong to support the killing of any group of people (much less the gays), especially if you're Christian.

Well definitely but that may still be a generalization.

Also, Jesus hung out with sinners so that they could repent. Which is what some of Cathy's money goes to, the reformation of homosexuals as that's what he believes in.

I would like to see evidence that he donates money to causes that kill people.

 

[Sydian]

I would like to see evidence that he donates money to causes that kill people.

It was a few pages back.

He gives to the Family Research Council, which spent 25,000 dollars on the Ugandan bill: original source here. At least once this was out in the open the FRC started backpedaling and insisting they were lobbying for a phrasing change.

And CFA has many wrongful termination suits that happen all the time for people who were fired for atheism or in the most recent case, to become a stay-at-home mother. Here's an older Forbes article about it, in case you were worried about bias against them considering all the drama now.

Right here.

 

[Shining Raichu]

The wonderful thing about freedom of speech is that it works both ways. Legally, everybody has the right to say whatever they want. So yes, this company has every right to publicly oppose gay marriage. Then we, in turn, have every right to publicly lambast them as shameful bigots. That, my friends, is how it should be. It's where the real fun starts :P

Nobody should have their right to free speech legally stripped away. They should deal with the consequences in the public and social spheres; it's so much sweeter that way. I'd rather everything be out on the table so everybody knows exactly where everybody stands. I'd much rather Chick-Fil-A (or any company, for that matter) come forth and state they're against gay marriage rather than have them secretly be against gay marriage and be taking my money and using it to fund their world view.

 

[droomph]

Well definitely but that may still be a generalization.

Also, Jesus hung out with sinners so that they could repent. Which is what some of Cathy's money goes to, the reformation of homosexuals as that's what he believes in.

I would like to see evidence that he donates money to causes that kill people.

Well maybe you're the minority I'm talking about. It's not a generalization because it is in the core beliefs of Christianity to embrace everyone and show them the power and mercy of Christ and God and the Holy Spirit. So it should be evident that most of us, if not all, should be disgusted by the organization, if not Cathy's, actions against gay marriage.

But Cathy is not Jesus or God, so let the power of Christ compel them on their own. The only duty of the ones in Christ, no matter how rich or poor, sinful or holy, is to spread his word in the way that everyone can hear the joy of the gift of God's grace. There is no need to force them to reform; that is God's job, and tbh He does a much better job than Cathy or the (any, for that matter) organization ever will. You know not to mini-mod on PC, right? That is the same here. Press the "report" button and let whatever wrath you have fall in a fantasy that does not affect them. It seems to be working for me, at least.

Spread the message, don't let it be held back. Tell the gays and pro-abortionists that they're loved on the same level that He loves the Pope, Martin Luther, Paul of Tarsus, and everyone else. No need to reform them; that's a sin in itself, to hurt others.

The wonderful thing about freedom of speech is that it works both ways. Legally, everybody has the right to say whatever they want. So yes, this company has every right to publicly oppose gay marriage. Then we, in turn, have every right to publicly lambast them as shameful bigots. That, my friends, is how it should be. It's where the real fun starts :P

Nobody should have their right to free speech legally stripped away. They should deal with the consequences in the public and social spheres; it's so much sweeter that way. I'd rather everything be out on the table so everybody knows exactly where everybody stands. I'd much rather Chick-Fil-A (or any company, for that matter) come forth and state they're against gay marriage rather than have them secretly be against gay marriage and be taking my money and using it to fund their world view.

The problem here is not freedom of speech - it's the support of the killing (though indirect) of gay people. And as a Christian who has gone far enough to make his restaurant chain follow the gospel of Christ he should know better.

It was a few pages back.



Right here.

To deny anyone money, a job, or anything, simply over who they are is the worst thing you can do as a Christian. This is the opposite of the Gospel, and you call yourself a Christian?!

 

[Bluerang1]

Well I see all your points of view. Chick Fil A continue to present a friendly and excellent customer service whenever I go there and I hope they do not discriminate.

I've learned from your posts, the Christian posters anyway, not to judge/discriminate against others even if you do not agree with their lifestyle, which is a given anyway.