Gen 5 suspects round 3

[Dark Azelf]

ttp://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=102217 is where things are going on if you're interested. But here are the most nominated so far.

Pokemon Nominated :

---Blaziken---

Why its nommed : Blaziken so far has recieved alot of nominations. For those of you not familiar with the game this may seem strange, but speed boost may have potentially pushed Blaziken over the edge along with Drought. As quoted by alot of players "nothing beats this in the sun apart from Slowbro". In the sun, it OHKO's Lati@s, Gyarados, Jellicent (water moves nerfed) and Salamence (post Intimidate) with a boost +1) with its Flare Blitz, this is with Leftovers and no boosting item. That speaks for itself. You also cant revenge kill with Protect and Speed boost as it'll just get faster than your scarfer.

---Thundurus---

Why its nommed: Thundurus is very threatening and many argue its just too powerful and its easy to see why, Nasty Plot and insane speed along with the Power and coverage make many believe its just too good. It is notable for being very hard to wall.

---Reuniclus---

Why its nommed: To quote many people "Calm Mind decimates stall whilst Trick Room decimates offense" with Magic Guard and Recover people say this thing is just TOO hard to take out. Nothing beats this bar Sp.Def Jirachi and Scizor and forces their use just like Latias forcing ScarfTar usage during gen 4.

---Excadrill---
Why its nommed: Here we go again, im not sure why this is up for debate again because it has quite alot of checks and counters and doesn't really take much to play around it. But ok, people are saying its too fast (breaks the speed tiers) and is too easy to set up with Ballon and Ohko's most of the metagame after 1 turn of set up and has a "un blockable" Rapid Spin.

---Latios---

Why its nommed : Forces the use of Sp.Def Jirachi, Tar and Scizor. Nothing else beats it. Trick and Psycho Shock take out special walls, fast, bulky, Surf 2hko's every Steel and Draco Meteor basically can do this too. HP Fire is standard now too to decimate Ferrothorn. Can hit and run your whole team with just Draco.

other notable pokemon that were nominated;

---Deoxys-S---

Why its nommed: It is THE reason the support characteristic was made during the 4th gen. Dual Screens (makes Shell Smash Pass Gorebyss + Sweeper broken), Spikes all with ease, you name it, D-S can do it. Forces the use of Magic Bounce if you don't like losing to Spikes.

Abilities Nominated:

---Drought and Drizzle---

These are nommed for making certain Pokemon too strong under them. Water moves and Hurricane are easy to spam under rain whilst things like Chlorophlly sweepers are very hard to deal with under the sun and also most notably Blaziken.

Items Nominated:

---BrightPowder, Lax Incense, Sandveil, Snowcloak under the evasion clause---

Bring nothing but pure luck to the game and take no skill to abuse (see : sub chomp fishing for sand veil hax) and we have enough of that (crits >>). Another interesting note is that, GARCHOMP WILL BE PSUEDO BANNED UNTIL ROUGH SKIN IS RELEASED IN DREAM WORLD should this pass.

Just as a note final note, ALL OF THESE POKEMON WILL BE BANNED ON THE PC POKEMON ONLINE SERVER UNTIL THEY HAVE BEEN VOTED ON AND WILL BE UNBANNED OR STAY BANNED ACCORDINGLY. This is to prevent problem Pokemon becoming issues and just to save hassle.

Your thoughts ? Discuss. ^^

 

[.Aero]

This thing is beyond broken in my opinion. All people do is set up sun, which isn't hard thanks to Ninetales, then send Blaziken on something to cause a switch for a free Swords Dance. After that it's pretty much a guaranteed sweep that you can't stop unless you carry Slowbro, or protect against a Hi Jump Kick (or send in a ghost of course). But the sheer power that both those moves carry, especially Flare Blitz, is just ridiculous. This should definitely be banned, if it's not, I'll be amazed. Ban

I'm not entirely sure what to think about Thundurus. Sure he's fast, but he's also really frail. I've personally only encountered a Thundurus issue a few times while laddering, but I can see how he could be broken. After a Nasty Plot, he hits that massive 698 Special Attack, and that's not even factoring in LO bonuses if the person chooses to run such a set. Leftovers also makes him more bulky than he appears, and prevents some 2HKO's that would be easily pull off otherwise. However, I'm still unsure what to think as I have personally never had a major issue with Thundurus. Maybe

Reuniclus is so dumb. He ruined the potential that stall had, and he can decimate certain pokemon that you would expect to decimate him (see: non-CB Tyranitar). I find it ridiculous that a psychic type would be so...non-pursuit bait and it's so damn bulky. As you said in the OP, only two things are guaranteed to win against him: Scizor and CM Jirachi. Heck, since Psyshock came around, Blissey can't even wall this little blob. Ban

No. I don't think Exadrill should be banned. He's non-threatening outside of Sandstorm, and it's not that hard to counteract that if you happen to be running a weather team as well (and c'mon, who isn't). Also, Mach Punch and Vacuum Wave and Aqua Jet all wreck him. And they also wreck other threats, so having to run Mach Punch and the like is hardly centralizing (priority is seriously big this generation, so I see no harm). Allow

I think he should be banned. As you said, nothing can truly wall him, and even stuff like Ferrothorn lose to the now standard HP Fire. I found it amazing that they even brought Latios down from uber in the first place as I don't think anything changed in preventing Latios from dominating other than the addition of Ferrothorn, which he beats anyway. So I saw no point in him partaking in OU in the first place. Ban

I don't think this mon should be banned as a lead. Sure it can get spikes up guaranteed (almost), and screens are annoying and all, but it's almost suicidal in most cases as a lead and most people carry a spinner to remove those spikes. Once they're gone, they're gone. However his offensive spread with Psycho whatever (D-Meteor of psychic, I don't recall the name), and carrying Superpower to beat Blissey makes him quite fearsome as well. So I think he should be banned as a sweeper as I find him more threatening in such a role. Pseudo-ban

---Drought and Drizzle---

I agree with your idea on the weather DA, with the whole one swift swimmer, or chlorophyll user for Drizzle or Drought respectively. A full team is swift swimmers in rain certainly is annoying to face, and I understand the original ban. However once swift swimmer isn't that bad, and it's essentially an Exadrill in the rain, so I don't see why there's a difference. This all applies for the sun teams as well. Pseudo-ban

---BrightPowder, Lax Incense, Sandveil, Snowcloak under the evasion clause---

Ban - that is all

 

[Skip Shot]

I honestly don't understand how Excadrill is suspect. Roob is terrible in the metagame, sure, but it beats Excadrill, along with tons of other stuff. The problem is that too many people just get lazy now because they slap on Tar, Latios, and Landorus and call it a team with no regard for anything else. Excadrill is just too easy to beat and if this many people are calling it suspect it makes me wonder at what's going on. Also if it shakes up speed tiers then what do Swift Swimmers do when Pokemon use Rain Dance? 0_0 or when Chlorophyll is used on sunny days teams?

 

[.Aero]

I honestly don't understand how Excadrill is suspect. Roob is terrible in the metagame, sure, but it beats Excadrill, along with tons of other stuff. The problem is that too many people just get lazy now because they slap on Tar, Latios, and Landorus and call it a team with no regard for anything else. Excadrill is just too easy to beat and if this many people are calling it suspect it makes me wonder at what's going on. Also if it shakes up speed tiers then what do Swift Swimmers do when Pokemon use Rain Dance? 0_0 or when Chlorophyll is used on sunny days teams?

Swift Swim was banned with Drizzle. But your Chlorophyll statement stands true. And I agree completely with such a statement.

 

[Vrai]

I have no doubt that this will be banned. ban

Tbh the biggest troubles I've had with Thundurus is him coming in and completely shutting down what would have been a clean sweep with Thunder Wave. While he is really good, he suffers from some small moveslot syndrome and the lack of recovery makes it easy to wear him down. He does have some surprising bulk, though; I hate it when it lives random priority attacks when it's already at half health like Scizor Bullet Punch. I expect it to be frailer than it is I guess, haha. :( Anyway, I don't really find anything about Thundurus to really be broken. no ban

Reuniclus is a giant cuddly bastard. Have fun beating this without Scizor, Jirachi, or Spiritomb. ban

Excadrill isn't broken by any standards. Yes, it's ridiculously good on occasion, but it has so many reliable checks and straight-up counters that it's not centralizing by any means. no ban

Latios mauls everything. ban

It's annoying as hell and does its job properly like every time. I don't really feel like it's ban-worthy, but... abstain

---Drought and Drizzle---

What happens when these two are banned? Do we ban Sand too?

I think that honestly D_A's proposition (not to be bandwagoning as I supported it from the start yeaaah) is like the best way to go even though it probably won't be. Sand only has one actual Swift Swim/Chlorophyll variant in Excadrill, whereas Kingdra, Kabutops, Venusaur, Sawsbuck, etc are all over the place in their respective elements. Why not limit them like Sand? Sand thrives just as well with one... no ban

---BrightPowder, Lax Incense, Sandveil, Snowcloak under the evasion clause---

These items are total bs. ~__~ ban

 

[Detox]

---Blaziken---

This thing is rediculous, Flare Blitz in sun KOing things like Salamence just is..no. Your best chance at revenge killing it is like using Extremespeed CB Dragonite so yeah, ban this crap.

---Thundurus---

I haven't really had problems with him. I understand the viewpoint people are coming from, its fast, has priority taunt and thunder wave, and is actually bulky enough to take a few hits. Call me dumb or whatever, but I just dont see it getting banned, so I would call this a possibility.

---Reuniclus---

Too bulky, trick room beats offense cm recpver beats stall. ban.

---Excadrill---

Why are people still nomming this? Haven't we already shown it has more than enough counters and checks lol? Leave this OU.

---Latios---

Hit and run draco meteor isnt nice, mauls steel types that would even think about walling him with hp fire. Ban.

other notable pokemon that were nominated;

---Deoxys-S---

I see what you mean here, it is pretty much guranteed to do whatever it wants at lead due to its great movepool..so ban.