Gen V - Metagame Speculation Thread

[Kazuhiro]

DISCLAIMERS: I am aware that the game has only been out for just 2 weeks and that not enough information have been discovered to get in the depth of the new metagame that await us. However, this thread's only purpose for the members to only discuss about what they expect and speculate about the new metagame.

To Moderators: If this thread already exist or is not in the right place, please delete or move the thread from here. Thank you.

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This thread is to speculate and discuss about the new metagame Pokemon Black & White bring us. Feel free to post some movesets for new Pokemons, Team options, counters, etc. Or just speculate about which Pokemon will be in OU/UU/NU or Uber.

I'll start things off with this guy:

#530 Doryuuzu @ Leftovers
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Sand Throw (Raises Speed in Sandstorm)
EVs: 252 Atk // 252 Spe // 4 HP
- Sandstorm
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Aerial Ace // X-Scissor

Personally, I think this guy will be OU worthy despite his little flaws such as his weakness being very common in the current metagame (Water, Fire, Fighting and Ground). What I think is great on him is his typing. With 9 resistances and 2 immunities (Lightning and Poison), this guy will be able to tank a lot of moves for his teammates and cause a lot of switches which will give him the time to set up Sandstorm. Under sandstorm, he becomes a pretty damn good beat stick with the speed boost and his 135 base attack. His movepool is a little lacking, but I believe he has what it takes to be pretty solid and be a great addition to Sandstorm teams.

Anyway, this is just my input for now. I had a lot more to say but I'll leave the discussion to other people. Feel free to agree/disagree and post more stuff about Gen V's metagame!

 

[blaQk]

Lol @ Sandstorm.

Seriously, that's bad.

 

[Kazuhiro]

Well, without it he doesn't really have a way to be efficient with only 88 base speed and frail defense. Unless he is paired with the like of Hippowdon or T-Tar, he will have to set it up himself.

Also, I didn't really see another move that could fit in except maybe Rapid Spin?

Instead of simply saying that it's bad, you can suggest some stuff, no?

 

[Dark Azelf]

Sandstorm is poop, just use it with T-Tar or Hippow lol and use Swords Dance. Rapid Spin is a good move for that last slot since this thing DESTROYS ghosts so you can spin rather easily with it.

Biggest threats i can see are the steel/bug with download and crazy special movepool. The mole in the OP and onononon dragon thing lol.

I really like the looks of the water/ghost who seems to be an awesome anti spin with recover, boiling water and all and Nuttre (steel/grass bulky as hell thing)

 

[Opposite Day]

The only bad thing about the bug is that it has no way to boost its stats barring rock polish(?), that, and the fact that it has next to no physical moves useable by its beastly att stat as well barring boom and bug stab :/ (oh, and return lol) Still, good mon.

Espeon also seems pretty cool, along with the stronger aerodactyl :x That, and the fact that wish got changed, so that blissey pretty much completely heals any mon that receives a wish from her. :>

 

[Impo]

i beat Chansey will be the new Blissey,
trust me ;)

 

[Aurafire]

i beat Chansey will be the new Blissey,
trust me ;)

That wasn't particularly funny.

That bug looks really awesome, looks like a cool mixed attacker that can function in what will no doubt be a very dragon-oriented metagame. Download is great on him because it can take advantage of both an attack and sp attack boost.

 

[Impo]

it wasnt meant to be funny.
The Evolution Stone can make Chansey increase it's defense and special defense.
in turn it will have better stats than Blissey for a wall.

 

[Aurafire]

I guess, but it loses leftovers recovery, and it still can't use special attacks. I would imagine its slightly better defenses aren't worth being set up fodder to any bulky sweeper/ghost with Substitute.

 

[Livewire]

~Alright goes into fanboy mode~

Shandera is frighteningly powerful with Shadow Tag. Its going to be an amazing revenge killer. Hell, with a FF boost it can maul pretty much any Pokemon resistant to fire too. It can OHKO Heatran with HP Ground.

 

[Impo]

~Alright goes into fanboy mode~

Shandera is frighteningly powerful with Shadow Tag. Its going to be an amazing revenge killer. Hell, with a FF boost it can maul pretty much any Pokemon resistant to fire too. It can OHKO Heatran with HP Ground.

it'll probably be uber :( .
and

@aura: i was thinking along the same lines,
but im not good with movesets;

Substitute | Toxic/Thunderwave | Seismic Toss/Aromatherapy | Wish

as i said, i'm not good with movesets.

 

[Ársa]

Sandstorm is poop, just use it with T-Tar or Hippow lol and use Swords Dance. Rapid Spin is a good move for that last slot since this thing DESTROYS ghosts so you can spin rather easily with it.

Biggest threats i can see are the steel/bug with download and crazy special movepool. The mole in the OP and onononon dragon thing lol.

I really like the looks of the water/ghost who seems to be an awesome anti spin with recover, boiling water and all and Nuttre (steel/grass bulky as hell thing)

Steel/Bug thing being Genosekuto.

Problem is its (lol) base speed. Only thing is, unless you run HP Ground or a Ground version of its special move, Heatran walls it hard.

I like Jaroda @ Perversity Leaf Storm (:

EDIT:

@Impo: At this early stage, I don't see it being Uber. It's not as bulky as Wobb, and doesn't have Wobb's annoying support options. Plus, it's outsped by many things, so it'll need to use Scarf to being a viable revenge killer, at which point it can also be revenge killed. I agree that Shadow Tag makes it one of the best revenge killers, but not exactly Uber status.

 

[Impo]

i wanna see harvest lum sweeper,
no statuses, but no good pkmn have it :P

 

[Kazuhiro]

Steel/Bug thing being Genosekuto.

Problem is its (lol) base speed. Only thing is, unless you run HP Ground or a Ground version of its special move, Heatran walls it hard.

Yeah. And he will have an insanely bad matchup against Infernape and Urugamosu (Fire/Bug) (who will probably be commonly played as well). I still think he is insanely good, though. OU for sure.

@Impo: At this early stage, I don't see it being Uber. It's not as bulky as Wobb, and doesn't have Wobb's annoying support options. Plus, it's outsped by many things, so it'll need to use Scarf to being a viable revenge killer, at which point it can also be revenge killed. I agree that Shadow Tag makes it one of the best revenge killers, but not exactly Uber status.

Little (noob) question though. Are you guys sure that Dream World abilities will be available in competitive play. The reason I ask this is because I heard some rumors that Dream World abilites would only work in a place called ''Dream World'' in the game. Can someone confirm if it's true or not?

 

[Ársa]

Yeah. And he will have an insanely bad matchup against Infernape and Urugamosu (Fire/Bug) (who will probably be commonly played as well). I still think he is insanely good, though. OU for sure.

Speed Boost Blaziken > All .-.

Little (noob) question though. Are you guys sure that Dream World abilities will be available in competitive play. The reason I ask this is because I heard some rumors that Dream World abilites would only work in a place called ''Dream World'' in the game. Can someone confirm if it's true or not?

Considering you're able to breed Dream World abilities to babies, I HIGHLY doubt it.

 

[Impo]

you can breed dream world abilities onto pokemon :o ?

sweet!

i liike 5th gen now :)

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I'm liking Harvest a lot. Sadly the metagame that will get the most use out of it is LC, with Exeggcute@Oran Berry.

I'm noticing that very few previous Pokémon got new moves, though notably Arcanine got Close Combat. I can't quite see it moving up, but it's definitely a semi-viable option.

New Grass-Steel will probably see much initial use as a "better Forretress", apparently. Yet I was under the impression that aside from Spikes, its main utility is spinning. So I could see it losing popularity, especially as it's set-up fodder for many things, mainly any fire type.

Explosion's major nerf will probably effect suicide leads the most, making them slightly less viable.

 

[SuperiorCat]

Honestly? I don't think Shandera is as Uber as people think. I think he will shape the metagame and will certainly be OU, but he definitely does not deserve to be Uber.
Shandera is pretty much raped by ScarfTar. Blissey or maybe even Chansey with that new pre-evolution stone can handle it, bulky waters like Suicune and Hydration Vaporeon can deal with it pretty well too. Mamanbou, Kerudio, and even that ghost jellyfish can probably do a good job at checking it as well.
Not to mention that it's speed isn't much to brag about, it's outsped by most things, including Gengar and Rotom. ScarfTran/SubTran can probably kill it with EP after rocks (haven't calculated)
And with sandstorm set to pretty much rape this generation, things with EQ that can outspeed are going to be pretty common. Like Doryuuza, and Randorosu.
As for Pokemon that could feel threatened by ShadowTag Shandera, like steel types, they can take a leaf out of Forretress' book and use a Shed Shell.
Of course, Shadow Tag could prove me wrong, but look at poor Duggy, he didn't go to Ubers just because of Arena Trap. Wooby and Wynaut only went to Ubers because Shadow Tag + Counter/MirrorCoat is amazing. If you ask me, this is Ryhperior all over again, I remember clearly when everyone thought his 140 Base Atk would send him to Ubers, hell, I was even one of those people.


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[Samson]

that new grass/steel has a great competitive typing for it's dual defensive bulk. it can actually hit spin blockers EXCEPT shandeera hard. kinda ironic how one very solid pokemon get's pretty much mutilated by another very solid pokemon.

one thing that i don't agree on about Shandeera is some belief that it is fragile. no, 60/90/90 is not something to shrug at.

but to that point, it seems there is a limit to utilizing DW abilities. i wish there were more details about how frequent Nintendo releases Dream World swarms. aren't the online servers from Nintendo down anyway? like really, you have over 1 million preorders on the games and you didn't think ahead for online gameplay?

i'm curious to how Arcanine will perform with both Close Combat and Wild Bolt in its arsenal. while he can definitely give some devastating hits with CB, the recoil plus SR damage is not in his favor. besides, with so many ability resistances lingering around, prediction can be deadly. and Life Orb? i'm not so sure Arcanine needs more. if perhaps Arcanine got a couple DDs BP'd to him, then he'd be a viable late-game sweeper with LO, but 1) he still gets walled and promptly KOd by Dragons and 2) how the hell are you gonna safely pass Arcanine 2 DDs? lol doggie has it tough ='(

 

[blaQk]

but to that point, it seems there is a limit to utilizing DW abilities. i wish there were more details about how frequent Nintendo releases Dream World swarms. aren't the online servers from Nintendo down anyway? like really, you have over 1 million preorders on the games and you didn't think ahead for online gameplay?

So far the only DW pokemon released are the Eevolutions and they are events. And no, the servers aren't down.