Great Anti- HM Slave Idea

Hell, I would think that Strength would be able to do lots of things.

You could DESTROY shrubbery instead of chopping it down.
You could use raw strength to OBLITERATE (and of course, move) rocks.
You could use strength to ANNIHILATE rocky walls to make a ramp for which you to climb.
You could use strength to CATAPULT yourself into the air and hope you land in the right location. Screw flying.

And my favorite...
You could use strength to create a shock wave through the ground in order to shatter the earth underneath and create a trench, thereby sucking in all the water, making Surf and Waterfall completely useless.

I'd also imagine that if you were really strong, you could create a strong thunderclap that causes gale force winds to erupt from the surroundings in order to clear fog. Actually, hell, you could use that wind to blow away trees and rocks.
 
~Morning Bliss~ said:
I don't agree with any of the ideas. xD

These things are there to make the game harder, and if we didn't have those HM's and had it easy-going, it wouldn't be as much fun to me. :\
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I think the same way. If you would leave out these things, it would be more then easy to go everywhere you want to, without have to win the right Badge before. That wouldn´t be a challenge anymore.

Besides, as it was mentioned, Surf and Cascade are really good and useful moves, so it wouldn´t be a good idea to take them out of the games.
 
They should make HM's TM's and make TM'ss removable, instead of having to go to a move deleter. It may take a little longer to do but it'd be better. But I like the idea of a self sufficient trainer. Surf could be swimming. Their are swimmers as trainers.
 
Inkfingers said:
They should make HM's TM's and make TM'ss removable, instead of having to go to a move deleter. It may take a little longer to do but it'd be better. But I like the idea of a self sufficient trainer. Surf could be swimming. Their are swimmers as trainers.
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The reason why HMs are HMs and not TMs are because they are vital to gameplay.
The reason why they are multiple use is because you will need them to beat the game. The reason why they cannot be deleted regularly is because then you will be unable to leave certain dungeons which you absolutely need Rock Smash or Surf, etc. to get in or out. If they were TMs and you accidentally deleted it, then you would potentially get stuck in a cave for the rest of the game and you will have no choice but to use Escape Ropes or restart your game file.
 
I guess my thing is...

You can only have six Pokemon in your party. IMO there should be no more than six HM moves. It's so frustrating when leveling up your Pokemon and you get to an attack you really want to learn, but can't because of an HM move. Not only that, I hate when certain Pokemon can't learn certain HM's that (IMO of course) they should be able to learn. Yanmega for instance..a giant six foot long dragonfly..yet it can't learn the HM for Fly? Come on..I was so happy when I saw that Flash was a TM in gen 4. Then I discovered...DEFOG!

Just for the sake of it, after beating the elite 4 in Platinum I've basically been travelling around with 2 HM Pokemon and leave the others for whatever I'm currently training.

Bibarel - Surf, Strength, Waterfall, Rock Climb
Tropius - Cut, Fly, Defog, Rock Smash

They work pretty darn well if you ask me haha. Not to mention they're none too shabby in battle either.

Anyway, like I said, six Pokemon = six HM's. I honestly don't mind teaching HM's to my Pokemon, since it makes it kind of realistic..but when a move like Defog is an HM, it's just pushing the term.
 
Some ugrades are definately in order...

Cut - either increase its power to 80+ or make it lower enemy defence.

Fly - good as it is.

Surf - good as it is.

Strengh - maybe increase to 100+...

Defog - At least make it lower evasion by 2 levels...

Rock Smash - either double the base power or make it lower defence by 2 stages...

Waterfall - Looks okay as it is...

Rock Climb - doesn't look to bad...
 
Roxasabridged said:
Some ugrades are definately in order...

Cut - either increase its power to 80+ or make it lower enemy defence.

Fly - good as it is.

Surf - good as it is.

Strengh - maybe increase to 100+...

Defog - At least make it lower evasion by 2 levels...

Rock Smash - either double the base power or make it lower defence by 2 stages...

Waterfall - Looks okay as it is...

Rock Climb - doesn't look to bad...
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  • Cut power increase is something I could go for.
  • Fly sucks as it is.
  • Surf is great.
  • Return > Strength still, even so.
  • Lowering Evasion does nothing, even if by two levels. I think it should remove Safeguard, Mist, Wish, Tailwind, and other turn-effects that only affect the enemy (not Stealth Rock, or Spikes on your side)... Though I have heard that Defog removes Spikes from your enemy's side of the field already lol.
  • 50% chance to lower Defense is already hell powerful. I say 60 power is the highest I would go, but that would even be pushing it. I also chose 60 because my Ambipom really likes Rock Smash lol.
  • Waterfall is not just okay. It is amazing.
  • Rock Climb has too little accuracy, bad proc chance, bad effect, and low power. Completely outclassed by Body Slam and the more common Return.
 
I dont agree with the 'it makes the game harder' comment, but c'mon, can you imagine Pokemon without HM's? I mean, we've had them since day 1, and they are used so you actually have to catch other Pokemon. It also adds to the fact you have to find them as well, to advance through the game, beat the gyms (well, at least not just for the badges and TM's. :P) among other things. You get access to more water Pokemon, makes it so you cant just go through the area straight away etc. and taking away HM's and replacing them with items just would kind of ruin that aspect. :\
 
Roxasabridged said:
Some ugrades are definately in order...

Cut - either increase its power to 80+ or make it lower enemy defence.

Fly - good as it is.

Surf - good as it is.

Strengh - maybe increase to 100+...

Defog - At least make it lower evasion by 2 levels...

Rock Smash - either double the base power or make it lower defence by 2 stages...

Waterfall - Looks okay as it is...

Rock Climb - doesn't look to bad...
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My opinion on this is:

Cut - I don't agree with increasing the power. I like Cut between Scratch and Slash. Maybe give it a high critical hit ratio? Slash already has that covered though..

Fly - Good power, just sucks that it's a two part move.

Surf - Great as it is.

Strength - Upping it's power would just make it like a normal type Cross Chop. I think Strength would be better at causing confusion than Rock Climb.

Defog - I have confidence that this will no longer be an HM next generation haha.

Rock Smash - If you raise its power then you just have another Karate Chop or Brick Break.

Waterfall - Fine how it is IMO.

Rock Climb - I like this move and I've never really had any problems with its accuracy. It just seems like a more powerful Strength though.


Also, Rock Climb, Strength, and Cut are all normal type moves. IMO I like Rock Climb as a Ground type move, Strength as a fighting type move (it's described as a punch, and we already have a normal type Mega Punch) and Cut..eh. I don't know about that one, maybe grass or just keep it normal. Just some ideas.
 
Yeah, i'm pretty tired of travelling long routes, then having to make my way back because I forgot the slave that knows cut.
How so? I think it's great, barring the occasional miss.
True.
Can't remember what return is... Is that the damage>switch attack?
  • Lowering Evasion does nothing, even if by two levels. I think it should remove Safeguard, Mist, Wish, Tailwind, and other turn-effects that only affect the enemy (not Stealth Rock, or Spikes on your side)... Though I have heard that Defog removes Spikes from your enemy's side of the field already lol.
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Well, it could help against Double Team spammers...
  • 50% chance to lower Defense is already hell powerful. I say 60 power is the highest I would go, but that would even be pushing it. I also chose 60 because my Ambipom really likes Rock Smash lol.
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Meh, an attack that is capable of obliterating rocks, yet being weak as hell isn't all that impressive to me...
I wouldn't know, I haven't really used it properly in a team.
  • Rock Climb has too little accuracy, bad proc chance, bad effect, and low power. Completely outclassed by Body Slam and the more common Return.
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85 Accuracy isn't terrible, just a mild annoyance, confusion isn't bad unless you're unlucky, and doesn't it have 90 base power?
 
Roxasabridged said:
Yeah, i'm pretty tired of travelling long routes, then having to make my way back because I forgot the slave that knows cut.
How so? I think it's great, barring the occasional miss.
True.
Can't remember what return is... Is that the damage>switch attack?
Well, it could help against Double Team spammers...
Meh, an attack that is capable of obliterating rocks, yet being weak as hell isn't all that impressive to me...
I wouldn't know, I haven't really used it properly in a team.
85 Accuracy isn't terrible, just a mild annoyance, confusion isn't bad unless you're unlucky, and doesn't it have 90 base power?
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Return is the move that powers up depending on how friendly your Pokemon is. The maximum power is 102 and its accuracy is 100%. It is a physical attack and has 20 PP. It outclasses Strength in every way and outclasses Rock Climb in both power and accuracy. Body Slam also outclasses Rock Climb because of its higher proc chance and reliability.

Double Team spammers aren't really that widely used, especially in competitive play. Still, packing a sure-hit move or Foresight would be a much better option. In fact, if Defog worked more like Foresight, Odor Sleuth, or Miracle Eye, it would be more useful than it is now.

Waterfall is one of the most powerful physical water attacks, with 100% accuracy and 80 base power. It's markedly more reliable than its relative, Aqua Tail, who not all Pokemon can learn anyway. That being said, it's the widespread alternative for Surf for Pokemon like Gyarados and Swampert. It has a 20% chance to flinch, so that is really good too.
 
i usually teach one HM to each of my team to have all 6 with me (cept whirlpool, and waterfall where i have to switch but its rare to use it do it doesnt bother me) and when im done with the league, i go to the move deleter to get rid of them
 
I never understood why we couldn't just climb over rocks. o.O
Same with ledges.
 
~Morning Bliss~ said:
Well that is not what I meant. xD

What I meant was that if we didn't get those HM's, we would be able to cross over to Canalave City, go to the Galactic Hideout without using cut, etc. without beating the gym leaders and that's why the HM's are for a purpose. :)

It wouldn't be a purposeful game if that happened. :\
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Yeah, I agree, like, using HMs is much more important than battling trainers. They could have made puzzles without the use of HMs, youknow. Want to block places you can't enter the first time you pass? "Hello, I'm a guard, and I'm not going to let you in without Badge X. Go away."
 
We know the reasons why HM pokemon can not be migrated because of the dessert island thing....
 
I Laugh at your Misfortune! said:
I think items would be a good idea for some of these...like an axe or something to hack through the shrubs...a hammer to smash the rocks...a surfboard to cross water.
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That's the greatest idea I've heard of.

WisherWisherWish said:
Strength: Let the player be able to move the boulders by him/ herself.

Rock Climb: let the player climb the rocks by him/ herself.
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You forgot...they are ten year olds.
 
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