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  • 4
    Posts
    16
    Years
    • Seen Jul 1, 2008
    There once was a time where I would just take any old sweeper and try build a team around it. Not a lot of synergy was in the team, and it showed in the battles. Sure I've built a couple good teams, but never have I reached the team that by my standards I can call great. And so I come to you to ask for help. This team is so close to greatness. It has fun, excitement, and unpredictability. Not only that, it wins. A lot. But, as with every team, there are changes to be made to better it. This is where you come in. I've written this RMT as good as I can so that I can receive the attention necessary to have some excellent rates. I've half-assed my last RMTs and I won't be doing that any longer. If I want a good quality rate, I need to work just as hard in my presentation of the team. So without further ado, I bring to you the squad.

    Please read the closing words of this post before making your own post. Even if you just read the Pokémon's movesets and their descriptions, please read the last part.



    ~ A Look at the Team ~

    Bronzong @ Lum Berry / Leftovers
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP / 80 Atk / 48 SpA / 128 SpD
    Sassy nature (+SpD, -Spe)
    - Hypnosis
    - Stealth Rock
    - Grass Knot
    - Gyro Ball

    Ah Bronzong, how many times have you put those opposing Gengars right back to sleep? How often have you 2HKO'd unsuspecting Swamperts? And how often have you saved my ass from a Mamoswine sweep? Bronzong is probably the most solid Pokémon in the game and makes for a fantastic lead on this team. Swampert, as most of you know, is a very solid counter to Tyrantar. This is why Bronzong is packing Grass Knot. Swamperts usually set up Stealth Rock on turn one, either waiting for me to Hypnosis or for me to switch to a Grass type. However, after just one Grass Knot, Swampert will take around 75% damage, leaving it in no condition to counter Tyranitar. The EV spread could use a bit of explaining. The 48 Special Attack EVs give me a 100% 2HKO against Hippowdon with Stealth Rock out on the field. Even though I won't usually get it with Slack Off, it means that Hippowdon cannot leave the field without about 50% of it's health gone. As for the Attack and Special Defense, I just took what the analysis gave me. If anyone would like to give me some advice on how to split Special Defense and Attack, I'd appreciate it. However, like most tanks that lack recovery, Wish support is a must for Bronzong. If I expect it to counter the likes of SpecsMence, I better be able to get health back in the long run. Vaporeon provides just that.


    Vaporeon @ Leftovers
    Ability: Water Absorb
    EVs: 216 HP / 252 Def / 40 SpA
    Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Hidden Power [Electric]
    - Wish
    - Roar

    Aside from Cresselia, I've found that Bronzong + Vaporeon provide for the best MixMence countering duo in the game. Not only that, but should I be pitted against a Gyarados lead, Vaporeon is one of the best counters in the game for it.

    Gliscor @ Leftovers / Yache Berry
    Ability: Sand Veil
    EVs: 252 HP / 200 Def / 56 Spe
    Impish nature (+Def, -SpA)
    - Earthquake
    - Ice Fang
    - Roost
    - Taunt / Knock Off / U-turn

    Gliscor is arguably the greatest physical wall in the game, and it couldn't fit in better for this team. Vaporeon and Bronzong both are obliterated by Heracross, and Tyranitar is going find it difficult to set up a sweep with a Heracross waiting on my opponent's sidelines. The same can be said with Lucario; both are very dangerous to my team. Gliscor takes both of them out of the game. I've been doing a great deal of consideration in having Gliscor hold a Yache Berry to prevent a surprise sweep from a Hidden Power [Ice] SD Lucario. However, I have a feeling I'll be sticking to Leftovers as in the long run it'll probably be much more helpful. For the last attack I've been using Taunt to help against Breloom. The 56 Speed EVs allow me to outspeed max Speed Breloom. However, U-turn has also been a very cool move on Gliscor. With 100 Attack EVs, I will always break TyraniBoah's Substitute, allowing me to come in on the Substiutute, U-turn to break the Substitute, and go to Vaporeon. Knock Off is always a reliable choice, but for now I'll be sticking with Taunt.

    I somewhat of a desire to switch this out for something more offensive. Gyarados or Salamence seem like good candidates, but adding them to the team would make the need of a Rapid Spinner even greater. I like Gliscor a lot as a Physical Wall, but I don't want my team to be slowed down if there is a better option.

    Roserade @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Natural Cure
    EVs: 6 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid nature (+Spe, -Atk) / Modest nature (+SpA, -Atk)
    - Leaf Storm
    - Weather Ball
    - Shadow Ball / Sleep Powder
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Roserade gives me a very fast special attacker, but the reason it is replacing Azelf is that it gives me something to absorb Toxic Spikes, which really screws over Vaporeon and Tyranitar. The drop in power hurts a bit, but Leaf Storm is a real ***** for my opponents. I'm using Shadow Ball to help out a bit when I need to take out a weakened Celebi. Is Timid really needed in a Garchomp-less metagame?

    Machamp @ Leftovers
    Ability: No Guard
    EVs: 252 HP / 16 Atk / 238 Def / 4 Spe
    Impish nature (+Def, -SpA)
    - Dynamicpunch
    - Ice Punch
    - Sleep Talk
    - Rest

    Gives me a way to handle Blissey, along with a reliable status absorber, something the team was missing before. With Garchomp out of the picture in the area I am battling, extra Tyranitar insurance is always appreciated.

    Tyranitar @ Leftovers
    Ability: Sandstream
    EVs: 252 HP / 76 Atk / 180 Spe
    Adamant nature (+Atk, -SpA)
    - Substitute
    - Dragon Dance
    - Earthquake
    - Crunch

    Power. Unpredictability. This is what a sweeper should hold, and this is exactly what this Tyranitar brings to this team. Substitute gives me two advantages over my opponent: surprise and protection. When a Substitute is thrown up from any Tyranitar, the first thing an opponent thinks it "TyraniBoah". So let's say they bring in Donphan or Gliscor (although they most likely have been taken out by now) when Substitute is used. Much of the time, a switch occurs. Even with knowledge of this set, I would probably make the same move. But unfortunately for the opponent, I'll have a Dragon Dance under my belt while they switch out. I have selected Stone Edge and Earthquake as my two attacks for a few reasons. First, I already have Magnezone to remove Bronzong from walling this set, which does a damn good job even if I'm running Crunch. Secondly, it's really nice to hit Zapdos for a OHKO instead of allowing it to stall me out with Sub+Roost, which has been gaining popularity lately. Honestly, I just love this thing to death. Since this is the central sweeper of the entire team, it is here to stay.

    Crunch > Stone Edge to allow me to have better coverage along with acting as a TyraniBoah to throw my opponent off guard.​

    ~ Possible Changes ~

    :Jolly Gliscor to outspeed Lucario:

    ~ Previous Members ~

    Azelf @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
    Rash nature (+SpA, -SpD)
    - U-turn
    - Psychic
    - Fire Blast / Thunderbolt / Hidden Power [Ice] / Grass Knot
    - Fire Blast / Thunderbolt / Hidden Power [Ice] / Grass Knot

    Ah Azelf… My speedy little revenge killer extraordinaire. Azelf gives me three things, the said role as a revenge killer, a strong special attacking force, and U-turn. With U-turn, I can scout their team and draw out Blissey. After the switch in, I can go to Tyranitar and Substitute up. Here is where the mind games come in… Now they think I'm a TyraniBoah. If this is early game, I will simply Crunch and wait to be phazed or switch out. This will make it easier to set up a DD sweep later in my match. Or, if it is already late game and I've taken out his counters, I will set up and sweep.

    But enough about Tyranitar, onto Azelf… It has worked pretty well, but like Gliscor it is another member whose spot is in jeopardy. However, thus far I can't think of anything that fits my team better. Fire Blast and Thunderbolt make for an amazing attacking combination, and Thunderbolt can help if Gyarados is able to set up when Vaporeon is dead.

    Magnezone @ Leftovers
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 172 HP / 252 SpA / 84 Spe
    Modest nature (+SpA, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Magnet Rise
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice] / Hidden Power [Grass]

    Magnezone provides me with a steel killer, something desperately needed on this team. Bronzong completely walls Tyranitar and Skarmory can phaze it away easily enough, so a steel killer is extremely important. I wish there were more to say here, so instead I'll talk about my concerns with Magnezone. Now, I know it is not to be underestimated, but I'm not sure if it is right for the team. With Azelf being my only really fast Pokémon (and it is weak to Pursuit), I feel like I can juggle things around a bit. I know I'm being vague, but if I knew exactly how to handle this I wouldn't be asking for help. Basically I want to give my team more speed without reducing the chance of a Tyranitar sweep.

    ~ Threat List ~

    This is a list of Pokémon and how I usually handle them. Keep in mind that I am not claiming to be able to handle every threat; I can't. We can theorize as much as we want on paper but it changes dramatically in the battle. This is just to give you a look at what I do when I come across some common threats.

    Abomasnow – Abomasnow really can't do much to Bronzong except Leech Seed it. I have Tyranitar so Hail in general isn't all that huge of a problem. Azelf can get in on an Ice Shard or Protect and OHKO with Fire Blast if it comes to that.

    Azelf – Azelf is tricky to maneuver against, but usually I can handle it. ScarfVersions are simply beat with prediction and switching. Bronzong can come in on Psychic / Grass Knot / Explosion, Vaporeon comes in on Flamethrower, and Gliscor comes in on Thunderbolt. For Nasty Plot versions, however, the situation depends on the set. If they are running Grass Knot, Tyranitar will have to switch in on Nasty Plot, take the hit and kill it with Stone Edge. If they're running Hidden Power [Fighting], Vaporeon will have to do the dirty work. No matter what the set, however, I can always hurt it enough to have Azelf take it down in the end.

    Breloom – Breloom leads are gay. Gay because when I predict a Spore and use Hypnosis, they Substitute and when I predict a Substitute, they Spore. But if I can predict a Substitute before they can put anything to sleep, I'm in luck. Gliscor comes in and Taunts Breloom so it cannot use Spore and I'm free to kill it. Not really a huge deal, but it's still gay as ever.

    Celebi – Not surprisingly, Celebi is gay. Natural Cure means I cannot put it to Sleep and be done with it, and without Crunch on Tyranitar I can't just rely on him taking the little flower out. Basically I just annoy the hell out of it until its HP is low enough for Azelf to do something. Fire Blast averages around 75% against Celebi, which is the reason I'm using it over Flamethrower. However, should it miss I could be in deep ****. At least a +1 Stone Edge is a 2HKO.

    Deoxys-S – Bronzong completely and utterly rapes Deoxys-S. This is why Wish support is so key; so that I don't get screwed over my a late-game Deoxys-S sweep. Vaporeon can take a Thunderbolt and often kill with Surf, and if worst comes to worst I can try and stall it out with LO + SS. I don't understand why some people just allow Deoxys-S to walk over their team when switching around enough can wear it down.

    Dragonite – All three of my walls do a damn good job against Dragonite. On mixed LO sets, Bronzong can take the Draco Meteor and Vaporeon can come in to clean up the mess. DD sets are unable to take out Gliscor nor Vaporeon in one hit (even with +1 Attack) so I am usally safe there.

    Electivire – The only Electivire that I would consider "threatening" is the Mild LO Electivire. Bronzong does a decent job handling it, as it can live a Flamethrower and kill it with Earthquake. Like Deoxys, should Bronzong fall I can stall it out with SS and Life Orb as I have a resist for every attack it has.

    Gallade – Vaporeon handles Ice Punch, Gliscor handles Close Combat and Thunderpunch, Bronzong handles Psycho Cut and Stone Edge. CBGallade doesn't realy have a true counter, but the defensive core I have set up can stop it.

    Garchomp – Now for the big surprise… I don't care! The primary place I am using this team has Garchomp banned, and I have a feeling that Garchomp will soon be banned on Smogon too. However, even without planning for it, Bronzong + Vaporeon + Gliscor do a damn good job against Garchomp.

    Gengar – ScarfGar is OHKO'd by Gyro Ball and most often put to sleep from the getgo. Bronzong is my "Gengar counter", but since SpecsGar is so powerful I have to rely on getting Tyranitar in on a Shadow Ball and just killing it.

    Gyarados – Vaporeon is my Gyarados counter, but if it is dead Azelf can get in on a Dragon Dance and Thunderbolt kill it.

    Heatran – Vaporeon is a really good Heatran counter… Bronzong can get in on predicted Earthpowers, but the most common Heatran is ReSTalk, who Vaporeon eats alive.

    Heracross – Gliscor is the closest thing to a Heracross counter in the game. If it has Swords Dance, I still can take it down with Azelf. But for the most part, Gliscor has Heracross 100% covered.

    Infernape – Vaporeon may not be the perfect Infernape counter, but it is one of the best.

    Kingdra – Kingdra needs to be worked around, as I don't have a Milotic on this team. On the predicted Surf or Waterfall or Ice Beam, I go to Vaporeon. The obvious Draco Meteor follows, I switch to Bronzong. Now Draco Meteor does a pathetic 30% to Vaporeon and I can Wish my health back. Usually Kingdra helps more than it hurts, as Water Absorb makes it's attacks useful in my favor.

    Lucario – SDLucario covered by Gliscor, but SpecsLuke is a beast. Honestly the best I can do is switch around for resistances and get Azelf in to revenge kill it. I do not know why SpecsLuke isn't used more; it is seriously a beast.

    Machamp – Machamp doesn't really have any counters, besides maybe Slowbro. Gliscor does a damn good job, though. Taunt prevents it from Resting or Sleep Talking so I can just pound it into the ground. If I can predict a Rest, Azelf can come in and Psychic (or more realistically U-turn on the switch for my advantage).

    Mamoswine – Bronzong is the best Mamoswine counter in the game, which is why he is on my team.

    Metagross – Bronzong can come in on Ice Punch, Earthquake, and if necessary Meteor Mash. Gliscor can take Thunderpunches all day, and Vaporeon can take a hit or two as well. But a well played Metagross could spell trouble for me. Magnezone is my best switch in on Meteor Mash, as it has a 4 times resist and I can just kill it off.

    Salamence – Almost all forms of Salamence are covered by my three walls. Choice Item Salemence are handled for the most party by Bronzong with a bit of help from Vaporeon. Gliscor can help against DDMences, and MixMence is picked apart by Bronzong and Vaporeon.

    Scizor – Gliscor and Bronzong for the most part can handle Scizor. It can take a nasty chunk out of Vaporeon's health, so that isn't something I want to do. If it has a CB, Magnezone can probably trap it and kill it.

    Snorlax – CurseLax is usually set up fodder for Tyranitar, as most can't even touch Tyranitar. Or I can be smart and just have Gliscor Taunt it and be done with it.

    Togekiss – Togekiss can be a *****. Usually I can put it to sleep with Bronzong, but like most Togekiss sets it depends on luck.

    Tyranitar – Bronzong resists most of what Tyranitar can throw at me, and Gliscor can stall out Stone Edges with Roost. Vaporeon and Bronzong handle TyraniBoah well enough.

    Weavile – Bronzong is a great Weavile counter and can live two hits from a Jolly CB Night Slash and live a +2 Life Orb Night Slash. Both times it will be OHKO'd with Gyro Ball.

    Yanmega – Lead Yanmega's are put to sleep and hit with Gyro Ball. As for the late game sweeper, Vaporeon can take a Bug Buzz and kill it as a last resort.


    Thank you for reading this long winded RMT and please post for your comments.

     
    Last edited by a moderator:
    I think you may have forgotten a few things while typing this thing up. In your post, you mention a number of times Magnezone and Azelf, but they currently aren't on your team (Magnezone can't stop Bronzong from walling TTar if he isn't there). Also, the giant empty space at the end of the post is annoying.

    Outside of that, it seems like a fairly solid team.
     
    Wow, I saw this team on Smogon yesterday, exact same thread and team.

    The team seem solid, though a Magnet Rising Magnezone can be sort of a pain, your Machamp can survive it and OHKO or 2HKO.
     
    Wow, I saw this team on Smogon yesterday, exact same thread and team.

    The team seem solid, though a Magnet Rising Magnezone can be sort of a pain, your Machamp can survive it and OHKO or 2HKO.
    Lol. That is because I am Pulse on Smogon. Also. Magnezone, and Azelf were on the team, but Roserade, and Machamp are replacing them. Dont pay attention to Azelf, and Magnezone. They are there just to let you know that they were in the lineup till now.
     
    Umm Roserade is good. Sceptile could be better in some situations.
    Dont use machamp slowbro kills that thing so fast.
    gliscor dies in one hit from an ice beam and its not that hard to hit it with that either.

    Its a good team but if something like heatran kills your brongzong all the foe hast to do is use deoxys-s and your screwed. But its a solid team. Very nice.

    I'll give it a 7/10 because after brongzong dies IT A DAY IN THE PARK FOR DEO-S
     
    Dont use machamp slowbro kills that thing so fast.

    This is the reason nobody uses SDLucario. Gliscor stops that thing so fast.

    Its a good team but if something like heatran kills your brongzong all the foe hast to do is use deoxys-s and your screwed. But its a solid team. Very nice.

    What kind of person actually lets Bronzong get killed by a Heatran? ._. I'd actually be a fair bit more worried about a Deoxys + Magnezone combo, but I've never actually seen somebody use it.

    Saying a team is weak to Deoxys after Bronzong dies is like saying a team's weak to SDLuke if Gliscor dies. =P

    I seem to have referenced Gliscor and SDLucario a lot in this post. =P
     
    Actually, consideirng Shed Shell on Bronzong may save you. I can see Magnezone coming in on Zong, Subbing, Rising, and Bolting. At that point, Deoxys-S can REALLY mess up things, so consider that.

    This team does have some stellar points, but Deoxys-S just really stands out as a major threat (Superpower versions, I should add.) Specs versions without Superpower can be handled with care though.
     
    People run Choice Specs Deoxys-S? Oh man that is not smart...

    Magnezone + Deoxys-S gives any team problems so I don't think it really even needs mentioning :P

    Team looks pretty good. Be aware of SpecsMence, who can pretty badly bang up your team. Watch out for Azelf and Gengar too, though you can revenge Azelf. If Roserade is down (which is a good possibility given its frailty), Azelf is probably going to sweep you since Vaporeon really isn't very good at taking it on. At least it can't really switch in on most of your team so it shouldn't be too big a deal. You might want to add some more Azelf insurance though if at all possible.
     
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