I need some suggestions for my Charizard.

[Mana Lugia]

Frosty: You suggest Rock slide over Sub? =/

Also, if you Sub on the right turn (Eg: Either when the opponent switches their breloom to a kingdra, or when they try to Twave you, for example), your Drum is guarenteed. The only question factors are whether the opponent has QA, and if they can break your sub first. On one battle, I actually had Zard HP Fly an Aero with a sub up first and later came back to Drum, so that the drummed salac will KO the Aero with one shot without Zard dying. That's strategic switching ;)

(Well, more of a lucky prediction, but still :X)

 

[Pogiforce-14]

It's a matter of preference. I suggest you try both out on NetBattle to see which one you like best. Personally, I like SD or BD.

I don't do net battle. :\ Not only can my computer not support the program, but I dislike it entirely. I prefer battling via GB where my chances are real instead of simulated.

 

[Mana Lugia]

your chances are very real on Netbattle.

Although much of it would be losing for someone who's never battled competitively before.

 

[Pogiforce-14]

My chances would be different, because it's just a sim that doesn't truly help me with anythign in real life. I can't download my netbattle team into my gameboy, and to me the GB battles are what really counts. And no one I ever fought in real life ever trained competitively enough honestly to beat even my last team, which had Evs issues all over the place.

So to break it down, Netbattling IMO is nothing but training for an extreme situation that for me will never come to pass, so I never worry with it.

And I resent that departing remark. Just because I never needed to battle competitively before (Which actually puzzles me as to why they bother calling it competitive since they almost never hold competitions in this sort of thing) doesn't mean I don't know how to.

 

[Toothache]

I'm starting to lose the point of this thread. Was it about breeding, or Charizard, or whether NB was better than GB battles? Pick a topic (the original topic, hopefully) and stick to it, people.

Before we move on, let's hear my coupla coins. I can see Pogiforce's point of view on NetBattling, it has some unrealistic situations that cannot be matched in GB battles (such as all Pokemon having max EVs, perfect Natures, whatever you need right there at the click of a button. In the GB world getting similar results takes a lot of patience and an extreme amount of luck). So, I respect his decision not to use NB.

At the same time, it does have it's benefits. For me, I never really battled anyone competitively before I started on NetBattle, mostly cos I never knew anyone near me who actually played the game (a lot harder than most when you're 22 and most of your friends thinks Pokemon is 'just for kids'). So, it's taught me a lot, improved my game beyond belief. However, I consider NB practise for GB battling, since it's a simulated environment seperate but extremely similar. It keeps my tactics fresh and my ability sharp.

I guess my point is, use NB or don't use it, it's your choice. I'm really not bothered either way, since there are good and bad points about each.

 

[Mana Lugia]

Actually, pogiforce, it does mean you don't. Unless you're a superhuman, there's always a learning curve when you start something new, such as when I started GSbotting a few years ago. Oh boy, you should have seen how my team was taken down by an Aerodactyl because my opponent outplayed me at every turn. Therefore, the odds of you doing well when you first start netbattle, assuming you battled half decent battlers, is stacked against you, rather than for you.

As well, unrealistic situations only apply in 1 thing in NB: The IVs. By that, obviously Hidden power as well. Personality isn't hard to control, you might spend some time hatching an egg or catching something, but it's easily changed with a new pokemon. EV wise, EV training is tedius, but completely manageble if you only use a team of 6. (Hence, NB allows you to simulate and make yourself a half decent team before you spend your time training, which is a good thing, because we don't want to end up with a Lv 100 EV trained Snorlax as your special sweepers with EVs in speed and spA)

Another NB advantage is the challenge. Unless your community is living under a rut, pokemon died a while ago, which is why people who like it are scattered around. I don't have the money to fly to someone else to battle them, so NB is fine for me. Besides, since everyone starts with the same opportunity to win, IMHO NB takes more skill to play than an actual link battle.

And of course, Toothy already addressed why things you learn from NB would apply to your game on the gameboy, so I don't think I need to start that again.

 

[Pogiforce-14]

Pokemon is coming back strong here. Half the people I ask have the games, the stores are selling Pokemon Merchandise like crazy, they've even brought back some classic merchandise such as teh pokemon pokeball keychains and the Vtrainers as New Advanced Gen material. Teh show is quite popular here. Pokemon is not dead. Not by a long shot.

I odn't need NB. that doesn't train me for teh real thing. They call it competitive because it's for competition rank I believe. However, whenever they hold these competitions, which are few and far between as it is, they are always on Gameboys. Not the internet. So trianing for extremes under the internet envionment will not prepare me for the realism of the game boy environment. I see no sense stressing myself for so much perfection when it's near impossible to obtain on teh GB and is rather needless to boot. I simply wanted to strengthen my charizard because even by in game standards She's struggling, and I wanted to even the odds a bit. So again, which is suggested: Swords Dance, or Dragon Dance? ANd please do not refer me to NB. By now you should know that I truly dislike that program and will avoid using it by any means necessary.

 

[HellishHades]

Pokemon is coming back strong here. Half the people I ask have the games, the stores are selling Pokemon Merchandise like crazy, they've even brought back some classic merchandise such as teh pokemon pokeball keychains and the Vtrainers as New Advanced Gen material. Teh show is quite popular here. Pokemon is not dead. Not by a long shot.

That's all very well and good, but that doesn't mean that poeple are battling effectively and competitively. There is a difference between happily playing in-game and battling with others who have EV trained and hatched monsters with near-perfect IVs.

I odn't need NB. that doesn't train me for teh real thing. They call it competitive because it's for competition rank I believe.

"Competeive battling" merely refers to battling with other trainers that have properly trained their monsters with effective move-sets. It's more of a play-on-words, indicating that there's "co competition" in in-game battling.

However, whenever they hold these competitions, which are few and far between as it is, they are always on Gameboys. Not the internet. So trianing for extremes under the internet envionment will not prepare me for the realism of the game boy environment.

The people who use Netbattle -- apart from "jajajajaja" boys: those bloody bundles of sticks -- will be much better prepared for GameBoy tournaments if you are facing opponents with any skill.

if (netBattleExp=true && hasActionReplay=true)
     gg(tourney);

// The smarter of the bunch will understand this...

I see no sense stressing myself for so much perfection when it's near impossible to obtain on teh GB and is rather needless to boot. I simply wanted to strengthen my charizard because even by in game standards She's struggling, and I wanted to even the odds a bit. So again, which is suggested: Swords Dance, or Dragon Dance? ANd please do not refer me to NB. By now you should know that I truly dislike that program and will avoid using it by any means necessary.

If you just want your Charizard to perform in-game, then just level it up; it should be able to KO everything in sight that way.

 

[Pogiforce-14]

But in game wasn't the whole point. My team could take on anything on Ruby no matter what trainer came to me. Even though my movesets weren't exactly top rank but ya'lls standards, they faired very well and were a really rough bunch. But this new set doesn't live up to the last set's standards and even though I can easily trade them over, I don't earn my opponent's respect battling with a team that was level 100 before I even bought Fire REd. So I wanted to build me a good FR team too, but it isn't fairing as well as I hoped, and level is not the best factor for winning in these cases. I need good movesets for this new team, whether they be approved by the standard competitive moveset or not, otherwise they won't live up to the quality my last team presented to me.

I'm going to ask you guys to please stop impressing this NB stuff on me. I'm not going to change my mind about it, so I'll ask you all to do me a favor and don't confront me with it anymore. It grows tiring have to keep saying I don't do Netbattle. I asked nicely. I thank you guys for your advice and I've decided to use Swords Dance. Thanks again.

 

[Nathaniel Essex]

simple answer.

Simple answer, Dragon Dance. only the toughest opponents need that extra attack level, and speed is great in ANY _realistic_ situation.

on a side note, i also agree that this net battle stuff is unrealistic and all just theory-crafting.

 

[Frostweaver]

Charizard isn't that tough and one attack level is a dramatic boost for Charizard's much needed attack power... and even after one swords dance, it really can't knock out too many in relative comparison to the other swords dancer.

As for netbattle, I'll ask a question in return:

"How is one 'less real' than another, when they're both exactly functioned in the same way, with the exception that you don't see your opponent face to face and that a player can't wimp out by disconnecting on the gameboy?"

Theorycrafting will be talking about things on paper. But when you're playing it out on netbattle, that is totally different... Netbattle's damage formula calculations, the way how attacks are suppose to function, and absolutely all aspects of it follow the calculations of the "real game." The only possible reason is that how IVs can be manipulated to be maxed out or to be for a certain stats so HP can be used, where on the gameboy you cannot. However, how much skill is it when one Pokemon lost to another, only because of the difference in IVs and that one Pokemon's stats are just too great compare to another...? In a game where every point of stats matter, a difference up to 30 points in each stats is dramatic and game-deciding...

If the "but you didn't raise the Pokemon!" part is the question, then exactly how different is choosing EVs than training EVs? It's not a difficult task at all. You just wait for RCs, and then pick off certain Pokemon for certain EV. If you want exact EV calculation instead of just 252 in 2 stats, then use a pen and a paper to help. Not difficult to do at all... if you have the time to do so.

Netbattle's "lazy way out" is in fact the reason why so many different Pokemon strategies are found today. Remember how curselax is once upon a time (even within RS world) the Pokemon of the day. Now, Snorlax usually go sublax instead of curselax. How did this change happen? Well, looking at the amount of time it takes to raise a Pokemon, it'll take a LOT longer to try out new strategy, not to mention that a new strategy can possibly fail, putting all of your efforts in vain.

Not everyone has a 2 gameboy advance and the time to do a billion of restarts just to get the TMs as well. And the most frustrating part is possibly how not everyone can afford to buy all 7 games of the Advanced Generation (R, S, E, FR, LG, Col, Box)... on the other hand, one netbattle for free does it all.

 

[HellishHades]

on a side note, i also agree that this net battle stuff is unrealistic and all just theory-crafting.

"Theory crafting" is what makes great teams. It is the reason and purpose behind a squad of monsters. Theory is the entire foundation of Pok?mon: "I believe (theorise) that I will beable to predict my opponent's next move, or how a monster will work", for example.

NetBattle is about theory, but it is also about the tactile Pok?mon experience. You experience battles with people from arount the world -- most, skilled people.

Methinks, your theory is flawed.



Edit: Why is it that either Man_Lugia or frostweaver always post just a smidgen in time before I? Cruel irony, perhaps?

 

[Pogiforce-14]

I hope that lecture wasn't directed at me Frosty, because I've already said I don't want to hear it and there is no way to change my mind. It doesn't matter how you develop the strategies if they are too hard to be done on the gameboy. To me, teh actual video game produced by nintendo is all that matters and any other medium is just a sim. Now I've made my choice, so this topic has no purpose. If people are to keep discussing the pros and Cons of NB then they need to take it someplace else because this is now offtopic and needs to be closed. Someone get Toothache in here to close this.

 

[Mana Lugia]

There's a difference between trying to change your mind, and arguing against your viewpoint because we deem it to be incorrect. The latter makes for a good debate, increasing the understanding of both parties in a spirited and effective way.

Hellish: It's Mana :p Also, because it's Friday the 13th where you live? :X

And finally: As long as you don't meet anyone who's had exp on Netbattle or Rsbot, you should do fine, Pogiforce. But with experience come great power.

 

[HellishHades]

But with experience come great power.

Sorry about the typo, I just type quickly. I must have missed a letter.


As for NetBattle, I'd galdly battle others with the game pak if there were any organised tournaments in Canada, somewhere near where I live. Perhaps, Nintendo will set some up -- not bloody likely. The Americans get them all; either that, or its at the West Edmonton Mall if there's on in Canada at all. (I've only ever seen an advertisement for one there.)

 

[Mana Lugia]

O_o you live in Canada? Where?

Also, most of the tournies nowadays are held in 1 location: NYPC =/ Thus if we want to battle competitively, well, for me anyways, I'd have to convince university students to convert to pokemon (read: impossible) and then kick their butts because they haven't played it before =/

 

[HellishHades]

O_o you live in Canada? Where?

Also, most of the tournies nowadays are held in 1 location: NYPC =/ Thus if we want to battle competitively, well, for me anyways, I'd have to convince university students to convert to pokemon (read: impossible) and then kick their butts because they haven't played it before =/

Not in Edmonton. Rather, Ontario: it's either that or Qu?bec for most of Canadians, anyway. Cue massive uproar from the populous of Edmonton.

 

[Pogiforce-14]

There's a difference between trying to change your mind, and arguing against your viewpoint because we deem it to be incorrect. The latter makes for a good debate, increasing the understanding of both parties in a spirited and effective way.

Hellish: It's Mana :p Also, because it's Friday the 13th where you live? :X

And finally: As long as you don't meet anyone who's had exp on Netbattle or Rsbot, you should do fine, Pogiforce. But with experience come great power.

If you find it incorrect, then that's your opinion. Frankly you're being stereotyping by thinking that all netbattlers are superior to all normal battlers. Which isn't fair. But that is not the problem. The problem is, however, that this topic was not made to debate Netbattling and instead was asking for advice for my charizard. You guys are off topic and this topic is in sore need of closing. If toothache doesn't get here soon I'll ask an S-mod to do it then. But if the off topicness continues to be this bad it needs to be closed as soon as possible. :\

 

[Mana Lugia]

Hellish: I'm at U of Waterloo, come visit!

Also, Pogiforce: I never said all NB, I'm pretty sure I said NBers who are half decent in particular. And trust me, that holds true most of the time, because with exposure to new strategies come the ability to use them effectively. Objectively, NB is a great program to train for battling. It's your subjectiveness and dislike for it that cause bias to contradict such. But it really doesn't matter, since there's the confirmation bias that hinders everyone.

And since your Zard already has Dance, go nuts and close this thread.

 

[HellishHades]

Hellish: I'm at U of Waterloo, come visit!

Coincidence, coincidence. What are you taking? Some sort of maths, or all of that philosophy stuff? I'll be going there next year -- likely.