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Purfugly, never do that again. Not only are you being an idiot but you are also starting to piss me off. The two dragon moves are needed. Draco Meteor can OHKO many things, but Dragon Pulse is useful to finish things off and still hit hard without the SAttk drop. Hydro Pump is not that bad of an idea on something that can't learn Surf and needs a reliable way to kill Heatran and Rhyperior. While I hate Salamence, absolutely hate it, I feel I have to defend Specsmence here. He is a ****ing beast. 110 SAttk (higher than Draggy's, mind you) + STAB Draco Meteor is nothing to laugh at. You think it sucks, I'll be waiting with one on Competitor especially made to kick your ass.

And ooka, thank you for telling them that. That's exactly why you use Flamethrower.
 
sanjay120 said:
Purfugly, never do that again. Not only are you being an idiot but you are also starting to piss me off. The two dragon moves are needed. Draco Meteor can OHKO many things, but Dragon Pulse is useful to finish things off and still hit hard without the SAttk drop. Hydro Pump is not that bad of an idea on something that can't learn Surf and needs a reliable way to kill Heatran and Rhyperior. While I hate Salamence, absolutely hate it, I feel I have to defend Specsmence here. He is a ****ing beast. 110 SAttk (higher than Draggy's, mind you) + STAB Draco Meteor is nothing to laugh at. You think it sucks, I'll be waiting with one on Competitor especially made to kick your ass.

And ooka, thank you for telling them that. That's exactly why you use Flamethrower.
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But the idea of what just about everyone is saying is that you must make your pokemon as versitile as possible. Two dragon moves aren't recommended, and Hydro Pump's accuraccy is too flakey to be recomended to anyone. If you want Rhyperior killer, get Earthquake. Not that Hydro Pump is all that bad, but there is better.
 
sanjay120 said:
Purfugly, never do that again. Not only are you being an idiot but you are also starting to piss me off. The two dragon moves are needed. Draco Meteor can OHKO many things, but Dragon Pulse is useful to finish things off and still hit hard without the SAttk drop. Hydro Pump is not that bad of an idea on something that can't learn Surf and needs a reliable way to kill Heatran and Rhyperior. While I hate Salamence, absolutely hate it, I feel I have to defend Specsmence here. He is a ****ing beast. 110 SAttk (higher than Draggy's, mind you) + STAB Draco Meteor is nothing to laugh at. You think it sucks, I'll be waiting with one on Competitor especially made to kick your ass.

And ooka, thank you for telling them that. That's exactly why you use Flamethrower.
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Oh wow. That means that I should teach my Sharpedo both Surf and Waterfall. Thanks for reminding me to waste one of my move slots on a move of a type I already have. And that also means that Mece's attack is equal to that of - Tangrowth. Congrats. You just made me feel better about myself.
 
No, you should not teach both Surf and Waterfall to Sharpedo:

Neither of them have any drawbacks like Draco Meteor.
Surf is special. Sharpedo sucks at special.
Sharpedo has better options, namely Crunch and Earthquake. Salamence doesn't. (Hidden Power Flying maybe, if you have to time to breed for it/want to risk a Rhypeior switch in)

On Dragonite, I would only use Draco Meteor because of the combined fact that it already has a Dragon move AND it has lots of other options, options that would usually be better than Dragon Pulse.

110 SAttk is not bad, in fact, it's very good.

And lol, Earthquake kills Rhyperior. Solid Rock + 130 Def + Stone Edge + I'm using Modest/Timid Specsmence and I will not compromise its defenses, kthx.
 
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sanjay120 said:
No, you should not teach both Surf and Waterfall to Sharpedo:

Neither of them have any drawbacks like Draco Meteor.
Surf is special. Sharpedo sucks at special.
Sharpedo has better options, namely Crunch and Earthquake. Salamence doesn't.

110 SAttk is not bad, in fact, it's very good.

And lol, Earthquake kills Rhyperior. Solid Rock + 130 Def + Stone Edge + I'm using Modest/Timid Specsmence and I will not compromise its defenses, kthx.
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Which is why I'd rather have an AttackMence any day. Leave the specials to the experts. His attack is still highest-and not by a small margin. Specmence isn't bad, just not as good.
 
sanjay120 said:
No, you should not teach both Surf and Waterfall to Sharpedo:

Neither of them have any drawbacks like Draco Meteor.
Surf is special. Sharpedo sucks at special.
Sharpedo has better options, namely Crunch and Earthquake. Salamence doesn't.

110 SAttk is not bad, in fact, it's very good.

And lol, Earthquake kills Rhyperior. Solid Rock + 130 Def + I'm using Modest Specsmence.
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Glad to know. In case you've decided to take a step off of the short bus:

a) I'm not effin retarded. You shouldn't put both on Sharpedo nor should you do it to Mence.
b) I didn't say 110 was bad, but it's sure as hell nothing to go crazy over, hell, Kadabra's is 120.
c) Regice just gets melted by Flamethrower, IMO.
d) Hydro Pump's Accuracy is - 80. Which basically means that it will only hit in-game.
e) Draco Meteor
f) I have to pee.
 
Physical Mence doesn't get Draco Meteor. And part of it is the surprise, switching in Skarmory or Bronzong on a Fire Blast is not good and could cost you the match. Besides, that post was mostly directed at Purfugly, not you.

Prufugly: Believe me, I'd use Surf if he got it. But he doesn't, and Hydro Pump is the only thing keeping Rhyperior and Heatran at bay. Physical Mence fails at Rhyperior stopping, no matter what you use, and Heatran usually carries Choice Scarf and will OHKO with HP Ice, so you can't EQ it. You sure are seeming retarded, if you can't think of a better example than Surf/Waterfall Sharpedo. That is nothing like Specsmence. Call me when you get a good analogy, or at least one that makes sense.

And wtf, Regice?
 
sanjay120 said:
Physical Mence doesn't get Draco Meteor. And part of it is the surprise, switching in Skarmory or Bronzong on a Fire Blast is not good and could cost you the match. Besides, that post was mostly directed at Purfugly, not you.
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I assume your talking to me. I wasn't trying to argue, just posting my opinion. Draco Meteor isn't all as good as it seems.
 
sanjay120 said:
Physical Mence doesn't get Draco Meteor. And part of it is the surprise, switching in Skarmory or Bronzong on a Fire Blast is not good and could cost you the match. Besides, that post was mostly directed at Purfugly, not you.

Prufugly: Believe me, I'd use Surf if he got it. But he doesn't, and Hydro Pump is the only thing keeping Rhyperior and Heatran at bay. Physical Mence fails at Rhyperior stopping, no matter what you use, and Heatran usually carries Choice Scarf and will OHKO with HP Ice, so you can't EQ it. You sure are seeming retarded, if you can't think of a better example than Surf/Waterfall Sharpedo. That is nothing like Specsmence. Call me when you get a good analogy, or at least one that makes sense.

And wtf, Regice?
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Okay, here is a better analogy.

Camerupt
~Overheat
~Flamethrower
~Filler
~Filler

And can't wait for your Hydro Pump to miss on Heatran, either way I'd doubt it would b a OHKO.
 
Richard Steel said:
Salamence has the potential to be both a Physical Sweeper OR a Special Sweeper (most people actually are going with the latter with something deemed "SpecsMence"), however the physical variation will always be better, seeing as how his Attack his higher than his Special Attack (an Attack that matches that of Metagross, actually). My personal favourite is Dragon Dance Salamence:

Salamence @ Leftovers
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpAtk)
EVs: 120 HP, 252 Attack, 136 Speed
- Dragon Dance
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Flamethrower

Of course, the nature could be changed to Naughty (+Atk, -SpDef) in order to boost Special Attack a bit, but then any Ice Beam would practically be an OHKO. Most of it is obvious: Earthquake has great type coverage, Dragon Claw is only resisted by one type (Steel), and Flamethrower is really quite vital in order to take down Skarmory and Bronzong, who would otherwise wall this set completely. And since Salamence does have a great Special Attack, even with an Adamant nature Flamethrower is at most a 2KO on Skarmory. Not sure about Bronzong, though.

However, watch out for Milotic, since she's generally a good counter for DDMence, and will usually OHKO with an Ice Beam, while taking minimal damage from Salamence, especially if she switches in during Flamethrower.

But many people who use Salamence also use Garchomp and TTar, who are only Physical Sweepers. So maybe that's why SpecsMence has gained so much popularity. But if you ask me which is better, I will always say Dragon Dance Salamence. I've seen it massacre teams, and after a few Dragon Dances it becomes virtually unstoppable, unless up against one hell of a Hazer.
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I'm not arguing with anyone here. He explained it perfectly. AttackMence is USUALLY superior, but SpeceMence isn't shabby, either.
 
I'm sorry, we took this argument too personally. This should help.

Empoleon
Nature:Calm/Modest
Surf
Ice Beam
Grass Knot/Stealth Rock
Yawn

This, I believe, is a standard Empoleon. I'm not sure, I picked Torterra.
 
Purfugly said:
Okay, here is a better analogy.

Camerupt
~Overheat
~Flamethrower
~Filler
~Filler

And can't wait for your Hydro Pump to miss on Heatran, either way I'd doubt it would b a OHKO.
Click to expand...

Maybe that could work, but it'd be better on Moltres. Camerupt is outclassed in fire-type Specsing and lots of things resist Fire. It also has low speed and a 4x weak to water doesn't help, though it did get a boost in Solid Rock. Salamence, on the other hand, has tons of resistances, Dragon is only resisted by Steel, and nothing beats it at Choice Specs Draco Meteor. Except Parukia.

And lol, Specs Hydro Pump does a minimum of 366 damage to no SDef Heatran.

Penguinpal, I've toyed around with the idea of CBMence with Draco Meteor. It sounds pretty good.
 
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