Required to learn gay history?

[Gothitelle.]

I've also been raised this way. Everyone I've been around is conservative.

 

[JimJams]

Being raised a certain way doesn't justify anything. Take some time to think about things with your own mind.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

If the government had no business to combat intolerance, then you tell me why we have the equal protection clause. If there was no need to expand the rights of people of different sexuality, religions, and race then why did we? Because intolerant, hateful people denied people these rights. The government stepped in to help keep people equal as best as possible and I don't see why that can't apply to schools as well.

I'd be glad to explain the Equal Protection clause to you.

The Equal Protection clause of the 14th Amendment prohibits discrimination by the government. It does not prohibit discrimination by private individuals and entities. In fact, private seech that expesses inoleranceis rightfully protected by the first Amendment, as the recent Snyder v. Phelps ruling tells us.

The Equal Protection Clause guarantees equal legal rights. It does not mandate the governmet to go on a social justice crusade to convert the hearts and minds of the people.

 

[Gothitelle.]

I'd be glad to explain the Equal Protection clause to you.

The Equal Protection clause of the 14th Amendment prohibits discrimination by the government. It does not prohibit discrimination by private individuals and entities. In fact, private seech that expesses inoleranceis rightfully protected by the first Amendment, as the recent Snyder v. Phelps ruling tells us.

The Equal Protection Clause guarantees equal legal rights. It does not mandate the governmet to go on a social justice crusade to convert the hearts and minds of the people.

Meaning everyone is treated equal but we are still allowed to have an opinion without the government making us feel bad?

 

[-ty-]

Gothitelle,
That is more of a reason to be open to other people's perspectives; if you are raised a certain way and you don't make any ideologies up for yourself you cannot say that you are right or wrong. If you were raised in the 1700's, and you were part of a plantation family, you would believe slavery is perfectly acceptable. They also used religion as a way to make it acceptable. Because the bible states that slaves shall obey masters whether they be gentle or cruel. So does that make it alright to enslave a person?

I just wish that people like you could be in the shoes of a GLBT person. You take your white, straight, and normative life for granted. Then you would like your country to become more knowledgeable about the truths about gay people. Oh by the way, several religious establishments have skewed the meaning of the bible. It is meant as a guide to ensure a successful society 2000 years ago. They didn't want men sleeping with men because it hindered procreation. Procreation was VITAL in society, but now it has become the downfall of India and china whom have more than 4 billion people, or 2/3 of the world population. Like slavery, it was acceptable and successful in stimulating the economy. But we have been able to do that without the usage of slaves. It's for our society's better good to include black people as equal citizens.

 

[Gothitelle.]

Yes, I do understand that there are many interpretations of the bible. Some still to this day believe in slavery, some don't. I'm not one of those people.

There's somethings I want to clear up about what you said. For one, even though you didn't directly say it, I don't hate gays. You were kinda implying that I did so I wanted to clear that up. I like all people, even gay people. There's an expression I live by: hate the sin, love the sinner. Or in a non religious way: hate the way of life, love the person living it.

Now that I cleared that up, I want to move on to your "I take my white, straight, normative life for granted". I'm kinda offended by that to be honest. Because for one, I'm not 100% white, I'm half black as well as I am half white. That's a stereotype down. Also, I know what it's like to be hated for being different. I've been teased and hated through out my whole school life because of my skin color and my looks. The race thing eventually died down when I was in middle school but the size thing still went on.

So I know what it's like to be teased. So I never take my life for granted. Why would you think I'd do that?

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Meaning everyone is treated equal but we are still allowed to have an opinion without the government making us feel bad?

That is exactly the way it is, and the way it should be.

 

[-ty-]

Yes, I do understand that there are many interpretations of the bible. Some still to this day believe in slavery, some don't. I'm not one of those people.

There's somethings I want to clear up about what you said. For one, even though you didn't directly say it, I don't hate gays. You were kinda implying that I did so I wanted to clear that up. I like all people, even gay people. There's an expression I live by: hate the sin, love the sinner. Or in a non religious way: hate the way of life, love the person living it.

Now that I cleared that up, I want to move on to your "I take my white, straight, normative life for granted". I'm kinda offended by that to be honest. Because for one, I'm not 100% white, I'm half black as well as I am half white. That's a stereotype down. Also, I know what it's like to be hated for being different. I've been teased and hated through out my whole school life because of my skin color and my looks. The race thing eventually died down when I was in middle school but the size thing still went on.

So I know what it's like to be teased. So I never take my life for granted. Why would you think I'd do that?

Really? So you believe there should be tolerance to black people but not gay people? Don't you believe that children should be educated about discrimination about black people how religion was used against them to be enslaved? If so, you should feel the same about gay people. Don't ask for pity about being teased if you are against educating children about gay people it makes you just as bad as those who teased you. People have come up to me and punched me in the face b/c people like you believe that it is a sin to educate children to be accepting of all people. Excuse me for adding race, although you should be more accepting of other minorities. But yes you do take your straight normative life for granted.

 

[Gothitelle.]

That is exactly the way it is, and the way it should be.

I agree.

I discussed this on another forum and my opinion is respected there. But here it's not.

So I will say this for the 1000th time, I'm no gay hater >:[

Maybe I should learn about you know , how they live. I'm not gay, I wouldn't know. I wouldn't know anything on it other than what I hear. That's all I can say.

 

[Margot]

I'd be glad to explain the Equal Protection clause to you.

The Equal Protection clause of the 14th Amendment prohibits discrimination by the government. It does not prohibit discrimination by private individuals and entities. In fact, private seech that expesses inoleranceis rightfully protected by the first Amendment, as the recent Snyder v. Phelps ruling tells us.

The Equal Protection Clause guarantees equal legal rights. It does not mandate the governmet to go on a social justice crusade to convert the hearts and minds of the people.

Exactly. Why the need to make things equal? Because at one point they weren't. And while you're right that it is strictly for legal purposes and can't tell people what to believe, it does prove my point that the government did intervene at one point to stop discrimination at any point. I do think they can make the same change for schools because schools are supposed to foster safe environments for the students attending them, including being discriminated against if you're gay.

Now to your point about "social justice crusades", in relation to this topic about gay history, shouldn't schools allow it then? If they're not supposed to fuel either side of the debate, then why not allow it in schools? It is apart of our history and a lot of important social movements have happened with gay rights. By not allowing schools to teach gay history, they are in fact siding with anti-gay ideals of other people.

 

[-ty-]

I agree.

I discussed this on another forum and my opinion is respected there. But here it's not.

So I will say this for the 1000th time, I'm no gay hater >:[

Maybe I should learn about you know , how they live. I'm not gay, I wouldn't know. I wouldn't know anything on it other than what I hear. That's all I can say.

Your opinion should not be respected if it promotes discrimination and violence!

Can you image how many more black hate crimes would be committed without the presence of acceptance education over the last few decades!!!

 

[Gothitelle.]

I never promoted discrimination and violence. I'm no hater.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Your opinion should not be respected if it promotes discrimination and violence!

Can you image how many more black hate crimes would be committed without the presence of acceptance education over the last few decades!!!

Now that's a dangerous and extreme line of thinking. If we are to censor opinions who disagree with, who is to stop your opinions from being censored when the people you disagree with gain power?

I've also never see black acceptance education. I've seen black history, but not an acceptance course.

 

[-ty-]

I never promoted discrimination and violence. I'm no hater.

You are against educating children to stop violence to gay people, so you are for not educating children so they are violent to gay people.

So...you are promoting violence and discrimination.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Exactly. Why the need to make things equal? Because at one point they weren't. And while you're right that it is strictly for legal purposes and can't tell people what to believe, it does prove my point that the government did intervene at one point to stop discrimination at any point. I do think they can make the same change for schools because schools are supposed to foster safe environments for the students attending them, including being discriminated against if you're gay.

Now to your point about "social justice crusades", in relation to this topic about gay history, shouldn't schools allow it then? If they're not supposed to fuel either side of the debate, then why not allow it in schools? It is apart of our history and a lot of important social movements have happened with gay rights. By not allowing schools to teach gay history, they are in fact siding with anti-gay ideals of other people.

You are against educating children to stop violence to gay people, so you are for not educating children so they are violent to gay people.

So...you are promoting violence and discrimination.

These posts are examples of the typical, fallacious "you're either with us or against us" line of thinking. That type of rhetoric is what pushes people in the middle of supporting LGBT rights away.

 

[-ty-]

Now that's a dangerous and extreme line of thinking. If we are to censor opinions who disagree with, who is to stop your opinions from being censored when the people you disagree with gain power?

I've also never see black acceptance education. I've seen black history, but not an acceptance course.

Who said I censored her opinion. I won't give her any credit in advocating against the prevention of GBLT hate crimes! I was required to take cultural diversity class in high school. We were only taught to accept people based on race, religion, socioeconomic status, gender, impairments, but not sexual orientation. So this is my experience and many other high school do the same, although its not called black acceptance it does explain how bigotry and misinformed people have created negative feelings towards black people. So yes, more schools are apt to teach children about tolerance of the diversity groups I have listed, than GBLT. All schools should teach their students about cultural and diversity misconception so that children like Gothitelle understand that there should be equality for all.

 

[Gothitelle.]

These posts are examples of the typical, fallacious "you're either with us or against us" line of thinking. That type of rhetoric is what pushes people in the middle of support LGBT right away.

Someone else understands!

I understand trying to shed light, but to put it to a point where you are forcing your views on me, not right.

 

[Oryx]

These posts are examples of the typical, fallacious "you're either with us or against us" line of thinking. That type of rhetoric is what pushes people in the middle of support LGBT right away.

Well, there are two options: they can mention LGBT people or not mention them. People on the supporting side want them to mention it, people on the attacking side want them not to. While it's easy for the schools to just go with what was already happening before, as in not mentioning it, that's still taking a side. In a situation like this there really isn't a middle ground.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Interesting. I never was required to take a "diversity and acceptance" course in high school. While a Wrld Cultures course was a 9th grade elective, it was not required. I have nothing wrong with teaching diversity in an unbiased fashion. It's when schools force acceptance on children against their parent's wishes is when I'm up in arms.

 

[-ty-]

These posts are examples of the typical, fallacious "you're either with us or against us" line of thinking. That type of rhetoric is what pushes people in the middle of support LGBT right away.

I am not addressing the middle. Gothitelle has expressed that she is not centrist, she is very much on the right side. She is against me. She does not want to protect LGBT community. IF she stated I have no opinion rather than advocate to prevent discrimination and subsequently, violence toward GLTB people, than I would not have a problem with her. So, yes there is a middle ground how may not support gay people, yet not hinder gay people. She along with others like her hinder efforts to live equal lives.