So what's up with Ash!

[Mudkip85]

As in the evolution fact I will use my fave type. The fire type pokemon that Ash has gain.

In reality Ash's charmander shouldn't have evole if you consider what they show in the show. The charmander is cute and sweet in the anime but never really had any real battle experience before it evole into a charmeleon. Then when it became a charizard you see that it didn't even battle much less leave its pokeball. How could it evole you ask? Then look at Ash's fire type during Johto, Qyndaquil. That little fire pokemon has been in many tough battles under Ash's adventures in Johto. It battle singlehandly against a well trainer Scyter and Steelix plus many more powerful pokemon like a Skarmory and others. If you just add up all those battles it appeared more times then Charmander and thus gaining a lots experience and that could be tell in the battle against Jasmine's Steelix. Now that is looking at the evolution question from your angle about just what we are shown in the anime.

The angle that I am viewing and mostly everybody else is seeing is that Ash's pokemon choose when they want to evolve. It not done by experience or something like that. They evolve after a major battle or something that could result in lots of valueable experience which is the only way experience can be involve with this at all. For some reason Cyndaquil doesn't want to evolve along with Squirtle and other of Ash's pokemon that hasn't evolve. They not weak or inexperience but they just like how things are.

This part of your post really made me realize how correct you are. Cyndaquil faced many tough battles with Ash during its journey through johto and yet still did not evolve into Quiliva. However i do have one suggestion to make. When a pokemon evolves does it loose parts of the relationship it has with its trainer? I mean lets take charmander evolving into charmeleon as you mentioned. Ash's charmander was loving and very loyal to its trainer, and did everything it could to help Ash progress through Kanto. However when it evolved into a charmeleon, it developed a lack of respect for Ash and disobeyed every command it was given, and also when it became a charizard it got worse. I know eventually, charizard developed respect for Ash but they went through some tough times to get there.

So could this be a reason as to why Ash's pokemon may choose not to evolve, because they are afraid to loose the relationship they have between eachother?

~Kipper~

 

[Poké King]

When a pokemon evolves does it loose parts of the relationship it has with its trainer? I mean lets take charmander evolving into charmeleon as you mentioned. Ash's charmander was loving and very loyal to its trainer, and did everything it could to help Ash progress through Kanto. However when it evolved into a charmeleon, it developed a lack of respect for Ash and disobeyed every command it was given, and also when it became a charizard it got worse. I know eventually, charizard developed respect for Ash but they went through some tough times to get there.

So could this be a reason as to why Ash's pokemon may choose not to evolve, because they are afraid to loose the relationship they have between eachother?

~Kipper~

Well, in the Anime it has been brought up here and there that when a Pokémon evolves because it evolves into a totally new being it often will develop a totally different personality therefore act different though this doesn't always happen obviously as seen with Ash's Chikorita. So because of this when Charmander evolved it went from caring to plain disrepectful as Charmeleon. Another good example of this is Brock's Lotad, it starts off nice & caring then evolved into Lombre becoming very relaxed and a bit lazy-ish then evolved into Ludicolo and became the life of the party.

Does the evolving of a Pokémon change there relationship with there Trainer, its a bit of a yes and no answer because even if a Pokémon's personality changes they can still like there Trainer just as much as before they evolved but at the same time when a Pokémon evolves it becomes a new person therefore there relationship is bound to change with there Trainer. A perfect example is when you were a kid you and your parents relationship was different but when you grow up (i.e. Pokémon evolving) you changed so you & your parents relationship changed somewhat or severly depending on how much you & they changed over time. So maybe its not a yes & no answer and its simply yes Pokémon evolving can change there relationship with there Trainer though it doesn't always happen.

As for that being the reason they don't evolve, I don't think so as it may be just about not wanting to change like how Bulbasaur and Pikachu didn't want to evolve when the opportunity presented itself because they wanted to stay who they were. I mean you do have to realize when you ask a Pokémon to evolve its like someone one day asking you to change into a 30 year old and obviously you probably wouldn't want to do that as you want to enjoy being a kid or whatever.

 

[Mudkip85]

Well, in the Anime it has been brought up here and there that when a Pokémon evolves because it evolves into a totally new being it often will develop a totally different personality therefore act different though this doesn't always happen obviously as seen with Ash's Chikorita. So because of this when Charmander evolved it went from caring to plain disrepectful as Charmeleon.

I understand totally where you are coming from when you say that pokemon want to stay as they are because they like who they are and would not want to risk the loss of the relationship they have with their trainer, but if thats the case i have to ask why on earth did charmander evolve? I mean it had everything going for it, it respected its trainer and its trainer respected it and they had a great powerful relationship. So why would it choose the risk of loosing all this by evolving. I have one sort of theory which could potentially answer this. Do you remember the first episode when we saw and met charmander where it was abandoned by its trainer and left weak and hurt in the rain, in a terrible condition and Ash came and rescued it? Well i think the only possible explanation why charmander evolved was to ever prevent this from happenning again, as by evolving it would become physically stronger so it could protect itself if anything like that were to have happened again. This way charmander who became charmeleon, although loosing its relationship and trust with Ash, was now able to protect itself, if any harm were to come to it. I think that my explanation also provides a strong arguement as to why it quickly evolved to charizard soon after its evoltion to charmeleon.

~Kipper~

 

[Poké King]

but if thats the case i have to ask why on earth did charmander evolve? I mean it had everything going for it, it respected its trainer and its trainer respected it and they had a great powerful relationship. So why would it choose the risk of loosing all this by evolving. I have one sort of theory which could potentially answer this. Do you remember the first episode when we saw and met charmander where it was abandoned by its trainer and left weak and hurt in the rain, in a terrible condition and Ash came and rescued it? Well i think the only possible explanation why charmander evolved was to ever prevent this from happenning again, as by evolving it would become physically stronger so it could protect itself if anything like that were to have happened again. This way charmander who became charmeleon, although loosing its relationship and trust with Ash, was now able to protect itself, if any harm were to come to it. I think that my explanation also provides a strong arguement as to why it quickly evolved to charizard soon after its evoltion to charmeleon.

~Kipper~

Well, Pokémon can't always determine when the will evolve just like you can't determine how you will change in 10 years. Like in the Anime there have been cases of Pokémon sensing there going to evolve and begin to act differently as a result, now maybe some can stop themselves from changing and maybe some can't as seen by Ash's Bulbasaur who stopped itself from becoming Ivysaur. Besides maybe Charmander thought he wouldn't change and maybe he evolved because he wanted to be stronger for Ash as his previous Trainer abandoned him because he deemed him weak therefore didn't want Ash to do the same then when he did evolve maybe he thought I did all this for him, I changed my entire self for him and inturn grew to resent Ash therefore reacted the way he did as Charmeleon. And when he evolved into Charizard it may have had more to do with becoming stronger to beat Aerodactly but luckily in time Charizard figured out that Ash trully cared about him and would never leave him at least in terms of general abandonment because as we know Ash did leave Charizard in Charicific Valley though Charizard understood why Ash did so because Ash wanted him to become stronger and as he wanted to be stronger for Ash he stayed plus getting his butt kicked by one of the Charizard's there made him want to get stronger to.

Well, didn't I go a little deep into Charmander's psyche lol. :P

 

[Forci Stikane]

I'm not really debating with anyone, but I need to prove something



From Wikipedia:

The English adaptation of the series was produced by 4Kids Entertainment (for eight seasons), with video distribution of the series was handled by Viz for the TV series for the younger generation as well as the eighth movie forward, Kids WB! and Nintendo for the first three movies and the first special, Miramax Films, and Buena Vista Home Entertainment for the fourth movie through the seventh. The series and all feature films are directed by Kunihiko Yuyama, with English adaptations originally written by Norman Grossfeld and Michael Haigney. However, starting with the ninth season, the American branch of The Pokémon Company, Pokémon USA, replaced 4Kids as the show producers and distributors outside of Japan, and the program has a new voice cast.

Yeah... Domo Arigato :tired:

Thank you. There you go, darth robert (or whatever your name was).

This part of your post really made me realize how correct you are. Cyndaquil faced many tough battles with Ash during its journey through johto and yet still did not evolve into Quiliva. However i do have one suggestion to make. When a pokemon evolves does it loose parts of the relationship it has with its trainer? I mean lets take charmander evolving into charmeleon as you mentioned. Ash's charmander was loving and very loyal to its trainer, and did everything it could to help Ash progress through Kanto. However when it evolved into a charmeleon, it developed a lack of respect for Ash and disobeyed every command it was given, and also when it became a charizard it got worse. I know eventually, charizard developed respect for Ash but they went through some tough times to get there.

Well, that's an interesting idea...but I think it has more to do with how Charmander was..."preowned" when Ash caught him. After all, we've had some of Ash's other Pokemon evolve and stay the same personality-wise (Bayleef, Donphan, Sceptile)...or perhaps it was just a freak accident. Or maybe Charmander had a rebellious Nature that didn't manafest itself until it evolved :).

 

[Scarlet Weather]

Umm.... this was a fun discussion, but now I'm just a little bit sick. Jeez, I don't even follow the anime for the most part, and yet I'm sick. Okay, let's start things off congratulating the brilliant.

Okay as we have already stated in this thread, Ash may not be the best trainer there is, but he has at least one two major leagues. You also have to bare in mind that if he was just made to win everything by the writers, people would get very bored extremley quickly and would refrain from watching the shows. It also adds a bit of drama to the show and shows that you can never win everything. If the company dare i say it get rid of Ash and introduce a new main character to the show, they would be taking a huge risk a people might watch the first couple of episodes and decide that the new character is worse, then there would be no turning back! We have had about 12 seasons so far of the anime and it would be very pointless to just loose everything the company has created with Ash. Ash's dismisal would also mean the dismisal of the 'signature' of the show pikachu, and im sure that everyone would be annoyed to see him go. Sure the ratings are low now, but as diamond and pearl episodes are released in the U.S and the U.K, and every other country for that matter that hosts pokemon, they are almost certain to get back up.

Hear, hear. D/P is probably an attempt to change the series a bit, I think, since Ash seems more like a "side character" than a main character to me- but I've only seen one D/P episode in its entirety, so what would I know? (Sorry, just being random here.)


Ren-Kun: You nutcase. Do not insinuate that Ash is gay. Give me one shred of conclusive evidence, and then say that he and Gary are gay. Ash is, in my eyes, fairly obviously heterosexual, though he might possibly suffer from an odd mental condition that causes him to be attracted to female Pokemon. (I'm not sure at all about the last one, I just entertain the idea because it helps me enjoy the series.)

Poke_King: I believe I have the answer as to why Ash does not catch all of the Pokemon he encounters. It is stated in the Japanese version, in the episode where Charmander is caught to be precise, that Ash only wants to capture rare or unusual Pokemon. All others are sort of "bonus catches", and I believe are usually caught by Ash because they want to be. Also, in the series it is shown, but never stated outright, I believe, that while Gary's team is more balanced because of his constant switching of Pokemon in order to give them all equal battling experience, Ash's team has a much deeper bond with their trainer because of the time they spend together. "Oaking" all of his Pokemon is only done for change of season purposes, and is slightly out of character for Ash. (At least with Johto they gave an explanation as to why some of his Pokemon left the team. In Hoenn, it was just Ash being a dingus. It annoys me that he is, but I can live with it.)

 

[Mudkip85]

Okay, let's start things off congratulating the brilliant.

Well what can i say thanks for the compliment XD.

Ren-Kun: You nutcase. Do not insinuate that Ash is gay. Give me one shred of conclusive evidence, and then say that he and Gary are gay. Ash is, in my eyes, fairly obviously heterosexual, though he might possibly suffer from an odd mental condition that causes him to be attracted to female Pokemon. (I'm not sure at all about the last one, I just entertain the idea because it helps me enjoy the series.)

Ren-Kun, i have to say your original post of direct critisiscm and abuse to Ash was slightly out of line. Although it may be your view of him, you must give valid reasons as to why you have those specific views of him.

Poke_King: Ash's team has a much deeper bond with their trainer because of the time they spend together. "Oaking" all of his Pokemon is only done for change of season purposes, and is slightly out of character for Ash.

I agree with you Ash certainly has a deeper closer bond with his pokemon than any other trainer in the anime, and it is this what makes him overcome those hard challenges. As for 'Oaking' his pokemon to give change at the beginning of each of the seasons new beginnings, i think its a great idea. Especially now that he has gone to Sinnoh and only has pikachu and aipom with him. It's going to be interesting to see how he forms his new team in this region.

~Kipper

 

[Poké King]

Poke_King: I believe I have the answer as to why Ash does not catch all of the Pokemon he encounters. It is stated in the Japanese version, in the episode where Charmander is caught to be precise, that Ash only wants to capture rare or unusual Pokemon. All others are sort of "bonus catches", and I believe are usually caught by Ash because they want to be.

So the reason he doesn't capture Pokémon a lot is because he only wants to capture rare and unusual Pokémon. Lets review his Pokémon and see the levity of that statement:

(Note: I only included Pokémon he actually captured so no Pikachu or any of the others he didn't capture and used. Not that any of them were really rare or unusual either)

Aipom
Mukjuru
Naetle
Bulbasaur
Krabby
Muk
Tauros
Snorlax
Heracross
Chikorita
Cyndaquil
Totodile
Noctowl
Phanpy
Taillow
Treecko
Corphish
Torkoal
Snorunt
Charmander
Squirtle
Caterpie
Pidgeotto
Mankey

Now I was gonna do a blurb for all of them but I had to keep copying and pasting not rare and not unusual so I decided not to lol. Of those Pokémon the only one that really stands out as rare and/or unusual is Snorlax, the rest are relatively common.

So if the only reason he captures Pokémon is because there rare and/or unusual then how does Ash have any Pokémon lol.

 

[Scarlet Weather]

Umm.. dude. More then half of these are rare and unusual. Let's start:

Starter Pokemon (all): No dip they're rare! Gamewise, you can't even find them in the wild, and the characters in the anime are lucky for even getting to see a wild one, let alone catch it!

Tauros: They are so annoying... in the games you can never catch them. That makes them rare.

Noctowl: SHINY! SHINY YOU DOPE!

Phanphy: It hatched from an egg Ash got from an old couple, so he never even really caught this one- besides, it's a Donphan now.

Mankey: It attacked him. Need I say more?

Torkoal: Fairly uncommon in the games.

Pidgeotto: Ash caught this in the early episodes, before he stated that he only wanted rare or unusual Pokemon.

Corphish: Caught because it attacked Ash, and he decided he wanted a Pokemon with that type of strength for his team.

Heracross: Fairly uncommon in the G/S/C games, which were the latest ones in the season that Heracross was caught.

Mukkuru: Caught because Aipom attacked it.

Aipom: Caught because it wanted to come with Ash... and it is a bit unusual.

Snorunt: Rare In-Game Pokemon.

Tailow: Caught because it would have been seriously injured if Ash had allowed it to continue battling Pikachu.

Snorlax: There are only two catchable ones in the game (One in G/S/C). No dip it's rare!

So there you have it- my reply to yours. And anyway, since in the original Japanese Ash himself is the one who states that he only wants rare or unusual Pokemon, you don't need to check the levity of my statement, unless of course you want to argue with Ash.

 

[Mudkip85]

Umm.. dude. More then half of these are rare and unusual. Let's start:Tauros: They are so annoying... in the games you can never catch them. That makes them rare.

You have raised many valid points as to why Ash's pokemon may be seen as rare or unusual, but you are forgetting one major thing this conversation is relating to the anime not the games, therefore you could not compare the rarity of the pokemon form the games to the anime as it does not correspond. Example you said Tauros were extremley rare and hard to capture in the games, but as we are relaitng to the anime, you can not really say they are rare or even hard to capture as Ash managed to capture 30 of them, so therefore tauros wouldnt be seen to be something special.

Mankey: It attacked him. Need I say more?

I dont see how that makes it rare or unusual as mankeys are known for there bad tempered nature.

Torkoal: Fairly uncommon in the games.

Again you are refering to the games which does not relate to the conversation as we are talking about the anime.

Heracross: Fairly uncommon in the G/S/C games, which were the latest ones in the season that Heracross was caught.

Once again refering to the games!

Aipom: Caught because it wanted to come with Ash... and it is a bit unusual.

Many of Ash's pokemon have wanted to come with him so i dont see how it makes them rare or unusual.

Snorunt: Rare In-Game Pokemon.

In games not necassarily in the anime.

Snorlax: There are only two catchable ones in the game (One in G/S/C). No dip it's rare!

Games yes anime no! As we have seen quite a few snorlax throughout the shows.

The rest of the pokemon you gave explanations for i can agree with you on but i think that in conclusion Ash's pokemon may be tough, loyal and respectful, but just not that rare.

~Kipper~

 

[Poké King]

Starter Pokemon (all): No dip they're rare! Gamewise, you can't even find them in the wild, and the characters in the anime are lucky for even getting to see a wild one, let alone catch it!

Um Starters are not rare or unusual, if they were they wouldn't be Starters because to be able to give every Trainer certain Pokémon then they have to be in abundance or else you couldn't do it and there not unusual because every Trainers has gotten one pretty much.

Tauros: They are so annoying... in the games you can never catch them. That makes them rare.

Ya and Ash caught 30 with ease, if that screams rare and unusual then Pidgey is a damn legendary lol.

Noctowl: SHINY! SHINY YOU DOPE!

Ya it was a Shiny but Noctowl normally isn't rare or unusual but I'll give you Noctowl just because it sparkles lol.

Phanphy: It hatched from an egg Ash got from an old couple, so he never even really caught this one- besides, it's a Donphan now.

Ya I forgot lol but still its not rare or unusual so it doesn't matter.

Mankey: It attacked him. Need I say more?

Ya it attacked him so?

Torkoal: Fairly uncommon in the games.

Ya in the game, talking about the Anime here.

Pidgeotto: Ash caught this in the early episodes, before he stated that he only wanted rare or unusual Pokemon.

Ya but one can assume that he thought that way before stating it besides Pidgeotoo isn't rare or unusual in either the game or the Anime.

Corphish: Caught because it attacked Ash, and he decided he wanted a Pokemon with that type of strength for his team.

So because it was decently strong its unusual lol.

Heracross: Fairly uncommon in the G/S/C games, which were the latest ones in the season that Heracross was caught.

Doesn't matter how rare they are in the game we are talking about the Anime.

Mukkuru: Caught because Aipom attacked it.

Mukkuru is just like Taillow.

Aipom: Caught because it wanted to come with Ash... and it is a bit unusual.

How it is unusual for a Pokémon to want to come with you, going by that logic practically all Ash's Pokémon be unusual because that's how he gets most of them lol.

Snorunt: Rare In-Game Pokemon.

Ya in game maybe but the in the Anime its questionable.

Tailow: Caught because it would have been seriously injured if Ash had allowed it to continue battling Pikachu.

So then your saying its not rare and/or unusual because its not, its the Pidgey version of the Hoenn Region.

Snorlax: There are only two catchable ones in the game (One in G/S/C). No dip it's rare!

Ya in the game there rare but in the Anime there not that rare though I will say I haven't seen too many in the Anime so there sorta rare and/or unusual though I previously said Snorlax was the only one who stood out as possibly being rare and/or unusual.

So there you have it- my reply to yours. And anyway, since in the original Japanese Ash himself is the one who states that he only wants rare or unusual Pokemon, you don't need to check the levity of my statement, unless of course you want to argue with Ash.

Checking the levity of the statement was not to check if he said it but just how truthful was the statement by his actions, ya he may of said it but is it true. No its not or else he have practically no Pokémon because none of his Pokémon are really rare and/or unusual.

You have raised many valid points as to why Ash's pokemon may be seen as rare or unusual, but you are forgetting one major thing this conversation is relating to the anime not the games, therefore you could not compare the rarity of the pokemon form the games to the anime as it does not correspond. Example you said Tauros were extremley rare and hard to capture in the games, but as we are relaitng to the anime, you can not really say they are rare or even hard to capture as Ash managed to capture 30 of them, so therefore tauros wouldnt be seen to be something special.

Ya in the games lots of his Pokémon could be considered rare and/or unusual but in the Anime there far from rare and/or unusual which was my point as this is not about the game its about the Anime. Oh and thanks for telling him what's what Mudkip85 while I wasn't here to do so myself lol.

 

[Forci Stikane]

I dont see how that makes it rare or unusual as mankeys are known for there bad tempered nature.

In the case of Snorlax and Mankey (and more than that, I believe) Ash captured them because he had to. Mankey--sorry, I mean PRIMEAPE (he never caught it as a Mankey, remember? Geez, what dummy got that wrong...oh, THAT dummy) was chasing after Ash and wasn't going to let him go, so Ash had to fight and catch it to get it to stop (yeah, doesn't exactly make sense to me either, but that's what happened). And Snorlax was eating all the food on a bunch of islands, so Ash caught it to protect the people there from anymore attacks (and Snorlax can swim, so I'd call it pretty unusual).

A few others:

Torkoal: He was impressed by it going to the Valley of Steel (or whatever it was called) and trying to fight the Steelix there.

Pidgeotto: Pre-statement and he was partly trying to prove Misty wrong (they were having an argument and she insulted his ability or something)

Caterpie: Misty wasn't going to stop screaming otherwise XP. ...Seriously, though, that was pre-statement as well.

Starters: Yes, they're rare. I can't think of a single time that they showed a wild Charmander (except for his, of course). And as for Squirtle & Bulbasaur, I only remember seeing them shown in the wild a couple of times through the WHOLE SERIES. If that doesn't shout rare, I don't know what does. Oh, and Ash had wanted them in the first place, but couldn't get them because he slept late, so you can also chalk it up to that.

Taillow: Caught FOR ITS OWN GOOD. Its health was at risk, for pete's sake.

So, yeah, he's gone against his statement, but that was usually because the Pokemon attacked HIM (or, as is apparently the case of Mukkuru, he got dragged into it), so it doesn't count.

 

[Poké King]

In the case of Snorlax and Mankey (and more than that, I believe) Ash captured them because he had to. Mankey--sorry, I mean PRIMEAPE (he never caught it as a Mankey, remember? Geez, what dummy got that wrong...oh, THAT dummy) was chasing after Ash and wasn't going to let him go, so Ash had to fight and catch it to get it to stop (yeah, doesn't exactly make sense to me either, but that's what happened).

You talk about me trying to start an argument and you call someone a dummy and technically when Ash decided to capture Mankey it was a Mankey at the time but before he actually began the process of capturing him it evolved. So technically he initially was going after a Mankey and ya it evolved before capture but all that matters is origninal intent.

And Snorlax was eating all the food on a bunch of islands, so Ash caught it to protect the people there from anymore attacks (and Snorlax can swim, so I'd call it pretty unusual).

Ya but last I checked any of them could of captured Snorlax after it was put to sleep, a little baby could of done it lol. And last I checked swimming isn't unusual unless its a Pokémon that either doesn't work well with water or its a Pokémon you wouldn't expect to swim well like a bird or bug like Beautifly or something.

A few others:

Torkoal: He was impressed by it going to the Valley of Steel (or whatever it was called) and trying to fight the Steelix there.

Ya and what about it, it was a Pokémon trying to fight another Pokémon. What's rare or unusual about that?

Pidgeotto: Pre-statement and he was partly trying to prove Misty wrong (they were having an argument and she insulted his ability or something)

Actually he wasn't trying to prove anything to Misty, he just wanted to capture it but after being incompitent by just throwing a Poké Ball at it then he wanted to prove to Misty he was a good Trainer course he then selected Caterpie to do so which proved he furthermore was a bad Trainer. And as I said pre-statement captures don't matter because he probably had the idea in his head all along.

Caterpie: Misty wasn't going to stop screaming otherwise XP. ...Seriously, though, that was pre-statement as well.

Ya or they could of just walked away lol besides Ash wanted to capture it, it just so happen if he didn't capture it fast she keep on screaming.

Starters: Yes, they're rare. I can't think of a single time that they showed a wild Charmander (except for his, of course). And as for Squirtle & Bulbasaur, I only remember seeing them shown in the wild a couple of times through the WHOLE SERIES. If that doesn't shout rare, I don't know what does. Oh, and Ash had wanted them in the first place, but couldn't get them because he slept late, so you can also chalk it up to that.

Ya there so rare that every Trainer in the world has had one practically lol. And we probably don't see them much in the Anime because it take the perceived specialness they have on them for being Starters away. And last I checked in Charicific Valley there were a ton of Charizard proving there at one point were a ton of Charmander and I could go on but why when I was right before you made your statement lol.

Taillow: Caught FOR ITS OWN GOOD. Its health was at risk, for pete's sake.

Ya but once again any of them could of captured it at that point.

So, yeah, he's gone against his statement, but that was usually because the Pokemon attacked HIM (or, as is apparently the case of Mukkuru, he got dragged into it), so it doesn't count.

Well, last I checked plenty of Pokémon attacked Ash in the Anime but he never tried to capture them like the Spearow and Beedrill in the first few episodes.

 

[Forci Stikane]

You talk about me trying to start an argument and you call someone a dummy and technically when Ash decided to capture Mankey it was a Mankey at the time but before he actually began the process of capturing him it evolved. So technically he initially was going after a Mankey and ya it evolved before capture but all that matters is origninal intent.


Ya but last I checked any of them could of captured Snorlax after it was put to sleep, a little baby could of done it lol. And last I checked swimming isn't unusual unless its a Pokémon that either doesn't work well with water or its a Pokémon you wouldn't expect to swim well like a bird or bug like Beautifly or something.

Aside: Or one that weighs a lot...

Ya and what about it, it was a Pokémon trying to fight another Pokémon. What's rare or unusual about that?


Actually he wasn't trying to prove anything to Misty, he just wanted to capture it but after being incompitent by just throwing a Poké Ball at it then he wanted to prove to Misty he was a good Trainer course he then selected Caterpie to do so which proved he furthermore was a bad Trainer. And as I said pre-statement captures don't matter because he probably had the idea in his head all along.

Aside: *GASP* A supposition!!

Ya or they could of just walked away lol besides Ash wanted to capture it, it just so happen if he didn't capture it fast she keep on screaming.


Ya there so rare that every Trainer in the world has had one practically lol. And we probably don't see them much in the Anime because it take the perceived specialness they have on them for being Starters away. And last I checked in Charicific Valley there were a ton of Charizard proving there at one point were a ton of Charmander and I could go on but why when I was right before you made your statement lol.

Aside: And yet AGAIN characteristics of those scum pop up...

Ya but once again any of them could of captured it at that point.


Well, last I checked plenty of Pokémon attacked Ash in the Anime but he never tried to capture them like the Spearow and Beedrill in the first few episodes.

............

I'm done trying to talk with you.

Of course, if anyone else would like to talk about it, then great. I just don't want to try talking to a brick wall...

 

[Poké King]

Of course, if anyone else would like to talk about it, then great. I just don't want to try talking to a brick wall...

Um let me see I prove you wrong about Mankey, I say Starters aren't rare which there not as explained before and ya Snorlax is heavy which means he has the strength to carry that weight therefore be able to swim.

And you don't want to talk to me anymore because I am proving what you say is wrong most if not all the time and I'm the brick wall. If your right then I will tell you but if your gonna say something wrong like Starters being rare I'm not gonna just sit back and make anyone who reads this who doesn't know the truth believe such a lie. Besides in the end I can admit when I am wrong, just ask Mudkip85 as I admitted to making a mistake from something he said yet no where in this thread have you said you were wrong about something even though you been repeatedly wrong and I am the brick wall remember lol.


Oh and if I'm scum or whatever you meant for me saying I was right, considering you just called someone a dummy for something they were right on I wouldn't be taking the morale high ground. And how interesting you didn't comment on when I said you insulted someone lol. I guess you didn't want to further show how you like to insult people.


In the end if I am wrong I'll admit it, if I am right I will admit it, if someone is right I will admit it and if someone is wrong I will admit it. Oh and you mentioned me saying probably and how bad it was or something, thats funny considering most of your post in this thread has been speculation but whatever.

 

[Mudkip85]

Torkoal: He was impressed by it going to the Valley of Steel (or whatever it was called) and trying to fight the Steelix there.

Okay so Ask may have been impressed but does that make it rare or unusual? Okay its a steelix so what lets not forget that steelix which is a steel type is weak against fire types so if anything it prooves that Torkoal was pretty weak as it was having difficulties beating a type where it should have a clear advantage.

Caterpie: Misty wasn't going to stop screaming otherwise XP. ...Seriously, though, that was pre-statement as well.

As Poke King said they could of just walked on, but it was Ash's first chance at catching his first pokemon, so it probably was special for him but in reality its a caterpie which is not rare at all, as its found in many places such as all the forests in the anime.

Starters: Yes, they're rare. I can't think of a single time that they showed a wild Charmander (except for his, of course). And as for Squirtle & Bulbasaur, I only remember seeing them shown in the wild a couple of times through the WHOLE SERIES. If that doesn't shout rare, I don't know what does. Oh, and Ash had wanted them in the first place, but couldn't get them because he slept late, so you can also chalk it up to that.

Charific valley has already been brought to the conversation by Poke King and its true that there must be many trainers that own a charizard considering the amount there are there, therefore charmander for one would not be seen as rare. However for other starters i would agree with you as its tru that they do not appear in the wild that often in the anime.

Taillow: Caught FOR ITS OWN GOOD. Its health was at risk, for pete's sake.

Does that make it unusual or rare?

~Kipper~

 

[Scarlet Weather]

Jeez... by the way, Ash captured a herd of Tauros. Once. It was a parody of Tauros's rareness in the games. By the way, I can tell you one thing- have you noticed that very few trainers in the show own a Pokemon that is of the same species as one of Ash's? Heracross and a few others do not show up at all in the rest of the series except under Ash's ownership. Anyway, trainers get starter Pokemon because starters are incredibly rare in the wild- it is shown in the Advanced Generation episode with Old Man Mudkip that starters given out by proffesors are bred for the most part. Besides, I'm fairly sure that the Charific Valley Charizard do not all belong to one trainer- they're mostly Charizard left there by other trainers to battle and get stronger. To top it off, I've noticed that Ash's Pokemon do have paralells when it comes to rarity in the games. Did you notice that? I did. Oh, and next time you reply to my posts, do us all a favor and do it from a neutral viewpoint. It helps. My views on Ash are that he is a horrible main character, needs more depth, and could be improved greatly, but he is not a complete and total illogical freak. If he were to disappear entirely, I'd feel a bit sad. Go figure.

Oh, and another thing- we're acting like Ash made some unbreakable pledge when he said that he'd only wanted rare or unusual Pokemon. Perhaps he just meant Pokemon he liked, or Pokemon that impressed him in some way. I personally still think going into a valley filled with giant steel monster-like things would be scary, especially if I was only a foot tall or so and didn't have anyone to back me up if I got hurt. Tailow in unusual btw- it can withstand electrical attacks. Top that. And you cannot use answers that are speculative without backing them up. Evidence, please! I had some. I showed it. Dispute the evidence if you don't agree. This is becoming more of an argument about "Is Ash an Idiot?" then "Why Does Ash Act Like This?".

 

[Poké King]

Okay so Ask may have been impressed but does that make it rare or unusual? Okay its a steelix so what lets not forget that steelix which is a steel type is weak against fire types so if anything it prooves that Torkoal was pretty weak as it was having difficulties beating a type where it should have a clear advantage.

Ya exactly, it was so weak even Type Advantage didn't help it out but I am surprised at you Mudkip85 as you often are a propenent of saying Type Advantage doesn't matter as seen in the Gym thread we participated in.

As Poke King said they could of just walked on, but it was Ash's first chance at catching his first pokemon, so it probably was special for him but in reality its a caterpie which is not rare at all, as its found in many places such as all the forests in the anime.

Ya because if Caterpie is rare and unusual then what is Magikarp a legendary lol.

However for other starters i would agree with you as its tru that they do not appear in the wild that often in the anime.

~Kipper~

Like I said before the reason we don't see them a lot is probably to make them seem special because there Starters because think about it if every Trainer we saw had one then there wouldn't be that many die hard fans of them because who wants to be a fan of something that is super common.

By the way, I can tell you one thing- have you noticed that very few trainers in the show own a Pokemon that is of the same species as one of Ash's? Heracross and a few others do not show up at all in the rest of the series except under Ash's ownership.

Like with the Starters that is also probably like that to make Ash's Pokémon seem special where as proven by what has been said the last few pages there not.

Anyway, trainers get starter Pokemon because starters are incredibly rare in the wild- it is shown in the Advanced Generation episode with Old Man Mudkip that starters given out by proffesors are bred for the most part. Besides, I'm fairly sure that the Charific Valley Charizard do not all belong to one trainer- they're mostly Charizard left there by other trainers to battle and get stronger.

In the Charicific Valley none of the Charizard belong to any Trainers, there all wild. Except for Ash's Charizard and Liza's Charizard Charla of course. Oh and even if Starters are rare in the wild by being specially bred and that most Trainers in the world have them they are inturn not rare because so many Trainers have them. An example of why there not rare is this: Say Magikarp were in reality rare but then one day someone made a bunch of them and placed them all around the world, in time through mating they became abundant. Point is even though they were rare at first because of them being spread across the world and breeding they become common just like Starters may be rare at first but as they are given to all Trainers pretty much they inturn become common and though there not common in the wild they still are common in the respect that there are so many held by most Trainers. That was a bit convoluted but I think my point go across.

Oh, and another thing- we're acting like Ash made some unbreakable pledge when he said that he'd only wanted rare or unusual Pokemon.

I'm not, I was really just responding to what someone said.

Perhaps he just meant Pokemon he liked, or Pokemon that impressed him in some way. I personally still think going into a valley filled with giant steel monster-like things would be scary, especially if I was only a foot tall or so and didn't have anyone to back me up if I got hurt.

So being brave means your unusual?

Tailow in unusual btw- it can withstand electrical attacks. Top that. And you cannot use answers that are speculative without backing them up. Evidence, please! I had some. I showed it. Dispute the evidence if you don't agree. This is becoming more of an argument about "Is Ash an Idiot?" then "Why Does Ash Act Like This?".

In the Anime the reason Tailow can resist Electric Type Moves is because of its determination not because it being special. And since you like proof so much I just reviewed the episode in which Tailow was captured by Ash. Brock even mentioned in the episode the Electric attacks took effect and it was that Tailow just wouldn't give up that caused it to keep fighting. And that was the reason Ash caught it in the first place because if it kept going if not stopped it be hurt severely as Brock also mentioned. Think about it like this, in Naruto when Gaara and Rock Lee battled he got up after being messed up severely by sheer will power even though his body was shot to hell which is why the battle was stopped because if it wasn't he may of died.

 

[Mudkip85]

This is becoming more of an argument about "Is Ash an Idiot?" then "Why Does Ash Act Like This?".

Let me just start by saying we do not have arguments here its simply our views being expressed and our critisicsms to other people's views.

Jeez... by the way, Ash captured a herd of Tauros. Once. It was a parody of Tauros's rareness in the games. By the way, I can tell you one thing- have you noticed that very few trainers in the show own a Pokemon that is of the same species as one of Ash's? Heracross and a few others do not show up at all in the rest of the series except under Ash's ownership.

Just think about it for a second, if the writers were to give other trainers the same pokemon, sure it would make it easier for them as it would mean less work for them to do. But thank goodness that this is not the case as it would be very boring for audiences to see the same type pokemon battling eachother. It would also have been a waste of time for the creators if they did not use all the pokemon they designed in the anime, so thats why nearly every other trainer has different pokemon show that they can show off all their creations making the anime interesting, although we do occassionly see the odd trainer with the same pokemon. Another possible explanation for trainers not usually having the same pokemn, is the fact because the anime was designed for a very young aged target audience so if the trainers who had the same pokemon used the exact same pokemon in a battle, it could make it extremeley confusing as to which is which and soo on, so by nearly making two trainers engage in battle with different pokemon makes a clear distinguish for the little ones to understand.

~Kipper~

 

[Lil-Dill]

LMFAO PIKACHU IZ A ****!!! xD. Well thats very wrong. Ash can sometimes get on my nerves even though im 12 im in the appropriate age group to watch this but also what can really bug me iz Team Rockets modo. Really, I bet even the people who play Jesse n James' voices must get tired of saying the same thing for a long time. But now they've changed it up they actually start to rhyme better which iz impressive in way cause it doesnt get on my neves no more!