Transgender

[-ty-]

Transgender Rights

Should more states create legislation to combat anti-transgender behaviors?

Transgender people are often ridiculed and/or harassed by some heterosexuals and even by some homosexuals without the ability to take any legal actions to protect their rights; sadly, we live in a fairly judgmental world. Only 13 states provide legislation to protect transgender people from discrimination at work, housing placement, custodianship, public bathroom access, and a whole lot more. Some opponents of anti-gender discrimination claim that such legislation would call for all unisex bathrooms, and/or their religious rights are being encroached upon. First of all, after the legalities are settled, a transgender person is permitted to only use a facility that is designated for whichever gender they associate themselves with. Secondly, transgender people should be able to do as they please with their image and lifestyle as long as it is not directly harmful to someone; I doubt that anyone's religious freedoms will be taken away just because they cannot discriminate against them!

Should government health insurance cover sex-change operations, body modification surgery, and hormone therapies?

The American Psychological Associations generally believes that the above therapies and surgeries are vital for a transgender person to overcome severe psychological issues that arise from what has been deemed Gender Identity Disorder. Many insurances will not pay for these remedies, superciliously viewing the operations as frivolous and unnecessary for health. I believe that insurance should pay for the operations since these surgeries and therapies could be vital for a transgender person's mental health - which is kinda important!


PLEASE

-NO FLAMING
-BE RESPECTFUL
-IF ANYONE IS RUDE; INFORM LIVE_WIRE, NOT THE OTHER PERSON!

This is NOT about the morality of transgender people, but whether or not there should be anti-discrimination rights/insurance coverage.

THANK YOU! ENJOY THE HEALTHY DISCUSSION! :)​

 

[Klippy]

There shouldn't be any discrimination no matter how you look at it; I think there needs to simply be an anti-hate law that encompasses all types of people. White, black, straight, LGBT, Christian, Muslim and everything in between. That's a whole lot to wish for, but really, everyone should just leave everyone else alone. It bothers me when groups demand crosses or American flags be taken off someone's private property because it might "offend someone" just as much as it bothers me when anyone is bullied for any reason, sexuality or otherwise.

 

[Blue Nocturne]

There should certainly be something in place to combat Anti-Transgender behaviour, just as there is for pretty much everyone else. I agree with Klippy that there should just be an all-encompassing "anti-hate" kind of thing. That doesn't exclude anyone, which is what we really need, as opposed to a reactionary "Stop bullying these specific people" kind of measure.

Should government health insurance cover sex-change operations, body modification surgery, and hormone therapies?
In special cases where it's quite clear cases of Gender Identity Disorder is leading to other serious mental, and possibly physical, health issues... than yes. But generally, I wouldn't think it's financially viable to offer up sex-changes for free.

 

[Phantom1]

OK I am going to look like a insert-censored-word here but.

People put too much into this transgender thing sometimes. I admit there are legal and numerous other issues that need to be resolved. But sometimes people are too touchy.

Ooops I called someone trans instead of transwoman or whatever they say I should have called them. Thing is it's too complicated half the freaking time and being politically right has to have some, I don't know, loophole or something. If people like that are so persnickity.... did I spell that right?... about crap like that then maybe they are overreacting... Just a little...


People need to accept that there are different parts of the world and different people who talk differently. And they may not necessarily being rude or mean, it may be just what they call it. No particular reason.

And begin the Phantom hate.

 

[BareBones]

Oh definitely. Just as much as there should be anti-racism things. But as the other two stated, just making an anti-hate thing that covers every kind of discrimination.

And in response to the second question I think it depends, really. It's an expensive procedure so giving them away for free wouldn't be very practical. As much as it hurts knowing that my friend can't get the FtM transition that he needs because he can't afford it, he understands why there's a price on it.
But I suppose the counter argument to that is that it's really quite devastating for people who can't get the operation they need because of a lack in funding.

So the last question is difficult to answer. But I think I'll go with what Blue Nocturne said and say it should be free if the disorder is becoming a threat to life, but generally not free.

 

[Mr. X]

Should more states create legislation to combat anti-transgender behaviors?

Should government health insurance cover sex-change operations, body modification surgery, and hormone therapies?

No. No matter how many laws they make, people will still scorn them.

No. Know why? Its a pointless operation. And a waste of taxpayer money. You were born a specific gender. Deal with it.

As for this operation being needed, can you provide me a example for where this prodecure saved a person's life? Or corrected a physical defect that prevented a person from functioning normally? IMO, these are the only times that the government should cover medical operations.

 

[-ty-]

OK I am going to look like a insert-censored-word here but.

People put too much into this transgender thing sometimes. I admit there are legal and numerous other issues that need to be resolved. But sometimes people are too touchy.

Ooops I called someone trans instead of transwoman or whatever they say I should have called them. Thing is it's too complicated half the freaking time and being politically right has to have some, I don't know, loophole or something. If people like that are so persnickity.... did I spell that right?... about crap like that then maybe they are overreacting... Just a little...


People need to accept that there are different parts of the world and different people who talk differently. And they may not necessarily being rude or mean, it may be just what they call it. No particular reason.

And begin the Phantom hate.

But it's much more than that. There is a huge difference between being called, let's say, something politically incorrect and actually denying a person housing, benefits, jobs, custodianship, marriage and many other important things based off their gender identity. I don't think a transgender person would be overreacting at all if they were denied right likes these based off their gender identity.

To others, yes, it would definitely be great if there were one-size-fits-all legislation that protects everyone from the various forms of discrimination, however I think that certain groups of people, including transgender people, should be specifically addressed, if not the legislation may be deemed to vague to protect certain racial, sexual, and gender minorities. But yes, I think that legislation should be made in order to specifically address all individual's rights.

No. No matter how many laws they make, people will still scorn them.

No. Know why? Its a pointless operation. And a waste of taxpayer money. You were born a specific gender. Deal with it.

As for this operation being needed, can you provide me a example for where this prodecure saved a person's life? Or corrected a physical defect that prevented a person from functioning normally? IMO, these are the only times that the government should cover medical operations.

Some people are born with chemical imbalances, that affects their mental health; should these people have to "deal with it"?

It doesn't have to be life-threatening in order to be deemed medically viable. If I am bi-polar, it may not save my life to take the medication, but it will promote my mental health. Also, transgender people are taxpayers, shouldn't there psychological health be taken as seriously as other individual's?

 

[Yoshikkko]

Definitely, like someone mentioned, an anti-hate law. Any form of discrimination or racism is unacceptable, so I agree with that.

Should government health insurance cover sex-change operations, body modification surgery, and hormone therapies?

I don't think so. I know that there are cases in which psychological issues/disorders are involved, and that it would really help someone improve their mental state if they'd be given this option from insurance, but I think that there are also a lot of people who would abuse it, because they don't have to pay for it. When you pay for it yourself, I can imagine that you'll think a lot about it, considering if you really want it, and base a decision upon pros and cons, and arguments (just like you do when you want to buy something that's really expensive. Because it costs so much money, you'll have to be absolutely sure of your decision), because not only is it a (probably) permanent change, it also costs a lot of money. If it is free though, I think people feel more tempted to resort to this option, which in most cases, isn't the right solution, and that would cause problems.

I believe that there are many people who suffer from a disorder where they feel like they have the wrong body, but I also think that there are a lot of people, thinking they have this disorder, just because it isn't deemed as controversial as in former times, in some places, it has become acceptable and widely embraced by a lot of people, and I think that this actually might motivate a some people, and make themselves believe that they are e.g. homosexual or transgender, just because the freedom to express it exists, and the get feeling that then they will be accepted.

The Netherlands for example, in general, we have a lot of respect, and widely embrace homosexuality. In general, we think it is amazing and that people should just go ahead and live their lives the way they wish. But the thing is, I think that this mentality motivated a lot of people who weren't actually homosexual, to convert anyway, just because the possibility and freedom for it exists, and that is what I don't like, and why I think that such operations and so on, shouldn't be covered by health insurance.

I have a lot of respect for homosexuality, etc, but not exactly for cases where people abuse that possibility and freedom, and 'come out of the closet' just for the sake of it.

 

[BareBones]

No. No matter how many laws they make, people will still scorn them.

No. Know why? Its a pointless operation. And a waste of taxpayer money. You were born a specific gender. Deal with it.

As for this operation being needed, can you provide me a example for where this prodecure saved a person's life? Or corrected a physical defect that prevented a person from functioning normally? IMO, these are the only times that the government should cover medical operations.

Alright. My friend, FtM. Can't afford the surgery. He's slowly becoming suicidal because it upsets him that much that his gender and sex aren't the same. If he got the surgery, he'll be happy again. Even if it isn't directly saving his life it's saving his mental health.

Also, the phrase: Sex is between the legs, gender is between the ears.
You're born a specific sex. Gender is entirely mental and has nothing to do with having a penis or a vagina.

And as -ty- said, they're taxpayers too. Their mental and physical health should be taken into consideration which is why these procedures exist.

EDIT: Also, racism still exists. But there are laws against that. Murder still exists. There are laws about that too. Regardless of if some individuals choose to follow them or not, there should still be laws against things like that.

 

[Mr. X]

Some people are born with chemical imbalances, that affects their mental health; should these people have to "deal with it"?

It doesn't have to be life-threatening in order to be deemed medically viable. If I am bi-polar, it may not save my life to take the medication, but it will promote my mental health. Also, transgender people are taxpayers, shouldn't there psychological health be taken as seriously as other individual's?

They were born with a specific gender. Thats their gender.

Should they have any mental disorders then give them the needed medications for whatever mental condition they may have, but don't suguest letting the person undergo numerous expensive surgerys (Which correct PHYSICAL disorders) to treat a mental disorder.

 

[-ty-]

They were born with a specific gender. Thats their gender.

Should they have any mental disorders then give them the needed medications for whatever mental condition they may have, but don't suguest letting the person undergo numerous expensive surgerys (Which correct PHYSICAL disorders) to treat a mental disorder.

Well, we have to consider the person's best needs, not our personal beliefs. In order for the person to become psychologically healthy, if they are not, is to either:

A) Have a sex change operation, body modification surgery, and/or hormone therapies.

B) Change their gender identity to the gender in which they were born.

So considering these two options, only one is medically possible - Choice A.

Like sexuality, gender identity cannot be modified. There is absolutely no way to change a person's gender or sexual identity other than give them a lobotomy; that would take away the person's entire gender and sexual identity causing severe psychological trauma. It is in the person's best interest to have their physical self modified, because that treatment pathway has been proven to reduce anxiety, depression, and suicidal thoughts.

 

[Bluerang1]

Should more states create legislation to combat anti-transgender behaviors?
If they combat homophobic behavior then I don't see why not.

Should government health insurance cover sex-change operations, body modification surgery, and hormone therapies?
Urm no. To me it's about choice. It could be a phase and they may want to change back after. It's their personal thing anyway, the government shouldn't be involved.

 

[twocows]

No. They should be treated the same as everyone else, which means no special legislation making them different.

 

[-ty-]

No. They should be treated the same as everyone else, which means no special legislation making them different.

Without the legislation, some of their rights are not incorporated via the 14th amendment. Unfortunately, they are not protected like other individuals. I know it would be nice to simply suggest to people that they should not hold prejudice against a transgender person during a job, housing, or adoption interview, but without a specific law, acts of discrimination cannot be punished nor will transgender people be able to be treated as equals.

Should more states create legislation to combat anti-transgender behaviors?
If they combat homophobic behavior then I don't see why not.

Should government health insurance cover sex-change operations, body modification surgery, and hormone therapies?
Urm no. To me it's about choice. It could be a phase and they may want to change back after. It's their personal thing anyway, the government shouldn't be involved.

Don't worry, when these surgeries are performed, the patient must undergo a psychological examination to ensure that they indeed have a gender identity disorder and not just a supercilious whim. And the government is involved with all realms of health care.

Try placing yourself into the situation. Imagine if you were born a female. Obviously you would have difficulty coming to terms with both sexuality and gender identity. If you legitimately were supposed to be born a male, you might be depressed, anxious, and have suicidal thoughts. I think we often are not able to understand the thoughts of someone who undergoes difficulties with their gender; we've never had problems with our gender. I just try putting myself in their shoes, and visualizing how I would want to be treated by others, and what types of difficulties that they have to live with.

 

[Star-Lord]

Wow a good amount of this thread is incredibly erroneous.

They were born with a specific gender. Thats their gender.

Oh I'm sorry. I didn't realize that you were the person who defined genders. Not to mention that, oh there's an entire gender spectrum. You know genderqueer, etc. Although I would suppose you're right. They were born either male or female, and that's how they currently feel. They don't feel comfortable in their body though. You can make the argument that they were born the male gender but being in the female body, yes.

I think that this mentality motivated a lot of people who weren't actually homosexual, to convert anyway, just because the possibility and freedom for it exists, and that is what I don't like, and why I think that such operations and so on, shouldn't be covered by health insurance.

That makes absolutely no sense. There will always be discrimination wherever you go if you're a member of the LGBTQ. Even in an liberal country (I live in Canada, for example.) it's still a huge hassle just to be what is supposedly different. I can't possibly see anybody choosing to act that way. a) It's an entire waste of time. b) You're just going to get discriminated against anyways so just continue acting yourself and being straight.

I have a lot of respect for homosexuality, etc, but not exactly for cases where people abuse that possibility and freedom, and 'come out of the closet' just for the sake of it.

There is absolutely nothing to abuse about being a homosexual. If you're seriously putting through the effort to lie about your sexual preference (especially when it puts you in a worse position) then I have no idea what to say. I can imagine people being incredibly confused and switching back and forth. I don't judge that way, because I don't have any idea what they are going through. There's no more freedom in being gay than if there were being straight.

Don't worry, when these surgeries are performed, the patient must undergo a psychological examination to ensure that they indeed have a gender identity disorder and not just a supercilious whim. And the government is involved with all realms of health care.

Thank you. This is something that a lot of people don't actually know. They need to have a psychological assessment before undergoing the surgery.

Transgendered people deserve the exact same treatment and rights that the rest of the population does. If they need another law to be put in place so that they can be equal then so be it. The general education about transgendered people needs to be increased too. The good lot of people (minus -ty- I'm guessing) haven't been completely informed on the subject. Which isn't necessarily bad, because there's always room to learn.

 

[Gothitelle.]

Should government health insurance cover sex-change operations, body modification surgery, and hormone therapies?

I'll answer this one, no. Because it's a cosmetic procedure and insurance doesn't cover cosmetic procedures unless it's life threatening.

 

[Melody]

Should more states create legislation to combat anti-transgender behaviors?
Yes. Transgendered people have rights just as anyone else does. No one need be discriminated against because they've changed their sex to match their gender.

Should government health insurance cover sex-change operations, body modification surgery, and hormone therapies?
I can understand programs like Medicare not funding these things. Programs that are meant to ensure that your basic health is ensured don't need to pay for such things unless a professional recommends it because they feel it will help you mentally or emotionally. Now I won't say that they shouldn't offer a little bit of assistance even if it's not recommended by a doctor, but I wouldn't compel government funded insurance to do so.

So Yes, if a professional thinks it's for the better. Because like any treatment there IS some person it WILL help, cosmetic or not. But I only say let the professionals decide if it is what a person needs. Because it's not always necessary, but it can help someone who is obviously committed to their gender more so than their sex and is obviously troubled by their sex to the point that it affects their physical or mental health over-much.

 

[Mr. X]

Oh I'm sorry. I didn't realize that you were the person who defined genders. Not to mention that, oh there's an entire gender spectrum. You know genderqueer, etc. Although I would suppose you're right. They were born either male or female, and that's how they currently feel. They don't feel comfortable in their body though. You can make the argument that they were born the male gender but being in the female body, yes.

You have a penis, you are a male.

You have a vagina, you are a female.

With these two facts stated, can you explain to me just what other types of organs there are that call for diffrent gender definitions? Thats right. NONE. Therefor, all other 'gender definitions' are technically a mental condition which is UNEFFECTED by surgerys which effect PHYSICAL conditions. That said, I have no problem with transgenders but I don't want my tax dollars to fund cosmetic surgerys.

Aslo, to Gothitelle, +1. Its nice to see another person who see's these expensive surgerys for what they REALLY are which is just another cosmetic surgery ment to make people feel good about themselves.

[sarcasm]Anyway, to everyone, mentally, im genderless. By this, I mean I don't feel sexual attraction to either gender. Does this mean that im going to undergo a sugery to remove my penis? No. [/sarcasm]

 

[Gothitelle.]

Aslo, to Gothitelle, +1. Its nice to see another person who see's these expensive surgerys for what they REALLY are which is just another cosmetic surgery ment to make people feel good about themselves.

Yeah, I mean if you look at it, there's really no medical related reason why people would get a sex change. Therefore, making it purely cosmetic.

Like if you were to have your penis removed because of cancer, that'd be a different story.

 

[Mr. X]

The only medical reason would be because of a mental condition which could be treated with medication and/or hormones... Which, come to think of it, are needed by people who have a sex change anyway.