YGO: Individual Card Discussion

[Frostweaver]

Horn of Heaven can stop Jinzo from being summoned in the first place, so it works, but no one plays Horn of Heaven. It's just solemn judgement that can really stop Jinzo in terms of traps. Rivalry of Warlords can also be used to stop it from being summoned provided that the opponent has a faceup monster and it isn't machine (but then again, no one plays that either.)

Forget what I said about smashing ground on Jinzo. Made an error there as that rule only applies for non-tribute stuff (except for Reaper) really...

 

[Zaikiro]

Yata was never $60 dollars, it was either more or less, from what I saw.

You can only negate Jinzo one way, and that's Solom Judgement, I know what you ment though. I forgot if Divine Wrath works on it, cause that would negate it too.:\

Depends on the store. Divine Wrath does not work on it. Acid Trap Hole can stop it also(if it's face down) Acid Rain and System Shutdown works well also. But Jinzo is not a threat overall.

 

[Forci Stikane]

Divine Wrath is a counter-trap, so it SHOULD work...

 

[Star Crossed Dreamer]

I was under the impression that Jinzo negated ALL Traps, not just some. Have they changed things a little more again?

 

[Zaikiro]

Divine Wrath is a counter-trap, so it SHOULD work...

The rulings! DDDDDo:

DIVINE WRATH

You can activate the effect of "Divine Wrath" to a Flip Effect, Ignition Effect, Trigger Effect, or Multi-Trigger Effect. But not to a Continuous Effect. This is because Continuous Effects cannot be chained to.

"Divine Wrath" is NOT a card that targets, so "Divine Wrath" may be used against Dragon-Type monsters while "King Dragun" or "Lord of D." is on the field.

You can activate the effect of "Divine Wrath" against an effect monster's effect that happens anywhere: on the field, in the hand, in the Graveyard, or removed from play.

You must chain "Divine Wrath" to an effect directly preceeding it in the chain. For example, if "Airknight Parshath" equipped with "Cestus of Dagla" attacks a Defense Position monster, "Airknight Parshath" inflicts damage to the opponent's Life Points during damage calculation. Then, during effect resolution, there are 2 simultaneous Trigger Effects that the controller places in a chain however he likes. If the effect of "Airknight Parshath" is Step 1 and "Cestus of Dagla" is Step 2, the opponent cannot chain "Divine Wrath". However, if "Cestus of Dagla" is Step 1 and "Airknight Parshath" is Step 2, "Divine Wrath" can be chained. In this case, the effect of "Airknight Parshath" that allows the controller to draw a card is negated, "Airknight Parshath" is destroyed, and the effect of "Cestus of Dagla" disappears before it resolves.

Another example: if "D.D. Warrior Lady" attacks a face-down "Morphing Jar", and activates her effect to remove both cards from play, "D.D. Warrior Lady" is Step 2 because she has an optional effect, and "Morphing Jar" is Step 1 because its effect is mandatory. So "Divine Wrath" can be chained to the effect of "D.D. Warrior Lady" to negate its effect, but not to the effect of "Morphing Jar" to negate its effect.

You can chain "Divine Wrath" to the effect of "The Creator" (Ignition Effect), "Fox Fire" when it is Special Summoned (Trigger Effect), "Strike Ninja" (Multi-Trigger Effect), and "Homunculus the Alchemic Being" (Ignition Effect).

You can activate "Divine Wrath" in a chain to a Trigger Effect that activates when the Effect Monster is Summoned such as "Breaker the Magical Warrior", "Dark Magician of Chaos", or "Marauding Captain". The opponent must declare the activation of "Marauding Captain"'s effect before "Divine Wrath" can be activated. In this case, the monster that would have been Special Summoned remains in the opponent's hand.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" during the Damage Step because it is a Counter-Trap, so you may activate it to negate the effect of "D. D. Warrior Lady", "Reflect Bounder", "Injection Fairy Lily", "D. D. Crazy Beast", "Dark Paladin", or "Mystical Knight of Jackal".

If you activate "Divine Wrath" during the Damage Step to destroy the attacking monster or the monster being attacked, the monster is destroyed. No replay occurs because a replay can only happen during the Battle Step. If damage calculation has not been performed yet, it is not performed.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" against "Sasuke Samurai" or "Mystic Swordsman LV2" when they attack a face-down Defense Position monster.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" to negate either effect of "Don Zaloog" and to negate the effect of "Airknight Parshath" that allows its controller to draw a card.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" to negate an effect that activates in the Graveyard, such as "Witch of the Black Forest", "Mystic Tomato", "Despair from the Dark", "Night Assailant", "Electric Snake", and "Sangan".

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when the opponent discards "Kuriboh" from his / her hand to negate the effect of "Kuriboh" and when a "Night Assailant" is discarded to negate the effect of returning a Flip Effect monster to the owner's hand.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when "Exiled Force", "Red-Eyes B. Chick", or "Paladin of White Dragon" is Tributed for its own effect.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when "Dark Necrofear" activates its effect in the Graveyard during the End Phase, and since a monster in the Graveyard cannot be destroyed, "Dark Necrofear" is not destroyed by a card effect, so its effect does not activate again.

You can chain "Divine Wrath" to the effect of "King Dragun" that Special summons a Dragon-Type monster.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when the opponent uses "Relinquished"'s effect to equip itself with a monster, or when "Relinquished"'s effect inflicts damage.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when a Spirit Monster is returned to the owner's hand by its own effect, and the Spirit Monster will be destroyed and sent to the Graveyard.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when the effect of "Helpoemer" activates in the Graveyard, and the effect of "Helpoemer" will not activate again.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when "Vampire Lord" or "Sacred Phoenix of Nephthys" activate their effects in the Graveyard, and their effects are negated and they are not Special Summoned; but because they cannot be "destroyed" while in the Graveyard, they are not destroyed by a card effect so their effect will not activate again.

You can chain "Divine Wrath" to the activation of "Peten the Dark Clown", and the effect of "Peten the Dark Clown" will not resolve (however, the "Peten the Dark Clown" that was removed from play remains out of play).

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when the effect of "Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning" activates that allows it to attack a second time.

You cannot chain "Divine Wrath" to Continuous Effects such as: "Perfect Machine King", "Raging Flame Sprite" (either effect), "Jinzo", "Fire Princess", "Mad Sword Beast", "Hayabusa Knight", "Cat's Ear Tribe", "Amazoness Swords Woman", "Harpie Lady 3", "Fusilier Dragon the Dual-Mode Beast", "The Fiend Megacyber", "Blade Knight" (either effect), "Patrician of Darkness", or monsters like "Element Saurus" that gain ATK continuously.

You cannot activate "Divine Wrath" when "Giant Orc", "Goblin Attack Force", or "Spear Dragon" changes to Defense Position because these are considered Continuous Effects.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when "Lava Golem" does damage to your Life Points, but you cannot activate it when "Lava Golem" is Special Summoned.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when any Union Monster activates its effect to equip itself to another monster, because that is an Ignition Effect. However, you cannot activate "Divine Wrath" when a Union Monster Special Summons itself back as a monster, because that is an effect of an Equip Spell Card.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when a "LV" monster is sent to the Graveyard to Special Summon the next level version (an Ignition Effect), and "Divine Wrath" will negate that effect, even though it cannot destroy the "LV" monster because it is already in the Graveyard.

After you negate the effect of "Sinister Serpent" with "Divine Wrath", your opponent can activate the effect of "Sinister Serpent" again to return it to his hand, even during the same Standby Phase.

Posted in bold. Staright from UDE.

I have'nt seen any new rulings on Jinzo for a while.

 

[Frostweaver]

Granmerg the Rock Monarch

When this cards is Tribute Summoned successfully, destroy 1 face-down card on the field.


Mobius have to target spells or traps, and is generally most useful for most decks. Zaborg is an excellent choice at control decks as it destroys monsters very well together with Mobius's backfield destruction. What about Granmerg the Rock Monarch? It can possibly target a facedown spell/trap, or a facedown monster. It's a Nobleman of Crossout + Nobleman of Extermination hybrid, taking a little bit of both. What about him?

 

[Agent9]

6/10. It's like blowback dragon, except granmarg targets facedown cards.

 

[Frostweaver]

Difference is that blowback is luck dependent, and in theory works multiple times. In reality, a coin flip is never preferred just because it's not skill based, and Blowback Dragon can't target the back row. The "reuse" factor is relatively weak as most monsters can't last very long in this format.

 

[Pogiforce-14]

Granmerg I would say is better than Zaborg as it is still a one for one, but with more options. Mobius I might place higher than Granmerg as he's a one for two, but then again he doesn't have the options. Sometimes though, having too many options can be a bad thing. I'd give granmerg a 7/10. I personally would still prefer Mobius for his ability, or Thestalos because he's burn and I'm a pyromaniac. :D

 

[Frostweaver]

Mobius is definitely better because there's a fair amount of monster removal cards in the effect of many non-tribute monsters, but no one can remove the backrow cards as easily as Mobius. Every time Mobius come out, it's gurantee pain unless Mobius walks into Bottomless Traphole + Dust Tornado, as those two will just chain itself to destroy one of your own backrow, then send Mobius to the removed pile.

Zaborg can destroy faceup beatsticks, especially to run over one Cyber Dragon with the effect, then crush the Don Zaloog with the attack power, then send it away for Chaos Sorcerer later when it's destroyed. Strike Ninja really benefits from having Zaborg.

Granmerg is definitely better than Zaborg if it can destroy one of anything (actually, make that broken). It's just that Granmerg hardly helps against arrgo (common deck type) in which everything will be faceup, or burn/ALO (also very common deck types) in which the backrow is filled with continous faceup spells/traps. Granmerg can only beat control, but then the other two monarchs are equally helpful in beating controls.

lol... Thestalos is my least favorite because Dark World came out XD; Even in burn I use Zaborg if I have to have a tribute ^^; (and burn will only have tribute if Scarab isn't enough to destroy the enemy anyway...) Of course, it's another story if it's Molten Destruction-minor burn deck, then obviously Thestalos is the best choice possible ;p

 

[Pogiforce-14]

Yeah, my burn deck had some issues facing it's first darkworld deck. Still managed to win though, as the only hand discarding cards I had were thestalos and Spirit Reaper. And since Thestalos was kinda coutneractive ina deck that had two level limit B and two gravity Bind, I just took him out. My Ultimate Baseball kids were stronger more often than not anyway.

 

[Frostweaver]

Burn decks' real enemy ins't Dark World (let Tomato worry about them) but just plain old Mobius. One Mobius come out, and there goes Level Limit Area B. During this time, the weenie steath birds are going to be crushed O.o; (and let's not forget other fellow arrgo friends). Burn decks need to be geared to have just as many ways to destroy monsters as any other deck. Those who cannot do so will be crushed easily... I mean, just 2 scarabs and lava golem summon are far from enough in monster destruction. >>;


Hmm since we somehow moved on to Scarabs, why not talk about Swarm of Scarabs now? How's Scarab doing in comparison to all the other non-tribute monster destruction effect monster cards, such as Yomi Ship, Man Eater Bug and Newdoria?

 

[Pogiforce-14]

I used to play a bug deck with Swarm of Scarabs as my best friend, but right now I just use pure life burn. I wish I had a mask of restrict though, as that would stop those pesky Mobiuses and Jinzos. Of coruse even if they summon one and break two cards, I usually have two left, one of which is either Gravity Bind or NIghtmare Wheel. either that or I have so many fire creatures already my Ultimate Baseball Kids are stronger.

But anyway, scarabs, ahem... Scarabs, like Stealth bird, requires some sort of defense to remain safe. The problem with scarabs though is that it's defense is considerably lower than Bird's and makes him much easier to kill. so he would have to depend on level limit B and other such limiting cards in order for the card to survive. Which to me makes it much a victim of Mobius as any other defense creature, only this one will not get his effect upon flipping up. with that in mind, I think A simple Man-Eater Bug with a Tsukuyomi would work better.

and just some trivia, once my opponent summoned a Jinzo, I activated MST on a face down card and it turned out to be Scapegoats, which they activated (This was not on the same turn) I activated Level limit Area B and just started swinging with Raging Flame Sprite directly. Because they had filled up their field with goats, there was really nothing they could do. not unless they wanted to sacrifice their goats to an all powerful Raging Flame Sprite with 3100 attack power. :D

 

[Frostweaver]

And such a deck really deserves to lose if they can't get rid of one Level Lmit Area B... Where's the Mobius? >>; There's a fair amount of monster removal with magic cards even if Heavy Storm and MST are used up, mostly smashing ground.

Depends on what time of the battle that is, but it'll matter a lot if this is mid to late game of that battle. A burn deck isn't hard to identify, so your opponent should just let Scapegoat die right there anyway if this is mid-late game. By then, they should know that they must get out as many monsters as possible to destroy the burning monsters. It sounds like your opponent isn't preserving resources, but instead play whatever at whenever it's allowed to be played...

 

[Pogiforce-14]

well they were blindly following the general rule: if they try to destroy anything that you can activate, do so. he just wasn't thinking I would bypass his creatures. he probably thought I was going to kill Jinzo and then start swinging with baseball kids.

I believe I was playing one of the local Noobs. I seriously doubt he had any MObius or Smashing Grounds. At the very least, I know I don't have smashing ground. I had one, but in all the thousands of useless cards I have floating around, it's pretty hard to find one card.

 

[Zaikiro]

Grandmarg is nowhere near Blowback Bragon.

Last format it completely got ingnored. Mostly because of sayings for examplewe have 2 Nobleman of Crossout for a reason and we have Breaker people, which is better.

Hopefully people options will change now on this card.

Mobius is the best. And saw play before the others.

Thestalos was not even noticed before Evan Vargas(Sand Trap on pojo) made top 4 in a SJC with 3 of them.

Zaborg was the most overrated form the start by being used into chaos decks instead of Airknight or any light tribute monster. Always gaining more play in the side deck than few tributes last format.

Grandmarg is underrated. It's effect could chain, Like the others ,but people never really mention that on the other monarchs, espacilly Zaborg. Having the choice to destroy a monster or spell is great. And face down prove to be more letal than a face-up most of the time. Grandmarg is one of the best tributes in the game. But is unoticed.

Traditional: 3.4/5(It kills Fiber Jar)

Avdanced: 3.7/5

 

[Frostweaver]

No one mention the chaining part for Zaborg because monsters aren't the same as spells and traps. If you're targetting a spell/trap, it can chain to that effect, use itself up, then you aren't destroying anything anymore. For monsters, that monster is gurantee to die to Zaborg unless the chained spell/trap either stops Zaborg's summon, or can temporaily remove that monster from play for that turn (Interdimension transport? I don't use that card so I forgot the name... not even sure if it's quickplay or not)

Granmerg targetting back row facedown can be potentially useless. In theory, the same can be said for Mobius, but it's unlikely for both of the backrow cards to be chainable and quickplay-ed. I only saw that once and that was a Dust Tornado + Scapegoat.

So really, Granmerg is inferior to both Zaborg and Mobius in specialized area, but Granmerg's advantage is that it can try to do both.

(I don't like Zaborg in chaos, as Soldier/Sorcerer can remove the threat. No need Zaborg to blast it apart. Zaborg is really good in soul control decks where you swap a searcher with the enemy monsters, summon Zaborg, blast the searcher apart to get a search, then attack for LP directly. Any deck that uses high tribute monsters definitely should consider not just Mobius, but Zaborg as well. That's where I think Zaborg fits best.)

 

[MegaDitto]

Sad. 11 days has passed and nobody replied.

Last CotW Something that ends and something new that begins. In Yugioh, a new banlist.
An new beginning.

Ending the year with a bang. Blowing away all your trouble and thinking ahead.

 

[Agent9]

Aren't Zaikiro, Mullet, and Frostweaver the only ones who can post cards?

 

[MegaDitto]

Aren't Zaikiro, Mullet, and Frostweaver the only ones who can post cards?

>.> Why are they the only ones? Would'nt it be right for all members to post cards?