5th Gen What happened to the old simple Pokemon?

Ravecat · Jun 6, 2010

All generations have good and bad.

You're all just being nostalgic.

DarkPrince304 · Jun 6, 2010

chikorita125 said:
i liked the 4th gen pokemon, but the first gen was the most creative

I thank you for saying this.
Because of you now many people are able to express their true thoughts about the 1st Gen about being so un creative.
Awesome Guys.
Pokemon just got creative since the 3rd Generation! :D
2nd was a little creative too a little bit.
We like the 1st Gen because when most of us was little the anime was new and it was awesome. (Anime not the Pokemon)
And the 2nd one because it was first time on the TV for a new Generation.
We are just being nostalgic. Just compare them. 5th Gen is awesome in every aspects! ;P

Sweet Smoochum · Jun 6, 2010

The good thing about the new games is in fact that some of the old Pokemon ARE included. You don't have to use any of the new Pokemon. You could use Gyarados, Machamp, Golbat, Tentacruel, etc as your team. I personally love a lot of Pokemon ranging from 1st to 4th. Some I'd like to name are: Vulpix (SoulSilver made me fall in love with it) Solrock, Banette, Croagunk, Stunky, Dusknoir, Mightyena, Swampert, Grovyle, Beautifly, Skitty, Torchic, Sableye, Altaria, Loudred, Grumpig, Cacturne, Zangoose, Torkoal, Duskull, Walrein, Glalie, Clamperl, Luxray, Torterra, Driftblim, Honchrow, Togekiss, Porygon-Z <333, Roserade, Leafeon, Glaceon, Pachirisu, Buneary, Piplup, Monferno, Froslass, Scizor, Teddiursa, Phanpy, Bulbasaur, Seel, Squirtle, etc.

Basically, there are a lot of Pokemon I adore. If it wasn't for GF making new Pokemon, I would have stopped long ago. The main reason why I got back into it was because I played Gold version in 2003 at my cousin's pool party. I saw the new Pokemon, and I loved the gameplay of Gold version as well. Personally, I love the new designs they come up with moreso than the old ones. I appreciate the artwork. I love the new legendaries. The color scheme is simple, but the designs are lovely. I also love the new starters for fifth gen, and I'm undecided about which I should choose. =)

Cyberglass · Jun 6, 2010

As someone who grew up when Red and Blue came out, I must say I like the first two generations the best. However, the Pokemon designs appeal to me solely because of nostalgia, not creativity (although, they were more creative at the time than any competitors).

I was actually going to quit Pokemon after Silver, since I was satisfied with where the franchise was, and Gen. II was far superior in graphics and gameplay to Gen. I, while including the entire area of Kanto. However, I recieved a copy of Ruby as an unexpected gift and was immediately hooked by the creativity of the Pokemon. Despite my dislike of Treecko and Torchic which prompted me to pick Mudkip, I enjoyed the designs of nearly every new Pokemon. They were different, yes, but that was not a bad thing. It opened up my world of Pokemon because I realized that it didn't have to be exactly like earlier games to still be the same Pokemon experience I had come to enjoy. The beauty of the graphics and new environs just made it that much more appealing.

When Diamond and Pearl came out, I was much more unsure about the designs, but they have grown on me over the years because I gave them a chance. And as they have done so I notice more and more that they are still in almost the same style as earlier Pokemon, they do have that "Sugimori touch", and I just couldn't see it before. And from what I've seen of Gen. V, the designs are much better and much easier to recognize as Pokemon than Gen. IV was.

Now, I still have newer Pokemon I don't like the designs for (e.g. Nosepass, Hippopotas) but there were also older Pokemon that didn't grow on me until their newer graphics and movesets in Gen. III, such as Farfetch'd, Lickitung, Aipom, Igglybuff, etc. (well, I still don't like the look of Igglybuff).

So basically the point of my rambling wall of text is to give the new guys the benefit of the doubt and don't compare them to the earlier Pokemon until you have the chance to get used to them. Nostalgia vs novelty always skews the balance too much to render objective judgment now.

Ho-Oh · Jun 6, 2010

They all seem kind of simple to me... just guess things as a kid stick out more than things now, well, in terms of Pokemon. Either way the Gen 5 Pokemon that are already announced I prefer them more than the D/P Pokemon, which could be a sign of it improving kinda.

Shining Meganium · Jun 6, 2010

I agree that they are seriously over complicating it. I think it started going wrong at gen 3 with blaziken which looks a lot like a digimon. Well... at least gen 4 was original. Perhaps in gen 5 they'll make some more new pokemon concepts like mothim and lumineon.

A Pixy · Jun 6, 2010

Ravecat said:
All generations have good and bad.

You're all just being nostalgic.

This sums it all up.

I hate when nostalgia blinds people from the truth.

I was going to tl;dr, but I don't need to now.

riddleraven · Jun 6, 2010

Yeah... I hate the new starters. They are the ugliest things I've ever seen! When I saw them I thought, "Ok. Maybe this is the point where I'll (finally) get out."

It's not all about the starters but it seems like as good of a time as any to just stop with the new games and focus on the old ones. :/

GunSaberSeraph · Jun 6, 2010

riddleraven said:
Yeah... I hate the new starters. They are the ugliest things I've ever seen! When I saw them I thought, "Ok. Maybe this is the point where I'll (finally) get out."

It's not all about the starters but it seems like as good of a time as any to just stop with the new games and focus on the old ones. :/

But Gamefreak already did that twice. FireRed/Leafgreen and HeartGold/SoulSilver were made to cater to older generations.

riddleraven · Jun 6, 2010

GunSaberSeraph said:
But Gamefreak already did that twice. FireRed/Leafgreen and HeartGold/SoulSilver were made to cater to older generations.

I didn't mean that about the catering. I mean that as an individual player *I* will focus on the old games and not even bother with B/W since they look dumb.

But I read on another thread that they might be the final games? If that's true, I'll probably go ahead and get them just so that I'll be able to say I've played them all. And maybe they'll have some cool features that will be fun, idk.

It's only the fact that these games SEEM to never stop being made that makes me want to quit getting new ones.

Guy · Jun 6, 2010

Cyberglass said:
As someone who grew up when Red and Blue came out, I must say I like the first two generations the best. However, the Pokemon designs appeal to me solely because of nostalgia, not creativity (although, they were more creative at the time than any competitors).

I was actually going to quit Pokemon after Silver, since I was satisfied with where the franchise was, and Gen. II was far superior in graphics and gameplay to Gen. I, while including the entire area of Kanto. However, I recieved a copy of Ruby as an unexpected gift and was immediately hooked by the creativity of the Pokemon. Despite my dislike of Treecko and Torchic which prompted me to pick Mudkip, I enjoyed the designs of nearly every new Pokemon. They were different, yes, but that was not a bad thing. It opened up my world of Pokemon because I realized that it didn't have to be exactly like earlier games to still be the same Pokemon experience I had come to enjoy. The beauty of the graphics and new environs just made it that much more appealing.

When Diamond and Pearl came out, I was much more unsure about the designs, but they have grown on me over the years because I gave them a chance. And as they have done so I notice more and more that they are still in almost the same style as earlier Pokemon, they do have that "Sugimori touch", and I just couldn't see it before. And from what I've seen of Gen. V, the designs are much better and much easier to recognize as Pokemon than Gen. IV was.

Now, I still have newer Pokemon I don't like the designs for (e.g. Nosepass, Hippopotas) but there were also older Pokemon that didn't grow on me until their newer graphics and movesets in Gen. III, such as Farfetch'd, Lickitung, Aipom, Igglybuff, etc. (well, I still don't like the look of Igglybuff).

So basically the point of my rambling wall of text is to give the new guys the benefit of the doubt and don't compare them to the earlier Pokemon until you have the chance to get used to them. Nostalgia vs novelty always skews the balance too much to render objective judgment now.

I thought my tl;dr was good, but this pretty much covers another point of view I share. Every generation that comes out, people are quick to speculate on how these games will be rubbish compared to the originals without first giving it a chance of at least playing through it. Basically what they're doing is "judging a book by its covers" to put it simply.

My favorite generation thus far is Generation Three, not because it was my first game, but because it was a major step up since the Second Gen in that it took a great change in graphics and made all their new Pokémon quite creative compared to the simple ones from the previous two (not saying they aren't great, because there are a fair share of 1st and 2nd Gen Pokémon that I like). However, when I first saw Treecko and its evolutions, I simply despised it. I never once wanted to choose it, until one day I restarted my game after many times before and decided to go with it just for the heck of it. You know what? After giving it a chance, Treecko's line of evolution ended up becoming my favorite starter thus far - and still remains so today. Point is, before you're quick to judge the new Pokémon and diminish them to the older generation Pokémon, give them a chance.

riddleraven said:
I didn't mean that about the catering. I mean that as an individual player *I* will focus on the old games and not even bother with B/W since they look dumb.

My point exactly. People are judging Black and White too soon before even giving it a try. They could "look" dumb, but that says nothing about the games right now other than a mere opinion to compared to what it actually may be like.

But I read on another thread that they might be the final games? If that's true, I'll probably go ahead and get them just so that I'll be able to say I've played them all. And maybe they'll have some cool features that will be fun, idk.

It's only the fact that these games SEEM to never stop being made that makes me want to quit getting new ones.

GameFreak is a company, and like all companies their goal is to keep making money. As long as Pokémon is still a popular franchise and continues to grow as it is today, then there will always be more Pokémon in the future and more games to come with it.

Agent Clank · Jun 6, 2010

Aquila said:
Well, basicly this thread is just a cry of irritation as once again it seems that the new Pokemon will be exaggerated with random objects and signs infiltrated in their being/body(whatever you call it). I have seen the new pokemon starters and legendarys and find them together with the 4th generation massivly exaggerated and too "fancy". The reason I like Pokemon, is mainly because of the 1st and 2nd generation who had simple pokemon with no "ultra"-shields and random trees on their back. There are of course some exceptions in the 4th generation, but they are rare. Pokemon is getting uglier every generation.

Well Pokemon has to change.
It has to get Different or People are going to get Bored and not Play it anymore.
I like how the 5th Generation Pokemon look so far.
I liked all the other Generations too.

Elise · Jun 6, 2010

Myself, I feel a bit like I'm on a swing about this subject. Sometimes I'm really optimistic about the changes and other times I really don't want anything about pokémon to ever change. We can't have it both ways though, either way a certain portion of the pokéfans are going to be disappointed and others are going to be stoked. That's just the way it goes.

In the end, even though Gen IV pokies didn't do it for me, I still enjoyed the game because it's pokémon and it transports me to a time when there were only 150 pokies and I didn't care about stats :). I'm super hopeful for Gen V, too. The starters look like good pokémon design to me, and the legendaries are okay. They just look a bit funky to me still because I haven't gotten used to them I suppose. (:

Serin · Jun 6, 2010

Well, I've spent a while examining all of the sprites of every generation on one sheet, and this is what I've observed:

The sprites from the 4th generation use noticeably darker colors, and is more variety in colors as well. Most likely because of the lack of technology before (Pokemon used to be limited to the amount of colors...Not sure exact details but it was something like 8 bit, now it's 32 bit? Again, I'm not too knowledgeable about that so don't take my word for it.)

And the Pokemon seem to be more cartoonish while the first and second generation Pokemon seemed fierce; actual monsters that tear each other apart. This could be because of the strictness of media these days. Notice how Pokemon don't get severely injured anymore with bruises and scratches and things (second or first episode of Pokemon, Pikachu gets it's ass kicked by a bunch of Spearow) and there is a noticeable lack of violence as well. So most likely Pokemon is trying to make the species more kid friendly.

We might as well be prepared for change, as I'm sure most of us here that are complaining are in our teenage years and we have been brought up with Pokemon Red and Blue when we were just 4, 5, or 6. As Obama has said numerous times, it's time for change. :P

Waki Tobaye · Jun 6, 2010

Romantica said:
I just hate when they start to look like Digimon or something off of the those other shows.

This^. That part of your post is exactly what I think.

Pokemon will be exaggerated with random objects and signs infiltrated are pretty ugly; but look at in their being/body(whatever you call it).

What about Steelix? Nidoking? heck, even Blastoise has "random objects" on it. Cannons on a turtle? That's what I'd call random. And before you say that they were creative, look at newer Pokémon like Metagross, who also has a creative design. BTW, I'm not saying that Blastoise is bad. It's actually pretty good.

Almost everyone of us thinks that Pokémon like Palkia, Tangrowth, Rhypherior, Probopass, Bastiodon and Lickylicky are bad-designed and ugly. Actually, they are. But just because 5 - 10 Pokémon are bad IYO, doesn't mean that 4º gen sucks. Don't make thinks general. Riolu and Buneary are pretty good, for example.

I actually think that 3º gen Pokémon are pretty cool, along with some 4º gen ones. Nostalgia is just playing with your frail mind. Don't let it win.

Jerme · Jun 6, 2010

yeah did people used to complain about steel cannons on a turtle?

Dillon_68 · Jun 6, 2010

Hiiro said:
My favorite generation thus far is Generation Three, not because it was my first game, but because it was a major step up since the Second Gen in that it took a great change in graphics and made all their new Pokémon quite creative compared to the simple ones from the previous two (not saying they aren't great, because there are a fair share of 1st and 2nd Gen Pokémon that I like). However, when I first saw Treecko and its evolutions, I simply despised it. I never once wanted to choose it, until one day I restarted my game after many times before and decided to go with it just for the heck of it. You know what? After giving it a chance, Treecko's line of evolution ended up becoming my favorite starter thus far - and still remains so today. Point is, before you're quick to judge the new Pokémon and diminish them to the older generation Pokémon, give them a chance.

This paragraph captures my feelings perfectly. I loved Gen. 3. It was so innovative, and it came out at a significant part of my life, which gives me a blast of nostalgia just thinking about it. I mean, I was blown away by the improved berry mechanics (which Johto introduced), the GBA graphics, and the new "natures". (which I had no idea of what they did initially, I was only in the 4th grade. I just thought it was a cool personality, lol.) Me and two of my friends all got seperate starters, which bumped up the fun factor. I love Torchic, which has been my only starter from that gen. Ahh...memories.

What I'm getting at is that no two people will have the same taste. I may like Hoenn the best, but there are aspects of every other Gen that I adore. For example, my favorite storyline is G/S/C. My favorite starter is Piplup (although I have a feeling Mijumaju will top that). And you have to give props to the Gen that started it all. I came into the game at age 5, with Blue version, so I have experience. Point blank, no matter what, Pokemon will be Pokemon. I don't think it has became to complicated untill we begin to drive Pokemon, a la a vehicle Pokemon or something outrageous like that.

PS: I had the same experience with Chikorita. For years I used Feraligatr and Typhlosion, but after picking up Chikorita, I never gave it up!

Zeta Sukuna · Jun 7, 2010

You know what this thread reminds me of? This.

TVTropes Ruined FOREVER said:
The Pokémon was always better before (insert current generation here). Usually either centered around complaints that new Pokemon are not as "cool" looking as older ones, or complaints that adding extra evolutions have ruined that Pokemon forever. Diamond/Pearl also had the usual complaints, plus claims that a dramatic re-balancing of all the moves (creating "special" and "physical" categories) ruined competitive battling forever.

The main reaction to HeartGold and SoulSilver seem to be "OMG they replaced Kris with Lyra! Ruined FOREVER!

OMFG the grass looks slightly different! Ruined FOREVER!

The game has more detail?! It's RUINED 4EVER!!!

Whitney's Miltank is one level lower in HG/SS?!?! EPIC FAIL GAMEFREAK

Perhaps a little conspiracy theory to go with it? "JUNICHI MASUDA IS BLACKMAILING THE ALMIGHTY TAJIRI-SAN TO TAKE OVER POKEMON! IT IS RUINED 4EVER!"

Lopunny, Gardevoir, et al led to cries of "FURRYMON" across the Internet. A Japanese video game with Cute Monster Girls? That's just crazy talk.

As soon as his silhouette was revealed, Zoroark was accused of being a Replacement Scrappy of Lucario. Seriously, WHAT?!

When people saw Pokemon from 3rd and 4th Gen: Pokemon look like robots instead of animals?! RUINED FOREVER!

The Tin Tower is now called Bell Tower. THE END OF THE WORLD IS COMING!!

The titles of the new games are BLACK and WHITE?! Oh no the, series is now absolutely going emo/racist by the NAME ALONE!!! It has been RUINED FOREVER!!!

The starters for Black and White have been revealed. People are, you guessed it, screaming 'RUINED FOREVER!'

The in-battle sprites are now animated. But the back-view sprites look low-res and blown-up! Nintendo doesn't care about Pokémon anymore!

The legendaries for Black and White were just revealed. What?! Black on white and white on black?! The black legendary slightly resembles Palkia?!! NO, NINTENDO, YOU SUCK YOU RUINED POKEMON!!

This is the entire quote from the pokemon section of Ruined FOREVER, pay attention to the bold. THIS is what the people with the rose-tinted nostalgia glasses keep adding to, and it's getting annoying. The newer pokemon aren't that bad. In fact, they're probably more creative then the old ones, because Gen 1 was basically animals with superpowers, with a couple of exceptions.

EDIT: Decided to quote more from TVTropes, because it still applies beautifully to this. This is from the 'They Changed It Now It Sucks' section.

Spoiler:

Watch, when Gen 5 comes out, Gen 3 will be idealized, Gen 1 will be forgotten about, Gen 2 will still be popular, Gen 4 will be dogged like Gen 3, and Gen 5 will be like Gen 4 is now.

Ripley · Jun 7, 2010

I am a fan of the good ol days (Simple Mewtwo and Mew), but I'm not gonna lie to you at all; I love the new legendaries. I am a fan of glam and accessories. I think Palkia and Dialga look awesome with all the extra stuff. I mean, when you keep adding more and more pokemon, you can't just make them simple, or you'll run out of ideas.

However, sometimes the glam is not tasteful. The Gen 5 starters look pretty funky, especially the water one. It looks like a teddy bear whose genes have been spliced with those of a Buneary.

Trap-Eds · Jun 7, 2010

Zeta Dimentio said:
This is the entire quote from the pokemon section of Ruined FOREVER, pay attention to the bold. THIS is what the people with the rose-tinted nostalgia glasses keep adding to, and it's getting annoying. The newer pokemon aren't that bad. In fact, they're probably more creative then the old ones, because Gen 1 was basically animals with superpowers, with a couple of exceptions.

Lol. I loooove TVTropes. xDDD
I really don't see how Pokemon look like Digimon. I'm sick and tired of hearing that. And even if they do, so what? Did ya think Ken Sugimori or whoever else designs the Pokemon was gonna stick to the same old art style forever? People see one tiny hint of change and freak out. Urgh.

5th Gen What happened to the old simple Pokemon?

More options

Ravecat

I'm Right.

DarkPrince304

Back to Hacking after exams!!!

Sweet Smoochum

Banned

Cyberglass

the stuff Porygon are made of

Ho-Oh

used Sacred Fire!

Shining Meganium

A Pixy

Cruel?

riddleraven

GunSaberSeraph

Durandal of the Devic Era

riddleraven

Guy

just a guy

Agent Clank

Bye PC

Elise

ニャーニャー

Serin

Noob

Waki Tobaye

Now known as City Checkpoint.

Jerme

stupid

Dillon_68

Lover of Winter

Zeta Sukuna

Descendant of the Inchlings

Ripley

Trap-Eds

Dig a hole, dig a hole........