The reason people are afraid to come forward and ask for help is because admitting that is putting your career and personal reputation on the line for something that most probably feel that they can control (and most probably can). There are plenty of examples in the past few years where people have admitted to being attracted to children (though not acting on it) and having their lives ruined because of it.
Is paedophilia inherently wrong?
- Thread starter Shining Raichu
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Are you sure about that? Pedophilia requires them to be prepubescent. You're probably thinking of the Greeks' pederasty, which is different.
Also keep in mind that places like Greece weren't the only ancient civilisations. Just because they didn't object to homosexuality, doesn't mean homophobia is new. e.g. Plato was against homosexuality way back in 350 BCE.
FreakyLocz14
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Some teens might not be mature enough to enter into a consenual sexual relationship; then again, neither are many adults.
Shining Raichu
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Oh no you don't.
Firstly, it has been proven time and time again that sexuality is not changeable. It is not possible to turn a gay man straight, nor a straight man gay. Similarly, it would not be possible to stop a paedophile from being attracted to children (which by the way is the subject of this thread, not homosexuality).
Furthermore, I'm not sure if you're trolling or just extremely prejudiced, but as someone who is not heterosexual I can guarantee you that there is nothing acceptable or correct about anything you just said. To even suggest that a person 'should' be approached to change their sexual orientation is just disgusting.
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fango pango
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honestly i'm not a pedophile nor will i ever be one
but....the definition i find it
a pedophile is a male/female over 18 who fantasizes or has intercourse with males/females under 18
now this is definitely wrong in most cases
but....if it is mutual then i guess it's ok
....i mean my girlfriend is 16 and i'm 14....in 2 years does that make her a pedophile?
according to the definition i see it is
....but im ok with it so...i dont think its wrong
....so
if its mutual its ok
if it isnt then its certainly wrong in this day and age
but....the definition i find it
a pedophile is a male/female over 18 who fantasizes or has intercourse with males/females under 18
now this is definitely wrong in most cases
but....if it is mutual then i guess it's ok
....i mean my girlfriend is 16 and i'm 14....in 2 years does that make her a pedophile?
according to the definition i see it is
....but im ok with it so...i dont think its wrong
....so
if its mutual its ok
if it isnt then its certainly wrong in this day and age
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Yes.
Pedophilia may not be the right choice for most of the world's population, but it isn't outrageous by any means. Furthermore, non-human animals have oft been documented in acts of both pedophilia and homosexuality, which damages the argument that it is not "natural."
Ice Car
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This depends entirely on who you are asking. Are you asking those who do have these feelings, those who are neutral, or those who are against or strongly against it? I'm neutral. People have their own interests, fetishes, or "things". I have no right to tell them they are wrong for having those thoughts. As long as they don't act upon them, I am completely fine and would treat them as a normal person.
I'll treat everyone the same way as long as they don't act like a jerkass or do something that violates what I think is right or wrong, if in a major way. In this case, pedophilia/sexual acts upon children deeply disturb and offend me. I would break all ties with such a person if I knew they had done so unless there was a very good reason for it.
I'll treat everyone the same way as long as they don't act like a jerkass or do something that violates what I think is right or wrong, if in a major way. In this case, pedophilia/sexual acts upon children deeply disturb and offend me. I would break all ties with such a person if I knew they had done so unless there was a very good reason for it.
Machu Pichu
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It really all depends on your standards.
Would a Christian find it wrong? Would an Atheist find it just as wrong? Would a Buddhist find it wrong? Would someone from China find it as wrong as someone from Finland?
The answer, on average, would be yes. It has been imbedded into most cultures that sexual intercourse with a child is "wrong" because they are not fully coherent enough to understand such actions towards them.
But then, there's a twist. What if the child is fully consenting and engaged in the relationship, and, under no circumstances, is being forced into it? Without the rape factor, is it still a crime? Is it still "wrong"?
This is where your standards come into play.
How large must the age gap be for such a relationship to become illegal? 6 years? 8 years? 10 years? Does the maturity of the child ever come into the consideration? What about the circumstances? Is the child happy? Would it still be "wrong" then?
The answers to these questions, I do not know, because, as I said, it's based on your standards. What do I believe? I believe that such matters are taken way too lightly, and the American Legal System will simply jump on anything that seems like Pedophilia to them, and mash a "sexual predator" label on the defendant in an instant, because we have to "protect the children."
And I'm definitely not saying that there aren't sick people out there, which do NOT fall into the category above, that do hurt children and do need to be imprisoned, but I've heard of people simply talking to children on the street who were immediately listed as sexual predators, their lives ruined in the process. Could you imagine trying to apply for a job with the words "sexual predator" listed on your record?
*is not a pedophile*
Would a Christian find it wrong? Would an Atheist find it just as wrong? Would a Buddhist find it wrong? Would someone from China find it as wrong as someone from Finland?
The answer, on average, would be yes. It has been imbedded into most cultures that sexual intercourse with a child is "wrong" because they are not fully coherent enough to understand such actions towards them.
But then, there's a twist. What if the child is fully consenting and engaged in the relationship, and, under no circumstances, is being forced into it? Without the rape factor, is it still a crime? Is it still "wrong"?
This is where your standards come into play.
How large must the age gap be for such a relationship to become illegal? 6 years? 8 years? 10 years? Does the maturity of the child ever come into the consideration? What about the circumstances? Is the child happy? Would it still be "wrong" then?
The answers to these questions, I do not know, because, as I said, it's based on your standards. What do I believe? I believe that such matters are taken way too lightly, and the American Legal System will simply jump on anything that seems like Pedophilia to them, and mash a "sexual predator" label on the defendant in an instant, because we have to "protect the children."
And I'm definitely not saying that there aren't sick people out there, which do NOT fall into the category above, that do hurt children and do need to be imprisoned, but I've heard of people simply talking to children on the street who were immediately listed as sexual predators, their lives ruined in the process. Could you imagine trying to apply for a job with the words "sexual predator" listed on your record?
*is not a pedophile*
OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire
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I wondered this too but about Polygramy, why should polygramy be illegal sure it's seen as bad but so was/are same sex couples.
On topic: Age only seems to be relevent between kid-adult couples...
I think people don't like to accept pedophilia cause they feel it's creepy/ pedo's are creepy. Also some of those kids are too immature to be in relationships (even with kids there age no matter what they might think) especially a sexual one with a grown man/woman.
On topic: Age only seems to be relevent between kid-adult couples...
I think people don't like to accept pedophilia cause they feel it's creepy/ pedo's are creepy. Also some of those kids are too immature to be in relationships (even with kids there age no matter what they might think) especially a sexual one with a grown man/woman.
Shining Raichu
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This is actually a fair point some people bring up. If you were talking to someone with the knowledge that they were indeed sexually attracted to children, would you be more likely to judge them if they looked like this:
than if they looked like this?
--
Would having a stereotypical 'creepy paedophile' look influence whether or not you thought of them as a threat?
than if they looked like this?
--
Would having a stereotypical 'creepy paedophile' look influence whether or not you thought of them as a threat?
Dawn
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One would suggest that because we accept homosexuality we should accept pretty much every other sexual orientation. However, that is a pretty shallow point in that it is defeated by simply pointing out that just because two things are a sexual orientation does not make them the same thing or even necessarily comparable. Let's just leave it at the fact that homosexuality is /extremely/ tame on the list of non-standard orientations.
As you go down the spectrum of non-standard orientations you would find that orientations farther down the line cease to be like homosexuality. They become everything we used to think homosexuality was. There are orientations out there that objectively hint at a very sick mind. Hence, somewhere along that spectrum we have to say "Kay, this is going too far. We need to stop here."
Where exactly that somewhere is is not for me to say or discuss. I merely point out that such a somewhere exists for the purposes of implying that Paedophilia is probably past that line.
Is it inherently wrong? No. Problably not. Neither is murder, or pretty much /anything else/. Most of what we view as right and wrong is not just there magically but rather is instilled in some way and can be changed in some way. Does not being inherently wrong mean it's not wrong at all? Heck no.
As you go down the spectrum of non-standard orientations you would find that orientations farther down the line cease to be like homosexuality. They become everything we used to think homosexuality was. There are orientations out there that objectively hint at a very sick mind. Hence, somewhere along that spectrum we have to say "Kay, this is going too far. We need to stop here."
Where exactly that somewhere is is not for me to say or discuss. I merely point out that such a somewhere exists for the purposes of implying that Paedophilia is probably past that line.
Is it inherently wrong? No. Problably not. Neither is murder, or pretty much /anything else/. Most of what we view as right and wrong is not just there magically but rather is instilled in some way and can be changed in some way. Does not being inherently wrong mean it's not wrong at all? Heck no.
Oryx
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I have to point out that often, children will want to do things that are bad for them. When I was a kid, I wanted to run away because I read The Boxcar Children and thought that running away was "cool". I was perfectly happy at home, I just wanted an adventure. If I had gone through with it, my life would have been drastically different today. Looking back on my past, especially 13-16, I can see that I thought I was as mature as an adult when I really had the maturity of...well, a 13-16 year old.
It's not about "age gap", except when it gets above the age of 14-16. Before that, there is no child that has the maturity to handle a sexual relationship with someone over the age of 18. They may think they do, just like I thought at 14 that I knew everything and was totally ready to go out into the adult world, but they're wrong. I'm not getting into sexual relationships with other people their own age because that's an entirely other topic here.
You're a bit off topic from the idea of pedophilia being wrong and the idea of child molestation being wrong. No one here is arguing that children can be in a consenting relationship at any age and therefore cannot be molested as long as they consent. It's pretty obvious that the laws (in most places) account for a higher level of maturity in older teens, while being strict on younger children because they in no way can consent. In many places, if a child is over the age of 14-16 (it varies), there is a small age gap that makes it okay to have sex with them if they consent. Usually it goes up to ~5 years older than the child, or to 20. This weeds out the people that are actually interested in the person because they're more mature for their age, and the people that are interested in them because they're 14-16.
Age becomes less relevant with...age. A 40 year old woman married to a 50 year old man doesn't turn any heads, but an 18 year old interested in an 8 year old? Yeah. This is relevant to the maturity level of the people involved; at a young age you mature quite quickly, and there's a large difference between years. 2 years can irrevocably change a person from 16-18 or younger, for example. A 40 year old aging 2 years won't change their personality and mindset too much, not compared to the changes they go through in youth.
However, once the age gap becomes too great, age does become a factor no matter how old you are. I would say that age gap is ~20 years. When you're older it doesn't turn heads as much as when you're younger (think 18/38 relationship), but then you have to deal with one of you growing older much faster than the other, which is its own set of challenges.
@Shining Raichu: I do think that appearance, as well as age, play a part in the opinions of people towards pedophiles...but it's the same as anything else. That's why as a defendant in a court case, no matter what you were accused of, you make sure you come into court wearing professional clothes and looking neat. That first man, while also looking dirty, immediately makes the mind jump to "there's something wrong in his head". Obviously he doesn't feel the need to take care of himself to a point that he looks neat, so combining that innate knowledge of neatness and mental capacity, people subconsciously make the leap that he's dangerous because he's not mentally stable.
The second man, on the other hand, is well-groomed to show that he's just the average guy. Other than his attraction to children, he does not look at all mentally unstable or likely to prey on the average child. In fact, most people would even go so far as to assume that if he was a 'sexual predator', it was due to a mishap with a younger girlfriend that consented instead of a child.
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I think it's sad that some mature, if underage people have to be denied the freedom to engage in relationships, but since there is no sure way to find out who is and who isn't mature enough we have to have arbitrary standards and in this case that's age. That's why we say that children can't legally consent. To protect as many children as we can because we can't be sure, but we're pretty sure that most of the time it would be the wrong choice to let them into relationships like that.
But I agree with you in that we're quick to start witch hunts and that's the wrong mindset.
Chikara
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LOL DOESN'T READ ENTIRE THREAD AT ALL.
We live in a society with people who watch and make pornographic videos involving waaaay stranger kinks than finding a child attractive. Like say... feet.
I don't think there's a problem with it, as long as it's never acted upon, like you said. I'm not generally opinionated about what people like in a sexual way, and I don't find it strange for people to get off on that.
New paragraph to avoid redundancy in my post. Whatever gets someone / you / me / anyone off, just as long as they're not a criminal about it.
We live in a society with people who watch and make pornographic videos involving waaaay stranger kinks than finding a child attractive. Like say... feet.
I don't think there's a problem with it, as long as it's never acted upon, like you said. I'm not generally opinionated about what people like in a sexual way, and I don't find it strange for people to get off on that.
New paragraph to avoid redundancy in my post. Whatever gets someone / you / me / anyone off, just as long as they're not a criminal about it.
Freedom Fighter N
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To be honest, I don't think children can be in love. Like and enjoy spending time with someone, of course. But love.. no way. Seriously my mother could have raped me and used that excuse, but ehh.. why did I get there.
As for maturity.. I don't know what the hell was up with her at that time, but one day my mother took me with her to a business meal, along with some other people who I have no idea who they are, what their position is and I don't really care. What I did get is positive comments about how mature I am. Add me a few centimetres, give me an adult body build, clothes that would fit me, and I'll blend in perfectly as one of the people in the meeting. Oh, I almost forgot, normal child behaviour was still there. Shyness is the only thing I can remember. Ohh, I almost forgot this as well: I was a completely uninterested in relationship child. Seriously, other than the way girls look.. or, some of them, I never really had an interest. I just said "I like girls" like what you expect a kid to say.
Age gap.. yeah that's something I hate. Seems like university students are what's hot for high school girls now. The excuse? Crap like "who are you to judge", "They're looking for someone mature", and my personal favourite, "love has no age". So said the paedophile!
Oh well, more reasons for me to get enjoyment from mocking girls about their night-spending habits.
Besides, it's too goddamn easy to manipulate children.
*Is a paedophile, absolutely loves children.
Oh, and this might be slightly inappropriate, but since we're already at a topic close to (or one that can relate to child sexuality), what do you think of:
https://www.confessionpost.com/10411/raised-son-daughter-to-have-sex-with-each-other
Attraction itself isn't anything physical. A person thinking about punching somebody but doesn't do it has not committed a crime.
Since all humans must be free to think, nobody can be criminalized for their interests, only their actions, which should be guided by their own morals.
But morals and character is a separate matter from attraction and interest. You can have strange interests but still be morally upright to know not to harm kids.
Yes... it's pretty innocent to compliment a kid. Definitely not inherently wrong.
There's nothing bad about finding a pre-pubscent person beautiful - what if they are? O_o No sense in denying credit where it is due.
Anyway, attraction isn't rape or intention to do harm, so it's silly to criminalize it. =D
Since all humans must be free to think, nobody can be criminalized for their interests, only their actions, which should be guided by their own morals.
But morals and character is a separate matter from attraction and interest. You can have strange interests but still be morally upright to know not to harm kids.
lol
Yes... it's pretty innocent to compliment a kid. Definitely not inherently wrong.
There's nothing bad about finding a pre-pubscent person beautiful - what if they are? O_o No sense in denying credit where it is due.
Anyway, attraction isn't rape or intention to do harm, so it's silly to criminalize it. =D
