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  #376    
Old November 11th, 2012 (9:12 AM).
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The problem with insurance is that forcing people to have insurance is a reaction, not an action. The action to begin with was to force insurance companies to cover people with pre-existing conditions without gouging them every month. Before this, a person who had a medical issue before they could walk may be denied insurance for the rest of their life, and if they find someone who would give it to them, they would be forced to pay exponentially more than another person, whether or not they're even ill anymore, because the insurance companies don't want to take on the liability. The point was to make insurance equal for every person.

But then it causes the problem of people gaming the system. If pre-existing conditions were never taken into consideration with insurance, then no one would ever need to get insurance until they got sick. They could get ill, then start paying for insurance, then drop it once they get better, over and over. This would end in insurance companies tanking because that's not how insurance is supposed to work. So the forcing of insurance is a reaction to allowing people with pre-existing conditions to get insurance, so people won't wait until they're sick to get insurance and drop it once they're well.
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  #377    
Old November 11th, 2012 (9:15 AM).
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    read an article that said the election proved republicans need to evolve or die stating how by 2020 the party will be no more if they don't have more liberaltarian stances even texas voted 40% for obama

    as a liberaltarian i want that party to die so more people vote liberaltarian

    my stance on universal health care is it sucks you force people to buy thing they dont need you need reform not a mandate thats why i disagree with obamacare wrong approach to the problem
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      #378    
    Old November 11th, 2012 (9:23 AM). Edited November 11th, 2012 by FreakyLocz14.
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    It seems that the issue people have here is white the evangelical movement, not with the Republican Party. The GOP's bedsharing with the evangelicals is actually quite recent. Old-school Republicans oppose national bans on same-sex marriage and abortion, as well oppose laws such as the Patriot Act and the NDAA 2012. They also voted in favor of most of the 1950s-60s era civil rights laws, while there was a concerted effort among Southern Democrats to filibuster them. There has been a resurgence in this brand of Republicanism in Congress, because the current neocon leadership's unpopularity has left the party in shambles and open to change from the inside.

    Speaking of the election results, it looks like not only will we have the same President if his illegal and unethical vote rigging is not challenged, the same leadership in the House, and 51-47-2 Senate in favor of the Democrats, meaning that there was absolutely no change in this election in leadership.
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      #379    
    Old November 11th, 2012 (10:08 AM). Edited November 11th, 2012 by Rodriguezjames55.
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      Quote:
      Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
      It seems that the issue people have here is white the evangelical movement, not with the Republican Party. The GOP's bedsharing with the evangelicals is actually quite recent. Old-school Republicans oppose national bans on same-sex marriage and abortion, as well oppose laws such as the Patriot Act and the NDAA 2012. They also voted in favor of most of the 1950s-60s era civil rights laws, while there was a concerted effort among Southern Democrats to filibuster it. There has been a resurgence in this brand of Republicanism in Congress, because the current neocon leadership's unpopularity has left the party in shambles and open to change from the inside.

      Speaking of the election results, it looks like not only will we have the same President if his illegal and unethical vote rigging not challenged, the same leadership in the House, and 51-47-2 Senate in favor of the Democrats, meaning that there was absolutely no change in this election in leadership.
      look robama/obamney had very similar policies only one person offered change

      click the pick for more comparisons
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        #380    
      Old November 11th, 2012 (10:16 AM).
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      I don't think it's just evangelicals that have made people turn away from the GOP. It's the tea party as well. Them and their insistence that they won't compromise on anything. Just the whole hard line that Republicans have taken in recent years, from their brinkmanship with the debt ceiling to the squicky comments about rape (as a "method of conception" and so on) in their stance on abortion.

      Romney was supposed to be the Republican that didn't have a far-right stance on social issues, but he campaigned as if he did and that undermined his credibility as a candidate that would be different from the rest of the pack.
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        #381    
      Old November 11th, 2012 (10:37 AM).
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      Quote:
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      look robama/obamney had very similar policies only one person offered change

      click the pick for more comparisons
      Pro-guns? Insane budget cuts now? Destroying Government spending? Abolish the Fed? Kill the closest thing to Health Care the US has had? Well, that sounds like someone I'd never vote for. I do applaud the reduction in military spanding, but that's highly unlikely to happen in the current world.

      Also that picture smells a bit like propaganda, but hey.
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        #382    
      Old November 11th, 2012 (10:50 AM).
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        Pro-guns? Insane budget cuts now? Destroying Government spending? Abolish the Fed? Kill the closest thing to Health Care the US has had? Well, that sounds like someone I'd never vote for. I do applaud the reduction in military spanding, but that's highly unlikely to happen in the current world.

        Also that picture smells a bit like propaganda, but hey.
        protecting the 2nd amendment cutting spend to prevent a economic collapse like Russia had giving states more rights have a free market health care system and having a state health care for people with pre existing conditions sounds american enough
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          #383    
        Old November 11th, 2012 (11:08 AM).
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          This thread is dedicated to discussion of the future US Presidential, Gubernatorial and Congressional election in November 2016. The purpose of this thread is to discuss the various candidates, their positions, and the various other positions being voted on across the country. All news and discussion of the upcoming election will be placed in this thread

          I know its 4 years away but if your a Libertarian we are thinking about this election to end the duopoly we need 15% to get a Libertarian in the debates
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            #384    
          Old November 11th, 2012 (11:17 AM). Edited November 11th, 2012 by droomph.
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          Quote:
          Originally Posted by KingCharizard View Post
          Exactly I'm not paying a fine because I chose not to goto the hospital(Not have insurance), i even had my ribs broke and healed them at home on my own.. I dont like hospitals and I dont want to go. I haven't seen a doctor in about 6 or 7 years and I'm still healthy. If i dont need insurance, I'm not paying for it..

          Are people that ignorant to the escalating conflict in the Mid east? Its getting worse, and it will continue to get worse, if its gonna stabilize the US will need to step in as well as UN forces.

          I was saying he would have made a great president...

          Not in america, Read, although it seems the other way around our system is based on the "Innocent Until proven guilty" ideal, its up to lawyers to prove ur guilty without reasonable doubt while its up to a defense attorney to prove your innocence. Thats why most people with pending trials can walk the streets, a guilty man is not allowed to leave the jail, home, or whatever the conditions of the sentence are...

          Bad words, I'm sure he wished he could have back..
          Just because people like you don't want to go the doctor, which is pretty stupid imo, doesn't mean that the majority of people who can't afford to go to the doctor but desperately need one can't have that guarantee.

          And no, he wouldn't. "Trickle down economics" was the basis of his campaign basically, and when's the last time you took your million dollars and used it to create jobs? You probably gave it all to a bloated bank who won't give loans to poor people, thus keeping the money stuck up there. That's why it doesn't work.

          And the fact that he wished he could have turned back doesn't change the fact that his views are completely unappealing to a majority of American citizens.

          Also just saying, it's definitely guilty until proven innocent. In logic, it's true until proven false, thus you have commited the crime until someone can prove otherwise. I'm pretty sure our courts wouldnt be as corrupted as to be the opposite of logic.
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            #385    
          Old November 11th, 2012 (4:10 PM). Edited November 11th, 2012 by Livewire.
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          Quote:
          Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
          It seems that the issue people have here is white the evangelical movement, not with the Republican Party. The GOP's bedsharing with the evangelicals is actually quite recent. Old-school Republicans oppose national bans on same-sex marriage and abortion, as well oppose laws such as the Patriot Act and the NDAA 2012. They also voted in favor of most of the 1950s-60s era civil rights laws, while there was a concerted effort among Southern Democrats to filibuster it. There has been a resurgence in this brand of Republicanism in Congress, because the current neocon leadership's unpopularity has left the party in shambles and open to change from the inside.

          Speaking of the election results, it looks like not only will we have the same President if his illegal and unethical vote rigging not challenged, the same leadership in the House, and 51-47-2 Senate in favor of the Democrats, meaning that there was absolutely no change in this election in leadership.
          Start coming up with some sources or some actual information or I'm going to start deleting these posts, you keep saying the same thing I've and over and over and the discussion keeps going into the gutter.

          Quote:
          Originally Posted by Zet
          Rmoney
          Quote:
          Originally Posted by Zet
          Rmoney


          Quote:
          Originally Posted by Zet
          Rmoney


          Please tell me this was on purpose, lol
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            #386    
          Old November 11th, 2012 (4:58 PM).
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          For this election, our choices were between two bowls of ****. The only difference was the smell.

          Anyway, http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/10/allen-west-patrick-murphy_n_2109313.html

          Looks like Allen is trying to do everything he can to stay in office. I'd say he's a sore loser, but given the large amount of election errors that Florida always has I'd say that his attempts are warranted. To a point.

          He still has money left over from his campaigning, so he's presumably going to use that to fund his lawyers in a attempt to get back his old job.

          I think that was intentional. I remember seeing a pic with his family in shirts like that, ment to spell out Romney but instead spelt out Rmoney. I don't know if it was real or shopped though.
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            #387    
          Old November 11th, 2012 (5:36 PM).
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          Quote:
          Originally Posted by KingCharizard View Post
          Exactly I'm not paying a fine because I chose not to goto the hospital(Not have insurance), i even had my ribs broke and healed them at home on my own.. I dont like hospitals and I dont want to go. I haven't seen a doctor in about 6 or 7 years and I'm still healthy. If i dont need insurance, I'm not paying for it..

          Are people that ignorant to the escalating conflict in the Mid east? Its getting worse, and it will continue to get worse, if its gonna stabilize the US will need to step in as well as UN forces.



          Not in america, Read, although it seems the other way around our system is based on the "Innocent Until proven guilty" ideal, its up to lawyers to prove ur guilty without reasonable doubt while its up to a defense attorney to prove your innocence. Thats why most people with pending trials can walk the streets, a guilty man is not allowed to leave the jail, home, or whatever the conditions of the sentence are...
          Healing your own ribs? If you were trying to prove how stupid you are, I'd say you did a job well done! Your lungs aren't indestructible, in fact even the smallest drop of water in there will have you gasping for air. Can you guess what would happen if your ribs were poking them? I would also say you're extremely unhealthy, it's recommended to visit a Doctor at least a few times a year, not once a decade.

          And for someone who talks about the Middle East, you certainly are behind on the news about it.

          Also you would need to read actual courtroom cases to understand that it is Guilty until prove Inncocent. People may say "Innocent until proven Guilty", but that's just silly.


          Quote:
          Originally Posted by Rodriguezjames55 View Post
          read an article that said the election proved republicans need to evolve or die stating how by 2020 the party will be no more if they don't have more liberaltarian stances even texas voted 40% for obama

          as a liberaltarian i want that party to die so more people vote liberaltarian

          my stance on universal health care is it sucks you force people to buy thing they dont need you need reform not a mandate thats why i disagree with obamacare wrong approach to the problem
          Except Freakylocz pointed out on the other page that Obamacare isn't universal :P

          Quote:
          Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
          It seems that the issue people have here is white the evangelical movement, not with the Republican Party. The GOP's bedsharing with the evangelicals is actually quite recent. Old-school Republicans oppose national bans on same-sex marriage and abortion, as well oppose laws such as the Patriot Act and the NDAA 2012. They also voted in favor of most of the 1950s-60s era civil rights laws, while there was a concerted effort among Southern Democrats to filibuster it. There has been a resurgence in this brand of Republicanism in Congress, because the current neocon leadership's unpopularity has left the party in shambles and open to change from the inside.

          Speaking of the election results, it looks like not only will we have the same President if his illegal and unethical vote rigging not challenged, the same leadership in the House, and 51-47-2 Senate in favor of the Democrats, meaning that there was absolutely no change in this election in leadership.
          Who was the last greatest Republican anyway? Abe Lincoln? I'm sorry, but even as someone who lives in Australia my knowledge of overseas history and politics is limited.

          Also Rmoney might have gotten some illegal and unethical votes. ;x

          Quote:
          Originally Posted by Rodriguezjames55 View Post
          look robama/obamney had very similar policies only one person offered change

          click the pick for more comparisons
          Oh Boy, fresh delicious propaganda! It's always such a filling breakfast of lies and Grade A ********! :D

          Quote:
          Originally Posted by Livewire View Post
          Start coming up with some sources or some actual information or I'm going to start deleting these posts, you keep saying the same thing I've and over and over and the discussion keeps going into the gutter.



          Rmoney

          Rmoney

          Please tell me this was on purpose, lol
          Hilariously enough, Freaky has been providing true facts and not some Fox Nation crap.

          And yes, I did do it on purpose. That typo image of a family wearing Romney shirts was entertaining.





          And this is a uh, wow just wow thing: http://www.examiner.com/article/15-states-including-texas-have-filed-a-petition-to-secede-from-the-united-states-1
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            #388    
          Old November 11th, 2012 (5:53 PM).
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          That petition site is just full of silly things. Nothing is going to happen through it.
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            #389    
          Old November 11th, 2012 (6:36 PM). Edited November 11th, 2012 by Mr. X.
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          Yeah, we all know how succession will turn out.

          Although the states, supposedly, have the right to secede history shows us that we will use extreme force to prevent such a thing from happening.

          Anyway,

          http://www.examiner.com/article/3-conservatives-that-deserve-blame-for-the-republican-destruction-of-the-economy

          http://money.cnn.com/2012/11/09/news/companies/coal-layoffs-obama/
          *Pay attention to the last part, the rules although put in effect by Obama are because of the Clean Air Act, which was passed by Nixon, and strengthened by Bush.*
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            #390    
          Old November 11th, 2012 (7:28 PM).
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            Oh Boy, fresh delicious propaganda! It's always such a filling breakfast of lies and Grade A ********! :D
            not propaganda research him that was a average dude picture
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              #391    
            Old November 11th, 2012 (7:32 PM).
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            It doesn't matter if it was any picture. Support your claims with facts and evidence from non-partisan sources, please.

            As far as I'm concerned, that picture doesnt cut it at all in terms of evidence.
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              #392    
            Old November 11th, 2012 (7:45 PM). Edited November 11th, 2012 by Rodriguezjames55.
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              here you go non bias sources along with his website
              non bias
              his site
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                #393    
              Old November 11th, 2012 (7:49 PM).
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              I think I'm more worried about the other stances listed in there, those of the other candidates.
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                #394    
              Old November 11th, 2012 (8:00 PM).
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              Quote:
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              here you go non bias sources along with his website
              non bias
              his site
              But where is the evidence stating that the "outrageous acts" of the other two have supposedly "supported" is, in fact, true? Nothing is telling me you didn't just write down some fake ******** and say that "hey look, Gary Johnson is better because he wont do what I think the other two will do!"
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                #395    
              Old November 11th, 2012 (8:23 PM).
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              Quote:
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              The problem with insurance is that forcing people to have insurance is a reaction, not an action. The action to begin with was to force insurance companies to cover people with pre-existing conditions without gouging them every month. Before this, a person who had a medical issue before they could walk may be denied insurance for the rest of their life, and if they find someone who would give it to them, they would be forced to pay exponentially more than another person, whether or not they're even ill anymore, because the insurance companies don't want to take on the liability. The point was to make insurance equal for every person.

              But then it causes the problem of people gaming the system. If pre-existing conditions were never taken into consideration with insurance, then no one would ever need to get insurance until they got sick. They could get ill, then start paying for insurance, then drop it once they get better, over and over. This would end in insurance companies tanking because that's not how insurance is supposed to work. So the forcing of insurance is a reaction to allowing people with pre-existing conditions to get insurance, so people won't wait until they're sick to get insurance and drop it once they're well.
              Insurance is all about hedging risks. A person with pre-existing conditions is a greater risk to health insurance companies, so it makes sense for them to treat them differently.
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                #396    
              Old November 11th, 2012 (8:36 PM).
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              Quote:
              Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
              Insurance is all about hedging risks. A person with pre-existing conditions is a greater risk to health insurance companies, so it makes sense for them to treat them differently.
              But the problem is, they're charging too much, even for charging higher than usual. That's called "gouging", and in the long term, benifits noone.
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                #397    
              Old November 11th, 2012 (8:40 PM).
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              not propaganda research him that was a average dude picture
              Neither Obama or Mittens are anti-gun. Obama wants to ban the sales of assault weapons(he's fine with hand guns, and I haven't seen any news at all that Mittens is anti-gun), and he also brought home troops when he was first elected. Everything about Obama and Mittens in that image is wrong and making them look bad so you'd vote for Johnson.
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                #398    
              Old November 11th, 2012 (8:41 PM).
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              If we are hedging bets, then why don't they deny insurance to those in the military or those living in high crime area's?

              You have here, two groups of people that are both great risks to insurance companies. The military more so, since a lot of them end up getting limbs blown off.

              Edit - About Obama and gun control, this is the NRA's fault. When he got elected, they all cried 'all weapons gonna get banned, all weapons gonna get banned!'. And guess what, he didn't in that term. I'm expecting the NRA to do this again.
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                #399    
              Old November 11th, 2012 (8:48 PM).
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                Quote:
                Originally Posted by Zet View Post
                Neither Obama or Mittens are anti-gun. Obama wants to ban the sales of assault weapons(he's fine with hand guns, and I haven't seen any news at all that Mittens is anti-gun), and he also brought home troops when he was first elected. Everything about Obama and Mittens in that image is wrong and making them look bad so you'd vote for Johnson.
                no they DO want more gun regulation dont belive check the national gun society site
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                  #400    
                Old November 11th, 2012 (8:50 PM). Edited November 11th, 2012 by Zet.
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                If we are hedging bets, then why don't they deny insurance to those in the military or those living in high crime area's?

                You have here, two groups of people that are both great risks to insurance companies. The military more so, since a lot of them end up getting limbs blown off.

                Edit - About Obama and gun control, this is the NRA's fault. When he got elected, they all cried 'all weapons gonna get banned, all weapons gonna get banned!'. And guess what, he didn't in that term. I'm expecting the NRA to do this again.
                They already have. People have been buying guns like crazy... again.

                Quote:
                Originally Posted by Rodriguezjames55 View Post
                no they DO want more gun regulation dont belive check the national gun society site
                Sure, I'll take a gun nuts opinion on something that hasn't even happened or will happen... and hasn't even been mentioned in the slightest.
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