Game Development: Quality vs. Quantity

[InMooseWeTrust]

After being a PokéCommunity member for a year and a half, the thing that most bugs me about game development and game developers is that everyone has to have everything his/her own way. As a result, you have an ever-expanding list of mediocre games in the Plot and Story Idea Space and Games Showcase.

And they usually have the same basic ideas: you're a 10-15 year old boy or girl in a region in the starter town getting one of three starter Pokémon. The Professor is a tree and you have no father. You go on a journey and the route names start at 1, 101, 201, etc.. There are a bunch of towns and some of them have badges. You beat all 8 badges to challenge the local Pokémon League.

Sadly, only a small number of games can claim to have 100% completed the region. Instead of making a completely playable game, people instead focus nearly all their energy on features. Features are nice, but what's the point of making all those custom tiles, 100 fakemon (plus all the old ones), and all those minigames if no one will ever be able to play them? By that, I mean 99.99% of all Pokémon fangames don't have a demo out with a lot of hours of gameplay (with the number of bugs at a tolerable level) and 0.00% of the games have ever been finished.

Because of the ambitiousness and sheer impracticality of the projects, most people will work on them for a few weeks or a few months (some maybe a year or two) and then just... give up. There are lots of highly talented game developers here, but this is how most of them end up.

I think we would do a whole lot better as a community if we were willing to pool our ideas and compromise each other's goals into a smaller number of games. That way we would be able to put our heads together and work as true teams (instead of as one person is the supreme creator of the game and the rest have to obey exactly what the creator says). If we do that more often, then the quality of the games will skyrocket. Yes, that means you would have to sacrifice a lot of ideas that you would like to be put into the game, but the best things happen when you work together.

That's how all the truly great games are made.

I accidentally voted for Quantity, by the way. I meant to vote for Quality.

 

[CHG-Swampert]

....... you know... thats a brilliant idea. All the game designers in PC could come together and we could think something up. but you know we'd have to decide on alot of stuff including the language and all this other stuff lol. Wouldn't be hard but its a good idea mate :)

 

[Conan Edogawa]

After being a PokéCommunity member for a year and a half, the thing that most bugs me about game development and game developers is that everyone has to have everything his/her own way. As a result, you have an ever-expanding list of mediocre games in the Plot and Story Idea Space and Games Showcase.

And they usually have the same basic ideas: you're a 10-15 year old boy or girl in a region in the starter town getting one of three starter Pokémon. The Professor is a tree and you have no father. You go on a journey and the route names start at 1, 101, 201, etc.. There are a bunch of towns and some of them have badges. You beat all 8 badges to challenge the local Pokémon League.

Sadly, only a small number of games can claim to have 100% completed the region. Instead of making a completely playable game, people instead focus nearly all their energy on features. Features are nice, but what's the point of making all those custom tiles, 100 fakemon (plus all the old ones), and all those minigames if no one will ever be able to play them? By that, I mean 99.99% of all Pokémon fangames don't have a demo out with a lot of hours of gameplay (with the number of bugs at a tolerable level) and 0.00% of the games have ever been finished.

Because of the ambitiousness and sheer impracticality of the projects, most people will work on them for a few weeks or a few months (some maybe a year or two) and then just... give up. There are lots of highly talented game developers here, but this is how most of them end up.

I think we would do a whole lot better as a community if we were willing to pool our ideas and compromise each other's goals into a smaller number of games. That way we would be able to put our heads together and work as true teams (instead of as one person is the supreme creator of the game and the rest have to obey exactly what the creator says). If we do that more often, then the quality of the games will skyrocket. Yes, that means you would have to sacrifice a lot of ideas that you would like to be put into the game, but the best things happen when you work together.

That's how all the truly great games are made.

I agree the quality of the games would improve. Sacrifice is important in a team.

 

[InMooseWeTrust]

....... you know... thats a brilliant idea. All the game designers in PC could come together and we could think something up. but you know we'd have to decide on alot of stuff including the language and all this other stuff lol. Wouldn't be hard but its a good idea mate :)

It doesn't have to be one game. I'm saying there should be FEWER games, with a lot more cooperation between game developers.

 

[magna15]

When it comes to game development and stuff, I'm more than happy to hear what my team mates have to say and offer, because when it comes to programming and scripting i'm hoorendous. I'm allways open to new ideas, and i'll take a vote with the rest of everyone.

 

[PokemonOI]

I disagree with this. I believe that this is only relevant to you and maybe to others like yo because Your game doesnt have custom tiles and doesnt have new features. I dont think you understand where people like myself and others are coming from because your not making a custom game.Your game is based off of recreating the old maps and events that we've already played in the past games and calling it a new game. Where there are others that create new pokemon,tiles,events and features that have never been in a pokemon game. I think coming together will result in fights or disagreements or have other developers who dont have good ideas stealing group ideas for their own game.

 

[Ty 101]

I would be willing to help out with a community game. But, I would not be willing to give up my own game to help out on another game full time.

 

[InMooseWeTrust]

I disagree with this. I believe that this is only relevant to you and maybe to others like yo because Your game doesnt have custom tiles and doesnt have new features. I dont think you understand where people like myself and others are coming from because your not making a custom game.Your game is based off of recreating the old maps and events that we've already played in the past games and calling it a new game. Where there are others that create new pokemon,tiles,events and features that have never been in a pokemon game. I think coming together will result in fights or disagreements or have other developers who dont have good ideas stealing group ideas for their own game.

Who are you to talk about stealing from other people? What about the battle animations on Infinite Rainbow that you always boasted about? They're made by victorspvl, and he was NEVER mentioned in the credits. I know this because the game I'm working on has the exact same battle animations. Do you want me to report this to the moderators? I may have fewer custom graphics than you do, but at least I don't take something from someone else without giving something back, and then claim his/her work as my own.

How many other people's custom work did you steal without giving credit?

My game doesn't have any custom features? That is the most hypocritical thing that you can say. And besides, it's not like anybody can try out your game and see how good your "features" are, so you have no reason to be boasting about them.

 

[PokemonOI]

Who are you to talk about stealing from other people? What about the battle animations on Infinite Rainbow that you always boasted about? They're made by victorspvl, and he was NEVER mentioned in the credits. I know this because the game I'm working on has the exact same battle animations. Do you want me to report this to the moderators? I may have fewer custom graphics than you do, but at least I don't take something from someone else without giving something back, and then claim his/her work as my own.

How many other people's custom work did you steal without giving credit?

My game doesn't have any custom features? That is the most hypocritical thing that you can say. And besides, it's not like anybody can try out your game and see how good your "features" are, so you have no reason to be boasting about them.

First of all I have credited him and second you dont know the deal me and victorspvl had. Not to mention if you wanna bring up custom stuff I've had to heavily edit the animations that he gave me there are few of his that I've actually kept. Also I dont wanna start a fight but I never took credit for victors work because there are very few of the animations of his that are in my game I take credit for the things I do. I dont steal custom stuff from anyone especially when unlike you i can make my own. If your saying it not like anyone can try out my game to see my features because I havent rushed a demo with numerous errors in it like you have then your right. I wasnt boasting about anything. All that I'm saying is that this is just a reason for people like you to team up with other game developers because you cant do most of the stuff yourself...I dont think this has anything to do with how many games are around here lol.

 

[InMooseWeTrust]

"All that I'm saying is that this is just a reason for people like you to team up with other game developers because you cant do most of the stuff yourself...I dont think this has anything to do with how many games are around here lol."

I'd like to know how much YOU can do by YOURSELF. The way you worded that it sounds like you can do a lot of this without a huge team of support and endless supply of resources.

 

[PokemonOI]

"All that I'm saying is that this is just a reason for people like you to team up with other game developers because you cant do most of the stuff yourself...I dont think this has anything to do with how many games are around here lol."

I'd like to know how much YOU can do by YOURSELF. The way you worded that it sounds like you can do a lot of this without a huge team of support and endless supply of resources.

No I'm not saying that at all. I'm not good at scripting at all....everything else isnt hard at all. I dont have a HUGE team, I also dont have a endless supply of resources but I can create my own. I can actually do alot of stuff on my own. But I'm done with this I just gave my opinion on this like the other posters did....is it because I disagreed? who knows and really who cares but whatever.

 

[DamianLeonhart]

I also have to disagree with this. Although this may be the internet, in the real world, what you are saying doesn't work. Take for example, everyone here who is a "mapper". Let's say there are 100 of them, and each know exactly where the maps are to connect and have the same tiles. We get one map from each of them, we now have 100 maps that connect, with the same tiles, that are completely different. Everyone has their own style of doing things. This would be like asking Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft to work together to make one entertainment system or Microsoft, Apple, and Linux to work together to make one operating system. It is not going to happen, because each one has their own goals. Teams need leaders, it is as plain as that. If it were not for the leaders, each one of these games would not have its own special little things, this community would not exist, or the computer you are using would not have been built. A leader helps direct along with pulling their own weight.

What is a game without its features. Why would I want to play Pokemon Protectors(my honest favorite, that's why I chose it), if it was like every other game, or Kyle and Co. MMORPG had it not have its own special touches that have been added to it. Also you are wrong, there has been one game completed, but it has been a while since then.

I won't vote because it's a public pole. That is just my thing. But if I had to choose, it would be both. I want lots of different games, with their own special touches.

 

[~JV~]

Really, it would be great to see more colaboration between the developpers, but I have to agree with PokemonOI at one point. I doubt that your game is aiming for quality, you shouldn't vote for that. Seriously, it's impossbile to make a game that involves all the existing regions and all of them with quality. Also, custom tiles, fakemon, custom music etc are considered as an important game quality raiser, at least for me. Also, the almost no existence of demos doesn't mean that the game is bad...

 

[PokemonOI]

Well I can tell that only game developers like Wichu can do most things by themselves. You, for instance, can only make 1% of your game if you work alone(don't tell me your teammates helped nothing on your project). Remember, your game would only be 1% of what it is right now if you don't team up with anyone.

HOF I'd have to disagree....not even wichu can do it all himself. I never said anything about doing everything myself and 1% I'd think it would be much higher.Because I dont think my teammates do 99% of the work. are you telling me you do 1% of the work on your game?

 

[Waudby]

There's no such thing as unique ideas anymore, game making has been around for such a long time that most of the really cool ideas have already been used in most commercial games, it's just a matter of getting someone to implement them.

On the side of making a huge community game, there's a lot of people here who use different software and different programming languages.

I personally think that more progress is made being keeping to how it is now, where developers strive to get the attention for their games.

 

[~JV~]

Also the competitivity between fangames estimulates the creation of new systems and the overall game quality. Also, I do believe that the main game designers (I mean the leaders from the teams) make at least 70% of their own game work...

 

[PokemonOI]

See this is what I mean. ~JV~,wauby and myself are saying the same thing basically. We dont mind collaboration but I think that maybe we have a different view on this because we are doing a different thing than you. we are making games that are custom with new music,features, pokemon...etc.Even Damienleonhart is basically saying the same thing. Different goals have made the GD section what is now why change it?

 

[Hall Of Famer]

HOF I'd have to disagree....not even wichu can do it all himself. I never said anything about doing everything myself and 1% I'd think it would be much higher.Because I dont think my teammates do 99% of the work. are you telling me you do 1% of the work on your game?

Well I have to say that you can't create your game without helpers as well. I already deleted my post since Moose made a similar comment. Anyway, I don't want to be involved in the conflict between Moose and you. But remember, don't make dumb comments like "you're not making a custom game". Even hacks like Pokemon Shiny gold is a custom game unless it's completely a remake.

 

[PokemonOI]

Well I have to say that you can't create your game without helpers as well. I already deleted my post since Moose made a similar comment. Anyway, I don't want to be involved in the conflict between Moose and you. But remember, don't ever make comments like "you're not making a custom game". Even hacks like Pokemon Shiny gold is a custom game unless it's completely a remake.

I never said "you're not making a custom game". I'm saying is that moose thinks that quality of the game takes a big huge team of game developers and it not true. he even went as far as to say why spend time making custom stuff? well I ask why spend all that time redoing all the stuff that we've already seen and played. What I'm trying to say is everyone working on one game doesnt make a game good at all if anything it creates a bunch of havok IMO

 

[~JV~]

Also, I think that super big teams just turns out things a big mess. It gets impossible to organizate things, people start fighiting each other etc. I particulary only like teams that at most have 6 or 7 workers. And opposedly as moose said, custom stuff adds A LOT to the game quality. If it didn't, it wouldn't be something that everyone likes to comment on and see on the games...