Atheist Alliance

[SmashBrony]

I don't know if I'll join this club, but I'd like to answer the topics anyways if that's ok.


What are your opinions on subjects such as same-sex marriage, abortion, the death penalty, and so on? Why?
Same Sex marriage:
Personally, I see homosexuality as ignoring the laws of nature, to ignore the way things are supposed to be.
But I know a homo-sexual & told her I'd support her.
That's what friends are supposed to do, to support their buddies.
I probaly sounded conterdicting, but no one is perfect...

Abortion:
It's MURDER, no matter what stage of preganty it is.
If you don't want a baby, don't do anything to have one in the first place.
Prevention is superior to the cure.

Death penalty:
If it's someone like Bin Laden or Adolf Hitler, yes.
& I think part of why we have so many criminals is because the law isn't severe enough...
But if the law does become more severe, I do hope they do a better job of telling the guilty from the innocent.

Why are your beliefs the way they are?

I have been raised in a Christian home.

Do you believe in any form of life after death?

Yes, I belive in Heaven & Hell.
I also belive I am covered by the blood of Jesus & therefore will go to Heaven after I die.

Do you believe in aliens?

In a universe as MASSIVE as ours, I have a hard time beliving that we are the only intelligent life out there...

Does your family and friends know about your faith? If no, why not?

My family knows & if I have any friends on-line that doesn't know, that's because they never asked about my spiritual viewpoint.

Do you think separation of church and state is different from freedom of religion?

Yes.
If people are allowed to practice their belifs at school, I expect the same for Christians.
But we live in a world that seems to HATE christians for any/no reasons & I have read stories of which the Muslims are allowed to wear their special headgear in school, (I don't remember what they are called...)
but they've tried to ban a christian girl from wearing her silver promise ring, "because it can be harmful".
How can a little ring be harmful?

If God does exist, what do you think it would be like?

For those who belives in God, they will find healing, strength & peace.

What are your family's general religious beliefs?

I can't say for the rest of my family, but here's how I see God:

He brings peace, not worry,
He gives strength, not weakness,
He gives wealth, not poorness,
He gives salavtion, not damnation,
He gives healing, not illness.

If any of you have questions regarding God, please PM me.
I can't promise all the answers, for I'm only human, but I'll do my best to straighten things out.

 

[Sonicspeed500]

Yeah, I'm ****ing dumb

 

[Gymnotide]

I'm back. It was my birthday yesterday. lol



Those are two completely different things that you're talking about.
What I had stated included an OR, not an AND.
OR is a difference, and AND is a connection that includes both.



same as....
Atheism is an absent belief in a deity
Atheism is an absent belief in a religion
I simply put an OR to combine the sentence, but with seperating the idea that there is a difference between them.

I never denied anything Gymnotide.
In fact, what I said never even mentioned Columbus, what you originally replied to me was a wild tangent off of what I said.
I simply said through obvious everyday knowledge that:



-WHICH IT WAS BY SOME PEOPLE. I never said Columbus knew it was round or that EVERYONE thought it was flat. The information about Columbus wasn't essential at all with what I was talking about, and it doesn't need to be added to my post to make it valid.

When I said the Big Bang Theory was false by the scientific community that founded it, you stated additional information about it and then claimed I was false. It doesn't mean I was wrong.

Telling me to ground my examples is an attempt to rub information in your face so you can trust me. Lets see you ground your examples? I work at a Bookstore, I can assuredly find multiple examples to prove that The Big Bang Theory was indeed posed into speculation about being invalid. It is a theory, you know, It doesn't mean it's been proven real anyway.

I don't need to provide an example for what I had said anymore than you would. If someone I had said was wrong, I would have no problem with you telling me so, but undermining my grammar and language to make me look like a fool is completely rude. I don't need to prove it, and I didn't go into detail to the point that I needed to prove it. I didn't impetuously say that I thought you didn't care. You have said so to me however. I did not have flaws in my "argument", be an argument as it may. In any case, I'm sure I am most assuredly banned from all of Landorus' clubs. : P

Since this is getting off-topic:

I took this discussion to PM.
Don't respond to it in this thread anymore.

 

[FrostPheonix]

Saw this, just came to say: Your sources say the following:
Princeton WorldNet: someone who does not believe in the existence of a god
Dictionary.com: a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings.
Answers.com (multiple): One who disbelieves or denies the existence of God or gods, non-believer, someone who denies the existence of a god
Mirriam-Webster: one who believes that there is no deity
The Free Dictionary: One who disbelieves or denies the existence of God or gods

So apparently, the definition that you provided "someone who denies the existence of god" is of your own creation, as each of your sources also included that it means "disbelieves" or "does not believe". The word "deny" is extremely biased when used by itself, as it implies that a god does exist, a claim for which there is no evidence.

Additionally, an atheist doesn't just not believe in God (Yahweh, Jehovah, Allah, each is the same), but we also do not believe in any other gods. Don't try to make your god more special by making it sound as if yours is the only one we don't believe in.

In fact, look at it this way: The only difference between my religious beliefs and yours is that I happen to believe in one less god that you do. (Paraphrased quote from someone, not exactly sure who)

Mehehe, i didnt, actually, make it up. I just copy pasted off google:

Spoiler:

Ah, well, seems google was lying to me about the definition.

I also never tried to make 'my God' special. Despite the fact that I beleive he is, in fact, special, I just capitalized it. Better if I wrote this?:

Yep, seems an atheist officially is someone who denies God any god or gods.

As for the multiuniverse theory nurse barbra mentioned, how do you think these came into existence?

Also, can someone please answer my question on how hindu-atheist works? forgot who, but someone mentioned it on a previous post. From what I know, it can't work.

 

[Gymnotide]

Also, can someone please answer my question on how hindu-atheist works? forgot who, but someone mentioned it on a previous post. From what I know, it can't work.

Sorry. I thought I addressed this, but I guess I didn't :S

Hinduism and Buddhism are two of the more liberal religions out there. While they have deities associated with them freely, some individuals have chosen to omit them from their faith. It's a bit hard for me to explain, but if you know how either of these religions work, it's clearer how the presence of god isn't necessary in worship. Half of it is spirituality, half is philosophy. However, unlike other philosophies, these hold things sacred.

Certain sects (like Jainism) believe that the material world can't come from a "god" or "gods," whom they believe are immaterial (because they can't observe them). Rather, the fate of the world is completely bound to the soul, both of the individual and the collective. The soul is intended to arbitrate itself (thereby ruling out any need for a deity or deities to do so) and accrues during its lifetime a pool of karma through actions. If a soul transcends through its actions, the soul then reaches a state of "godhood," but (is not a god and) cannot exert any force on the world. Once all the souls in the world reach a point of enlightenment (a state of no karma, not good karma), the universe is more or less complete. In this way, the soul is divine, rather than a deity that would have otherwise created it.

Buddhism, which is a distant offshoot of Hinduism, believes in a similar fashion. Each soul is bound to the mortal plane by its own existence and the goal of life is to meditate into a state of higher wisdom. Upon awakening in this state, a soul can transcend the cycle of rebirth (rebirth is a very, very bad thing that all souls must endure!) and reach Nirvana. In this way, the thought is divine, rather than a deity that would have otherwise created it. The Buddha is not regarded as god, but merely a paragon. Some Buddhists, however, are theistic and believe that gods exist--however, these gods are subject to the same judgment as all the other souls. The vast majority of Buddhists are atheists, though.

Carvaka is the third of the three large atheist factions related to Hinduism. This one is least similar out of the three. Rather than any preset goal to attain, life is merely as it is. It is generated of its own accord and ends definitively (there is no rebirth, no afterlife, no punishment, no judgment, etc.). Anything of the world is created in the way that it is by its own nature. If it can be, then it is--trying to understand the "why" and "how" of the world is irrelevant. In that, the "goal" of life is then to enjoy what the world has to offer, live to the fullest, be carefree and grateful for the ability to sense. In this way, life itself is divine, rather than a deity that would have otherwise created it.

If you don't get what I mean, here's a Wikipedia article to get you started: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism_in_Hinduism Just click around.

edit I've also done some more research and I've stumbled upon these few things:

Raelism (diaeresis on the e; Ra-EL-is-um) is an atheistic religion that believes that all god-like figures in the past (the Elohim), i.e. Jesus, the Christian God, angels, etc., were extraterrestrial messengers that came to Earth. These extraterrestrials were responsible for shaping the world as we know it and some still watch over the planet. Raelians believe that the world has fallen from the expectations of their creators; they aim to pacify the world in an attempt to appease the Elohim and be welcomed into their higher society. Many Rael support human cloning.

Unitarian Universalism is a sect of Christianity that is not limited by belief or practice. Its followers unite under the desire for spiritual growth, rather than due to a common belief in a deity. While many UUists are theistic and believe in the Christian God, there are atheistic UUists who practice religious code in the same way as other Christians. Other forms of Liberal Christianity do not limit themselves to the belief of God and seek morality, equality, peace, etc.

edit2 I'd also like to mention something that I'd learned a good year back. Paganism, chiefly that of the Ancient Greeks (that I know the best of), traditionally followed polytheistic rules by definition. However, it's also important to note that their deities probably didn't / don't exist. For example, most of the Greek deities embody things that aren't particularly godlike, but are personified according to metaphor. Ares, for example, is the god of war and rage. He may be given a figure every now and then, but a lot of his reference is that he IS rage. Strife and Discord arise when there is strife and discord. Zeus is rain. Poseidon is an earthquake. Athena is wisdom and battle technique. It's very possible that they worshiped the metaphors / emotions that we now interpret as "gods".

• irreligion (n.) the absence of, indifference towards, or hostility towards religion.
• agnosticism (n.) the belief that any information about the existence of god is liable to skepticism; a god or gods cannot be truly proven to exist.
• ignosticism (n.) the philosophy that all other philosophies (agnosticism chiefly) assume too much about a god or gods and pass judgment too quickly based on a generalized definition of god. Ignostics believe that the term "God" or "god" is fundamentally meaningless; since there is no coherent definition for "god," it must be defined by each individual before proving or disproving the existence of such a being.
• theism (n.) the belief that at least one deity exists.
• atheism (n.) the disbelief in the existence of a deity or deities. Disbelief is not a belief nor an anti-belief.
• belief (n.) the state of holding a proposition or premise (both terms in psychology / logic) as true. A proposition is always either true or false. Therefore, you don't believe in a religion--you follow a religion. You believe in the ideas the religion entails.

 

[World King]

Finally; a place for me! So, if no one minds (I know no one does), I'll join up.

I'm an Atheist, of course, but the subject of being an Atheist follower of a relligion sounds intriguing... o,o ​

 

[Gymnotide]

Finally; a place for me! So, if no one minds (I know no one does), I'll join up.

I'm an Atheist, of course, but the subject of being an Atheist follower of a relligion sounds intriguing... o,o ​

Well, if you think about how many gods modern monotheists reject from polytheistic religions, it's not hard to believe that atheistic religions can reject that last one that monotheists follow. For the same reason monotheists don't believe in the hundreds of gods from other pantheons, atheists don't believe in the one of monotheism.

 

[HarrisonH]

Mehehe, i didnt, actually, make it up. I just copy pasted off google:

Spoiler:

Ah, well, seems google was lying to me about the definition.

I also never tried to make 'my God' special. Despite the fact that I beleive he is, in fact, special, I just capitalized it. Better if I wrote this?:

Ah, my bad. Odd that Google is listing that as the source when that exact definition appears nowhere on that page...

Anyways, no, that is not better. I do not deny anything. I simply do not believe in any gods. Deny gives the impression that the existence of a god or any gods is true, which is completely unsupported by any evidence so far.



Is anyone else active with secular activism? I posted previously something that I had done (as well as two other people I know), and I'm also planning on starting a group with the Secular Student Alliance at my college this upcoming year.

 

[Gymnotide]

Ah, my bad. Odd that Google is listing that as the source when that exact definition appears nowhere on that page...

Anyways, no, that is not better. I do not deny anything. I simply do not believe in any gods. Deny gives the impression that the existence of a god or any gods is true, which is completely unsupported by any evidence so far.

Be that as it may, "deny" is used rather judiciously here. It's a matter of strict semantics--I understand the case you are trying to make, but "to refuse to believe" and "to reject" are also two of the definitions, slurred among "to contradict," "to refuse," and "to disavow." Deny is technically a correct word to use (though perhaps not the correctest).

I'd even file a case where every non-scientific dictionary gets the definition of "evolution" wrong, but that's for a different thread.

 

[NurseBarbra]

As for the multiuniverse theory nurse barbra mentioned, how do you think these came into existence?

I believe the "Big bang", Being two colliding "forces", was actually formed by 2 other universes that collide off eachother, and ours could have helped form 2^∞ other universes. I also believe that dimentions are formed the same way~

 

[FrostPheonix]

Ah, my bad. Odd that Google is listing that as the source when that exact definition appears nowhere on that page...

Anyways, no, that is not better. I do not deny anything. I simply do not believe in any gods. Deny gives the impression that the existence of a god or any gods is true, which is completely unsupported by any evidence so far.



Is anyone else active with secular activism? I posted previously something that I had done (as well as two other people I know), and I'm also planning on starting a group with the Secular Student Alliance at my college this upcoming year.

I still don't get how I made my God special, but I'll just leave it at that.

Also, I find it good that people get to make their own "atheistic club", and that schools are forced to allow them. Let people to get their say. Let them get together and talk about what they beleive.

I believe the "Big bang", Being two colliding "forces", was actually formed by 2 other universes that collide off eachother, and ours could have helped form 2^∞ other universes. I also believe that dimentions are formed the same way~

Well, then how did the two colliding forces come into being? What would be, in your opinion, the beginning of all dimensions?

 

[NurseBarbra]

Well, then how did the two colliding forces come into being? What would be, in your opinion, the beginning of all dimensions?

I meant that the collision or end of one or more universes are the begining of the next. I my opinion, The universe only exists because we exist. If senient life didn't exist, the universe would just continue to "exist" without a purpose.

I also suppose that the universe is on an endless repeat cycle. The big bang of our universe being the result of the big crunch of the previous cycle. This could be where Deja Vu comes from...

 

[Gymnotide]

The common theory for the creation of the Universe is the spontaneous fission of matter and antimatter. When this happens, the mass of the antimatter cancels out any mass of matter, obeying the Conservation of Mass. In this, it's feasible that even the split of one sub-sub-sub-(and so on)-subatomic particle could generate a cascade that eventually formed the four "fundamental" particles, and from those, nucleons, and from those, atoms.

 

[HarrisonH]

Be that as it may, "deny" is used rather judiciously here. It's a matter of strict semantics--I understand the case you are trying to make, but "to refuse to believe" and "to reject" are also two of the definitions, slurred among "to contradict," "to refuse," and "to disavow." Deny is technically a correct word to use (though perhaps not the correctest).

I'd even file a case where every non-scientific dictionary gets the definition of "evolution" wrong, but that's for a different thread.

While technically correct, I dislike the word "deny" as all of my experiences with it within this context is used by the opposition with a smug sense of superiority, as if we are "denying the facts".

Also, I find it good that people get to make their own "atheistic club", and that schools are forced to allow them. Let people to get their say. Let them get together and talk about what they beleive.

What do you think about people fighting to get public schools to remain secular? By this I mean, fighting against invocations at commencement ceremonies, having prayer banners hung by the school removed, etc.

Well, then how did the two colliding forces come into being? What would be, in your opinion, the beginning of all dimensions?

The cool thing about being an atheist/scientific is that we're not afraid to say "We don't know". We have plenty of scientific hypotheses relating to how the universe started, but no current way to say that one is absolutely correct or incorrect.

Bringing some sort of a higher power into the equation doesn't solve anything, as the question then becomes "Where did the universe higher power come from?" If you answer "It always existed", why can't that same answer be applied to the universe? Gods answer no questions, they only raise more.

 

[FrostPheonix]

What do you think about people fighting to get public schools to remain secular? By this I mean, fighting against invocations at commencement ceremonies, having prayer banners hung by the school removed, etc.

I'd say that you should calm down. A little prayer won't hurt anyone, and the only thing I'd say you might get worked up about is when they try converting you to a religion or stuff like that.

The cool thing about being an atheist/scientific is that we're not afraid to say "We don't know". We have plenty of scientific hypotheses relating to how the universe started, but no current way to say that one is absolutely correct or incorrect.

Bringing some sort of a higher power into the equation doesn't solve anything, as the question then becomes "Where did the universe higher power come from?" If you answer "It always existed", why can't that same answer be applied to the universe? Gods answer no questions, they only raise more.

I had this wonderful answer written out, but then I exited the page and now I forgot it :(.
What I'd say for now is that, putting a 'higher power' into the world answers more questions than saying that the universe always existed. If God/gods is a higher power, he would be outside time and therefore could exist eternally. The universe is different, there would be proof that it existed for ever, if it did. At least, that's what I gather from my knowledge.
Lol, that doesn't sound in the least convincing, but that's all I can think of atm.

Also, see this:

World's oceans in 'shocking' decline-BBC

Kinda random, but what do you guys think? What might happen if we die out?

 

[HarrisonH]

I'd say that you should calm down. A little prayer won't hurt anyone, and the only thing I'd say you might get worked up about is when they try converting you to a religion or stuff like that.

That's silly. There's absolutely no reason for any sort of religion to be sponsored by a public school. If it was a private school then it wouldn't matter, but public schools are supposed to remain secular, and the only way to guarantee that is to call them out.

I had this wonderful answer written out, but then I exited the page and now I forgot it :(.
What I'd say for now is that, putting a 'higher power' into the world answers more questions than saying that the universe always existed. If God/gods is a higher power, he would be outside time and therefore could exist eternally. The universe is different, there would be proof that it existed for ever, if it did. At least, that's what I gather from my knowledge.
Lol, that doesn't sound in the least convincing, but that's all I can think of atm.

Not convincing at all :P and, in my eyes, answers nothing. But I'm fairly certain neither of us are going to change their views, so I'll skip it.

Also, see this:

World's oceans in 'shocking' decline-BBC

Kinda random, but what do you guys think? What might happen if we die out?

If we die out, then we die out. Assuming the world isn't a desolate wasteland, whatever's left on earth will continue to live on until our sun runs out of fuel (~5 billion years from now). With us out of the equation, earth will probably be an amazing place.

 

[magikarpower]

I'm agnostic by definition though I don't like all the terms out there. i usually just say idc enough to look into anything. I will gladly hear what anyone has to say to support a religion, cause, whathaveyou, but most likely, it won't influence more, just educate me. I'm not sure if their is a god out there, but if there is, I've kinda decided he isn't what anyone thinks. I like to think that he could be a 4th dimensional being (that's directed to anyone who likes science). He can not be imagined because we are only 3 dimensional. He is just a normal person who took the "Create a dimension" class in high school. That's just how i see religion and god if he exists. Its half serious and half humorous. I did grow up Christian, however, and I know a lot about the religion and that is probably why I'm not concerned with it. as for aliens, I think there is life outside of this planet, whether it is amoeba or green dudes. This is basically my stepping stones into my joining of this group. I will gladly respond to any questions concerning more detailed subjects.

 

[Butterfree-Charizard]

Honestly I can't see how anyone can be an Gnostic atheists at all. How can you be so narrow-minded that you completely rule out any chance of there being a god. The same goes for Gnostic theist. I can understand believing in god but to disregard science is just wrong. I find religion to cause more problems than its worth. I'm kinda leaning more and more towards being agnostic atheist as I grow older. I'm just saying you need to think, not just say there is a god or there isn't, because quite honestly you don't know, no one does. don't mean to offend anyone.

 

[Gymnotide]

Honestly I can't see how anyone can be an atheists* at all. How can you be so narrow-minded that you completely rule out any chance of there being a god. The same goes for hard core theist. I can understand believing in god but to disregard science is just wrong. I find religion to cause more problems than its worth. I believe in god I guess, but I'm kinda leaning more and more towards being agnostic as I grow older. I'm just saying you need to think, not just say there is a god or there isn't, because quite honestly you don't know, no one does. don't mean to offend anyone. Although I'm sure I did :P


* Most Atheists end up really being agnostic in the end anyway

Um. Not offended, but can you please revise your mentality... Please?
(1) Agnosticism is not an alternative to atheism.
(2) You can be both agnostic and atheist at the same time.

Personally, I'm more on the side of being ignostic (with an 'i'! That is, not agnostic) where I believe that the notion of any singular notion of a deity is flawed. Singular notion, not singular deity--that's not to say that I oppose monotheism, but the fact that we interpret all types of deities in the same way. "Deity" or "god" means different things to different people and it's difficult to say that people as a whole are narrow-minded for rejecting the possibility of god. In a way, they are narrow-minded for equating all gods to one definition, but definitely not for the reason you state.

 

[Butterfree-Charizard]

Um. Not offended, but can you please revise your mentality... Please?
(1) Agnosticism is not an alternative to atheism.
(2) You can be both agnostic and atheist at the same time.

Personally, I'm more on the side of being ignostic (with an 'i'! That is, not agnostic) where I believe that the notion of any singular notion of a deity is flawed. Singular notion, not singular deity--that's not to say that I oppose monotheism, but the fact that we interpret all types of deities in the same way. "Deity" or "god" means different things to different people and it's difficult to say that people as a whole are narrow-minded for rejecting the possibility of god. In a way, they are narrow-minded for equating all gods to one definition, but definitely not for the reason you state.

Atheism is saying this no chance of there being a god, where as agnostic leaves the possibility of there being a god, you can't really be both, because if you are then your just agnostic.

Agnosticism is basically saying that you can neither confirm or deny the existence of any deity.

Atheism is denying that there is any deity in existence.

I see what you mean though.