First RMT on this forum.

[HorseGuy]

Eat Your Greens (Celebi) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 80 HP/176 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Heal Bell
- Trick
- U-turn
- Grass Knot
---
Anti-lead. Once I've tricked off Scarf, provides support with Heal Bell.

Science Fiction/Double Feature (Magnezone) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 6 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt
- Signal Beam
---
Celery u-turns Scizor, then-DOM DOM DOM. Keels the steels.

JetStream (Latias) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP/116 Def/28 Spd/112 SDef
Impish nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Zen Headbutt
- Wish
- Waterfall/Protect
- Thunder Wave
---
Physical paraflinch Psychic and Dragon provide okay coverage- I was thinking maybe protect over waterfall.

Nom Nom Nom (Heatran) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Earth Power
- Fire Blast
- Toxic
- Substitute
---
Toxistall Heatran is hawt. Takes fire, scouts with substitute and toxics when necessary.

Air Strike (Togekiss) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP/6 Spd/252 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Air Slash
- Body Slam
- Roost
- Aura Sphere
---
Special paraflinch with body slam over t-wave for electrics and grounds and such.
Though Vire is rare, I don't feel like getting tipped up and eaten away.
Fisticuffs (Hitmontop) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 240 HP/252 Atk/16 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Close Combat
- Fake Out
- Mach Punch
- Sucker Punch
---
Standard technician set. Hurts things in the late game.
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I'll post pictures when I break 15 posts. >__>
Also, thinking about running "Leadtran" and putting Celebi to the side.


Heatran @ Leftovers ** UltimaHorse Tran
Nature: Modest (+ Special Attack, - Attack)
EVs: 248 HP | 100 Special Defense | 160 Speed
Trait: Flash Fire (Absorbs fire attacks to multiply their power)
- Will-o-Wisp
- Stealth Rock
- Roar
- Fire Blast

Amazing Anti-Lead Tran. Sets up Rocks and Wisps the other lead if physical and not named Infernape. Roar for fun, and Fire Blast for an attack and Anti-Steel fun. It's so great to use against Ground leads who think you'll automatically switch out so they can set rocks down. So you Wisp them which lets you survive an Earthquake, and set up your own rocks. Out-Speeds full speed Adamant Scizor.

 

[Dark Azelf]

Mach Punch for Scizor

You do ~ 3 damage to it btw =p

Celebi

Anyways, biggest threat here is DD LO Gyarados since it outspeeds and OHKO's pretty much everything here.

Id personally make celebi a defensive variant to better cope with it, something like T-Wave or Reflect/Recover/Stealth Rock/Grass Knot @252 hp/252 def /6 sp.att @ bold. Also gives you that ever broken SR to work with.

Togekiss

Aura Sphere >> Sub on kiss, or its just, Tran, Tar etc fodder :>

Hitmontop

Also is there any point in Rapid Spin? You only have one SR weak and the rotom formes etc just lol at it anyway. Not enough to warrant a slot imo, you could use Fake Out or even Sucker Punch.


Ill come back later if i spot anything else.

 

[wolf]

How does Heatran stall if he goes in four subs? You can only stall if you have a healing move, and Heatran has only one recovery move: Rest, and Toxic is not great on Rest Talk since it limits the moveset coverage. Or, is it meant to sweep and stall? Please explain how it works, I just don't get it. Mods feel free to delete this post if this is useless.

 

[UltimaLink007]

You do ~ 3 damage to it btw =p

Actually, with his spread vs 252 HP Scizor:

317 Atk vs 212 Def & 344 HP (60 Base Power): 97 - 115 (28.20% - 33.43%)

Although since you're going Adamant, I'd just throw in Close Combat, which does to the same Scizor:

317 Atk vs 212 Def & 344 HP (120 Base Power): 193 - 228 (56.10% - 66.28%)

Celebi

Anyways, biggest threat here is DD LO Gyarados since it outspeeds and OHKO's pretty much everything here.

Id personally make celebi a defensive variant to better cope with it, something like T-Wave or Reflect/Recover/Stealth Rock/Grass Knot @252 hp/252 def /6 sp.att @ bold. Also gives you that ever broken SR to work with.

Latias really doesn't mind Gyarados too much, and can come in and paralyze it which ruins it completely. This also technically ruins Gyarados with a Scarf Trick. Gyara also doesn't really enjoy Seed Bombs, but if it's bulky it can take a few hits which is bad...

Togekiss

Aura Sphere >> Sub on kiss, or its just, Tran, Tar etc fodder :>

Tar is handled by Hitmontop. Aura Sphere would be cool though. Perhaps put it over Sub since it doesn't need both that AND Roost... Meh, not a huge Togekiss fan.

Hitmontop

Also is there any point in Rapid Spin? You only have one SR weak and the rotom formes etc just lol at it anyway. Not enough to warrant a slot imo, you could use Fake Out or even Sucker Punch.

Good point. Also, go Intimidate to make it a better Tar counter if you want, it would certainly help. Close Combat is nice for hitting things hard when Mach Punch doesn't cut it, Stone Edge is fun on a Top set, and Sucker Punch is cool too. Toxic is a pretty cool idea, along with Bulk Up. It's up to you.

Cressy looks like it walls you pretty hard right now, but I'm too tired to do any more calcs tonight. Not sure what to put where to fix that right now, so I guess I'll give it a better rate tomorrow...

 

[wolf]

Gyara also doesn't really enjoy Seed Bombs, but if it's bulky it can take a few hits which is bad...

Doesn't Gyara have Intimidate which lowers Attack? I also suggest going special instead of physical on Celebi to bring down lead Hippowdon easier with Grass Knot instead of Seed Bomb, which he walls entirely with his high Defense and HP, and then attacks back with Ice Fang.

 

[Anti]

Actually, with his spread vs 252 HP Scizor:

317 Atk vs 212 Def & 344 HP (60 Base Power): 97 - 115 (28.20% - 33.43%)

Although since you're going Adamant, I'd just throw in Close Combat, which does to the same Scizor:

317 Atk vs 212 Def & 344 HP (120 Base Power): 193 - 228 (56.10% - 66.28%)

28% is essentially doing 3 damage when the move is there for the Pokemon it's going 3 damage to though, lol. In other words, that would kind of be like Blissey using Ice Beam for Heracross.

Tar is handled by Hitmontop. Aura Sphere would be cool though. Perhaps put it over Sub since it doesn't need both that AND Roost... Meh, not a huge Togekiss fan.

But that's pretty silly, really. That's kind of like not using Brick Break on MixMence because Machamp handles Blissey. Aura Sphere is pretty much a must on Togekiss or it gets walled by about everything. I actually am not a big Togekiss fan myself since the Rotom formes and Zapdos' rise in popularity have kind of nerfed it a lot.

BTW, Thunder Wave >>> Body Slam for 100% para (especially on the ever-common Rotom switch-in which Body Slam doesn't even hit). Most electrics are hit by Thunder Wave anyway and no Ground-type has any business trying to mess with Togekiss (though your team does have some Electivire problems to be honest...luckily it's on a very small amount of serious teams).

Cressy looks like it walls you pretty hard right now, but I'm too tired to do any more calcs tonight. Not sure what to put where to fix that right now, so I guess I'll give it a better rate tomorrow...

I agree with this as well. It can para you entire team very easily...Heatran is virtually your only way of stopping it. Luckily, Cresselia can't do much back to anything on your team, but with some support (Toxic Spikes, SS, etc.) it could probably stall out your entire team at will.

 

[UltimaLink007]

28% is essentially doing 3 damage when the move is there for the Pokemon it's going 3 damage to though, lol. In other words, that would kind of be like Blissey using Ice Beam for Heracross.

I was merely showing the other person that it did much more than 3% damage, which is why I bothered to show it at all.

But that's pretty silly, really. That's kind of like not using Brick Break on MixMence because Machamp handles Blissey. Aura Sphere is pretty much a must on Togekiss or it gets walled by about everything. I actually am not a big Togekiss fan myself since the Rotom formes and Zapdos' rise in popularity have kind of nerfed it a lot.

It depends on the MixMence you use to be perfectly honest... :P I never use Togekiss, so I can't say too much about it. If I DID use it, I would go Aura Sphere / Shadow Ball for unresisted coverage rather than a gimmicky set like ParaFlinch, but hey, if he can get it to work he can get it to work.

BTW, Thunder Wave >>> Body Slam for 100% para (especially on the ever-common Rotom switch-in which Body Slam doesn't even hit). Most electrics are hit by Thunder Wave anyway and no Ground-type has any business trying to mess with Togekiss (though your team does have some Electivire problems to be honest...luckily it's on a very small amount of serious teams).

Meh, I can only guess that it can be put under the "Just In Case List."

I agree with this as well. It can para you entire team very easily...Heatran is virtually your only way of stopping it. Luckily, Cresselia can't do much back to anything on your team, but with some support (Toxic Spikes, SS, etc.) it could probably stall out your entire team at will.

RestTalk gives him trouble because it absorbs the status Latias and Heatran can throw at it, but other sets can be handled hopefully by Toxic Heatran, so long as it doesn't get statused and gets a sub up. Trick could also hurt Cressy, because she doesn't want a Scarf. I'll do calcs for U-Turn later, although I'm not sure how that would do. Rest / Sleep Talk / Charge Beam / Ice Beam looks like it hurts... If anyone is cool enough to run that set...

 

[Anti]

I don't see the point in Shadow Ball >>> Air Slash. Yeah you hit Rotom, but it becomes easier for stuff like Swampert and Tangrowth to wall it. I agree that ParaFlinch is a worthless gimmick though. lol

I haven't run any damage calculations, but if a Choice Banded max attack Flygon does lol damage with U-Turn, Celebi's damage output will be no better. Nobody will run RestTalk/mock BoltBeam since that set doesn't really work, so it's not something I would worry about for this team.

BTW the whole thing wasn't in response to what you said, but gah I sure made it look that way lol.

 

[UltimaLink007]

I don't see the point in Shadow Ball >>> Air Slash. Yeah you hit Rotom, but it becomes easier for stuff like Swampert and Tangrowth to wall it. I agree that ParaFlinch is a worthless gimmick though. lol

I haven't run any damage calculations, but if a Choice Banded max attack Flygon does lol damage with U-Turn, Celebi's damage output will be no better. Nobody will run RestTalk/mock BoltBeam since that set doesn't really work, so it's not something I would worry about for this team.

BTW the whole thing wasn't in response to what you said, but gah I sure made it look that way lol.

Don't worry, it's 4 AM now, I've been working on AP Biology stuff simultaneously, so I'm sure my points are null. So much homework...

 

[HorseGuy]

Updated. I'm off to school- so 'twas a hurried update.
I'll be back in about 7 hours. >.>

 

[luke]

Jirachi does you are doing with Latias a million times better.

Leaf Storm pairs with U-Turn really well and will OHKO almost all Tyranitar switching in except the extremely rare Careful Max HP / Max SDef variants and will even OHKO that variant if you manage to trick a Life Orb onto your Celebi.

Body Slam on your Togekiss is eh. Try Flamethrower / Grass Knot / Thunder Wave over it. Thunder Wave may make it into a lame Paraflinch variant, but the Paralysis support provided could help your team in the long run. Body Slam just doesn't seem worth it in the long run. Flamethrower lets you hit Psychic/Steel, Skarmory, and Forretress (with the latter two not being as popular but still present) that may switch in and take not-so-hot damage from Aura Sphere. Grass Knot will ensure the doom of Swampert.

 

[Dark Azelf]

Actually, with his spread vs 252 HP Scizor:

317 Atk vs 212 Def & 344 HP (60 Base Power): 97 - 115 (28.20% - 33.43%)

Although since you're going Adamant, I'd just throw in Close Combat, which does to the same Scizor:

317 Atk vs 212 Def & 344 HP (120 Base Power): 193 - 228 (56.10% - 66.28%)

The 3 damage was a joke in regards to the damage output, because as shown it doesnt do much =o.

Latias really doesn't mind Gyarados too much, and can come in and paralyze it which ruins it completely. This also technically ruins Gyarados with a Scarf Trick. Gyara also doesn't really enjoy Seed Bombs, but if it's bulky it can take a few hits which is bad...

+1 Life Orb Ice Fang (which ~ 30% of Gyarados still carry) does 78.85% - 92.86% to the Latias spread, which means with ANY residual damage pretty much, he loses.

Tar is handled by Hitmontop. Aura Sphere would be cool though. Perhaps put it over Sub since it doesn't need both that AND Roost... Meh, not a huge Togekiss fan.

I know Top handles tar, but its for coverage which without Aura Sphere that set severly lacks. IIrc Arua Sphere + Air Slash hit everything in the game for at least neutral bar Zapdos (Although this gets hit too if you count body slam) and Rotom.



Still something needs to be done about said Gyarados weak, the defensive Celebi i suggested i would go along way. Either that or you could shove a HP Electric Vaporeon >> Celebi and put SR on Heatran.

 

[.]

Leaf Storm pairs with U-Turn really well and will OHKO almost all Tyranitar switching in except the extremely rare Careful Max HP / Max SDef variants and will even OHKO that variant if you manage to trick a Life Orb onto your Celebi.

?_?

Leaf Storm vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar: 74.27%-88.30%

Leaf Storm vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar: 62.87%-74.75%

Leaf Storm (w/ Life Orb) vs. 252 HP / 216 SpD Tyranitar: 68.81%-81.68%

And just for fun...

Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD (- SpD nature): 83.28%-98.53%

So uh...yeah....

Onto the team

Togekiss with Body Slam sucks, go Thunder Wave if you absolutely have the ParaFlinch combo. An offensive option can range from Flamethrower to Tri Attack (hey, it hurts!).

Latias has better things to be doing than...Waterfall. Use this spread:

Latias @ Leftovers
Calm
252 HP / 116 Def / 112 SpD / 28 Spe
-Dragon Pulse
-Wish
-Thunder Wave / Roar
-Recover / Roar / Reflect

More defensive, helps with Infernape that is a problem a times for this team. Celebi does want Leaf Storm > Grass Knot as well.