First Shoddy Team

Amp

This is crazy.
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    So I've decided to give competitive battling a shot. Now, I'm not one to waste time actually RAISING highly tuned instruments of destruction, but Shoddy means I don't have to ;).

    Anyway, I sort of know what I'm doing with movesets, I just want your opinions as to whether this group meshes well/has any major weaknesses.

    This is for OU, btw.

    Charizard@Leftovers- Modest
    252 Spd/252 S.Atk/4 S. Defense
    Sunny Day
    Solarbeam
    Air Slash
    Heat Wave
    *I went off the deep end with this one, since I didn't want to use Bellyzard. I hear Charizard isn't the best sweeper, but I decided to give it a shot.

    Flygon@Choice Band- Naughty
    252 Spd/ 252 Atk/ 4 Def
    Crunch
    Earthquake
    Stone Edge
    Dragon Claw(curse the gods that didn't give it Outrage!!!)

    Steelix@ExpertBelt- Impish (Sturdy)
    Earthquake
    Stealth Rock
    Stone Edge
    Explosion
    *Wall and do as much damage as possible, then Explode

    Togekiss@Lum Berry- Lonely (serene Grace)
    252HP/ 152 Sp. Atk/ 104 SP. Def.
    Air Slash
    Aura Sphere
    Nasty Plot
    Baton Pass

    Scizor@Choice Scarf- Adamant (Technician)
    28 HP/ 252 Atk./ 228 Spd
    Aerial Ace
    U-turn
    Night Slash
    Brick Break

    Starmie@Leftovers
    160 HP/ 216 Spd./ 132 Sp. Atk.
    Thunder Wave
    Surf
    Rapid Spin
    Recover

    So, what do you guys think?
     
    I think you mean Thunderbolt on Starmie.

    Sunny Beaming is eww, Dragon pulse and Focus Blast >> it. On Zard

    Leftovers on Steelix 252 HP / 120 ATT / 136 SP.DEF on Steelix.

    Consider U-Turn or Fire Punch>>Crunch on Flygon.

    Lack of walling sp.walling concerns me, i would replace Charizard with a sp.wall and make Togekiss, 252 HP / 152 Sp.A / 104 Speed Air Slash/Nasty Plot/Aura Sphere /Roost....Nothing benefits from NP passing apart from zard, so its kinda meh...

    Maybe a solid fighting resist such as Bulky mence >> Flygon ??
     
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    As Dark_Azelf said, you are in dire need of a Special Wall. Seeing as how 4/6 of your team is weak to BoltBeam - a rather common combination - I would suggest Blissey since this team is also status bait. I'd remove Charizard for Blissey. Also, I would prefer you use Scizor with Leftovers and Swords Dance / Agility.
     
    Thanks guys, I'll make the necessary tweaks.

    How about editing Zard with Dragon Pulse and Focus Blast, then removing Flygon for a sp. wall? I really don't wan to lose CHarizard.
     
    Zard really is a dead weight. He can't do much, and a Sandstorm + Stealth Rock combination absolutely murders him. He loses 50% of his HP just by switching in. Combined his not-so-great speed and Failgar laughs at you.

    Really, a Tyranitar + Garchomp duo would make this team great, but then it'd be a weakness to Starmie and it would become too much like an SS Team (which are great and fun as hell to use)

    I suggest using Blissey

    Blissey @Leftovers
    252 HP, 252 Defense, 6 SpD
    Natural Cure
    Aromatherapy/Ice Beam (so Ghosts don't lol at you)
    Thunder Wave/Toxic (Twave does AMAZING at sweeper switch ins, Toxic is just pwnage)
    Softboiled
    Seismic Toss

    If you are one of the many against Blissey, then...lol


    Scizor is not really impressive without Swords Dance.

    Scizor @Leftovers
    Adamant
    184 HP, 176 Att, 148 Speed
    X Scissor/Brick Break
    Quick Attack
    Swords Dance
    Roost

    Once it gets a few Sword Dances off, it becomes a total BEAST. I suggest X Scissor > Brick Break so you can hit Ghosts, but Iron Head works.
     
    Complete lack of walls. Steelix isn't a good wall in OU, no special wall means you would get 6-0ed by a special threat.
    Anyway I can't really do a team rate without seeing the structure and strategy of a team, but I have a few suggestions for walls:

    Gliscor is arguably one of the best physical walls, able to counter SDLucario and Heracross due to its resistance to Fighting. Don't use Gliscor alone, pair it up with a Mamoswine/Weavile counter that would help Gliscor with walling, it can't wall Mamoswine/Weavile with its 4x weakness to Ice.
    Skarmory and Bronzong helps in that respect.

    A special wall usually would be able to do its task on its own. Blissey is arguably the best special wall you can use, Seismic Toss/Ice Beam/Thunder Wave/Softboiled help against a lot of special threats disabling them. Seismic Toss is mandatory for Calm Minders.

    Garchomp >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flygon by the way unless you want to use Roost and U-turn both which Garchomp does not get.

    I feel that being opposed to the usage of one pokemon is stupid as that one pokemon can help you win matches. Having such a mentality is against the whole idea and concept of competitive battling, which is to win.
    I find it silly when people are against Blissey/Garchomp/Gengar or whatever, they obviously will help you to win matches and are proven to be a determining factor in competitive battles due to their high weighted usage statistics.
     
    You could use a Snorlax as a special wall, however he is normaly more bulky with defence EVs as well, to make him almost a mixed wall.
     
    Aquilae said:
    A special wall usually would be able to do its task on its own. Blissey is arguably the best special wall you can use, Seismic Toss/Ice Beam/Thunder Wave/Softboiled help against a lot of special threats disabling them. Seismic Toss is mandatory for Calm Minders.

    Garchomp >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flygon by the way unless you want to use Roost and U-turn both which Garchomp does not get.

    I feel that being opposed to the usage of one pokemon is stupid as that one pokemon can help you win matches. Having such a mentality is against the whole idea and concept of competitive battling, which is to win.
    I find it silly when people are against Blissey/Garchomp/Gengar or whatever, they obviously will help you to win matches and are proven to be a determining factor in competitive battles due to their high weighted usage statistics.
    Click to expand...

    Well, it's also about personal preference. You can see that he likes Zard, so the least we can do is try to respect that that wish as much as possible. Not everyone is playing to blindly win, and whether or not you feel that fun isn't involved, it's a factor to some. We can at least make this team as competitive as possible, while respecting whatever things he wants. Don't get me wrong, I do like Blissey, but this whole "the whole point is winning" is moot to some. Yeah, try to win, but if that's the case, I can look up threads at Smogon & steal the best one, like what's been done to Dark Azelf. Very easy to do that. I play to win, but I am not going to only use a few pokes that's been deemed most worthy.

    Otherwise, there is no point in team rating. We should all pick the top OU's & call it a day. Make the game limited to what, 48 pokes? Plus 58, counting BL. But BL isn't the best, sorry, so just 48. And a few of those pokes are only usful when the team is centered around that, cutting the small 48 down further.\

    Not saying that you are wrong, however, but people has differnt views of the kids game, and should be respected. I love me some best wall in the game myself.

    That said, you really should replace Char with Blissey, or get a spinner to help Char's overwhelming Stealth Rock weakness.
     
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    Agreed, Sims. Anyway, I don't see the point of Thunder Wave on Starmie, not to mention Heracross destroys you even more w/ a status condition. T.T Lonely with Special attacks is kind of moot, what are you going to boost? =/ Where are Steelix's EVs? =) Other than these things, I don't see anything wrong, but that's probably because I didn't look at some of the other things. BTW, Charizard has better things to do than Heat Wave. Try Flamethrower or Fire Blast. I don't really like it, but Overheat is pretty good as well.
     
    Basically saying, you can't make a team of favs without first fixing the flaws first. Kinda like if something cost $30, & you only have $30, you can't buy anything else. Don't even think of making a team with Charizard without backup. Like WALLS.
     
    steelix is a bad physical wall week to fighting (you need that to be resisted to nuetral)
     
    Thanks for all the help guys! I'm still not using Blissey. I want some originality, here. Also, I DO hope to win, but what I'm really after here is to make my own way with my own ideas. What does one prove by winning with the same old standards? But if I can do some considerable damage and fight to the bitter end with my favorite pokes, and surprise someone with how well the 'second string' can really do, that's all the victory I need. :)

    The biggest tip I've gotten is that I need walls. I guess I'm still stuck in my in-game mentality of straight-up offense. I'll need to work past that. I'm liking this Snorlax idea a lot, I might work that in. Here's what I'm thinking offhand:

    Special Sweeper- Charizard(yeah, he's staying. deal with it.)
    Physical Sweeper- Salamence@choice band
    Physical Sweeper- Technical Scizor
    All-around- Tyranitar(his defenses are good, but fighting owns him. can he be used as a wall?)
    Wall- Bronzong
    Wish/status inducer- Vaporeon

    How's that sound, offhand?
     
    Bad. Ttar is not a wall. In fact, fighting moves were made for him. srsly. I think Game Freak said "hey, let's give Ttar a 4x fighting weak!"

    Anywoo, bad. You have no real special wall, and Charizard is still weak to Stealth Rock. A good Rapid Spinner would do wonders. I suggest maybe Forretress, off the top of my head, but someone feel free to suggest others. Strong in the pysical offence, maybe, but I do believe Heracross beats this team, as well as Boltbeamers.
     
    Why use Charizard as a Sp. Sweeper? He is much more suited for physical work.
     
    Well, he makes a great sp.sweeper. But as physical, I think your refering to Bellyzard? I wouldn't rely on that pretty predictable move.
     
    Right. Zard's sp. atk. is higher than it's phys. atk. However, for a while, Bellyzard saw some play, which was Charizard with Belly Drum and a Liechi Berry. The strategy was to switch in on a survivable attack, Belly Drum down to less than 1/3 HP, which activated the Liechi Attack boost and Blaze at the same time. Fire Fang/Flare Blitz/Fire Punch for the sweep.

    However, WITHOUT all those shenanigans, Charizard has some pretty solid Sp. Atk. He just didn't really have much of a special movepool until gen IV. THen they brought STealth rock, and Charizard was once again booted to BL.
     
    Yeah...thanks for the history lesson. We all kinda knew that.

    Regardless, you just stated one thing. You need a spinner to resist that terrible SR weakness to your ONLY sp.sweeper. I suggest Forry, as it can act as your wall. Physical, at least.
     
    YOU all kinda knew that, but apparently King Tyranitar was ignorant to the ways of the Zard. I'll see about a Forretress.
     
    No he wasn't. He had very good reasoning. Because Zard is mostly used for BellyZard. And I know first hand how scary it can be.

    However, it is very flawed.
     
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