Flash Carts are NOT illegal

[FreakyLocz14]

It is a common misconception that many people believe that flash carts are illegal. There is no law against making, selling, purchasing, or using a falsh cart for a video game console.

What is illegal; however, is using a flash cart to play a copyrighted game. It is perfectly legal to play homebrew games granted you do not infringe on anyone's copyright within the game. I'm not sure on this but it may also be legal to back-up a copy of a game you legally own.

 

[Melody]

You are right about everything except for backing up. Technically, backups are still a legal grey area that no judge has ruled on (In the US) as far as cases where all the person did was backup the game they owned. Depending on the country you live in, the laws may be different. You should research them before using a flash cart to backup games.

Additionally, you may have to manually dump the Backup yourself. You cannot usually legally download the game. (I know, it's stupid as hell, but that's how the laws are being read.)

 

[TheAppleFreak]

You are right about everything except for backing up. Technically, backups are still a legal grey area that no judge has ruled on (In the US) as far as cases where all the person did was backup the game they owned. Depending on the country you live in, the laws may be different. You should research them before using a flash cart to backup games.

Additionally, you may have to manually dump the Backup yourself. You cannot usually legally download the game. (I know, it's stupid as hell, but that's how the laws are being read.)

Dumping is actually becoming a lot easier for normal people to do nowadays; there are programs for flashcarts that actually transfer the entire copy of a game to a computer wirelessly.

 

[Zet]

Flash carts are illegal, so says the swat teams that are raiding people in Australia for selling them.

 

[Dawn]

Flash carts are illegal, so says the swat teams that are raiding people in Australia for selling them.

You poor soul. We and our silly American tunnel vision extend our hand to you.

I like this topic. I hate when people call things like flash carts illegal because they assume things.

 

[Cherrim]

Well, considering the sheer amount of people who use flash carts for illegal things (downloading and playing retail ROMs), it's no surprise that they are generalized as illegal.

I mean, it's practically a guarantee that most people who own flash carts don't use them for legal things. :| I'm not sure why people always seem to take offense to the assumption.

 

[RTHookers]

Oh again idiot guys.
I realllllly hate guys who say "it's illegal" etc. Let's look at M33's work on the PSP (Which I DO use), fantastically improved what my PSP can do. Flash carts are the same. I own a Supercard and use a M33 firmware on my PSP. Put me in jail plz.

..It's legal as long as you don't do something illegal with it. TBH one of my very reasons of a flashcart was to dump my Platinum save so I can edit my pokes. < OH WOW IT'S ILLEGAL DUDE YOU CHANGED SOME DATA BYTES AKA PRISON IMMEDIATELY lol.

 

[Zet]

Oh again idiot guys.
I realllllly hate guys who say "it's illegal" etc. Let's look at M33's work on the PSP (Which I DO use), fantastically improved what my PSP can do. Flash carts are the same. I own a Supercard and use a M33 firmware on my PSP. Put me in jail plz.

..It's legal as long as you don't do something illegal with it. TBH one of my very reasons of a flashcart was to dump my Platinum save so I can edit my pokes. < OH WOW IT'S ILLEGAL DUDE YOU CHANGED SOME DATA BYTES AKA PRISON IMMEDIATELY lol.

It's illegal in Australia, the UK, Japan and a bunch of other Countries. I suggest you actually research before talking.

edit: Looks like they are illegal in America
https://www.chillingeffects.org/anticircumvention/notice.cgi?NoticeID=154
https://gbatemp.net/lofiversion/index.php?t116572.html

 

[RTHookers]

Well it's legal in Israel. Actually nobody here gives a **** because there's stores selling those kinda things everywhere. Including hacked PSPs / PS2 chips etc lol.

Also people lost sense. What makes it illegal is how you use it.

 

[Dawn]

Looks like they are illegal in America

They still sell them in stores... I bought one at Best Buy once =/

Oh and...
https://www.tomsguide.com/us/Nintendo-DS-France-Judge-Flash,news-5270.html

 

[Legobricks]

Any EULA I've read of an otherwise "all rights reserved" game states they allow licencees to make a single backup copy of the software, so long as they don't give or sell it to other people. They don't define what format this backup may be limited to (though they might say 'digital copy', so I guess putting a game on something like magnetic tape would be illegal, even though questionable as to why that would or even could be done), so I don't see a reason for 'flash carts' to be outlawed from that perspective.

The vast majority of people will however use them for illegal ends because the device empowers them to do so, even though that isn't its intention (much like dynamite being made for peaceful applications like mining and construction, but ultimately being used more by militaries), hence many laws' stands on them being at least dubious out of I would suppose common sense.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Flash carts are illegal, so says the swat teams that are raiding people in Australia for selling them.

And Australian law cannot be applied across the board to other countries. They may be legal in other countries.

Well, considering the sheer amount of people who use flash carts for illegal things (downloading and playing retail ROMs), it's no surprise that they are generalized as illegal.

I mean, it's practically a guarantee that most people who own flash carts don't use them for legal things. :| I'm not sure why people always seem to take offense to the assumption.

It's a matter of law, not statistics on what people use flash carts for.
The law in many jurisdictions ban unauthorized use of copyrighted content. What the majority use flash carts for is irrelevant. If this were a criminal trial the prosecution would not be allowed to tell the jury that they can assume to defendant used to flash cart for copyright infringement because that's what most people do with them. In fact, mere possesion of a flash cart does not even give police officers probable cause to arrest. They would have to obtain a search warrant and discover that the flash cart was being used for illegal purposes before they can make an arrest. Of course, asking people what they use it for can bypass this but they would still have to discover what the flash cart was being used for to arrest a suspect.

Many retail stores choose not to sell them in America, but that's within their right to choose what products to offer to their customers. This doesn't neccessarily mean the products are illegal.

While certain uses of flash carts are illegal, the flash carts themeselves (at least in my jurisdiction) are legal. Legislatures and voters can pass laws that ban the sale and use of flash carts based on the assumption that they will be used for illegal purposes but without specific statutes saying otherwise, flash carts are legal.

 

[JakeyBoy]

And Australian law cannot be applied across the board to other countries. They may be legal in other countries.

So we should just completely disregard these countries and pay mass attention to the "important" ones.

As for the back-up thing, I actually heard somewhere it could only be magnetic info, or something. This isn't a grey area, it's pretty much transparent.

 

[Zet]

And Australian law cannot be applied across the board to other countries. They may be legal in other countries.



It's a matter of law, not statistics on what people use flash carts for.
The law in many jurisdictions ban unauthorized use of copyrighted content. What the majority use flash carts for is irrelevant. If this were a criminal trial the prosecution would not be allowed to tell the jury that they can assume to defendant used to flash cart for copyright infringement because that's what most people do with them. In fact, mere possesion of a flash cart does not even give police officers probable cause to arrest. They would have to obtain a search warrant and discover that the flash cart was being used for illegal purposes before they can make an arrest. Of course, asking people what they use it for can bypass this but they would still have to discover what the flash cart was being used for to arrest a suspect.

Many retail stores choose not to sell them in America, but that's within their right to choose what products to offer to their customers. This doesn't neccessarily mean the products are illegal.

While certain uses of flash carts are illegal, the flash carts themeselves (at least in my jurisdiction) are legal. Legislatures and voters can pass laws that ban the sale and use of flash carts based on the assumption that they will be used for illegal purposes but without specific statutes saying otherwise, flash carts are legal.

Looks like you didn't read my full post buddy

 

[FreakyLocz14]

So we should just completely disregard these countries and pay mass attention to the "important" ones.

As for the back-up thing, I actually heard somewhere it could only be magnetic info, or something. This isn't a grey area, it's pretty much transparent.

I never said we should ignore other countries. It could also be said that people who assume flash carts are illgeal ignore the law in places in where it's legal like you are assuming I who say that they are legal is ingnorung the law of other places.

My point is that this is the internet and we have people here from all kinds of different places with all kinds of different laws.

 

[Archer]

I never said we should ignore other countries. It could also be said that people who assume flash carts are illgeal ignore the law in places in where it's legal like you are assuming I who say that they are legal is ingnorung the law of other places.

My point is that this is the internet and we have people here from all kinds of different places with all kinds of different laws.

By the way, they're more vigilant in Canada and Japan than they are in Australia. Seems like the US is the odd one out here.

And similarly to firearms, it may be legal to possess them, but using them for their main purpose is illegal. I personally couldn't care less if you did use them, but the fact is that USING them is illegal, so there's no point looking for holes unless you're about to face a lawsuit for possessing one. In which case they will have found the cart and its contents.

 

[Cherrim]

And Australian law cannot be applied across the board to other countries. They may be legal in other countries.



It's a matter of law, not statistics on what people use flash carts for.
The law in many jurisdictions ban unauthorized use of copyrighted content. What the majority use flash carts for is irrelevant. If this were a criminal trial the prosecution would not be allowed to tell the jury that they can assume to defendant used to flash cart for copyright infringement because that's what most people do with them. In fact, mere possesion of a flash cart does not even give police officers probable cause to arrest. They would have to obtain a search warrant and discover that the flash cart was being used for illegal purposes before they can make an arrest. Of course, asking people what they use it for can bypass this but they would still have to discover what the flash cart was being used for to arrest a suspect.

Many retail stores choose not to sell them in America, but that's within their right to choose what products to offer to their customers. This doesn't neccessarily mean the products are illegal.

While certain uses of flash carts are illegal, the flash carts themeselves (at least in my jurisdiction) are legal. Legislatures and voters can pass laws that ban the sale and use of flash carts based on the assumption that they will be used for illegal purposes but without specific statutes saying otherwise, flash carts are legal.

...read my post, would you? I never said flash carts were illegal. I simply said that there is a good reason that people assume they are illegal and getting into a fit because of it (you didn't, but the person who posted at the same time as me certainly did :p) is just silly. No, it's not illegal [everywhere] but even though it enables people to legally play homebrew on the DS, the vast majority use their cards to play retail ROMs instead (or in addition).

So no, it's not illegal, but like I said, merely assuming that it is isn't too far off since I'd wager that most people with a flash cart are not using them for noble purposes. So while it's good to educate people and let them know that--hey, flash carts aren't all bad and immoral!--there's no need for attitude or rudeness (in general, not saying you are but I've seen so many that do lose their top) over it. :/ I think it's perfectly reasonable to assume they're illegal before looking up whether they are or not in your jurisdiction.

 

[ThePlatinumShadow]

Very considerate thread, a great debate.
The R4DS, as I know, was originally made to hold .NDS applications, one thing lead to another and they started using this to their advantage to pirate games, and produce them throughout the internet.

This is a theory, I'm not for sure if it's true.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

America law on flash carts is rather confusing to non-Americans who are not familiar with out federal system of government.

Using flash carts for copyright infringement is always illegal in any state since copyright law falls under the jurisdiction of the federal government. Mere manufacture, sale, purchase, and possesion of flash carts varies from state to state, and can also vary from city to city within a state.

I was once told by a GameStop employee that R4DS is illegal when I asked if they carry them but upon further research I found out R4DS is perfectly legal where I live. Similary, having LimeWire or another file sharing program on your computer is not illegal where I live.

In order to be more accurate, people should say that using flash carts to play copyrighted ROMs are illegal, not the carts themeselves. One would need to know where the person lives before being able to say that accurately.

By the way, they're more vigilant in Canada and Japan than they are in Australia. Seems like the US is the odd one out here.

And similarly to firearms, it may be legal to possess them, but using them for their main purpose is illegal. I personally couldn't care less if you did use them, but the fact is that USING them is illegal, so there's no point looking for holes unless you're about to face a lawsuit for possessing one. In which case they will have found the cart and its contents.

What main purpose is illegal? Firearms can and are regulary used for legal puproses including hunting and having ready in one's home for self-defense. Using a firearm is not always illegal, it depends on what it is being used for.

 

[Zet]

America law on flash carts is rather confusing to non-Americans who are not familiar with out federal system of government.

Using flash carts for copyright infringement is always illegal in any state since copyright law falls under the jurisdiction of the federal government. Mere manufacture, sale, purchase, and possesion of flash carts varies from state to state, and can also vary from city to city within a state.

I was once told by a GameStop employee that R4DS is illegal when I asked if they carry them but upon further research I found out R4DS is perfectly legal where I live. Similary, having LimeWire or another file sharing program on your computer is not illegal where I live.

In order to be more accurate, people should say that using flash carts to play copyrighted ROMs are illegal, not the carts themeselves. One would need to know where the person lives before being able to say that accurately.



What main purpose is illegal? Firearms can and are regulary used for legal puproses including hunting and having ready in one's home for self-defense. Using a firearm is not always illegal, it depends on what it is being used for.

Real men use their fists, take up boxing or a martial art for self defense. It's not that hard to protect yourself.

Ironically enough the guy who made limewire owes over a trillion dollars from all the illegal downloads