My first competitive team

[CHARMANDER418]

I just recently got Platinum and once I beat the E4 i will begin breeding/EV training my first competitive team. This team is a type specific but none of the members are singulerly that type. The type is probly my favorite. The type is fighting and I have chosen pokemon to give me some type coverage as well.

TEAM DETAILS:​

Breloom @ Adamant
item: Toxic Orb/Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Toxic
Mega Drain
Force Palm
Dynamicpunch​

Ok I think this guy is pretty good, but then again im a noob lol. I also think he could be better, so any help here?​

Poliwrath @ Adamant
item: Leftovers/Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 4 Def/252 HP/252 Atk
Focus Punch
Ice Punch/Rock Slide
Hypnosis
Substitute​

Poliwrath has a move set to give him a much better chance at useing the powerful focus punch. I am having trouble choosing between ice punch and rockslide for him though.​

Toxicroak @ Adamant
item: Life Orb/Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Swords Dance
Sucker Punch
Poison Jab
Earthquake​

Basicaly a swords dance sweeper. After useing SS his attacks are more powerful and the allow for a bit of coverage.​

Gallade @ Adamant
item: Expert Belt/Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 236 HP/252 Atk/20 SDef
Close Combat
Psycho Cut
Night Slash
Thunder Wave​

Gallade is able to hit psychics hard with night slash and this is good since my whole team is fighting. Thunder wave gives me more status support, psycho cut is good on ghosts and other fighting types while CC utilizes his power.​

Lucario @ Jolly
item: Choice Band/Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Close Combat
Crunch
Dragon Pulse
Extremespeed​

Crunch gives me more coverage on types my team is weak to. Extremespeed is useful for picking of faster weekend opponents. DP is for dragons, duh, and CC again is for power.​

Infernape @ Jolly
item: Muscle Band/Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Flare Blitz
Close Combat
Stone Edge
Swords Dance​

Infernape is basicaly a power house. Flare blitz and stone edge both give my team more type coverage.​

 

[ClassicPokemon]

I'm not experienced enough at this to give you advice but I think they are going to tell you that you need more defense. :P

 

[Johnny590]

There's also the fact that one Good Psychic can K.O. most of your pokemon. xP

 

[Yuuko]

It'd be ok in a monotype competition which isn't so common. Half your team has EQ weakness. I think it'll be best to change Lucario to a mix attacker cause that Dragon Pulse is random and would be useless in that build. Put Infernape as a special attacker, maybe a Nasty Plot Ape? Or have Lucario be the special sweep and Infernape be mix. And maybe try a Bulk Up Poliwrath, since most of your Pokemon aren't so tanky.

Also maybe look into other fighting Pokemon, like Hariyama and the Hitmon-clan.

 

[Pokedra]

I'm not experienced enough at this to give you advice but I think they are going to tell you that you need more defense. :P

Umm..no. In the current metagame walls are not needed in teams anymore. You could go for an all-out offense team and have a lot of success.

I just recently got Platinum and once I beat the E4 i will begin breeding/EV training my first competitive team. This team is a type specific but none of the members are singulerly that type. The type is probly my favorite. The type is fighting and I have chosen pokemon to give me some type coverage as well.

TEAM DETAILS:​

Breloom @ Adamant
item: Toxic Orb/Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 44 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spe
Spore
Focus Punch
Seed Bomb
Stone Edge
​

Ok I think this guy is pretty good, but then again im a noob lol. I also think he could be better, so any help here?

Never ever use Mega Drain on Breloom, first off all it has base 40 power and secondly his SpAtk is way inferior to its Atk and the SporePuncher set is what you want not the set you had.
​

Poliwrath @ Adamant
item: Leftovers/Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 4 Def/252 HP/252 Atk
Focus Punch
Ice Punch/Rock Slide
Hypnosis
Substitute​

Poliwrath has a move set to give him a much better chance at useing the powerful focus punch. I am having trouble choosing between ice punch and rockslide for him though.

Fine.
​

Toxicroak @ Adamant
item: Life Orb/Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Swords Dance
Sucker Punch
Cross Chop
Earthquake / Stone Edge
​

Basicaly a swords dance sweeper. After useing SS his attacks are more powerful and the allow for a bit of coverage.

Poison Jab sucks in OU, no coverage whatsoever. Cross Chop goes fine over it and Stone Edge to smack fliers with. Cross Chop hits most of what EQ does anyway.
​

Gallade @ Adamant
item: Life Orb/Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 236 HP/252 Atk/20 SDef
Close Combat
Psycho Cut
Night Slash
Swords Dance
​

Gallade is able to hit psychics hard with night slash and this is good since my whole team is fighting. Thunder wave gives me more status support, psycho cut is good on ghosts and other fighting types while CC utilizes his power.​

Just turn him into a SDer or the double status set. Mixing them up isn't really a good idea. LO grants you more power.

Lucario @ Jolly
item: Choice Band/Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Close Combat
Ice Punch
Swords Dance
Extremespeed​

Crunch gives me more coverage on types my team is weak to. Extremespeed is useful for picking of faster weekend opponents. DP is for dragons, duh, and CC again is for power.

You're running Adamant which weakens Dragon Pulse plus you can use Ice Punch and smach their 4x weakness harder plus it gives you more coverage.
​

Infernape @ Jolly
item: Muscle Band/Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Flare Blitz
Close Combat
Stone Edge
Swords Dance​

Infernape is basicaly a power house. Flare blitz and stone edge both give my team more type coverage.​

Fine >3

Okay looking at this, teams focussed around one-type aren't always the best idea. If Poliwrath goes down or is injured Gyarados with a DD hurts you pretty bad. To be honest I'd replace Gallade, he's not doing much. Scarftran would work fine in my opinion.

Heatran@ Choice Scarf
Nature : Naive(-SpD, +Spe)
EV : 4 HP / 252 SpAtk / 252 Spe
-Explosion
-Fire Blast
-Earth Power
-HP Ice

^ This thing will allow you to handle some threats by revenge-killing. Another thing that worries me is that all of your team needs to set-up to become threatening so I reckon you could replace Toxicroak since he's doing the same thing as Infernape and Lucario. Maybe something like SpecsLatias who can switch into Ground-attacks aimed at Ape and Luke as well as providing something that does alot of damage.

Latias@ Choice Specs
Nature : Timid(-Atk,+Spe)
EV : 4 HP / 252 SpAtk / 252 Spe
-Draco Meteor
-Trick
-HP Fire / Surf
-Thunderbolt / Dragon Pulse

That's what I think, you could wait for DA to give you a better rate however.

 

[Joltz]

You are going to have a lot of trouble with Alakazam or any decent Psychic type. I suggest you add a Pokemon that can outspeed most Phychics as well as have a dark move such as Crunch to deal with them if your insisting on using a single type. Unless this is for monotype battles only you are going to have a lot of trouble.

 

[wolf]

You can also slap a Scarf on Gallade (use the moveset Pokedra suggested, but with ThunderPunch over SD), and 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe with Jolly. Gallade is one of the Fighting-types that is neutral to Psychic and can take a hit (special), and can outrun every non-Uber Psychic-type, and kill with Night Slash. It revenge kills stuff which you lack (outruns once DD Gyara).

You have a bit too much set-up sweepers, you need a few that can be an immediate threat.

 

[Malevolent Mismagius]

This team could use Machamp. Its bulk is better than a lot of other fighting types. CBMachamp>>Gallade. That really isn't working that well.

Machamp @ CB
252 HP/252 Atk/6 Def
Adamant


Close Combat
Thunderpunch
Ice Punch
Payback

Payback hits the psychics that you are weak to for SE so that's a plus.

Choice Scarf Hera>>Toxicroak. Toxicroak is lol in OU.

Heracross@Choice Scarf
252 Atk/252 Spe/4HP
Jolly

Close COmbat
Megahorn
Stone Edge
Toxic

Bulky waters sort of trouble you without Breloom so Toxic helps with that. With Jolly you outspeed Timid Choice Scarf Heatran which does trouble you.

Use choice scarf breloom>>the one you have now.

Breloom@Choice Scarf
4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Jolly

Spore
Superpower
Seed Bomb
Stone Edge

Othwerwise,Go with Pokedra's changes with the SDLuke.

 

[dotKarma]

Like the other people were saying, your team has a weakness for Psychics, but I agree with a lot of the things that Pokedra recommended to kind of more balance out your team.

 

[Jake♫]

Umm..no. Teams without walls don't stand the chance the minute the opposition pulls out a sweeper who is faster than all of yours, or a good counter. Walls are necessary to regain control of a battle. Without them it would come down to who has the Gengar/Aerodactyl.

...Not at all. The current metagame relies around using resistances to switch in and set up a sweep. Walls are considered to be useless outside of stall teams, where you need the walls to effectively stop the opponents offense. Offensive teams are meant to be run with hard-hitting sweepers, revenge killers, and obligatory stealth rock, not walls. If you can get in a free switch with a resistance and force a switch by yourself and set up, walls are pointless.

And that arguments about Gengar and Aerodactyl...lol. Both of them are so frail it isn't even funny. That, and Chocie Scarfers outspeed them anyways. Gengar is Pursuit bait (Minus the increasing BurnGar (which is awesome)), and Aerodactyl is SR weak and gets killed by a Surf from a Poliwag :P

Now, onto the actual team XD Fighting mono-type....not going to work....at all. I agree with Pokedra's suggestions, but I'd also switch Infernape over to MixApe, so you have a Mixed Sweeper to break through whatever defense the opponent sets up.

Infernape@Life Orb
Blaze
Naive Nature
252 SpA/192 Spe/64 Atk

• Close Combat
• Fire Blast
• Grass Knot
• HP Ice

 

[Anti]

Umm..no. In the current metagame walls are not needed in teams anymore. You could go for an all-out offense team and have a lot of success.

Yeah, but you're arguing against a point that he wasn't making. Actually, what he said was pretty much on the mark despite it not being supported by much, as this team has absolutely no defensive capabilities at all. Unless you're arguing that the only problem with this team is the attacking core, you're being pretty unfair.

Also, there are a few things I want to say before anything more is said that doesn't relate to this team. First of all, I know offense work and no walls can work assuming the team is well put together, it doesn't mean that suggestions for getting walls are bad just because offense is a viable strategy. I know it's also wrong to say that you need walls to win, but it's usually smart for new players to play more conservatively to learn the ropes. I know you're just trying to help, but if you see advice that's bad, just report it and I'll deal with it, and that way we can avoid the argument dragging out like it appears to be doing right now.

 

[CHARMANDER418]

Haha well now that i see there are more weakness then i first thought maybe my ALL fighting team isnt a good idea, yet. So i may just go for a mixed team first until as it was said I learn the ropes and can better put this together. Also i want the argument to stop.

So ill work on a mixed team plan now instead, and this can either stay open so i can be givin more ideas to improve my fighting team, or closed/deleted so it wont get out of control on the wall/no wall thing. That ill leave for a mod to decide

Also thanks for the suggestions they will help me alot later on

 

[Anti]

So ill work on a mixed team plan now instead, and this can either stay open so i can be givin more ideas to improve my fighting team, or closed/deleted so it wont get out of control on the wall/no wall thing. That ill leave for a mod to decide

Well, the purpose of my last post was basically to stop the argument, so it is likely finished. If anybody insists on more off-topic posts, I'll just infract and delete their post, so you don't have anything to worry about.

A good way to run a balanced team is a bulky offense team (even though, as the name implies, it leans more towards offense, but you still have good defenses). Pokedra's suggestions would be good to take if that's the route you want to go, but first I have to say that his Specs Latias set is really terrible. Use:

Latias @ Choice Specs
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Spd / 252 SAtk
Modest / Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dragon Pulse
- Surf
- Trick

Let me explain the change. First of all, Hidden Power Fire has terrible base power and is only useful over Surf for OHKOing Scizor instead of 2HKOing. Surf has better base power, neutral coverage, and most importantly, it hits Tyranitar AND Scizor with one move, which eases prediction a lot. Also, Dragon Pulse is almost totally necessary; it allows you to sweep without hammering away at Draco Meteor (and its low PP, unreliable accuracy, and SAtk drop) and is good if you need a kill on something like an 80% Breloomwhen Draco Meteor would leave Latias vulnerable. Modest Nature is also a very good option to consider for the extra power, which often makes a difference. However, if you want a revenge killer for Hidden Power Fire Gengar (its Speed IV maxes out at 30, so Latias will have the speed advantage) as well as Infernape, Timid is preferred. In other words, it depends on your team, so the nature is impossible to determine until most/wall of the Fighting Pokemon have been replaced.

Now for the "bulky" part of offense. Here I would recommend Vaporeon - it stops Gyarados, MixApe (sort of, but enough that with Modest Specs Latias, you should be fine), and it passes Wish to your Choice item users and keeps them healthy, which is especially useful on a bulky offensive team. I would replace Poliwrath for this. Here's the set:

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Surf
- Hidden Power [Electric]
- Wish
- Protect

The Defense really helps this take Close Combats from Infernape and Stone Edges and Earthquakes from Gyarados.

Latias + Vaporeon + Heatran is a pretty solid start, and I'd imagine you want to keep one or two of your Fighting-types (Lucario is the best fit, if anything to provide a Rock resist and Tyranitar check). Replace the choice Band with a Life Orb to make it SDLuke - not only is the Swords Dancer better, but it's also a better fit (which is more important) since you're beginning to accumulate choice item users.

Hope that gives you a good start. I don't want to do the whole thing for you since it's not my team, so I hope this helped.

 

[Zero°]

Seeing as all of Gallades moves are attacks(Attack types are determind by contact in 4th gen), replace the SP.attack EV's with Attack and Defense, both 126EV's because your Gallade has weakness to bird Pokemon. and besides, Adamant Lowers your SP attack, and hightens your Attack.
For Lucario, switch Dragon Pulse with Ice Punch, Lucario is more of an Attack pokemon, plus Ice Will give you good coverage against Birds, Dragons, and Grass.

 

[jake_pokemon_newbie]

you have all fight type pokemon a flying type would rip through this team (with high speed to attack first and probs brave bird its one hit ko's for the opposition) any speed EV'd staraptor would cripple you sorry mate.

 

[Anti]

This thread is deteriorating very quickly. He already posted his new RMT here, so this thread simply has no use anymore.

And guys, I had to delete several posts in this thread. Make sure you offer solutions instead of just pointing out weaknesses. Also, while this might be obvious, make sure your suggestions are explained and that they address the problems with the team. But yes, there's no use keeping this open so...

Locked