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5th Gen Pointless Start Moves

Volroc

The Unpredictability Trainer
    • 1,880
    Posts
    15
    Years
    • Seen Jul 20, 2015
    As you see with every evolved pokemons moveset you get a bunch of moves it learns threw level up anyways, who else thinks these should be removed for moves more useful, or just plain removed
     
    Just no, think about lvl 5 Mamepato launching Sky Attack on you? It would not feel right, or first Koromori you encounter uses Psychic to destroy you, would not be cool.
     
    Pandemonioum said:
    Just no, think about lvl 5 Mamepato launching Sky Attack on you? It would not feel right, or first Koromori you encounter uses Psychic to destroy you, would not be cool.
    Click to expand...

    you didnt read at all did you?

    i was talking bout how whiscash has the first 5-6moves barboach learns plus zen headbutt as start moves

    charizard has the first 4-6moves charmander gets plus heatwave

    exc.
     
    Yeah, why would you want to RE-learn scratch or Ember?
     
    MistahDude said:
    It was that way for contests. It also makes sense. Why would a pokemon be unable to use what it's previous forms could learn?
    Click to expand...

    but it learns those move TWICE

    its starts off with them, then learns them anyways threw level up

    its useless space being taken up.
     
    Volroc said:
    but it learns those move TWICE

    its starts off with them, then learns them anyways threw level up

    its useless space being taken up.
    Click to expand...


    Only one Pokémon learns a single move twice o.o I just can't remember which one...



    Charizard, as in your example, cannot double learn anything by levelling up normally (if you level up at every opportunity). It DOES double up if you press B on occasion, since charmander/charmeleon will learn moves a level or two earlier.

    Now you want this not to happen, however this means people who never evolve their Pokémon (and there are a fair few) would be limited to moves for Charmander and Charmeleon a lot.

    A Charizard is never going to level up and want to learn Ember, as Ember is Lv 7, unless you've hacked the thing.

    So really I don't see the problem? XD
     
    Generation IV
    Other generation learnsets: I - II - III
    Level Move Type Cat. Pwr. Acc. PP Contest Appeal
    Start Air Slash Flying Special 75 95% 20 Cool 2 ♥♥
    Start Dragon Claw Dragon Physical 80 100% 15 Cool 2 ♥♥
    Start Shadow Claw Ghost Physical 70 100% 15 Cute 2 ♥♥
    Start Scratch Normal Physical 40 100% 35 Tough 3 ♥♥♥
    Start Growl Normal Status — 100% 40 Cute 2 ♥♥
    Start Ember Fire Special 40 100% 25 Beauty 3 ♥♥♥
    Start SmokeScreen Normal Status — 100% 20 Smart 2 ♥♥
    7 Ember Fire Special 40 100% 25 Beauty 3 ♥♥♥
    10 SmokeScreen Normal Status — 100% 20 Smart 2 ♥♥
    17 Dragon Rage Dragon Special — 100% 10 Cool 3 ♥♥♥
    21 Scary Face Normal Status — 90% 10 Tough 2 ♥♥
    28 Fire Fang Fire Physical 65 95% 15 Beauty 3 ♥♥♥
    32 Slash Normal Physical 70 100% 20 Cool 3 ♥♥♥
    36 Wing Attack Flying Physical 60 100% 35 Cool 3 ♥♥♥
    42 Flamethrower Fire Special 95 100% 15 Beauty 2 ♥♥
    49 Fire Spin Fire Special 15 70% 15 Beauty 0
    59 Heat Wave Fire Special 100 90% 10 Beauty 2 ♥♥
    66 Flare Blitz Fire Physical 120 100% 15 Smart 2 ♥♥
    Bold indicates a move that gets STAB
    Italic indicates a move that gets STAB only from an evolution of this Pokémon

    this is charizards moveset.

    now i see several moves twice, now im sure you can read, so youll see what i mean.
     
    I agree. Who would have a level 5 blastoise.

    The only reason they are there are for the down to level one dungeons in pokemon mystery dungeon.
     
    Volroc said:
    but it learns those move TWICE

    its starts off with them, then learns them anyways threw level up

    its useless space being taken up.
    Click to expand...
    what space? its not like you can learn that same attack if you've already got it, and i doubt it would take up any room on the ds cartridge.
    i can see that it's pointless, but it's not like it matters if it's still there in BW.
     
    Volroc said:
    Generation IV
    Other generation learnsets: I - II - III
    Level Move Type Cat. Pwr. Acc. PP Contest Appeal
    Start Air Slash Flying Special 75 95% 20 Cool 2 ♥♥
    Start Dragon Claw Dragon Physical 80 100% 15 Cool 2 ♥♥
    Start Shadow Claw Ghost Physical 70 100% 15 Cute 2 ♥♥
    Start Scratch Normal Physical 40 100% 35 Tough 3 ♥♥♥
    Start Growl Normal Status — 100% 40 Cute 2 ♥♥
    Start Ember Fire Special 40 100% 25 Beauty 3 ♥♥♥
    Start SmokeScreen Normal Status — 100% 20 Smart 2 ♥♥
    7 Ember Fire Special 40 100% 25 Beauty 3 ♥♥♥
    10 SmokeScreen Normal Status — 100% 20 Smart 2 ♥♥
    17 Dragon Rage Dragon Special — 100% 10 Cool 3 ♥♥♥
    21 Scary Face Normal Status — 90% 10 Tough 2 ♥♥
    28 Fire Fang Fire Physical 65 95% 15 Beauty 3 ♥♥♥
    32 Slash Normal Physical 70 100% 20 Cool 3 ♥♥♥
    36 Wing Attack Flying Physical 60 100% 35 Cool 3 ♥♥♥
    42 Flamethrower Fire Special 95 100% 15 Beauty 2 ♥♥
    49 Fire Spin Fire Special 15 70% 15 Beauty 0
    59 Heat Wave Fire Special 100 90% 10 Beauty 2 ♥♥
    66 Flare Blitz Fire Physical 120 100% 15 Smart 2 ♥♥
    Bold indicates a move that gets STAB
    Italic indicates a move that gets STAB only from an evolution of this Pokémon

    this is charizards moveset.

    now i see several moves twice, now im sure you can read, so youll see what i mean.
    Click to expand...


    And, if you look, you will realise that a Charizard does not learn most of these things by level up ^^.

    You are only going to encounter moves from 36 onwards, and none of those are repeated anywhere else in the list.

    The 'Start' moves are just for move relearner, or possibly a debug list for when they test the game.

    There is no reason to remove them, as they in no way effect the game. Without a list/Hacking you would never know that Charizard learns ember at lv 7 as it would never happen. They also shouldn't be changed as it has the the first 3 moves as 'special' relearn moves, and the others are just from the normal moveset. o_o
     
    Para-Dox said:
    I agree. Who would have a level 5 blastoise.

    The only reason they are there are for the down to level one dungeons in pokemon mystery dungeon.
    Click to expand...

    people who use AR for solo runs duh :P

    vibratingcat said:
    what space? its not like you can learn that same attack if you've already got it, and i doubt it would take up any room on the ds cartridge.
    i can see that it's pointless, but it's not like it matters if it's still there in BW.
    Click to expand...

    it does take up space if you add it together after you count all the pokemon&moves, you could remove a few megabits &voila you could get more moves, or more gameplay
     
    Volroc said:
    people who use AR for solo runs duh :P



    it does take up space if you add it together after you count all the pokemon&moves, you could remove a few megabits &voila you could get more moves, or more gameplay
    Click to expand...

    all in all it really doesn't matter. They are going to continue to do it and you can't really do anything about it.
     
    I think what he means is, Charizard's movelist shows ember at both level 1, and level 7. It's impossible to learn ember at level 7, so the only way you can learn it is with the move rememberer. But you could still learn ember because ember is still there under level 1. It's just impossible for an un-hacked Charizard to learn ember at level 7.

    It's not something to bother about though. I really doubt space was a problem for them.
     
    Volroc said:
    it does take up space if you add it together after you count all the pokemon&moves, you could remove a few megabits &voila you could get more moves, or more gameplay
    Click to expand...

    Oh, I'm pretty sure Game Freak knows exactly what they're doing. Everything in the game will be everything planned. I highly doubt anything will be excluded. The only time that ever happened was Red, where the ROM was crammed with crap because the Gameboy was just too small. The DS can hold hundreds of MB of stuff, all of which is now compressed. It's really quite massive, what they can do.
     
    Volroc said:
    people who use AR for solo runs duh :P



    it does take up space if you add it together after you count all the pokemon&moves, you could remove a few megabits &voila you could get more moves, or more gameplay
    Click to expand...
    Do you use Ar?
    Besides I think a move like Ember doesn't even use up a entire MB anyways...
     
    I always thought we had the extra moves in the final species thanks to Heart Scale? Or something crazy like that.

    Frankly, I don't mind the 'almost-extra' moves, they don't bother me a bit.
     
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