Gold hack: Pokemon Gold Beta Map Restoration Project.

[Mitchman]

Oh sure just get the hard stuff out of the way. Acually i did try many hack tools. But hacking was just satisfactory enough so i quit to use sphere. And by hex i mean making events and scripts to add warps and events such as making cinabar gym work as in blue/red. Those who do that are call scripters and if i recall scripters usually dont go doing the hard work for the new guy on the block but do other stuff such as making there own hacks. Im not trying to flameb or anything but all your really doing is using gold map searching for tiles and offsets.
Edit: I was acually saying the truth.

 

[bobby681]

I tried this a while ago, I got as far as Violet city and gave up though

Good luck :)

 

[Cartmic]

I'm not posting here often any more as I've a busy'ish life outside of ROM Hacking with University Etc. But I have to ask this question, why is this thread in the Hack Showcase and not the Scrapbox?

Cartmic.

 

[GKS]

Oh sorry about that. Those objects looked really strange though. Ihardly play crystal anymore so my apologies/


~link smash~'s quote:

"Wait is this gold with maps changed and some areas added? If so then this really snt considered a hack. I saw the vids and read the post but i really dont think this could be considered a hack. Oh in the cinibar vid-the first one-you mention you cant hex edit. Does that still apply? Cause if so then well you wont go far. No one will come in to the thread and say gee ill spend my time working on the main part of someones hack instead of making my own!"


Oh really then I guess back in the old days that means that when all we could do were pallete and sprite hacks it wasn't considered hacking now was it? Judging by the way you are talking you're saying searching for offsets that are for maps not normally used by a map editor isn't hacking? I also think you are one of those people who has never used a single hacking tool in his life and relies on hex coding for everything. Yo udon't know that editing offsets exist in a tool. I don't enjoy hex editing because I would like to see visually what I'm editing before I edit it. I don't feel to safe doing that otherwise. Trial and error slows down the process. It doesn't speed it up. Recently though I planned On learning hex but only after I fully hacked the visual aspects of my hack first. My motto is "Get the stuff you know out of the way first. After that figure out how to do the stuff you don't know.

It would be great to have a skilled programmer work with me on hex and/or scripting side by side but i guess that will never happen seeing as I can't get anyone to cooperate with me. I don't plan on having that person do everything anyways. Just getting the hard stuff out of the way. Unfortunately m major slow down has been that no one has donated any new beta material to me yet. As a result I may have to postpone the hack.


If anyone wants to lift a finger and get beta stuff for me (i.e. map files, Prototype screenshots and/or prototype videos. Any of those thing are urgently needed) I'm not looking for the four early Alpha screenshots that are seen most often. I'm talking about any other prototype screenshots. (Most notably the beta Skateboard screenshot. These and the scrapped prototype objects and text are all we have of the prototypes.


Don't ever think that someone will ever steal and dump a GSC rom. Nintendo has been known to hold onto stuff forever and lie to the public about some things. Trust me on this NOA is especially notorious for this. They have become so money hungry now that they no longer care as much as they used to for their customers. They were just as noble to their customers as SEGA was to theirs during the 90's. Now it appears some new hot shot is pulling the strings at NOA rather than the same caring person who ran NOA back in the 90's. If it is the same guy I would really want to know why he changed so much. It actually saddens be that such a good company would be ruduced to distrust to its customers. What's the world coming to these days? Now all everyone cares about is money. It makes me wonder how many years away it will be until the next console manufacter loses all of its money and is downgraded to third party or nonexistant. Sorry for going off topic but I'm basicallly saying that since NOJ has such a tight lock on protos the only way to obtain one would be to buy one from NOJ or Gamefreak. That could cost millions of dollars/yen to buy just one pokemon prototype. The only reasons why SEGA has prototype leaks is because they are careless, they now are a third party company, and at least one prototype was stolten from a game show (Not contest Game Show, Game show as in a convention similar to a Car show.) in new York. It was then dumped and spread throughout the internet and eventually reached the Sonic Hacking Community in 1998. Don't expect a theif to steal a protoype cartridge from a facility like NOJ without running into some high standard security systems.

Anyways back on to topic: For all those newbies using Goldmap (any version.) Don't ever edit the tiles it screws up the collision data and can most likely make you walk out of the boundaries and send you to the glitch dimension. (Aka see Ho-Oh fly in full color on the title screen glitch.)

I'm experimenting with tiles and stuff using Golmap 1.5 to restore the beta tiles. (Which will probably be quite glitchy.)

Oh and ~link smash~ sorry for going off on you but you sounded really sarcastic which is not allowed by forum rules. I'm not trying to back seat mod just warning you to watch how you say stuff because people may take it the wrong way and get you into trouble.

Using tools isn't really a skill, hex editing and scripting is. Tools were made by people who know way way more than you seem to know, and the people who script are way smarter than a person who considers knowing how to use tools as a skill, seeing almost anyone could do that. Seriously, without scripting the willingness of trying new stuff (like tiles), this hack won't go long. I recommend that you head off to the tutorial section and learn how to do stuff than depending on "tools" to do it for you.

Why on earth would anyone want to do all the hard work for you. I do have a scripter for my hack, but I know how to script myself. The chances of you (who joined the community this month) finding a decent scripter to help you while you know like nothing about it, is pretty low.

What you know how to do is pretty much less then average, and not that many people would be interested, especially after you release a beta and they try it out. NOT putting you down on purpose, but had to make this point, and don't get an attitude when tell you their opinion. I could be wrong about the outcomes of your hack.

 

[glitchhunter09]

I see your point. I've been fiddling around with the Goldmap's try map feature. I've been seeing what maps I could get to come up. I found some really good offsets here for all the maps including the beta ones. The beta maps are heavily broken though so piecing them together will be fun! I've already released a beta somewhere else. I guess I do need to cool it though. My ego has been really high in hacking lately. I found a cool hacking wiki to aid me in my .map file search. It can be found here:

http://datacrystal.org/wiki/Pokemon_Gold:ROM_map#Map_Pointers


Of course this site is probably well known in the Pokemon hacking scene.

Well I'm off to finish the visual aspects of my hack so I can start on the other stuff and learn how to do it. To non-rom hackers the stuff I'm currently doing is like a gift from the poke heavens. Ah I marvel at how the Non-hacking people take interest in simple things such as this. Someone please locate those beta magizine screenshots/scans please. Especially the so called skateboard screen. I've searched everywhere for that darn Screenshot. I want to know what the sprite looks like.

 

[Innocence]

I really think that some of you more experienced hackers are being counterproductive. Instead of criticizing how this hack doesn't employ any advanced techniques, you should be giving the newbie in question a leg up.

Mr. Glitch, (:P) I think that your perspective on hex editing is slightly off. Once you have mastered doing something in hex, it will speed things up long term, rather than slowing you down.

I would be prepared to teach you some things in gold hacking if you would be willing to learn. I don't have a "resume" as I am somewhat a perfectionist, and I won't pretend to be an expert in assembly, but in basic, run of the mill hex, I am somewhat adept. I think I might be using too many big words :P.

The point is, I know stuff. Do you want to know stuff?

Sorry if I came across too much like a know-it-all. I don't. I just can't cope with not using flowery language. Also, they never taught me the grammar for smilies XD. I can't figure out where the full stop goes. I'm rambling. I'll stop.

-Ryan

 

[glitchhunter09]

Thanks. I'd really appreciate your help. Oh btw do you know where I can find a large amount of GSC beta screenshots? Ones other than the four I see constantly everywhere? I'm looking for magazine scans or even old prototype video advertisements. I'm especially trying to find the "supposed" Skateboard beta screenshot. Any idea where I might find this screenshot?


Back to hex editing: What's the first thing I need? I've already got like two or three different hex editors to try out. how do I see what I'm editing. Do I need to find a .tbl file somewhere?

 

[bobby681]

http://pkmn.net/?action=gallery&page=viewgall&id=19
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Pokémon_Gold_and_Silver_Beta

They were the maps I was working from, but you can probably find more by going in the 'beta maps' section in Goldmap 1.5

 

[~Red]

I dont know the pointers but there is a beta Cinnabar Labs in the Gold data. See if you can find it. Btw, there are many HEX tutorials out there, maybe you should give them a try. It isn't as hard as you think ;)

 

[glitchhunter09]

I already found the lab's pointers on datacrystal.org. Unfortunately though the lab tileset has no doors. The closest thing the lab tileset has to a door is a green brick wall in the shape of a door. Also goldmap's reconstruct events data won't work for this map. I actually knew about the lab before I started this hack which was one of the things that set this hack in motion.

Edit:I've been to both of those websites and no longer use them because I've seen the non-bulbapedia link as infereior and worthless to me. One of the reasons why I left that site.

As for the bulbapedia link I've read the whole article like a bazillion times already.

Like I said before these things set my hack idea in motion.



Btw I've successfully restored beta Ecruteak City's map. However when the map is enter from route 37 weird graphical glitches happen because I had to expand Ecruteak's y axis by two rows. If I didn't The way would be barred off by a pair of trees. I plan on fixing that so don't worry. I just need to figure out how to do it first. The other routes can access Ecruteak just fine though. I'm going to add several other beta maps today so hopefully by sometime today I'll be ready to start on hex and scripting for the maps. I may even release beta 3 of my hack soon. Where are betas 1 and 2 you ask? 1 is only existant in a small number now. two is still available for download in .RAR format on my somewhat secret website. I'm not going to tell where that site is here and I recomend you don't go searching for beta two as it will be obsolete soon.

Edit2: Note that even if only the layouts have been changed so far I plan on adding beta events to compensate the aggressive oldbies floating around the site. It wasn't in the original plan but is definitely part of it now. I plan on adding those events now too. I could have made this a beta hoax and posted it saying it was a real rom of GSC beta but then everyone would get mad at me for it. If I would have known how poorly received this hack was going to be I would have done that just to make the criticizing oldbies angry with me because I'm very evil like that. anyways just be glad I didn't because I would have tried to be very convincing. Hey if a person in the Sonic hacking community was able to trick everyone into thinking a Sonic 1 hack made to look like Sonic 1 beta then it could have been done by me.

Update: New Bark Town Beta is fully operational. I'm going to Work on getting some of the other maps in as well. So far Cherrygrove city beta seems to be the only heavily broken beta map. The town .map file enclosed in this download below is unidentifiable. datacrystal.org labels it as cinniwood but I don't think it is. anyone who wants to find the best possible match for this beta map. The file has been compressed to.RAR format so keep in mind that you'll need winrar or 7zip to uncompress it before examination.

I'm off to work on some more beta maps so see you in a while. Next time I'll edit this post so that it doesn't look bad entirely. (Even though this is my topic.


Oh btw the guy who asked why this wasn't in scrapbox. It is because I'm actually working on it. Scrapbox is just where new ideas go.

This is probably going to be my only beta hack because of complaints that this is not original. It isn't supposed to be entirely original because This is a "what if" type rom. In other wordsI'm using this as an alternate outcome/ what if story for if the beta maps were in the final version of the game. Now with that out of the way I'm off to restore beta maps again. (Or at least the ones that don't require a lot of engine editing for now anyways.)


Oh I'm just curious but is the lost Entei event script in GS or crystal? I'd imagine that if the Entei event script is in GSC then that would meean that it would have been encountered through an event similar to the legendary birds and what not. If this assumption of mine is correct then that would mean that at one time in production Raikou and Suicune had similar events in GS. It makes me wonder where they would all be located at. Hmmmm...
Lets see the most logical place in Jotho for Suicune would probably be Mount Mortar or Ice Path similar to Articuno in the watery and frozen Seafoam Islands. Raikou would probably be located in some place in Johto with lots of Electic pokemon I'm not really sure where he'd fit though. Entei would most likely be located in Burned Tower. That may explain why the beta map for Burnt Tower's basement is slightly larger and more complex than the one in the final. Maybe the event starts out with all three Legendary Beasts/Dogs in the same spot in Burned Tower except only Suicune and Raikou run away to someplace else and Entei jumps in front of you to start a fight. Similar to the Suicune event in pokemon Crystal.

That's just my idea. Recently Since this is now more than just a beta map restoration project maybe I should try and extend the map data a bit into the blank map data so I can recreate old Red and blue Caves and areas. Note: Power Plant will stay the same due to the fact that it would change everything the wrong way. I could relocate Zapdos to somewhere else. Similar to the way Moltres was relocated in FR/LG. I'm going to have to brush up on hex first before I do that. For Seafoam Island I could just be simply lazy and relocate the warp for Seafoam Gym to Cinnabar Gym which would make the gym smaller yes but would prevent me from using anymore memory in the RAM than I have to to restore maps I might expand the map a bit for editing purposes though so that it takes longer to get to Blaine.

I'm thinking about adding Cerulean Cave to the mix with a Level 70 Mewtwo included.

For say Viridian forest I'll just edit the Silver cave beta map as it is quite spacious. I still have to expand the map data reading in goldmap for this to work however.

Another area I have plans for is Pewter Museum of Science. While on the subject there is a invisible object near the fruit bearing tree by the back door. When made visible it is actually a Teru Sama. Very odd. Of all the places this thing was located it was in Pewter City and was just invisible the whole time. It makes me wonder if a storyline related item was to go there and was removed in midproduction having its hex slot replaced by a Teru Sama and it was made invisible to prevent it from being tampered with by the player.

Does anyone recall the lady in soul house of Lavender Town who mentions underground passages only Mr.Fuji knows about that lead to more pokemon graves? Well it makes me wander what relevence that has to do with the Soul house itself. Yeah sure it could have been used as just a decorative term but perhaps atone point one could go to these downstairs chambers for some sort of story related event or side quest. maybe therewas a berserk ghost pokemon wandering the chambers or maybe there were still more Team Rocket members who still hadn't got the message Team Rocket disbanded yet other than that weird Speacking Rocket wandering around Cerulean causing all sorts of chaos and what not. This is just a theory with very little to back it up but it is heavily plausable. Is it not?

Well I'm off to work seeyou in a few hours hopefully.

 

[Stalin Malone]

If you're adding stuff why not add in the Sevii islands?

 

[glitchhunter09]

While an interesting concept it would be to see the Sevii Islands three years later it defeats the purpose of this being a generation 2 hack. Talk to the people in charge of ShinyGold. I'm sure they'd think of it as an interestin twist/concept.

Btw while surfing datacrystal.org I came across a link to a lonely pokemon hacking forum with only two members( one of which was the head admin.) It was called Phantom ..... er something I forgot but anyways I went to their tools section and came across th prerelease version of goldmap 1.7. The only new feature I saw was that you could now change the location of where you could start a new game. Not really useful to me but I'm well sure some other GSC hackers will appreciate it. I'm lazy and am not allowed to post links to other forums anyways. If you want Goldmap 1.7 beta so badly go find it yourself. I recommend using datacrystal.org as a place to start.


As for me I cannot locate a decent script editor. The reason being that the toolbox section is very disorganized and some of the script editors I found never told whether or not they were for Generation 2 or generation 3. There are way too many generation 3 hacks nowadays. Which is quite shocking considering that generation to has been deemed by many people as the best pokemon generation. No disrepect to any Generation 3 hacker reading this I'm merely stating my point. Besides one day after I get this hack finished i'm going to start a generation 3 hack maybe. I really want to experiment with importing Midi's from external sources into the games for more customization if of course that hasn't been done already.


Back on subject I'm going to import beta Goldenrod to the final to see how well it imports. Beta Olivine is is a mess. I have to fix that.

Edit: apparently The warp data gets all screwed up in goldenrod when the beta map is imported. Warps will literally jump out of place and end up somewhere else on the map. Perhaps there is some hidden data within beta goldenrod's location relating to events and whatnot. Then again probaly not as warps were in the streets. I could fix this if I felt like it. right now however I'm bored. I'm probably going to take my time editing the maps just to see how much the oldbies squirm. =p

Btw Goldmap 1.7 also allows you to move around the fly warp. (the thing that dtermines where you'll land when you fly to that city.

 

[~Red]

There is also beta dialogue in the game. Notice in the games textbanks there is an extra badge? This was going to be for Lake of Rage Town Gym. There are tons of beta maps left in the game that was never used. Also I found this on another forum:

 

[glitchhunter09]

It has been assumed the VOLTORBADGE may have just been some random form of text because it sounds really ridiculous for a pokemon gym to have a badge named after a pokemon but I'll take your word for it even if the name VOLTORBADGE doesn't sound cool at all. That strage piece of text is most likely just a hack of some sort. Of course I'd need more back up information on it to confirm it.

As I mentioned before I'm procrastinating Learning how to edit text to make the oldbies squirm from annoyance. But anyways I'm going to go to a tutuorial on hex today.

 

[Hat?]

Try the links to the internet archive backups tutorials about hex editing etc on that forum you were talking about. Also PKSV is meant to have scripting support for GSC (I haven't tried any proper GSC scripting however), most hackers who've dealt with that generation have been using a hex editor for scripting though.

 

[glitchhunter09]

The one thing that really steams me is that in the pokemon hacking scene you are expected to use a hex editor and using any rom hacking tools is a sin. What is the point in making tools if it is frowned upon to use them for hacks. This is the only rom hacking community I know of that doesn't consider using hacking tools other than hex editors as hacking. Grow up and realize they can do some things that hex editing can too and that with hacking tools you are modifying the code too not just editing. Sure hex editing is easy but not on a forum whose tutorial and toolbox sections are so disorganized that it is hard to find exactly what you are looking for. Some one should catagorize those by game because those two threads look like my bedroom.

Anyways I just don'tfeel like hacking at the moment. I'm not giving up or anything like that. I'm just taking a little breather thats all.

I'm just telling you like it is.

 

[GKS]

I know I was saying harsh things in my previous posts, but good luck in your hack.

 

[~Red]

Perhaps you could try and copy the beta tileset? I mean the one from the VERY EARLY screenshots.

 

[glitchhunter09]

There aren't really enough early screenshots to work with. Also If I wanted to do that I would have used a japanese pokemon red/Green rom because those early screenshots were of that quality. One screenshot which has been mentioned half a dozen times, I have been unable to find or get anyone to find. I wanted that GS beta skateboard screenshot that I heard about. Find that screenshot. Also those tilesets won't appear in game even if I tried or at least where I stand now anyways.

 

[master morty]

I love it. (or will when it comes out) great idea, if you research gold hacking extensively you could put in new scripts and such.

check around documents and tutorials (if you already do thats fine) but look for tutorials on scripting, repointing and asm you could be one of the greats in gold hacking