Red/Blue remakes on 3DS

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

What about E4 rematches? The PC (quit ignoring/erasing the female PCs) might also want to be Champion of the entire Indigo League and not just half of it. Adventure is a good enough reason.



Fighting old Gym Leaders and seeing familiar faces again, alone, is more enjoyable and superior to a bunch of silly fetch-quests. Plus, Johto is still an actual region with an actual backstory and culture and not a generic collection of islands with hardly anything to do.

Of course, there was a good alternative to Johto as a quality postgame area, but that required borrowing from the anime. (Which is what most fans wanted, anyways.)



GF doesn't seem to like sequels period. (Even B2W2 were only made due to pressure from Nintendo, with the DS being a dying handheld and all.) Plus, a second region would be an adventure-centric postgame, which just won't fly in this day and age of competitive battling. :rolleyes2:

It doesn't even need to be a true sequel, it could just be a dropping by to visit with no ties between the stories outside of references to the past upon arriving to the old region.
Well that may be true, after all GF seems to be planning something else for XY than sequels (prequels?)

Which is likely why ORAS lacks a sub-region or second region while the first two sets of remakes had one (with Sevii filling the role of sub-region for FRLG), and considering that the Resort areas in Sinnoh are considered a sub-region of Sinnoh it is sure to be the only remake in awhile to lack one (unless if Sinnoh loses the Resort areas in it's remakes).

 

[Wicked3DS]

Do you seriously think that GF plans games 5-6 years in advance?

Do you work for Game Freak? Did you even read this part?

Also, keep in mind that all of this is SUBJECTIVE to opinion as well unless GF comes out and says something. That was one of the things that drove me away from this thread before, it felt like my opinions held no weight and just were completely wrong.

Also, I can't rule it out. First of all, there was a console jump. GBA to DS was a fairly large leap in technology if you ask me. Plus, with new mechanics in the game and such, they may have wanted to make sure it was absolutely right. Games in general weren't being made as fast in the early 2000s, compared to now when a series is pumping out a new game every year.

Besides, HGSS didn't even reference Sevii, let alone include it; those islands basically ceased to exist after FRLG.

Is that an automatic prerequisite?

What GF was more than likely trying to do was give us a "fake Johto" in Sevii because they wouldn't let us visit the real one in Gen 3 for whatever reason.

Maybe because they gave it to us later on a better platform?

 

[Cerberus87]

What about E4 rematches? The PC (quit ignoring/erasing the female PCs) might also want to be Champion of the entire Indigo League and not just half of it. Adventure is a good enough reason.

I said Red because like it or not and by force of RBY not having the female PC he ended up being canonized as his own entity separate from the player.

The "entire" Indigo League doesn't exist, Gold/Kris isn't any less Champion by having only the Johto badges. The only reason for collecting the Kanto badges is that there was a challenge beyond the League (Red). E4 rematch in HGSS is also completely optional.

Actually, if you take out the gyms, GSC Kanto has the same sort of menial tasks as the Sevii Islands, maybe even less. The Team Rocket "quest" in GSC Kanto was a joke, for example, while the Sevii Islands one foretold what would happen in Johto later on.

 

[BettyNewbie]

It doesn't even need to be a true sequel, it could just be a dropping by to visit with no ties between the stories outside of references to the past upon arriving to the old region.

That's not really a sequel, though... Just a cameo.

Which is likely why ORAS lacks a sub-region or second region while the first two sets of remakes had one (with Sevii filling the role of sub-region for FRLG), and considering that the Resort areas in Sinnoh are considered a sub-region of Sinnoh it is sure to be the only remake in awhile to lack one (unless if Sinnoh loses the Resort areas in it's remakes).

Like XY and most of the other modern Pokémon games, ORAS were designed with the "metagame" in mind as the primary postgame. Once you finish the game, you're expected to dump your story team and breed/EV up a new one for either multiplayer or the Battle Maison. Giving you a second region to explore and new Badges to earn detracts from that main goal. :rolleyes2:

I said Red because like it or not and by force of RBY not having the female PC he ended up being canonized as his own entity separate from the player.

HGSS were supposed to be sequels to FRLG, not RBY. Besides, we're talking about a new remake in a new timeline, so it wouldn't be beholden to that screwup.

The "entire" Indigo League doesn't exist, Gold/Kris isn't any less Champion by having only the Johto badges. The only reason for collecting the Kanto badges is that there was a challenge beyond the League

The Indigo League covers both Kanto and Johto, which means 16 Badges. Yes, you only need 8 to fight the E4, but the actual League itself is still double that.

And, Kanto returned in GSC because GSC were meant to be direct sequels to RBY, and they wouldn't have been so without Kanto.

Geez, what do you have against getting more Badges? Or, just multiple regions being in the same game? (I thought you were a fan of Gen 2...) Not everyone is interested in competitive battling (be it multiplayer or battle facility), and a more substantial postgame would be great for them.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

That's not really a sequel, though... Just a cameo.



Like XY and most of the other modern Pokémon games, ORAS were designed with the "metagame" in mind as the primary postgame. Once you finish the game, you're expected to dump your story team and breed/EV up a new one for either multiplayer or the Battle Maison. Giving you a second region to explore and new Badges to earn detracts from that main goal. :rolleyes2:



HGSS were supposed to be sequels to FRLG, not RBY. Besides, we're talking about a new remake in a new timeline, so it wouldn't be beholden to that screwup.



The Indigo League covers both Kanto and Johto, which means 16 Badges. Yes, you only need 8 to fight the E4, but the actual League itself is still double that.

And, Kanto returned in GSC because GSC were meant to be direct sequels to RBY, and they wouldn't have been so without Kanto.

Geez, what do you have against getting more Badges? Or, just multiple regions being in the same game? (I thought you were a fan of Gen 2...) Not everyone is interested in competitive battling (be it multiplayer or battle facility), and a more substantial postgame would be great for them.

Exactly, it can just be a 'cameo' instead of a direct sequel.

It's more like there are two paths to enter the Indigo League, through Johto or through Kanto.

Sadly Kanto's gyms in GSCHgSs were easy to defeat. I think that's one of the reasons why GF hasn't added more than 8 badges beyond GSC and their remakes and likely why the facilities popped up (sadly it seems the Facilities are being ignored , or disliked by fans according to GF so there's no need for more than a half hearted attempt, just like what they gave to making the Kanto gym leaders a challenge in HgSs. Well in general the main story tends to be easy, but difficult easy). It would still be nice to have both the facilities and another region to explore (only games where this is the case are Crystal, HeartGold, and Soul Silver) post main story. Actually the very naming of the events from getting the Starter up to defeating the Champion as the main game is indicative that there is no plot after defeating the Champion (or Ghetsis in the case of BW). It'll be nice if the story encroached into the post game. The Delta Episode sort of felt like that...and given the fact that we couldn't access the Battle resort until beating it makes it seem more like part of the main story. If GF expands on that we could see a longer story even after the league.

 

[BettyNewbie]

Exactly, it can just be a 'cameo' instead of a direct sequel.

Which is considerably more boring. :|

Sadly Kanto's gyms in GSCHgSs were easy to defeat. I think that's one of the reasons why GF hasn't added more than 8 badges beyond GSC and their remakes and likely why the facilities popped up (sadly it seems the Facilities are being ignored , or disliked by fans according to GF so there's no need for more than a half hearted attempt, just like what they gave to making the Kanto gym leaders a challenge in HgSs. Well in general the main story tends to be easy, but difficult easy). It would still be nice to have both the facilities and another region to explore (only games where this is the case are Crystal, HeartGold, and Soul Silver) post main story. Actually the very naming of the events from getting the Starter up to defeating the Champion as the main game is indicative that there is no plot after defeating the Champion (or Ghetsis in the case of BW). It'll be nice if the story encroached into the post game. The Delta Episode sort of felt like that...and given the fact that we couldn't access the Battle resort until beating it makes it seem more like part of the main story. If GF expands on that we could see a longer story even after the league.

Ideally, the battle facilities would just be an optional side area and not the entire postgame. You need to have something for people who aren't into competitive battling and don't feel like breeding/EV-ing up a new "perfect" team, and an extension of the story in a second postgame region would be the best way to go.

 

[RandomDSdevel]

Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing both Johto and the result of merging the Sevii Islands and the Orange Archipelago into a true region of its own in Kanto re-remakes! 24 badges would interesting and cool if they could pull it off and get the level curve right. And the battle facilities could still be there for competitive players, so it'd be a win all around!

 

[Cerberus87]

The Indigo League covers both Kanto and Johto, which means 16 Badges. Yes, you only need 8 to fight the E4, but the actual League itself is still double that.

And, Kanto returned in GSC because GSC were meant to be direct sequels to RBY, and they wouldn't have been so without Kanto.

Geez, what do you have against getting more Badges? Or, just multiple regions being in the same game? (I thought you were a fan of Gen 2...) Not everyone is interested in competitive battling (be it multiplayer or battle facility), and a more substantial postgame would be great for them.

I don't, but it's hard to cram two regions in all their glory into a cart. Graphics take a lot of space. I can see them doing it in a new remake, though, because Kanto is much smaller than Kalos.

At least in HGSS both regions were decently sized and fit into the cart with all the Kanto improvements. But you still need a bit of story for the postgame.

It's rare for a Pokémon game these days to feature only competitive battling in the postgame. Nor is it desirable. Even XY aren't exclusively competitive battling, however small the post game quest was.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

That's true, there was the Looker Episodes in XY, then in ORAS we got the Delta Episode. Actually there seems to be more story there than there was in Kanto in Gen II/IV...

 

[BettyNewbie]

That's true, there was the Looker Episodes in XY, then in ORAS we got the Delta Episode. Actually there seems to be more story there than there was in Kanto in Gen II/IV...

Yeah, a couple of short side stories, and that's it. After they're done, unless you feel like breeding/EV-ing up a team for multiplayer or the battle facility, you might as well turn it off and play another game (Pokémon or otherwise).

 

[Cerberus87]

That's true, there was the Looker Episodes in XY, then in ORAS we got the Delta Episode. Actually there seems to be more story there than there was in Kanto in Gen II/IV...

The Kanto in GSC had a different value from the Delta Episode. The idea behind it was mainly to see how everything was after three years.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Yeah, a couple of short side stories, and that's it. After they're done, unless you feel like breeding/EV-ing up a team for multiplayer or the battle facility, you might as well turn it off and play another game (Pokémon or otherwise).

Well it's the same thing even with an extra region, once one defeats the gyms there is little else to do (especially if Gym rematches don't return). Actually defeating Kanto in Silver and SS took me as long as the Delta Episode did in OR...

@ Cerberus That's true. I must say that it's interesting how the rural regions have never been revisted in the future (or the past). Kalos will likely get prequels though...but Kalos is both rural and urban.

 

[BettyNewbie]

Well it's the same thing even with an extra region, once one defeats the gyms there is little else to do (especially if Gym rematches don't return). Actually defeating Kanto in Silver and SS took me as long as the Delta Episode did in OR...

Well, every game eventually has to come to an end, but with an extra region you, at least, have more room for non-competitive content (like Gym Leader rematches). Minigames might also be worth looking into as postgame content.

 

[Mega_Kris]

So, Gen 1 should just be left behind in the past and completely forgotten, then? Because, that's pretty much what's starting to happen. Fandom--even older fans--only care about the latest and greatest, which is why the Color/Metal and Advance Generation boards are less active than the others. If you're not into the newer games, then you don't have much of a community to turn to, anymore.

says the one who hates Firered/leafgreen for being nothing more than a remake.

I agree, Gen 1 shouldn't be forgotten. and what way to re-introduce it to fans without heavily modifying the original.

The only reason Gen 1 (either RBY or FRLG) hasn't completely evaporated from memory is because of ROM hacks (and, more specifically, FireRed being the easiest base ever to hack, especially in comparison to the DS games). Sad that fan games are doing a better job of keeping the Gen alive than GF, but it is what it is.

Well, that's technology for 'ya. Old games become obsolete with new handhelds, and GF has decided that remakes are the solution to that problem, for better or worse.

Which is why i suggested a Red/Blue combined with Gold/silver remake. makes perfect use of two regions.

 

[Cerberus87]

FRLG was a bit of a cheap way to complete the Pokédex, but it's not like GF said after releasing RS "hey, we need a way to complete the Pokédex... alright, let's remake Red and Blue!". I'd say the lack of classic Kanto Pokémon in RS was a sign that GF already planned before RS's release to remake Red and Blue to fill in the gaps.

Later remakes were pushed by public demand, though. The craze we saw with Hoenn in 2013, we had with Johto around the mid-2000s, which even led to the creation of the Shiny Gold hack. It remains to be seen if Sinnoh will get the same treatment, and when.

 

[Mega_Kris]

FRLG was a bit of a cheap way to complete the Pokédex, but it's not like GF said after releasing RS "hey, we need a way to complete the Pokédex... alright, let's remake Red and Blue!". I'd say the lack of classic Kanto Pokémon in RS was a sign that GF already planned before RS's release to remake Red and Blue to fill in the gaps.

I'm positive that during the creation of RSE, they intended to make it as big as Gold/Silver (having two regions). but it couldn't fit it all due to overestimating the capabilities of the GBA. so separating it was most likely necessary. looking back at GBA's line of games. i never really saw a complete SNES level game except for the ports themselves.

Later remakes were pushed by public demand, though. The craze we saw with Hoenn in 2013, we had with Johto around the mid-2000s, which even led to the creation of the Shiny Gold hack. It remains to be seen if Sinnoh will get the same treatment, and when.

Remakes were made by demand due to FireRed LeafGreen letting fans know Remakes were an option.

But even then, no one really wanted a full Ruby/Sapphire remake. And yet, one was announced. which was more of a remake.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

I'm positive that during the creation of RSE, they intended to make it as big as Gold/Silver (having two regions). but it couldn't fit it all due to overestimating the capabilities of the GBA. so separating it was most likely necessary. looking back at GBA's line of games. i never really saw a complete SNES level game except for the ports themselves.

Remakes were made by demand due to FireRed LeafGreen letting fans know Remakes were an option.

But even then, no one really wanted a full Ruby/Sapphire remake. And yet, one was announced. which was more of a remake.

That may very well be possible as there were apparently dex numbers for Gen I and II Pokemon in the Hoenn dex that were never used according to Bulbapedia. Foolishly I thought that beating the BF in Emerald was going to open access to Kanto and Johto (this is before I played Silver and knew that there was a game that could allow us to go to a past region), oh the days of noobdom.

Anyways it appears that Gf wants to isolate the regions from one another, just look at the skip in route numbers between Kanto-Johto and Hoenn, Hoenn and Sinnoh, the reset of the route numbering back to 1 for Unova, and again for Kalos. It's speculated that the reason the Sevii islands lack route numbers was that it would have to pick up where Johto left off and fool people into thinking Johto was in the game too.

 

[Cerberus87]

Foolishly I thought that the beating the BF in Emerald was going to open access to Kanto and Johto (this is before I played Silver and knew that there was a game that could allow us to go to a past region), oh the days of noobdom.

Not worth the trouble, sorry. :P

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

Maybe they could make it that if we complete the regional dex we'll get access to another region.

Maybe for a Kanto re-remake we'll have the old 151 Kanto dex but at a certain point it'll get updated with all of the newest additions evolutions wise. They could make it so that Oak thinks there are only 151 but we reveal to Oak that isn't true with our dex finds.

 

[Mega_Kris]

Maybe they could make it that if we complete the regional dex we'll get access to another region.

Maybe for a Kanto re-remake we'll have the old 151 Kanto dex but at a certain point it'll get updated with all of the newest additions evolutions wise. They could make it so that Oak thinks there are only 151 but we reveal to Oak that isn't true with our dex finds.

That would've been good for a Red/Gold and Blue/Silver remake.