So what's up with Ash!

[Death Rogers]

Well, you have to remember 4kids owns Pokemon. They make it kid-friendly. The TV series aims at the 12 - Age groups. If it weren't for 4kids Pokemon would be a lot more violent. 4kids already banned like 9 episodes. They banned an episode just because they gave James breast implants to win a beauty contest.

The movies, however, are for some reason always more violent than the TV series.

 

[Latium]

lol... yeah the movies are a little more violent. Just look at the first pokemon movie. The clone pokemon, and the real pokemon were pummeling eachother.

 

[Death Rogers]

Not to mention Ash turned to stone.

 

[Scarlet Weather]

And lol about the Ash & Pikachu relationship being messed up by Pikachu being a boy, did you want them to get married or something? Though I think it be cute if Pikachu was a girl though he seems more like a male in the way he acts so if he was a girl people be like why was he acting that way before.

No, of course not! I just thought it was insanely funny, and would explain why Ash has never begun any sort of romantic relationship with a human female. (Accent there being on "human"- I haven't given up hope on Altoshipping yet. I swear, I would go so crazy if only Latias was introduced as at the very least a recurring character. Okay, break's over now.) And yeah, Pikachu being a girl made sense to me- he doesn't really act too "guy-ish" since he was never given a confirmed gender up until D/P. Before that *insert expletive here* Mimiroru showed up, I had a few "make-fun-of-canon-shipping" shipping fics planned, including one involving Ash getting stuck as a Pikachu again, discovering his own Pikachu is in love with him, and basically going nuts, as well as a PikachuXGary's Umbreon fic which involved a whole lot of love letters going back and forth, and explanations for the seeming low intelligence of all main characters. (Pikachu was drugging them in order to make sure that they did not discover her secret love relationship with Umbreon.) It was so sad.... *cries*. And the reason I'm ixnaying the guyXguy Pikashipping is because Yaoi just disturbs me, with one notable exception.

 

[Death Rogers]

Wait, Ash turned into a Pikachu and discovered Pikachu was physically attracted to him!?

Wow. Never would've thought Pikachu was homosexual.

 

[Forci Stikane]

...Where's DC when you need him...?

*sigh* Okay. There is so much stuff wrong with this thread that I'm just going to jump in.

Well, you have to remember 4kids owns Pokemon.

LEAVE. NOW. A comment THAT uninformed merits banishment from discussion.

Why doesn't Ash ever capture Pokémon? I mean sure he captured a few but most of them weren't like "Oo I see a *blank* and wanna capture it", they were more like "Hey I came across *blank* and it likes me so I'm gonna capture it" I mean even Misty back in the day if I recall talked about how Ash didn't really capture the Pokémon he had on him which then prompted him to capture his Krabby. Plus when you take in account he has had numerous chances to do so, some of which offered pretty good Pokémon. So if he wants to be a Pokémon Master as he stated a lot back in the day why would he do nothing to really get there, it kind of reminds me of Naruto always talking about being Hokage but in the end doing really nothing to do so.

That's because most of those Pokemon shouldn't be captured. Sometimes it's best to leave them in their natural habitat. It isn't a game, where the creatures don't have "feelings". You don't go out and capture wild animals, just to bring them home as pets. You leave them where they are, because that's where they should be. The Pokemon Ash captures usually WANT to go with him, so he's smart enough to know when to catch and when not to catch.

Why doesn't Ash battle much? Ya he battles Gym Leaders, Frontier Brains and rarely fellow Trainers but mostly he doesn't battle at all, nor does he train his Pokémon in others ways to make up for that fact.

We don't see everyhting that goes on every day. He could have battles with May & Brock daily, for all we know. And what about that training to teach his Pokemon new moves (cite: Volt Tackle & Bullet Seed)? Just because we don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist (like the restrooms...).

#2 brings me to another question which is how does Ash win battles? I mean his lack of variety of Pokémon as well as a lack of training for them should mean he doesn't win much but practically every person he faces he beats and if he doesn't beat them the first time he does the second. And add to it that he is incompetent in battling most of the time like using Normal Type Moves against Ghost Types or sticking with a Pokémon even if he has a horrible disadvantage with it because there low on HP or have a Type disadvantage or something else. To me it seems that he wings most of his battles and wins by luck usually just like May does in Contest.

...I'll start with the Normal v. Ghost comment first--the last time he competed against a Ghost-type, I believe, was early-mid Johto, almost two years before his latest match. People forget things. You'd probably forget about something like that, too, if you didn't deal with it for so long.

Now, as for the winning part, his Pokemon are stronger than you apparently think they are. He gets in quite a bit of training, and even though Team Rocket IS pathetically weak, there's still SOME experience there.

And as far as why he focuses on the same ones, what would you prefer, a few level 100s or a bunch of level 50s? The former, of course, and that's basically what Ash gets (if they even USED the level system in the Anime, but that's for an entirely different discussion).

As for side adventures, ya there good but I think the series has become more about the adventure of traveling and not the adventure of training, raising & battling your Pokémon which is what the series is supposed to be about. I mean if it wasn't for May and her Contest we barely see any battles on the show so though she may be an incompetent Coordinator she does give us battles.

Well, no duh. Of course the story's about the travelling. That's where the adventure comes from! After all, if you don't travel, then how are you supposed to see new things?

Most of Ash's Pokémon don't evolve for the very same reasons I gave above which is that he doesn't train them or battle with them much therefore there not gonna get anywhere Level wise yet his unevolved Pokémon always seem to kick the ass of other Pokémon who clearly are greater Level wise.

As for Pokémon who haven't evolved yet, they are: Totodile, Cyndaquil, Bulbasaur and Squirtle. When it comes to the first two they probably haven't evolved because of lack of training, Bulbasaur if you recall chose to stay that way rather than evolve into Ivysaur very early in the series and Squirtle should of evolved though maybe before Ash got him he chose to not evolve on his own as well.

They don't evolve because they A. don't want to, or B. the writers don't want them to. It is NOT a lack of strength. Even at Oak's lab, they're still getting exercise and growing stronger.

I must thank you, though, as your rants have been very fun to read, albeit lacking in the facts department.

 

[Death Rogers]

LEAVE. NOW. A comment THAT uninformed merits banishment from discussion.

*Scratches Head* Saywha?

That comment wasn't uninformed. 4kids owns Pokemon. That's all you need to know for the rest of my post that you quoted.

 

[Forci Stikane]

*Scratches Head* Saywha?

That comment wasn't uninformed. 4kids owns Pokemon. That's all you need to know for the rest of my post that you quoted.

I said leave. I meant LEAVE. 4Kids does not "own" Pokemon, nor do they have anything to do with it now.

 

[Death Rogers]

I said leave. I meant LEAVE. 4Kids does not "own" Pokemon, nor do they have anything to do with it now.

Last I checked, 4kids did the English dubbing of Pokemon. That's what I meant by "owns".

And who are you to tell me to leave? You're not a mod nor an admin. I won't leave unless the creator of this thread, a mod, or an admin tells me to.

And if my information was proven false, I would not have to leave the thread. The most I would have to do is edit my post. And I will not do so until you can find information that proves me to be false.

 

[Poké King]

Not to mention Ash turned to stone.

Well, it was either that or kill him so because it was for kids he turned to stone.

Wait, Ash turned into a Pikachu and discovered Pikachu was physically attracted to him!?

Wow. Never would've thought Pikachu was homosexual.

LOL

 

[Death Rogers]

Yeah. If they killed him then the series would be looooooooooong dead.

 

[Poké King]

That's because most of those Pokemon shouldn't be captured. Sometimes it's best to leave them in their natural habitat. It isn't a game, where the creatures don't have "feelings". You don't go out and capture wild animals, just to bring them home as pets. You leave them where they are, because that's where they should be. The Pokemon Ash captures usually WANT to go with him, so he's smart enough to know when to catch and when not to catch.

Um last I checked the goal is to capture Pokémon whether its in the games or the Anime. And Ash isn't smart in how he catches Pokémon, it doesn't take a genious to say "Hey this Pokémon wants to battle so I will battle it then capture it" lol

We don't see everyhting that goes on every day. He could have battles with May & Brock daily, for all we know. And what about that training to teach his Pokemon new moves (cite: Volt Tackle & Bullet Seed)? Just because we don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist (like the restrooms...).

He didn't teach Pikachu Volt Tackle, Pikachu learned it on his own and all Ash did was try to get him better at it. Besides I never said he didn't do any training, I just said he didn't do a lot of training.

...I'll start with the Normal v. Ghost comment first--the last time he competed against a Ghost-type, I believe, was early-mid Johto, almost two years before his latest match. People forget things. You'd probably forget about something like that, too, if you didn't deal with it for so long.

Ya but he wants to be a Pokémon Master and if I wanted to be the best at something I think I wouldn't forget one of the basics. I mean when he started out he didn't even know how to capture a Pokémon and ya he was just starting out but come on.

Now, as for the winning part, his Pokemon are stronger than you apparently think they are. He gets in quite a bit of training, and even though Team Rocket IS pathetically weak, there's still SOME experience there.

Ya but very little and how are they strong I mean they don't participate in many battles nor are trained much.

And as far as why he focuses on the same ones, what would you prefer, a few level 100s or a bunch of level 50s? The former, of course, and that's basically what Ash gets (if they even USED the level system in the Anime, but that's for an entirely different discussion).

Last I checked if he actually trained them right he could have a bunch of Level 100's.

Well, no duh. Of course the story's about the travelling. That's where the adventure comes from! After all, if you don't travel, then how are you supposed to see new things?

Ya but its also about capturing, training and raising Pokémon. And it seems it become more about them walking around and getting into crazy situations then doing any of those three things.

They don't evolve because they A. don't want to, or B. the writers don't want them to. It is NOT a lack of strength. Even at Oak's lab, they're still getting exercise and growing stronger.

Your forgot C they aren't trained hard enough to level up to evolve, you seem to think that isn't a possibility at all.

I must thank you, though, as your rants have been very fun to read, albeit lacking in the facts department.

Funny how you talk about facts when what facts have you given me, all you have given me is possible theories and speculation. The only real facts you listed was that he trained Pikachu to make him good at Volt Tackle and that he trained Treecko to do Bullet Seed but everything else was maybes and could be's like ya he could be battling Brock/Misty but I highly doubt it.

 

[Death Rogers]

LOL Ichapokemr, you just got proved wrong in everything you said.

And you say I should leave this thread.

 

[Mudkip85]

We don't see everyhting that goes on every day. He could have battles with May & Brock daily, for all we know. And what about that training to teach his Pokemon new moves (cite: Volt Tackle & Bullet Seed)? Just because we don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist (like the restrooms...).

Yeah i have to agreee here, for instance another example of this is when sometimes at the beginning of a show, we see Ash and Pikachu, running together on the beach or on the pavement. Training doesnt necessasarily mean just simply leveling up your pokemon by battling. Training by the running that Ash and Pikachu do together would also increase Pikachu's stamina stats. Ash actually does teach some moves to his pokemon to, take snorunt for example. It couldnt control or learn how to actually perform the attack by itself until Ash taught it to. So although Ash doesnt train intensivley, he does try to get his pokemon to develop and get physically and mentally stronger.

~Kipper~

 

[Poké King]

Yeah i have to agreee here, for instance another example of this is when sometimes at the beginning of a show, we see Ash and Pikachu, running together on the beach or on the pavement. Training doesnt necessasarily mean just simply leveling up your pokemon by battling. Training by the running that Ash and Pikachu do together would also increase Pikachu's stamina stats. Ash actually does teach some moves to his pokemon to, take snorunt for example. It couldnt control or learn how to actually perform the attack by itself until Ash taught it to. So although Ash doesnt train intensivley, he does try to get his pokemon to develop and get physically and mentally stronger.

~Kipper~

Um there is no Stamina Stat and he never taught Snorunt Ice Beam, he made him get better at it like with Pikachu and Volt Tackle. The only Pokémon of his that I recall he taught anything to was Treecko and Swellow, he taught them Bullet Seed & Aerial Ace. Beyond that all the Moves his Pokémon have known they learned themselves through growing stronger though as I said before I don't see how they grow so strong with the lack of training & battling. And even if running on the beach could be considered training it still wouldn't do that much.

 

[Charaxes]

Okay! Okay!

Sorry, Ichi, I had a transcription to deal with. Anyway, I read this thread and I will post something after my errands (and I'll re-edit this.)

Actually, I do applaud SBaby and Ichi's POVs, but I do admire you taking a more analytical approach to this, Poke King. However, Ichi is right: the series is trying to make this a real world setting and thus, it's difficult to compensate the fantasy for the reality. Of course, I've thought the same with Ash a long time ago, I did. And then, I realized the anime is going to do whatever it wants and we've seen time and time again the producers not following the game canon, and it leads to a lot of broken expectations.

So, the easiest thing is not to think about it because, then, you realize how much they've dropped the ball. I like the thread, but keep it balanced. I'll post in depth later tonight if I can.

 

[Forci Stikane]

Last I checked, 4kids did the English dubbing of Pokemon. That's what I meant by "owns".

And who are you to tell me to leave? You're not a mod nor an admin. I won't leave unless the creator of this thread, a mod, or an admin tells me to.

And if my information was proven false, I would not have to leave the thread. The most I would have to do is edit my post. And I will not do so until you can find information that proves me to be false.

...You haven't seen a single episode of the new season, have you? A statement that outdated would have to mean that you've not only missed ALL of Pokemon:Battle Frontier, but also haven't bothered to keep up with what's going on. Somebody that lazy/uncaring & outdated shouldn't be discussing the anime, IMO.

Poke King, the point that you seem to fail to grasp is that we don't see everything that goes on in the show, and the show's mechanics aren't the same as the game's. For instance,

Um there is no Stamina Stat

stamina might not be a real factor in the game, but it sure is in the anime, since those battles are "real" with creatures that tire out with prolonged work/battling.

Ya but its also about capturing, training and raising Pokémon. And it seems it become more about them walking around and getting into crazy situations then doing any of those three things.

...And how do you find those Pokemon to capture? By travelling, that's how.

Ya but he wants to be a Pokémon Master and if I wanted to be the best at something I think I wouldn't forget one of the basics.

You would if it was something you never had to deal with for about two years.

Your forgot C they aren't trained hard enough to level up to evolve, you seem to think that isn't a possibility at all.

It isn't, because a. evolution isn't based on level in the anime (or else how would TR's Pokemon be able to evolve?), and b. as I mentioned before, the game's level system doesn't exist in the anime.

Funny how you talk about facts when what facts have you given me, all you have given me is possible theories and speculation. The only real facts you listed was that he trained Pikachu to make him good at Volt Tackle and that he trained Treecko to do Bullet Seed but everything else was maybes and could be's like ya he could be battling Brock/Misty but I highly doubt it.

This whole thread is part-speculation...but if you can't trace my facts, then you might want to refresh yourself on the episodes, particularly Chronicles (in "The Legend of Thunder", Jimmy makes a particularly-notable mention on why to NOT capture a Legendary Dog) & Johto. And, considering how the episodes have opened/ended on battles already in progress (most recently when Brock's Mudkip evolved into Marshtomp), there's no doubt that there're battles going on when we can't see them.

EDIT: Oh, DC, I didn't see you there. About time.

 

[Mudkip85]

Um there is no Stamina Stat

I actually was thinking more about the anime as although there is no actual stamina stat, its only normal for a pokemon to tire out eventually whilst battling. Therefore when i said that when Ash runs with pikachu its a form of training, well its true because it will increase the stamina of a pokemon so it will not tire out quickly in battle.

~Kipper~

 

[jasonresno]

Um there is no Stamina Stat and he never taught Snorunt Ice Beam, he made him get better at it like with Pikachu and Volt Tackle. The only Pokémon of his that I recall he taught anything to was Treecko and Swellow, he taught them Bullet Seed & Aerial Ace. Beyond that all the Moves his Pokémon have known they learned themselves through growing stronger though as I said before I don't see how they grow so strong with the lack of training & battling. And even if running on the beach could be considered training it still wouldn't do that much.

Ok here goes:

The reason for Ash:

1)Why doesn't he catch more Pokemon?
--He doesn't NEED them. And were he to catch every Poke he sees...not only would it bore the viewer (e.g US!) but he would never be able to use them all and the writers would have difficulty fitting them into the story.

2)Levels/Stats/Evolution
--The anime is NOT the game. There is no such ting as levels or stats or anything like that. Think of the Pokemon like you would a real life animal training..(I.E Running..where there is no Stamina stat...it does help you get fit)

3)Ash makes mistakes.
--OMGZ NO WAIZ!!! Ash can mess up..and it's all by design. He is supposed to be a normal/identifiable character. We all goof up sometimes, so does he.

4)Why doesn't Ash ever train/Why are his Pokes' so strong?
--We only see a little frame his day in each episode. We have NO idea what goes on.

5)Why doesn't his Pokemon evolve?
--They do, just not all of 'em. Maybe he doesn't want them to evolve.

 

[Poké King]

Poke King, the point that you seem to fail to grasp is that we don't see everything that goes on in the show, and the show's mechanics aren't the same as the game's. For instance, stamina might not be a problem in the game, but it sure is in the anime, since those battles are "real" with creatures that tire out with prolonged work/battling.

So you didn't say I was right because I was, there is no Stamina Stat. As for the Anime of course stamina plays a role in how well Pokémon do in battle. And its because of that I am adding Stamina in my Pokémon game to make it more realistic.

...And how do you find those Pokemon to capture? By travelling, that's how.

Ya you have to travel to get Pokémon but in the 3 Regions Ash has been in he has only captured a handful of Pokémon and ya there may be those 30 Tauros but even if you add them its still not that many Pokémon considering all the Regions he's been in. So ya they travel a lot and that alone should mean he as well as his friends would have more Pokémon or at the very least of battled more.

You would if it was something you never had to deal with for about two years.

Uh no, he wants to be the best . And when you wanna be the best at something or at least good at it you don't forget the basics, it be like an Architect forgetting what a blue print is lol.

It isn't, because a. evolution isn't based on level in the anime (or else how would TR's Pokemon be able to evolve?), and b. as I mentioned before, the game's level system doesn't exist in the anime.

Ya it doesn't exist in the Anime but I still think it take a lot more battles to evolve a Pokémon in the Anime. Which was the point of what I said which was they didn't battle much so it didn't make sense for them to evolve so fast and be so strong.

This whole thread is part-speculation...but if you can't trace my facts, then you might want to refresh yourself on the episodes, particularly Chronicles (in "The Legend of Thunder", Jimmy makes a particularly-notable mention on why to NOT capture a Legendary Dog) & Johto. And, considering how the episodes have opened/ended on battles already in progress (most recently when Brock's Mudkip evolved into Marshtomp), there's no doubt that there're battles going on when we can't see them.

Its not really speculation because everything I have said is based on what has and hasn't happen in the Anime therefore the only real facts we can go by is what happens in the Anime because everything else would be speculation so if anyone is saying facts than I am and if anyone is just saying speculation then you are.

And I vaguely remember that episode but in the end even if Jimmy wanted to capture it he couldn't of because his Pokémon was far too weak. Also ya they open/end on battles which proves that at least one battle happens in between episodes which still isn't enough to get said participating Pokémon so strong besides most of the battles that aren't done at the end of a episode are continued in the next anyways so saying that was kind of pointless.

The reason for Ash:

1)Why doesn't he catch more Pokemon?
--He doesn't NEED them. And were he to catch every Poke he sees...not only would it bore the viewer (e.g US!) but he would never be able to use them all and the writers would have difficulty fitting them into the story.

Really, he doesn't need them. Um last I checked how many times has Ash gotten nailed when battling because he didn't have a good variety of Pokémon luckily for him he gets lucky and the writers make him win somehow. For god's sake he hasn't even captured every Type yet after exploring 3 Regions in 2 years time.

2)Levels/Stats/Evolution
--The anime is NOT the game. There is no such ting as levels or stats or anything like that. Think of the Pokemon like you would a real life animal training..(I.E Running..where there is no Stamina stat...it does help you get fit)

Whether the Anime is like the game is non consequential because either way in the Anime you have to train Pokémon to make them stronger and either way we don't see him do that much.

3)Ash makes mistakes.
--OMGZ NO WAIZ!!! Ash can mess up..and it's all by design. He is supposed to be a normal/identifiable character. We all goof up sometimes, so does he.

Messing up is forgeting a Move a Pokémon may be able to do. Not forgetting an Electric Type Move doesn't effect a Ground Type or forgetting a Normal Type Move doesn't effect a Ghost Type. Thats called incompetent and if he is supposed to reflect us then the writers must not think we are that competent.

4)Why doesn't Ash ever train/Why are his Pokes' so strong?
--We only see a little frame his day in each episode. We have NO idea what goes on.

Ya but as I said I am going by what is seen in the Anime not the stuff we haven't seen because that is speculation besides from what I have seen in the Anime Ash isn't to concerned about training really so how can I as well as all of you expect him to be that way in what we don't see.

5)Why doesn't his Pokemon evolve?
--They do, just not all of 'em. Maybe he doesn't want them to evolve.

Never actually said they don't evolve, guess you like putting words in my mouth.


In summation lol I AM GOING BY WHAT THE ANIME SHOWS US so by that what I said makes senes, apparently you all who disagree like to imagine what happens outside of the Anime a lot and apparently in your imagination Ash is a dedicated bad ass Trainer lol.