The Rainbow Connection [LGBTS Club]

[Esper]

What do you guys think of this It Doesn't Get Better video?

This was actually kind of fascinating to watch. I didn't know there was any backlash to the It Gets Better campaign except from people who were generally anti-gay already.

A lot of the views this guy has are kind of not specific to queer people. Like he talked about how some people are stuck in rural areas with the same bullies they grew up with, or that only the skinny people can be thought of as pretty. That's the kind of thing that anyone could have to deal with, not just among queer people. I mean, I don't want to validate his whole point, but as far as I looked at it, the It Gets Better message was "High school sucks because you have to go there and once you're done with it you'll have the freedom to make your own choices." I personally never thought the message was a guarantee that life would be all sunshine and roses, just that you'll mature and have more experiences with time and you'll be a stronger person for it. Which I think is a totally cool message to be giving people who maybe feel like high school is all they'll ever know.

But yeah, I'm glad there are views like this guy's. It helps keep people honest if they can address the things dissenters like him bring up. If there is one thing about the gay community which I think needs addressing it's that it's not homogeneous and does have legitimate issues it needs to deal with.

 

[Ineffable~]

This was actually kind of fascinating to watch. I didn't know there was any backlash to the It Gets Better campaign except from people who were generally anti-gay already.

A lot of the views this guy has are kind of not specific to queer people. Like he talked about how some people are stuck in rural areas with the same bullies they grew up with, or that only the skinny people can be thought of as pretty. That's the kind of thing that anyone could have to deal with, not just among queer people. I mean, I don't want to validate his whole point, but as far as I looked at it, the It Gets Better message was "High school sucks because you have to go there and once you're done with it you'll have the freedom to make your own choices." I personally never thought the message was a guarantee that life would be all sunshine and roses, just that you'll mature and have more experiences with time and you'll be a stronger person for it. Which I think is a totally cool message to be giving people who maybe feel like high school is all they'll ever know.

But yeah, I'm glad there are views like this guy's. It helps keep people honest if they can address the things dissenters like him bring up. If there is one thing about the gay community which I think needs addressing it's that it's not homogeneous and does have legitimate issues it needs to deal with.

Yeah, I think people raise their expectations too high because they think that everything that is positive automatically lacks serious flaws, and that suffering and happiness are mutually exclusive.
Imperfection is beauty in my opinion. Some stuff sucks, and that's how you tell what's good and fun and happy.

By views I mean the doctrines of the church. I don't know if the two churches you went to were of the same denomination, but from one Catholic church to the next they teach to love everyone no matter who they are or their sexuality, it's a blanket belief that covers every Catholic church. Yeah, some people are more tolerant than others and that affects the attitude of the church in general, but the doctrines don't change.

They were both Lutheran.
Um I think I misinterpreted you at first. xD Sorry. I thought you meant intolerance was a rooted doctrine of the church that can't be completely removed and I disagreed since I know tolerant churches, but I think we agreed in the first place. :3

 

[Hiidoran]

What do you guys think of this It Doesn't Get Better video?

Definitely went into this thinking he was going to be one of those self-agonizing gays who've experienced a little bit more than their fair share of discrimination, and have become debbie-downers about being gay in the adult world. However, he brought up a good few points.

Even so, I think his arguments are more geared towards the exceptions and not the majority. I think he had very well thought-out arguments, and yeah, the "it gets better" campaign has somewhat sugar-coated the world for hopeful gay teens. It's not like that. Welcome to the world, children. Whether you're a minority, a woman, queer, handicapped, or different in any way, you're going to face discrimination. It doesn't stop. What does change is that you'll have better tools in which to remedy your issues with discrimination in the future. Not only will you obtain freedom to escape your possible hostile surroundings for that of a more comfortable locale, but you gain the strength to endure what people throw at you. Don't get me wrong, it's still going to hurt, but grab a gallon of ice cream and begin the healing process.

His viewpoints on the gay community are pretty spot on. While I think even his own arguments proves that there is, albeit minimally, a community to speak of... we're far from tight-knit. We police each other and judge, and when we do actually come together, it's for something camp... only really giving the heterosexual majority more reason to further ostracize us. The truth is, we're individuals, and while having a common interest in being "different" in regards to our sexuality or gender/sexual identities may bring us "together," saying we are one is grossly overgeneralizing. However, as he put it, to be considered one of the "cool gay kids" you have to look a certain way, dress a certain way, and do certain things. This does give our community a stereotype in which to follow. Good or bad, we have a face for homosexuality. I'll admit, I fall right into nearly all of those... and continue to conform, or, um, not conform in some cases... which in itself is conforming anyway. -shrugs- I think sometimes we all do things to gain social acceptance, even to a certain degree. If you didn't, stop speaking English. You're conforming to get along in our society. See what I did there?

I think sometimes we just get swept up in our rally to make our lives as queer individuals more accepted that we forget the logic behind it. We immediately turn on those that have a differing opinion to current issues like gay marriage or, in this case, disagree with a campaign aimed at helping gay teens feel better about themselves. Perhaps we should look at what they're really saying before jumping to conclusions. Chances are good they're not disagreeing with the cause, they're disagreeing with the implementation.

/end opinion

 

[Shining Raichu]

Ugh OK I was so busy with birthday stuff yesterday that I never made it to LGBT Club, despite being online most of the day lol. So, ALLOW ME TO CATCH UP.

Would you ever have sex with your significant other's sibling in order to produce a child with genetic material from both sides of the family?

Uh... no. I... don't think I could. I've never heard of this being a thing. On Will & Grace once, they wanted to have a baby together and rather than waiting a whole month for IVF treatment they decided to have sex... which in the end they couldn't go through with because they were best friends. Honestly, I don't think I would ever be able to have sex with a woman, even if it were cold and mechanical for the purpose of reproduction. Also, I hate kids and don't want them lol.


Now, onto that video. Is it wrong that I actively can't stand that guy? He bugged the living hell out of me for the entire eleven minutes. In that entire time, there was only one argument that I could agree with - and that was the "It Gets Better" campaign's implication that the solution lies in the future and you should therefore just wait it out and do nothing. That actually struck me as something I hadn't thought of before. Other than that, I think he was just an angry little man who's given into cynicism and is using that to give unnecessary opposition to a campaign that is designed to stop people from killing themselves. I think the fact that he made that video, when you consider that potentially suicidal teens may be exposed to it, is absolutely terrible and is an example of exercising freedom of speech for the sake of it.

 

[Taemin]

Can't watch any videos right now. ;.;

Would you ever have sex with your significant other's sibling in order to produce a child with genetic material from both sides of the family?

Honestly, I don't think I would ever be able to have sex with a woman, even if it were cold and mechanical for the purpose of reproduction. Also, I hate kids and don't want them lol.

Pretty much that, except flip it a bit. I don't think I could ever have sex with a guy. XD; It sounds completely unappealing. Sex in general doesn't interest me much with my whole semi-asexual thing going on, but especially not with a guy. On the really really rare chance that I would fall for a guy, there's an even rarer chance that I'd have sex with him. That would have to be a lot of love, and even then it might not happen. Sooooo, even if it were for the sake of having a child, I doubt I could do it. I'd rather donate eggs and have someone carry a child for me, because I have no want for that in any way. >__>

 

[Alice]

What do you guys think of this It Doesn't Get Better video?

Hmm, I can't argue with a lot of what he's saying, but his main argument was how you have to fit into a big queer group for it to get better. Really, that's no different than trying to fit in to normal heterosexual society, so I don't see why you should bother, or really care if you can't fit in.

 

[Esper]

I think the fact that he made that video, when you consider that potentially suicidal teens may be exposed to it, is absolutely terrible and is an example of exercising freedom of speech for the sake of it.

I have to disagree with this a little. The guy is really cynical and that kind of attitude isn't helpful if you are a potentially suicidal teen watching the video, but he's saying things that need to be said and addressed, even if it's just him saying something so that everyone else can disagree with it or prove him wrong. If you get past his attitude he's for making things better for queer people and his overall message is just "Are we really going about things the right way?"

I really should try watching some of the related videos to see how they approach the idea, but I don't want to get all cynical, too. D;

 

[Ineffable~]

Video response to the It Doesn't Get Better video (uncynical, safe for Scarf viewing):

​

I didn't watch the whole thing but I rather like this response from what I've seen. You just need to go out there and enjoy the world. You can't expect it to automagically get better. Sometimes happiness takes an effort.

 

[Esper]

Video response to the It Doesn't Get Better video (uncynical, safe for Scarf viewing):

​

I didn't watch the whole thing but I rather like this response from what I've seen. You just need to go out there and enjoy the world. You can't expect it to automagically get better. Sometimes happiness takes an effort.

This was exactly what I wanted to see: a realistic, positive and hopeful attitude.

Also, automagically is my new favorite word.

So, a question I have relates somewhat to the question brought up earlier regarding having children via your love's siblings. What are people's experiences with family and the whole "carrying on the family" name or anything really about your family's expectations of your having children of your own?

 

[Ineffable~]

This was exactly what I wanted to see: a realistic, positive and hopeful attitude.

Also, automagically is my new favorite word.

Glad you like it. Both on the video, and the word. :3

So, a question I have relates somewhat to the question brought up earlier regarding having children via your love's siblings. What are people's experiences with family and the whole "carrying on the family" name or anything really about your family's expectations of your having children of your own?

This was before I came out to anyone (even myself) but once when my sister and I were talking, we realised we both didn't want kids at all. My sister however said "crap, well you at least have to since you're the only one that can carry on the name."
Somehow, though, I feel she might change her mind someday. I'm not sure. I don't even know her opinion on it at the moment since that was a long time ago. She doesn't like her boyfriend's last name, so . . . who knows, maybe if she marries him (IF, just a hypothetical lol) she could actually pass on the name using hyphens. xD


Umm, slightly more about me. >.> My parents always wanted a boy, and they never said exactly why but I'm assuming part of it is because of the whole passing on the name thing.
. . . I don't really want to keep my old last name because it's a little too conspicuous, but even so, I'm not having kids. Anyway I don't see what would be the huge problem with this for most people considering you could adopt if you wanted to (correct me if I'm wrong, I think most states allow that now). I just think wanting to keep your legacy going is a little pointless in the first place, but that's just me.

To simplify it, I have indeed felt pressure from my parents, and it sucks because I don't want to upset them, but there are a lot of reasons I can't do it.

 

[Reddit]

HEY GUYS, I'M POLITE_ALL_CAPS_GUY AND I'D LIKE TO JOIN, YO!

Anyways, I am a bit hyper right now. I am the Landorus AKA the jerk who disappeared and left the club un-updated. THANKS ANDREW FOR STEALING THE CLUB! seriously

So..hi! :3 I don't really have much to say about the current topic besides the guy saying it doesn't get better is..very pessimistic.

 

[Ineffable~]

HEY GUYS, I'M POLITE_ALL_CAPS_GUY AND I'D LIKE TO JOIN, YO!

Anyways, I am a bit hyper right now. I am the Landorus AKA the jerk who disappeared and left the club un-updated. THANKS ANDREW FOR STEALING THE CLUB! seriously

So..hi! :3 I don't really have much to say about the current topic besides the guy saying it doesn't get better is..very pessimistic.

D: If you are the Landorus then why are you on a different account?

CONFUSED.

 

[FreakyLocz14]

I have another question:

Do you think that some people become LGBT later in life, rather than being born that way?

I thought about this dude to what happened to a friend of mine. Her boyfriend cheated on her with guy. When confronted, he admitted that his desires for men are new and stem from dissatisfaction with the performance of women.

 

[Taemin]

I have another question:

Do you think that some people become LGBT later in life, rather than being born that way?

Well, I have definitely heard of people suddenly choosing to turn gay because of bad experiences with the other sex. I.E. a girl friend of mine wants to start dating girls because she's fed up with guys, but up until that point she'd been flawlessly straight. Though, I don't understand how someone can switch so suddenly later on in their life.. xD; seems like they maybe had to be bisexual the entire time, but might've not realized.

 

[Reddit]

D: If you are the Landorus then why are you on a different account?

CONFUSED.

Because I hated that name. ^-^; I changed the signature on that account to say the name of this account.

Well, I have definitely heard of people suddenly choosing to turn gay because of bad experiences with the other sex. I.E. a girl friend of mine wants to start dating girls because she's fed up with guys, but up until that point she'd been flawlessly straight. Though, I don't understand how someone can switch so suddenly later on in their life.. xD; seems like they maybe had to be bisexual the entire time, but might've not realized.

I agree with the bisexual statement.

SO TODAY THIS GUY AT WORK MADE ME VERY ANGRY.

This guy - first of all he thinks I am gay but isn't sure - anyways, he was ranting about how the gay community at my college is too big and that it's nasty, then he was saying how it was "sick" that they repealed DADT

I was thinking.."ARE YOU TRYING TO INSULT ME? DO YOU WANT TO GET FIRED YOU BIGOTED JERK-OFF?" But I just smiled and walked away because I am being considered for a management job.

 

[Melody]

Drew, you said she was "Flawlessly Straight", are you sure that's what you mean? It's perfectly possible she was either hiding her other impulses or were as you mentioned, unaware of them.

Yeah...Usually you don't just flip. Generally I do happen to believe as Drew said, you might have been bi or gay in the first place but never accepted or realized that usually. Secondly, So what if you do choose it? It's not wrong. It kind of upsets me to see that LGBTs who don't like who they are take out their anger on those who happen to be flexible enough to change, assuming the person who does change is actually in the middle of the Kinsey scale and not on one extreme end or the other.

Bisexuals are surprisingly more common than you think, but it's true that some lean one way or another more heavily than others do. Not to mention that Bisexuals do tend to be able to "Blend in" better than some others do...and it is quite possible to be Bisexual and not know it, because it's so easy to fall in the mindset of "Oh, I'm just curious or over-imaginative, not actually craving the same sex." So yeah, if someone is bi then it's possible to place the "straw that broke the camel's back" and cause them to lean and/or trend the other direction. It kind of disappoints me to see that some people call themselves bi or just straight and then change their orientation based on whatever gender their mate happens to be because they want to seem less "promiscuous" when that's not the case at all.

But I do believe that your place on the Kinsey scale is NOT fixed at birth. Your place on the Kinsey scale is not set in stone, it's likely to slide around up to 2 points in either direction as you learn, mature and grow...based upon how you experience life. If you grow up in a homo-unfriendly environment you might shy away from increasing your score and if you grew up in a homo-friendly environment, you might not care at all and let your score increase. So naturally I dislike it when ANYONE, LGBT or not says that it is set in stone at birth. What we become as we grow into adults is just as much influenced by our upbringing, and surroundings as it is by our genetics, family history and much more.

Given a few years, anyone can change who they are as a person pretty well if that is what they choose to do. So I don't disbelieve that someone younger can do so faster than that, nor do I believe sexual orientation is the exception to the rule.

 

[Alice]

Do you think that some people become LGBT later in life, rather than being born that way?

Hello.

I thought about this dude to what happened to a friend of mine. Her boyfriend cheated on her with guy. When confronted, he admitted that his desires for men are new and stem from dissatisfaction with the performance of women.

I've never had a relationship with anyone, and wasn't attracted to guys in the slightest until a year ago or so.

There's really no reason, I just changed.

 

[Shining Raichu]

-cries- y u people always so active I'm at work or sleeping ;;

I have to disagree with this a little. The guy is really cynical and that kind of attitude isn't helpful if you are a potentially suicidal teen watching the video, but he's saying things that need to be said and addressed, even if it's just him saying something so that everyone else can disagree with it or prove him wrong. If you get past his attitude he's for making things better for queer people and his overall message is just "Are we really going about things the right way?"

I really should try watching some of the related videos to see how they approach the idea, but I don't want to get all cynical, too. D;

I think the cynicism really overrode anything he was trying to say. There were things said that need to be addressed, particularly regarding the in-fighting within the LGBT community itself, however the message I took from the video was not "Are we really going about things the right way?" it was "It doesn't get better" which is simply not true.

What are people's experiences with family and the whole "carrying on the family" name or anything really about your family's expectations of your having children of your own?

I haven't run into much trouble with that yet. My mother desperately wants grandchildren someday though, because... well, I don't really know. I guess that's just what mothers want. I don't think it's really about the name as such, though, she just wants grandchildren. Unfortunately, since I'm gay and my sister hates children nearly as much as I do, she won't be getting any lol. I think that will cause some problems down the line.

As far as the "family name" issue is concerned, I honestly don't understand why this is an issue for anybody. Why does it matter? It's just a name. It means nothing. In 100 years time, if there's a descendant of yours running around with your last name, it won't change the fact that you're dead and that nobody remembers who you are. It's more prudent to make an impact on people while you're alive than hoping that your name flowing down a line of descendants will be enough to carry your memory.

Do you think that some people become LGBT later in life, rather than being born that way?

I thought about this dude to what happened to a friend of mine. Her boyfriend cheated on her with guy. When confronted, he admitted that his desires for men are new and stem from dissatisfaction with the performance of women.

No, I don't think thing people "become LGBT" later in life. There's any number of explanations for this situation, but the most likely is that your friend's boyfriend was lying to cover the fact that he's always been gay. It's kind of genius really, it's along the lines of saying "I'm not gay, I'm just experimenting".

HEY GUYS, I'M POLITE_ALL_CAPS_GUY AND I'D LIKE TO JOIN, YO!

Anyways, I am a bit hyper right now. I am the Landorus AKA the jerk who disappeared and left the club un-updated. THANKS ANDREW FOR STEALING THE CLUB! seriously

Haha welcome back, Landorus! You're quite welcome, but MINE NAO. ALL MINE. MUAHAHAHA

 

[Alice]

No, I don't think thing people "become LGBT" later in life.

Again, I have to say, Hello.

 

[-Jared-]

So, a question I have relates somewhat to the question brought up earlier regarding having children via your love's siblings. What are people's experiences with family and the whole "carrying on the family" name or anything really about your family's expectations of your having children of your own?

Gah, there is a lot to respond to. 0_o I think I'll just answer this though, lol.

For me, there kida is some pressure to carry on the name. :\ My mom, who otherwise is super supporting of my sexuality, says the ONE reason she wishes I wasn't gay was because she wants me to have biological children so that she can have, in her words, "Little Jareds". >__> And while I appreciate the sentiment, it just makes me feel bad, because while I do want children, I would rather adopt than go with in vitro or something. :\