You Can't Go Chasing Waterfalls

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Poliwrath will have to pack a lot of atk EVs with a neutral nature (200, and that's about 98-114% with Brick Break), or 100 with a positive nature (same result) to ensure a OHKO, but no atk EVs and neutral nature still ensure a 2hko.
 
I truly agree with Poliwrath. Resisting almost evverything that Tar has.
 
I thought Poliwrath ran defense as well. Anyway, with 252atk EVs and a positive nature, Brick Break does 94-110%, so that's a good chance of a OHKO. Waterfall won't even OHKO in the rain (75-88%), but both of these don't apply with any sort of damage boosting items (only Leftovers). Waterfall without rain may fail to 2hko (50-58%), so consider something like Expert Belt if you have to OHKO it.

Poliwrath@Leftovers/Expert Belt
Adamant
252atk/252HP/6def

Brick Break
Waterfall
Hypnosis/Rock Slide
Rain Dance/Ice Punch

Last two moves are just some preference. If you need it as a Rain Dancer, then Hypnosis will help.
 
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Ah, my bad! I just thought it'd be common sense for a fighting type to have Access to Stone Edge *smacks self* I'll change it to Rock Slide.
 
Syaoran said:
He really doesn't need Rock Slide..

Waterfall, Sub, Hypnosis, and Brick Break or Focus Punch works very well.
Click to expand...

I like Rock Slide, it makes an effective Gyarados counter with it.

Ice Punch/Brick break or F Punch/ Waterfall Rock Slide @Choice band is what i use.


You can drop t-bolt on Mesprit if you choose rock slide if your using Poliwrath to deal with Gyarados and consider Grass Knot or Energy ball on Mesprit to help deal with foe swamperts, i can see them being problematic.
 
Rock Slide barely scratches Gyara if he Intimidates, and Poliwrath has much better things to do than being Banded..

I suggest Zapdos over Mesprit as it has a reliable recovery move and is REALLY hard to take down. It's also a nice set upper for Rain Dance, and HP ice hurts too.
 
I don't think Gyarados would switch in on a Poliwrath :/ It won't like getting Hypnosis'd on the switch if it believes Poliwrath is running it. Also, unless Gyarados is running Return or going Earthquake, I'm sure Wrath will still be out-damaging Gyarados, even after Intimidate.
 
Blueberry said:
Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 212 HP / 252 Def / 46 SDef
Calm Nature (Special Defense +, Attack -)

Hydro Pump
Ice Beam
Wish
Rain Dance

Persian @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 6 HP / 252 Speed / 252 SAtk
Timid Nature (Speed +, Special Attack -)

Swift
Water Pulse
Hypnosis
Nasty Plot

Qwilfish @ Leftovers
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 168 HP / 252 Atk / 88 Speed
Adamant Nature (Attack +, Special Attack -)

Waterfall
Poison Jab
Explosion
Swords Dance

*-May replace with Feraligatr. I would also like to be able to outrun the standard ScarfGarchomp and explode in it's face if needed.

Magnezone @ Leftovers
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 172 HP / 84 Speed / 252 SAtk
Modest Nature (Special Attack +, Attack -)

Thunderbolt
Hidden Power [Ice]
Magnet Rise
Substitute

Mesprit @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SAtk
Bold Nature (Defense +, Attack -)

Psychic
Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Rain Dance

Kingdra @ Mystic Water
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 88 Speed / 168 SAtk
Naughty Nature (Attack +, Special Defense -)

Waterfall
Draco Meteor
Surf
Ice Beam
Click to expand...

In my opinion, Vaporeon is not a good lead, as 8 pokemon out of the top 10 leads (Gengar, Gyarados, Bronzong, Tyranitar, Yanmega, Ninjask, Azelf, Infernape) don't care about it and can set up on it.

The next thing I see is lack of a status absorber. You would have to force a sweeper to be incapacitated if Gengar, Bronzong and stuff start spamming Sleep moves.

I don't see the role of Qwilfish on this team. Most people already know what Qwilfish does - Explode. Therefore the strategy is predictable and Qwilfish would be a burden on your team.

Kingdra wants the Atk and SpA Evs switched, 168 Atk already guarantees the 2HKO on Blissey.

Your team is weak to Scarf sweepers like ScarfCross, as they can decimate your team and your only "counter" to them is Mespirit and Vaporeon, and Kingdra can only come in and revenge when the Rain is up.

Lead LO Gengars also rape this team, 2HKOing Vaporeon, OHKOing Magnezone (70% chance), Mespirit (100% chance), the only thing that can safely switch in is Kingdra, and it will get Hypnotised by Gengar without Rain.

So, fast sweepers are the downfall of this team, if the opponent gets a good matchup at the start, Rain Dance won't even be up. SDLuke and DDGyara among other fast set-up sweepers will also pose a significant threat to this team.
 
First off, remember that this team was made with Quillfish in mind. As such, I believe he is adamant in keeping it.

I will agree that fast sweepers kinda gives this team trouble.
 
Okay, the set I would recommend for Qwilfish is the suicide bomber lead set. Basically

Qwilfish @ Focus Sash
Swift Swim
Adamant, 252 Attack, 252 Speed, 4 anything

Rain Dance
Explosion
filler
filler

The filler can be any one of these -
Protect, Destiny Bond, Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Thunder Wave, Poison Jab, Aqua Tail, Waterfall, Flail

Sets up Rain Dance and Explodes off the bat.
 
Meh, I like BLueberry's other set. You make it seem like Quillfish is NU or something. He has nice attack, and great speed, for Dancin' purposes, anyway.
 
Shedinja weak.

I'd stick Damp Rock somewhere, and maybe Toxicroak as you seem to lean to the special side.
 
That's an odd thing to say. And it's true. Guess we all forgot about Shedinja.
 
Yeah, short of PP stalling it into Struggle you're not doing anything.

The only reason I say that is because when I scan over moves I see them in colors according to type, and I see blue, pink, yellow... and I noticed that you have nothing Shedinja worries about. Poison Stab threw me off for a second because it's purple like Shadow Ball but then I caught it.

You won't be seeing many Shedinja though.
 
Yeah, not really a weakness that he should scramble to fix right away anyway.
 
nnnnnnnnnooooooo change your avy back blue berrie.....you scare me now lol
i like the kabutops idea but if someone wouldnt mind doin calculations For 252 hp quilfish that would help and i would say do this

quilfish@damp rock jolly
evs-252 hp 124 atk/speed
-rain dance
-destiny bond
-water fall
-poision jab

it looks stupid but if it lives it surprises opponents with rain bonding and allows you to set up. i also like kabutops because you have only one physical

lasty hp grass on zone to own swampert

also you put -sp atk for timid by the way
 
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