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6th Gen Your Father

Altairis

take me ☆ take you
  • 5,188
    Posts
    11
    Years
    I hope he shows up more! I mean, my dad's a gym leader but all he does is sit in one room until the post game? He doesn't even say hi to me when I move in? As much as Alder annoyed me, I hope he pulls an Alder in the remakes and shows up randomly to check up on the player. In the originals I always had gotten the vibe that he didn't really care that much, since he knew his kid was on a journey but he never even made an effort to say hi, haha.
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

    10000 year Emperor of Hoenn
  • 17,521
    Posts
    14
    Years
    Maybe they could make it so that at certain times of the day one can talk to Norman at home (after all he travels all the way to his gym). Like at night for example. He could give the player advise or act like the mother does, healing our Pokemon and telling us to take care.
     
  • 2,777
    Posts
    17
    Years
    • Age 31
    • USA
    • Seen Mar 30, 2024
    I haven't played Heart Gold or Soul Silver so I wouldn't know. Do any of the characters in those games get an extended role beyond what they do in Crystal, besides the Kimono girls?

    Kind of. There are some added scenes you can watch unfold between various Gym Leaders which gives you a better idea of their characters.





    Ahhhhh Norman. The dad everyone thinks is so mean but in reality is so tragic. He watches his child grow up, from not being able to leave town because the tall grass is scary, to defeating him at his own profession. It was great how you had a dad who wanted what was best for you, but at the same time wanted to succeed, himself. They could really play up that "fatherly love" kind of thing...perhaps a scene between him and your mother about how he doesn't want you to beat him not because he wants you to fail, but rather because he doesn't want you to grow up, leave, and never rely on him and your mother any more? You know, that typical "parent stuff" that makes you cry because of how much they care but still have to "let you go" to live your own life.

    Norman is usually thought poorly of because of his lack of a role, especially as a father, but now that they have the opportunity to expand upon that, he could really become the father character players have been asking about in Pokémon games since its conception.

    As for the female protagonist and male protagonist having different fathers, that would be a pretty neat idea, I admit. My only worry is that I wouldn't want one father to be given more depth than the other. But if executed correctly, that could be a really cool dynamic; one could set high hopes on his son, and the other could worry about the safety of his daughter? Game Freak does a really good job at challenging gender roles in their games, but I'm honestly not sure how far they'd be willing to take it in an instance like this--but honestly that's the only reason I can see for even having different fathers in this scenario. Otherwise it's just a visual difference that means that one gender misses out on the dynamic of competing with your own parent (which, as I've said, is a very interesting and complex one that I wish they would play up more for ORAS, because I'm certain they didn't want Norman to come off as unsupportive, but he did for most people because of how little he's involved in the game).
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

    10000 year Emperor of Hoenn
  • 17,521
    Posts
    14
    Years
    Kind of. There are some added scenes you can watch unfold between various Gym Leaders which gives you a better idea of their characters.





    Ahhhhh Norman. The dad everyone thinks is so mean but in reality is so tragic. He watches his child grow up, from not being able to leave town because the tall grass is scary, to defeating him at his own profession. It was great how you had a dad who wanted what was best for you, but at the same time wanted to succeed, himself. They could really play up that "fatherly love" kind of thing...perhaps a scene between him and your mother about how he doesn't want you to beat him not because he wants you to fail, but rather because he doesn't want you to grow up, leave, and never rely on him and your mother any more? You know, that typical "parent stuff" that makes you cry because of how much they care but still have to "let you go" to live your own life.

    Norman is usually thought poorly of because of his lack of a role, especially as a father, but now that they have the opportunity to expand upon that, he could really become the father character players have been asking about in Pokémon games since its conception.

    As for the female protagonist and male protagonist having different fathers, that would be a pretty neat idea, I admit. My only worry is that I wouldn't want one father to be given more depth than the other. But if executed correctly, that could be a really cool dynamic; one could set high hopes on his son, and the other could worry about the safety of his daughter? Game Freak does a really good job at challenging gender roles in their games, but I'm honestly not sure how far they'd be willing to take it in an instance like this--but honestly that's the only reason I can see for even having different fathers in this scenario. Otherwise it's just a visual difference that means that one gender misses out on the dynamic of competing with your own parent (which, as I've said, is a very interesting and complex one that I wish they would play up more for ORAS, because I'm certain they didn't want Norman to come off as unsupportive, but he did for most people because of how little he's involved in the game).
    To me Norman came off as being a more 'traditional'/samurai kind of father, one who comes off as distant but actually cares for his child, while also wanting them to succeed in what they do but push them on. His gym gave me the vibe of a dojo which in turn reminds me of the samurai whom had a show no weakness kind of attitude, not even towards one's own family.
     
  • 2,777
    Posts
    17
    Years
    • Age 31
    • USA
    • Seen Mar 30, 2024
    To me Norman came off as being a more 'traditional'/samurai kind of father, one who comes off as distant but actually cares for his child, while also wanting them to succeed in what they do but push them on. His gym gave me the vibe of a dojo which in turn reminds me of the samurai whom had a show no weakness kind of attitude, not even towards one's own family.

    That's a very good observation! Whichever way they decide to roll with Norman, I hope they enhance his character somehow. It makes me sad when so many people say Norman's a bad father, when all he's doing is looking out for his kid and himself.
     
  • 270
    Posts
    10
    Years
    • Seen Jan 3, 2017
    That's a very good observation! Whichever way they decide to roll with Norman, I hope they enhance his character somehow. It makes me sad when so many people say Norman's a bad father, when all he's doing is looking out for his kid and himself.
    People's low opinion of Norman could stem from the Adventures manga. He's pretty terrifying and abusive in that continuity.
     

    OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire

    10000 year Emperor of Hoenn
  • 17,521
    Posts
    14
    Years
    People's low opinion of Norman could stem from the Adventures manga. He's pretty terrifying and abusive in that continuity.

    I liked his character apart from the times he was abusive, as he had moments that showed he cared for Ruby, he was even going to let him participate in Contests before he ran away...
    Hmm...his special adaption also reminds me of a samurai...running away from one's family was seen as the ultimate betrayal, equal to treason against the state in those times.

    I hope that Norman appears more and gives the trainer battle advise and he'll seem like a wise figure while still having that warrior kind of aura.
     
  • 2,777
    Posts
    17
    Years
    • Age 31
    • USA
    • Seen Mar 30, 2024
    People's low opinion of Norman could stem from the Adventures manga. He's pretty terrifying and abusive in that continuity.

    That is also very possible. If a character is depicted differently in one medium, it could very well affect how you think of them in general.

    But since Special/Adventures does not share the canon of the main series games, I'm basing this mostly on how I see people react to him in the games. For instance, in the beginning he tells you to go get more badges before battling him, and people may respond with, "Wow dad, thanks. You think I can't beat you?" ...This man has two Slaking, of course you can't beat him yet! He's doing this for your own good! Really! He wants you to succeed, he just also wants to succeed, too. Being a Gym Leader is his job, after all.
     

    Salzorrah

    [font=Montserrat][b][color=#66CC66]g[/color][color
  • 6,374
    Posts
    13
    Years
    Really do hope that Norman takes more of a prominent role in these games. Just seems so random that your father in RSE is just sitting in one room, in one spot, for pretty much the entire game with the same piece of dialogue every time. Not to say that your Mum's is much different, but at least she had a bit more life in her in X&Y. So to many degrees, I hope that both Norman and the mother of the player in the story take more of a prominent and "involved" stance. Especially with dialogue. Norman should be pretty well "in-the-know" when it comes to the goings-on in Hoenn, so I should be expecting him to know more about what the player is experiencing, especially when it comes to Team Magma/Aqua. I wouldn't mind if he had more involvement in the story for sure, but I really hope that Norman isn't the lifeless father sitting in the end of a gym all day with the same line "<Player>, you should go visit your mother every so often. I'm going to stay here and redouble my training. It would bother me as a Trainer to not avenge my loss to you, <player>!" every time I see him. Except for the rematches of course, in which his dialogue alters slightly (still boring).

    Yeah, I argee with you Gav! I kinda hate how in every game it is always like this:

    Mom: "Oh so you defeated the league, save the world from utter destruction, and caught all of the Pokemon? That's nice dear!"

    And yeah, I kinda hate how Norman is like "derp im gonna stay here bein a gym leader while my kid saves the freakin world"

    I really wish GF would do something about this :(
     
  • 12,284
    Posts
    11
    Years
    • Seen Oct 22, 2023
    Norman has his own gym, and gym leaders probably aren't allowed to go outside of their city or town as long as they have their gym open; they always have challengers coming, and only way they could reject their match is when they don't have sufficient badges. Plus, the league most likely requires them to available for certain amount of hours, and if leaders don't follow these guidelines, they might wind up losing their position. Due to all this, I could definitely see why Norman hasn't made much appearance in RSE. Would I like to see him more involved in ORAS? Sure, he's one of favorite characters, but unless he quits his gym, it just wouldn't make much sense to me. :(
     

    Salzorrah

    [font=Montserrat][b][color=#66CC66]g[/color][color
  • 6,374
    Posts
    13
    Years
    Norman has his own gym, and gym leaders probably aren't allowed to go outside of their city or town as long as they have their gym open; they always have challengers coming, and only way they could reject their match is when they don't have sufficient badges. Plus, the league most likely requires them to available for certain amount of hours, and if leaders don't follow these guidelines, they might wind up losing their position. Due to all this, I could definitely see why Norman hasn't made much appearance in RSE. Would I like to see him more involved in ORAS? Sure, he's one of favorite characters, but unless he quits his gym, it just wouldn't make much sense to me. :(

    Maybe like after defeating Norman, he may take a leave of absence from his gym possibly and maybe help you in your journey perhaps? But then again, that seems silly that your dad follows on your journey to success while abandoning the fact that he's the one that earns money in the family lel
     

    Elaitenstile

    I am legend
  • 1,908
    Posts
    11
    Years
    • Seen Feb 27, 2015
    Maybe like after defeating Norman, he may take a leave of absence from his gym possibly and maybe help you in your journey perhaps? But then again, that seems silly that your dad follows on your journey to success while abandoning the fact that he's the one that earns money in the family lel

    Mom mentions that Norman took his defeat to his child very badly and is training full-time now. So I don't see any chance of this happening as he's only gonna try harder; embarrassed by losing to his own son/daughter.
     

    Salzorrah

    [font=Montserrat][b][color=#66CC66]g[/color][color
  • 6,374
    Posts
    13
    Years
    Mom mentions that Norman took his defeat to his child very badly and is training full-time now. So I don't see any chance of this happening as he's only gonna try harder; embarrassed by losing to his own son/daughter.

    Who knows, he might travel the region and might bump into you in cases and help you out? Still possible :P
     

    Elaitenstile

    I am legend
  • 1,908
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    11
    Years
    • Seen Feb 27, 2015
    Who knows, he might travel the region and might bump into you in cases and help you out? Still possible :P

    Yeah, but hopefully he wouldn't be too angry... it's not comforting to know that our own dad bears a grudge against us.
     

    Salzorrah

    [font=Montserrat][b][color=#66CC66]g[/color][color
  • 6,374
    Posts
    13
    Years
    Yeah, but hopefully he wouldn't be too angry... it's not comforting to know that our own dad bears a grudge against us.

    Didn't he say it himself that he wants to see us grow and be stronger than him?

    I'm positive that he wont be angry :)
     
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