Fire Emblem Fates Discussion

[Arc]

Maybe a spoiler about Ryoumas son?

Spoiler:

So I didn't know you had to talk to Shiro to recruit him in his Paralogue. He died in the first turn, so I couldn't do so anyway. Well, the dialogue after the chapter implied that he was joining the party and I saved the game. But he doesn't join the party if he dies. So now I can't get him at all. :(((( So yeah, make sure you talk to Shiro asap if you want him.

Spoiler:

Yeah, if a kid start out as an Ally, typically you must talk to them with their respective dads to be recruited, unless there are some other requirements (e.g Asugi). Shiro's map does suck though. Past Chapter 18, you have to use a Rescue staff, because the chances of him surviving are non-existent.

 

[JJ Styles]

Whoever said Hayato was so good was pretty darn right. His Underdog like personal skill "Pride" really boosts up his damage and just makes him keep up with everyone. Also turned him into a Basara since said class has Rend Heaven, which is so good at taking out high STR and high MAG targets such as Berserkers and Sorcs.

I really wished there were more Killer Axes to get. Its so tempting to just run a Killer Axe on Rinka to abuse Deathblow instead of that Giant Club and its shoddy accuracy, and borrowing Scarlet's all the time is something i don't want to do all the time.

 

[Kameken]

So, I just finished chapter 27 in Conquest, that was neat. Until,

Spoiler:

Surprise, second final boss who's a billion times stronger and impossible to get to because he has 800 minions and gets more as time goes on and if you lose you have to replay the last chapter because you can't save after beating Garon. It's too hard to design things so here's every hard thing in the game instead, have fun.

 

[JJ Styles]

so i just played that Paralogue where:

Spoiler:

You get Hisame, Hinata's child. How do i describe this mission? Wasting your 3ds battery power? Map looks decent until you realize that the terrain really screws with your unit's movement unless you have your air force, oh and those Faceless that you probably where used to cutting down? Oh yeah. Even with your promoted units they take forever to die with their billions of HP and nothing else. Oh and the mission? Rout the Enemy... I thought it was defeat the boss.. it was a good thing i had my airforce at hand else this paralogue could have taken ages. Then again, it was my fault for not bringing my heavy hitters other than the Avatar and the wife, but everyone got some EXP and weapon exp from all the faceless mutilation.

i'm having Kagero more in my army for some reason. Must be those assets she has, almost comparable to Camilla's. Though in all seriousness she has a lot going on. Not sure about her class path yet. Still tinkering around. Saizo being able to use the Samurai class is so cool though. I still can't get over the fact that:

Spoiler:

Kaze died, in-story and he had a lot more going on... x-x and i just read that it was actually preventable too. Dang... he was my best fighter in the early game.

Its also a good thing i went with the Male Avatar since i just saw what the Male Kanna looks like and its certainly not what i expect.

Spoiler:

TLDR: looks like a cave troll.

 

[Keiran]

I still can't get over the fact that:

Spoiler:

Kaze died, in-story and he had a lot more going on... x-x and i just read that it was actually preventable too. Dang... he was my best fighter in the early game.

Spoiler:

Oh, that's pretty disappointing. :( I hoped he would reappear later in the game. He was actually one of my favorite units and I actually promoted him during the chapter right before he dies.

 

[bobandbill]

Spoilers btw. Just for the chicks and bros who aren't playing yet (i doubt it though but still)

No need to doubt! Some of us live in Europe or Australia and hence don't even have a date for the game. =( So thumbs up for continued use of spoiler tags.

How are people finding Birthright and Conquest in terms of difficulty and map missions anyways?

 

[Sir Codin]

Okay so on Birthright, my wife is Hana. The samurai chick. It was either her or Felicia and I seriously decided it on a coin flip.

 

[thedestinedblade]

I still haven't found much time to play so I'm still around chapter 17 of Conquest. Did a few of the Paralogues and trying to pair off the remaining units I have.

Felicia was my first choice but I decided to pair Corrin with Azura since I figured it was the storyline favored pairing, but the supports were a little on the boring side. I hear Revelation does the couple more justice.

 

[Nah]

No need to doubt! Some of us live in Europe or Australia and hence don't even have a date for the game. =( So thumbs up for continued use of spoiler tags.

Tbh I don't understand why Europe and Australia still don't have a release date for Fates. I get that that's the usual thing with release dates, the Japan gets it first and then NA and then the rest of the world, but I've hoped that people would start trying to do more worldwide releases these days, especially for more major franchises. It's been out in North America for a couple of weeks now, what's the point in not announcing a Europe/Australia release date at this point, even if they don't plan to release it for, say, a few months?

 

[JJ Styles]

Okay so on Birthright, my wife is Hana. The samurai chick. It was either her or Felicia and I seriously decided it on a coin flip.

I actually considered having Hana as the wife since the Boon stat of my avatar was Speed, and Hana's best stat was also speed, so that's a lot of Speed to pass down to the child, but i never went for it since i forgot that the "personality" class of my avatar was a Samurai, so i felt that there was no point in passing down just Samurai based traits.

I might to it on a different playthrough if i consider replaying Birthright from the start. Hana is kinda cute.

Spoiler:

Also, if i have to make a 2nd playthrough, I'll be avoiding all of the scripted playable character deaths such as Gunter's and Kaze's so i can have more units. I'm still pissed at how i completely missed out on Kaze and his child.

 

[Keiran]

No need to doubt! Some of us live in Europe or Australia and hence don't even have a date for the game. =( So thumbs up for continued use of spoiler tags.

How are people finding Birthright and Conquest in terms of difficulty and map missions anyways?

What do you mean by map missions?

As for difficulty, I just beat Birthright (Hard Casual) and it was pretty easy. No strategy was required. Most missions were over within a few turns. However, enemy stats scaled pretty well so you could still get done in with some unfavorable RNG.

Something I've noticed in Fates is that it's almost impossible to have godlike characters because everything has a weakness. Javelins and Hand Axes can't hit adjacent units, so they are no longer the best weapons in the game since they can't reliably clear a whole map in one enemy phase. All of the strongest weapons come with drawbacks (apart from character exclusive weapons like Yato). If you're overleveled, you can still be brought down pretty easily if you get debuffed.

The only character that I felt was overpowered was Ryoma due to his very strong Katana that also has 1-2 range, and if he actually got hit and put into Vantage range he can pretty much kill anything before they attack even on an enemy phase. Furthermore, Bushido is a fairly strong and reliable buff, and Duelist pretty much guarantees that he doesn't get hit on player phase.

Honestly if you don't play on Casual, even Birthright can be pretty difficult.

 

[Arc]

How are people finding Birthright and Conquest in terms of difficulty and map missions anyways?

My impressions, for what their worth. All were/being played on Lunatic/Classic.

Spoiler: Birthright

You get a rout! You get a rout! Everybody gets a rout!

I would love to be joking, but most of Birthright is just routing a la Awakening. Birthright is a fairly smooth experience. Money is thrown at you from left to right, and with the game being mostly rout, experience is plenty. Characters are recruited in bulk and early, expect a full team by Chapter 14.

Very much a simple experience that most can get into, as the difficulty is consistent throughout until the last four chapters, where it becomes 'okay' to 'how do I one turn this to save myself a headache'. Birthright's approach to difficulty is give disincentive to players from turtling by increasing unity density through changing enemy composition and more reinforcements. Despite saying that, turtling is easily the safest option.

Spoiler: Conquest

The good version!

Objectives are varied and side objectives are plentiful. Expect to see Seize, Rout, Escape, Defeat the Boss, and Turn Limits. As for the side-objectives, keep a look out for chests and villages, you're going to need everything you can get.

Unlike Birthright where all the units are given to you early, Conquest decides to sprinkle the units throughout, and let's you work on a steadier pace for your team; as you'll have more time to judge their early levels for longer instead of hastily swapping all the good guys in. (you'll still want the great units, but you're going to have to cut some of the regular units.)

Conquest has some superb map design. It blows Birthright and by extension, Revelations out of the water. Chapter 10, 12, 15, and 24, are some of the handful that I can vividly recall from my head. A little off-topic, but I do hope whenever IS designs a defend map, they look to Chapter 10 as an example. It easily is the best defend map in the whole series, which wasn't exactly a high of a bar, nonetheless an accomplishment.

Conquest's approach to difficulty to is changing enemy weapon loadouts and skills. Out of curiosity, I've compared that the stat difference from Hard to Lunatic is non-existent, at most you'll see a +1 or +2 to all of the stats, aside from odd cases. Nothing too severe. To counteract that, you'll be fighting against much tougher individual enemies and staves users all around. This will keep you on your toes and contemplate of how your approaches fair.

For good measure, might as well throw in Revelation.

Spoiler: Revelation

Before Fates left the shores of Japan. There were a couple of importers, and some played through the third route, Invisible Kingdom. Soon after, they stopped calling it that, and it was dubbed 'Gimmick Kingdom', because that's what this whole path is about. GIMMICKS.

In terms of objectives, you'll be seeing a lot of Defeat Boss, Seize, Rout, and pinch of Escape. As for the actual map design, it's better than Birthright at the very least. Except that most map revolves around a gimmick to go in tandem with Dragon Vein. Usually, the gimmick is time-based as well, so the chapters go on to be a drag at times. Chapter 13 was actually one of my favourites as it didn't solely rely on Dragon Vein, and it had an interesting mechanic in picking up unbreakable objects; with this, you can actually create walls and chokepoints, very fun.

Characters are given to you similar to Conquest, sprinkled throughout the route, but like Birthright, in bulk. You'll have forty-four characters (excluding children) at your disposal, and only sixteen can be taken to the Endgame, the benches are going to be very warm. It's a good thing that IS has kindly decided to make the choices easier for you though, as half of the cast is near unusable. The unit imbalance is on par with FE10 and FE12, as there is little justification to use them.

Revelations approach to difficulty is increasing enemy density and buffing up stats. In addition to this, you'll be fighting promoted units a lot early than the other routes. It's not apparent in the early game, but as you continue further throughout the game, you'll soon find the stat creep to be incredibly staggering.

 

[Arma]

Man, I sure wish I could play those games... ;-;

I couldn't resist watching an LP of Conquest. Is it just me, or are the dialogues downright horrible in this game?

Spoiler:

Everybody absolutely loves he avatar! The bad guys are over the top evil. And Silas tells a story about picnicking when the avatar is surrounded and overwhelmed by faceless...

Appart from that, I really like what I see, hard mode is much more of a challenge compared to awakening, amd map design and objectives are nice and varied.

 

[bobandbill]

What do you mean by map missions?

The win condition for each map/chapter. I read for instance that Birthright is basically always 'kill everyone' (rout the enemy), while Conquest has more varied and complex ones (e.g. Defend for x turns). Nice to hear there's some good map design in Conquest as well! They weren't so great in Awakening compared to older games imo.

Tbh I don't understand why Europe and Australia still don't have a release date for Fates. I get that that's the usual thing with release dates, the Japan gets it first and then NA and then the rest of the world, but I've hoped that people would start trying to do more worldwide releases these days, especially for more major franchises. It's been out in North America for a couple of weeks now, what's the point in not announcing a Europe/Australia release date at this point, even if they don't plan to release it for, say, a few months?

Yeah, it's kinda annoying. At least I now have Bravely Second to keep me busy for a while?

 

[Dedenne1]

K so first thoughts:

Spoiler:

Tbh I havent had much time to play either although I recently played Birthright which yes I'd recommend everyone to start with if your playing both like me cause it is definately the easier of the two in my opinion and allows you to really get hyped for conquest because theres more just follow the story you'll get there repeat repeat repeat with each chapter I mean its just kinda ongoing but still good. Birthright is great dont get me wrong but in comparison to conquest atleast in my opinion I'm finding conquest to be much harder and the storyline to be more enticing for me although this isnt final as I havent finished conquest so far conquest is my favorite of the 2. What I really like so far is that in birthright it seemed your the complete and utter hero and Nohr is evil while in Conquest no one is really evil except for Garon and his underlings your family is good and understands you and the Hoshidans may be attacking you but not nearly as much as Nohr did in Birthright.

 

[JJ Styles]

So people are now telling what they like and not like for Fates and I'll ride along the Fate train as well: Since i have Birthright, I'll be basing my comments on BR. After reading some previous posts, maybe i'll get Conquest for the heck of it.

One of the bigger complaints that i had in Awakening was that despite the different personalities in the cast, many of the units are basically the same units with stat distributions and stat growth being the main difference among the people. You could have three Great Knights (Frederick, Sully, and Stahl) and while they are different characters, they are still the same unit, just with differences in stats and growth.

The addition of a personal skill or the unique skill among the characters/units in Fates really help give many of the characters a better definition of who they are and what you want to do with them. It helps differentiate the units from each other other than their base class, class build options and stats.

The only other complain that i have that i can say though is that the units don't have the same fiery critical/skill activation quotes as that from Awakening. I haven't found a line that matched well with "Pick a God and Pray!" or my other personal favorite from Awakening's Miriel - "Begone Foul Miscreation!". I know these are very minor things for most people but for people such as myself who love picking and appreciating the littlelest of things, this is a major thing for me. I think one of the most enjoyable things really in Awakening was the crit/skill activation quotes since they gave so much fire and personality to the characters, despite my earlier complaint about the FE13 units being basically the same. Here in Fates BR, and with the English voice cast that i have to tolerate, the crit/skill activation quotes aren't as fiery or intense, and i'm not getting that "TWHOMP" or the satisfaction of watching my unit do a crit or proc a skill. To be a little positive, at least Kaden's Crit/skill proc quotes are pretty funny, especially with his rather funny voice.

 

[Keiran]

The win condition for each map/chapter. I read for instance that Birthright is basically always 'kill everyone' (rout the enemy), while Conquest has more varied and complex ones (e.g. Defend for x turns). Nice to hear there's some good map design in Conquest as well! They weren't so great in Awakening compared to older games imo.

Ah, yeah. I always referred to them as map objectives. But that is my biggest (and probably the only) complaint about Birthright. There was only one chapter (12) that wasn't rout/defeat boss. And on top of that, most of the maps were small and winnable in a few turns - I beat the last chapter in 2 turns. I'm wondering if every map is small due to a limitation of the 3DS because if I remember correctly it was the same story in Awakening. I didn't actually feel as though I were at war in Birthright.

 

[Sir Codin]

Holy goddammit Takumi, I wish Virion was as good as you when I got him in Awakening. No joke, Takumi is THE archiest of archers in Birthright.

 

[JJ Styles]

Man, I sure wish I could play those games... ;-;

Spoiler:

Everybody absolutely loves he avatar! The bad guys are over the top evil. And Silas tells a story about picnicking when the avatar is surrounded and overwhelmed by faceless...

Appart from that, I really like what I see, hard mode is much more of a challenge compared to awakening, amd map design and objectives are nice and varied.

Spoiler:

Personally i have no problem with the bad guys being over-the-top evil. As cliche as it is, its something that i still like, and it beating the crap out of every single one of them becomes satisfying.

Now for how the characters treat the avatar, this is the same "problem" in Birthright. Then again, i remember in Awakening, the avatar wasn't even the main hero of that story, it was Chrom, who pretty much is liked by everyone especially the girls (Cordelia in particular). I think they gave so much effort in making sure that YOU t,he player and avatar, are the central character and not some other important prince. So yeah you get a lot of the love. Taste the love?

its overly cheesy though and I get what you mean. Sometimes i lose myself in giggles whenever i read the support dialogues.

As for conquest, that game definitely has the edge in terms of variety. Here in BR, its Awakening all over again with the "Kill everything that moves" or "Kill the main commander" kind of thing. There are some sections of the game where you need to do something else but those are rare compared to the mentioned ones.

 

[Arma]

Spoiler:

Personally i have no problem with the bad guys being over-the-top evil. As cliche as it is, its something that i still like, and it beating the crap out of every single one of them becomes satisfying.

Now for how the characters treat the avatar, this is the same "problem" in Birthright. Then again, i remember in Awakening, the avatar wasn't even the main hero of that story, it was Chrom, who pretty much is liked by everyone especially the girls (Cordelia in particular). I think they gave so much effort in making sure that YOU t,he player and avatar, are the central character and not some other important prince. So yeah you get a lot of the love. Taste the love?

its overly cheesy though and I get what you mean. Sometimes i lose myself in giggles whenever i read the support dialogues.

I haven't seen many of the support conversations yet, the ones I have seen were pretty good too.

Spoiler:

I think the avatar doesn't have to be the main character in the game. I'd never picture myself as the avatar in Fates, and I think the games woul be better if he wasn't customizable. The only Fire Emblem game that introduced a good avatar is FE7: Blazing Sword.