Chit-Chat: ROM Hacking Daily Chit Chat

[CosmicBlazer]

I don't see how they destroyed Pokemon at all. In fact, they added a lot of really neat features to the game that made it more advanced.

I liked the new Generation. Only problem I had was the overworld and how they walked and looked. I didn't like it too much but it wasn't that big of a deal.

 

[machomuu]

Just a heads up to keep this hacking related. We're starting to head into the "General Pokemon Discussion" Station.

So as to rerail, I want to post a theory. Now, a huge barrier for hacking the DS games has always been the models (this is a bigger problem in Gen 5 than it is with Gen 4, and FAR moreso in Gen 6 than in Gen 5). But wouldn't it be theoretically possible to create a rom base (or just create tiles) that are 2D and, similarly, create sprites that are more top-down, so as to make them work better with a 2D interface similar to pre-Gen IV rather the sort of faux-3D camera perspective that the DS ones use.

In fact, if such a rombase were made available, it would present a whole new, larger playground for hacking to grow on.

 

[Renegade]

But wouldn't it be theoretically possible to create a rom base (or just create tiles) that are 2D

Are you talking about how the tiles in the DS games kind of shrink and make a '3d' effect as they go into the background? If so then yes, it would be possible to just recreate them as you posted above. I think Platinum Red & Blue have done a pretty good job of this.

create sprites that are more top-down, so as to make them work better with a 2D interface similar to pre-Gen IV rather the sort of faux-3D camera perspective that the DS ones use.

For sure. Again, being a demake, I think Platinum Red & Blue emulate this effect just like the real Platinum does.

 

[CosmicBlazer]

I found some BW tile buildings made my Wesley Fg that were in GBA style then you got some BW nature tiles on deviantart to use. There is someone making a BW demake right now so yeah its possible.

 

[machomuu]

I found some BW tile buildings made my Wesley Fg that were in GBA style then you got some BW nature tiles on deviantart to use. There is someone making a BW demake right now so yeah its possible.

Well I'm not referring to making a demake. Rather, I'm saying that if we eliminated buildings from the equation altogether, since 3D models are a huge barrier to making DS hacking accessible, things would become a lot smoother on our path to mainstream DS Pokemon hacking.

Because in the DS games (BW most specifically), there's just so much that you can see that takes a good amount of hacking magic to achieve or just plain isn't possible. The possibilities in the capabilities that DS hacking holds are staggering, and while I'm not saying we should abandon GBA hacking (because that just won't happen), I really do think that we should start building an accessible framework for DS hacking so that we can create a more varied hacking palette.

 

[CosmicBlazer]

Well I'm not referring to making a demake. Rather, I'm saying that if we eliminated buildings from the equation altogether, since 3D models are a huge barrier to making DS hacking accessible, things would become a lot smoother on our path to mainstream DS Pokemon hacking.

Because in the DS games (BW most specifically), there's just so much that you can see that takes a good amount of hacking magic to achieve or just plain isn't possible. The possibilities in the capabilities that DS hacking holds are staggering, and while I'm not saying we should abandon GBA hacking (because that just won't happen), I really do think that we should start building an accessible framework for DS hacking so that we can create a more varied hacking palette.

I see where you are coming from but right now there aren't that many resources for DS hacking or tutorials compared to GBA which is why many choose to hack GBA.

 

[Hitsushiro]

I see where you are coming from but right now there aren't that many resources for DS hacking or tutorials compared to GBA which is why many choose to hack GBA.

That is his point. If we create a user-friendly rombase accessible to all, then that would prompt a new hacking movement. People will want get into DS hacking, and tools and tutorials will sprout from this point on.

 

[int]

Nah, not really. Many many would still stay at GBA. Reason: Nostalgia <3

 

[Christos]

There could be HOTM style in the Beginners Lounge . I don't know if that would work.

There aren't many hack/idea threads in Beginner's Lounge, and even if there were they'd have so little progress that I don't think any competitions would work out for that section.

I was considering a competition for the Hacks Studio, but seeing as there aren't many active hacks in the section, I think Hack of the Year is enough for now. I also have several ideas for a small project contest, similar to LuxrayHacker's idea, but I'm going to wait and see how his Get-Together event goes first.

On the DS hacking topic, I think a 2D overworld would definitely be more convenient and make DS hacking more popular and approachable, though I believe GBA games will still remain the most popular option for hacking for a while, since it's so well emulated on a lot of operating systems.

 

[Hitsushiro]

I think it's just not necessary to deal with DS hacking... Some people might be interested, but in the end it's just about the rombase. GB/C and GBA are plain and stable which is what you want for rom-hacking, really.

HOTM could work in the Beginner's Lounge... or something like that... Like I said, whilst HotW was stupid, it did help organise hacks and promote the ones with potential.

 

[Elaitenstile]

I remember in PHO we used to (maybe still) have something called PotS. It's Project of the Season, which evaluates hacks and games together (funny, yes) once in four months. I think it's a call for Hack of the Season! Because three to four months is the average time taken for a casual hack to get to beta stage. Or at least the average time for reshuffling of the hacks.. This ensures that hacks aren't that frequently judged and yet gives a frequent chance to evaluate hacks.

If that doesn't work, maybe BHotY? Like once in 6 months?

 

[Logan]

Hack of the Month and Hack of the Year are the only official competitions.

 

[machomuu]

Nah, not really. Many many would still stay at GBA. Reason: Nostalgia <3

Will they? For me, I don't really have any nostalgic connection to Gen 3 because I played the original games when they came out. It really depends on how old the gamer is and when they got into Pokemon- which in my case was Gen 1. And I do see a lot of hackers around my age group that got into pokemon in much the same way. But having said that, I feel that people cling to the GBA more because of the accessibility and the wide array of tools than anything else.

On the DS hacking topic, I think a 2D overworld would definitely be more convenient and make DS hacking more popular and approachable, though I believe GBA games will still remain the most popular option for hacking for a while, since it's so well emulated on a lot of operating systems.

I think it's just not necessary to deal with DS hacking... Some people might be interested, but in the end it's just about the rombase. GB/C and GBA are plain and stable which is what you want for rom-hacking, really.

Well in the case of GB/C, I would say that it's difficult for people to jump into because there aren't many tools. There's a lot more hex knowledge that's mandatory with gen 2 and 1, things that one just can't casually pick up. A lot of people pick up GBA hacking for fun and then decide to make a hack later, and that's kind of my point here.

But I wouldn't say that DS emulation isn't stable. No$GBA may be questionable, but DeSmuME can almost flawlessly emulate games at such a small cost. Performance cost, not money. Not to mention that it's still actively being updated.

The other real wall that I see is the popularity gate. Specifically, we won't try to expand because the GBA is the popular platform. And it's because of this that people won't want to move on. "Why hack that when everyone else is hacking the GBA games?" or "There are more hacks on the GBA, that seems easier". In some cases, the GBA games' popularity might completely overshadow those of the DS games in the beginning that people won't even notice them as an option. They'd need to have their eyes open by some sort of spectacular hack by those people who do see the platform as viable, which may be unlikely in itself.

 

[DoesntKnowHowToPlay]

But I wouldn't say that DS emulation isn't stable. No$GBA may be questionable, but DeSmuME can almost flawlessly emulate games at such a small cost. Performance cost, not money. Not to mention that it's still actively being updated.

Last I checked, the Desmume devs hated Pokemon with a passion and refuse to fix emulation glitches they have. It's most noticeable on HGSS, which is the version I think most people would prefer to hack in 4th gen due to followers but breaks messily on the overworld at random intervals.

 

[machomuu]

Last I checked, the Desmume devs hated Pokemon with a passion and refuse to fix emulation glitches they have. It's most noticeable on HGSS, which is the version I think most people would prefer to hack in 4th gen due to followers but breaks messily on the overworld at random intervals.

Hmm...I use the nightly builds rather than the older official release, so I couldn't say (and I would assume that most people do use the official release, so I can't really disregard it). But, with that said, No$GBA and a regular DS work fine. And most games work with Desmume, but I feel that I should at least try the games on Desmume myself, especially considering that I'm the one proposing this.

 

[Mana1]

I've always found DS emulation a pain in the neck, the ones I have tried always ended up with ridiculous lag. :(


The map review thread needs some love :( it doesn't get many solid reviews these days.

 

[Satoshi Ookami]

I've always found DS emulation a pain in the neck, the ones I have tried always ended up with ridiculous lag. :(

Bad DeSmuME you are using.

 

[Hiatus]

I don't bother running DS emulators on my laptop at all; every time I try, games take ages to start up, and their speed would be extremely slow in general.

 

[CosmicBlazer]

I've always found DS emulation a pain in the neck, the ones I have tried always ended up with ridiculous lag. :(


The map review thread needs some love :( it doesn't get many solid reviews these days.

I agree $NOGBA and Desume always lagged for me but that was years ago. So I don't know if it got better.

Yeah the map review does need some love. It is not as active as it use to be. I think its because of it being in the Beginner Lounge.

 

[SuperEspeon]

Starting my first hack. Wish me luck!
Also, damn this is tedious.